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Thread: Bowers vs. Forest - Who you got?

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by GB54 View Post
    Forrest should have separated himself via an extra year in the system-so, Bowers
    In fairness to Forrest, that extra year was a completely different system.

  2. #32
    "Upside" is crap. "He has so much potential." Same crap. Either the guy has it now or he doesn't have it at all. Cal can't afford to wait for potential or upside. We need a leader now and that guy has to have a high football IQ, the talent for quick thinking, good at managing the huddle, leadership skills, a strong arm, the ability to use peripheral vision to escape the first grasp of oncoming defensive players and, as I said before, accuracy.

    What Jared Goff had in spades and what Webb lacked to some degree is to put the football where your receiver has a reasonable chance to catch it. Simple, huh? Brady has it, so does AR, Matt Ryan too, but it is what defines greatness and at the college level it says this guy has all the tools. That's what we need. Which guy has it?

  3. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by 6bear6 View Post
    "Upside" is crap. "He has so much potential." Same crap. Either the guy has it now or he doesn't have it at all. Cal can't afford to wait for potential or upside. We need a leader now and that guy has to have a high football IQ, the talent for quick thinking, good at managing the huddle, leadership skills, a strong arm, the ability to use peripheral vision to escape the first grasp of oncoming defensive players and, as I said before, accuracy.

    What Jared Goff had in spades and what Webb lacked to some degree is to put the football where your receiver has a reasonable chance to catch it. Simple, huh? Brady has it, so does AR, Matt Ryan too, but it is what defines greatness and at the college level it says this guy has all the tools. That's what we need. Which guy has it?
    Disagree. This is not 2005, where we are ready to compete for the conference title this year. We can afford some growing pains at QB this season, if it means better performance next year.

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by grandmastapoop View Post
    Disagree. This is not 2005, where we are ready to compete for the conference title this year. We can afford some growing pains at QB this season, if it means better performance next year.
    You miss the point of the entire thread. It's about which of these two players is ready now! Irrespective of the conference title, Cal fans want an effective and efficient QB. I laid out a number of qualities that an effective QB has. Is it Forrest or Bowers? We don't need growing pains, we need maturity at this important position.

  5. #35
    True Blue Golden Bear KoreAmBear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYCGOBEARS View Post
    Is JT is holding a Denny's menu?
    As if the menu is not big enough, he still has more plays on his arm band.

  6. #36
    True Blue Golden Bear going4roses's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KoreAmBear View Post
    As if the menu is not big enough, he still has more plays on his arm band.
    Man o man

  7. #37
    I will take which ever one tackles harder. This team needs toughness.

  8. #38
    Golden Bear Strykur's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MilleniaBear View Post
    I will take which ever one tackles. This team needs toughness.
    Modest goals man.

  9. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by 6bear6 View Post
    You miss the point of the entire thread. It's about which of these two players is ready now! Irrespective of the conference title, Cal fans want an effective and efficient QB. I laid out a number of qualities that an effective QB has. Is it Forrest or Bowers? We don't need growing pains, we need maturity at this important position.
    No, that's YOUR interpretation of the thread based on YOUR personal feelings on why someone should be named a starter. I don't even take a position on who should start. I don't think I have any real info. But to argue the coaches should ignore the value of higher upside, when that upside arguably needs playing time to be realized, is foolish. I'm not saying it's the only factor. But it's a factor in the decision.

  10. #40
    Poop, I would hope that both guys have upside futures. I'm not saying they each reached their apex. But one or the other has the qualities I listed in more abundance than the other. I have no more information than you about Forrest and Bowers, but I really don't want another season to pass where Cal fans have to say "maybe next year." Instead, how about "this year?"

  11. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by 6bear6 View Post
    Poop, I would hope that both guys have upside futures. I'm not saying they each reached their apex. But one or the other has the qualities I listed in more abundance than the other. I have no more information than you about Forrest and Bowers, but I really don't want another season to pass where Cal fans have to say "maybe next year." Instead, how about "this year?"
    And if the flip side prevails and they are better than we are given to think, then we have them of two and three years. Not bad.

  12. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by 6bear6 View Post
    Poop, I would hope that both guys have upside futures. I'm not saying they each reached their apex. But one or the other has the qualities I listed in more abundance than the other. I have no more information than you about Forrest and Bowers, but I really don't want another season to pass where Cal fans have to say "maybe next year." Instead, how about "this year?"
    That's fair, but that's not what you first said. I was responding in particular to this: "'Upside' is crap. 'He has so much potential.' Same crap. Either the guy has it now or he doesn't have it at all. Cal can't afford to wait for potential or upside."

    I don't agree that upside is crap or that potential is crap. Let's pretend we know the end results for a moment. Player A and Player B are both quarterbacks. Player A has 2 years to play and Player B has 3 years to play. Player A is presently the 8th best QB in the conference if he starts. Player B is the 12th best. But Player A can never be better than 6th best in the conference, and he won't get there until Year 2. Player B will be the 6th best QB in the conference in Year 2, and the best QB in the conference in Year 3. But, Player B cannot get there without starting in Year 1.

    So your options over the next few years are the 8th/6th/unknown best or 12th/6th/1st. I take Player B every time. Again, we don't KNOW this is true of Bowers/Forest, and we can't know. But coaches, who do this for a living and spend time with these players every day for years, might have a better idea. If they think Player B is not better than Player A but can be better with playing time, it's should be taken into consideration as to who should start.

  13. #43
    I agree with you - this year will be poor, so you might as well take a chance. Iirc, Forrest was an afterthought, a late scholly to a guy who did decently at a long-time powerhouse (Mater Dei in So Cal) whereas Bowers was a highly regarded prep in Washington who was highly recruited. Now, in year 2 and year three they look about even according to the coaches.That indicates to this amateur that Bowers is the better choice, and from what I saw in the tv broadcast, I also came to that conclusion. OTOH, I certainly trust Wilcox and his OC to make the tight choice.

  14. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by CAL6371 View Post
    I agree with you - this year will be poor, so you might as well take a chance. Iirc, Forrest was an afterthought, a late scholly to a guy who did decently at a long-time powerhouse (Mater Dei in So Cal) whereas Bowers was a highly regarded prep in Washington who was highly recruited. Now, in year 2 and year three they look about even according to the coaches.That indicates to this amateur that Bowers is the better choice, and from what I saw in the tv broadcast, I also came to that conclusion. OTOH, I certainly trust Wilcox and his OC to make the tight choice.
    Their games are remarkably similar - a little difference here, another there, but choose the one for whom Beau's scheme is most natural.

    What this tells me is that the door is wide open for the new guy.

  15. #45
    Rushinbear - You may well be right - iirc, he is the most highly recruited of the three. I can't agree on Forrest v Bowers - Bowers seemed more athletic, stronger arm etc. but those who followed the practices in person would be better judges of that than my limited basis.



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