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Thread: Cal WBB

  1. #1

    Cal WBB

    Down 3 with 2 minutes to go. Win or lose, Cal's WBB team is such a frustration for players who are supposed to be so good. The best analogy I can give would be me, a 15 handicapper, trying a golf shot that I saw on TV by some pro on Sunday afternoon, that is from a trap, between two overhanging trees, 175 from the green and slamming away and trying to do the impossible. The turnovers by trying to do too much are just ridiculous. Takes any joy out of watching.

    After watching the MBB team play this afternoon, if only MM could crack down on these wild women, hopefully it will help. This is just plain painful. Not even good BB, but players who I am convinced are top drawer.

  2. #2
    Wowza, I never like to use the word but I won't lie, i am "embarrassed" by Cal today. That was not a Ncaa tournament team by any means

  3. #3
    I agree. Too much talent to be playing like that. They made their free throws in overtime and still lost. The Trojans had one player scoring in the last 5 minutes of the game and in overtime and yet Cal did little to shut her down and make someone else score. I hope this team will start to grow and learn with 2/3 of the season behind it but I have some big doubts and concerns.
    Go Bears!

  4. #4
    That foul call on Laysha in the last 17 seconds was bull****. That being said to many offensive rebounds given up and missed ft's. What happened on the inbounds play in the last minute when the refs gave the ball to $C?

  5. #5
    maybe we need better coaches. i will give the coaching staff one year to get it going right. then no money for them.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by LodeBear View Post
    maybe we need better coaches. i will give the coaching staff one year to get it going right. then no money for them.
    Why not leave now? Your ultimatum carries such weight.

  7. #7

    Cal v. USC

    Totally agree with Odonto after watching tonight's game. Its painful to watch the Women commit error after error. What a contrast with how the Men played earlier in the day, with the men working the ball for easy baskets underneath and our shooters getting wide open looks from outside. The Women on offense, by comparison, are reckless wild. USC was beging Brittany to shoot from outside, and she willingly accomodated - making only one or two (one banked in) out of many attempts, most of which weren't even close. I wouldn't want Boyd taking those wide open opportunities SC was tempting her with. (I believe her 3 point shooting percentage is not much above 10%). I'd at least want to see a greatly improved shooting percentage in practice, before I'd want her shooting from outside. And we have other players who are far better outside shooters. Boyd also has to be much smarter about when to drive hard to the basket, when the middle is plugged up with bigs (STUFF).

  8. #8
    I sat down to write about our turnovers, but was surprised to see we had only 13. However most of them were of the ugly variety, lazy passes and passes right to the opponents. And we all know about our free throw woes.

    But after some reflection I think we have real problems against quick teams. Briana Gilbreath killed us all through the game -- I'm surprised we didn't let Afure try to defend her, and I wish Erika were still with us. Ariya Cook killed us at the end after Eliza and Brittany both fouled out.

    Which brings up the officiating. Of course I'm a Cal fan, but in my opinion USC got away with a lot more than we did. It wasn't the calls, but the non-calls. And that offensive foul on Layshia which decided the game was, as calbearsfan eloquently and succinctly pointed out, bull****. Confirmed by the replay.

    Some positives: Gennifer finished well, not just on offensive rebounds but on many drives from the top of the key. Not to mention a routine (for Gennifer) 17 rebounds. Lindsay hit 3 threes early. Eliza played great defense and took smart shots. Reshanda played with great heart. Too bad the officials didn't let Eliza and Reshanda play more. And Layshia hit some key shots, including the one which should have won the game.
    Last edited by stu; 02-12-2012 at 11:01 AM.

  9. #9
    Gennifer looked great, I agree. But after my post above which was done in regulation, we had a 7 point lead in OT and lost. How do you do that? This is the wild that I speak of. No control. Seven points. Two minutes. Plain ugly. There needs to be some discipline. At least Boyd can't be blamed for the loss of lead, for she had fouled out. But nobody builds a 7 point lead in 3 minutes, and then does not have the ability to protect it. Whoops, yes somebody does.

    I am not denying at all that there is talent there. Matter of fact excellent talent. But they are just playing playground ball, with McD AAs to boot. Do not understand it. Love the team and the players, hate the way they are playing.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by OdontoBear66 View Post
    we had a 7 point lead in OT and lost. How do you do that?
    Defense, or lack thereof. Look at these excerpts from the play-by-play:

    01:32 72-67 H 5 GOOD! LAYUP by Crook, Ariya [PNT]
    01:17 73-70 H 3 GOOD! 3 PTR by Crook, Ariya
    00:49 75-72 H 3 GOOD! JUMPER by Crook, Ariya
    00:43 75-74 H 1 GOOD! LAYUP by Crook, Ariya [PNT]
    00:05 75-76 V 1 GOOD! JUMPER by Crook, Ariya [PNT]

    That's 11 points by one player in less than a minute and a half!

    During that interval we also had a weird out-of-bounds violation I didn't see, that bull**** offensive foul, and no Eliza or Brittany -- all thanks to the refs.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by stu View Post
    Defense, or lack thereof. Look at these excerpts from the play-by-play:

    01:32 72-67 H 5 GOOD! LAYUP by Crook, Ariya [PNT]
    01:17 73-70 H 3 GOOD! 3 PTR by Crook, Ariya
    00:49 75-72 H 3 GOOD! JUMPER by Crook, Ariya
    00:43 75-74 H 1 GOOD! LAYUP by Crook, Ariya [PNT]
    00:05 75-76 V 1 GOOD! JUMPER by Crook, Ariya [PNT]

    That's 11 points by one player in less than a minute and a half!

    During that interval we also had a weird out-of-bounds violation I didn't see, that bull**** offensive foul, and no Eliza or Brittany -- all thanks to the refs.
    We got jobbed but Cal team very difficult to watch. Agree with OdontoB lots of street ball and improvisation going on..which is why half court game is practically practically doesn't exist and it is the same old thing..boyd or EZ at the top of the key and our forwards in both corners.

    Maybe...Cohen = Lin which would offer a better half court game. Have her in with boyd which would still give us the speed for possible fast breaks but Cohen would be the point person for half court offense. Who knows she could surprise us with our desperately needs for perimeter shooters. Problem with EZ and Boyd in together..teams still back off of them and pack the middle. Got to do something to make the team run more smoothly. Just...can't stand more of these ugly games..unless of course it is the other team.

  12. #12
    True Blue Golden Bear 59bear's Avatar
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    This team is still pretty young, especially at PG. That explains a lot of what causes you anguish.
    Access is better than ownership!

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by 59bear View Post
    This team is still pretty young, especially at PG. That explains a lot of what causes you anguish.
    Quite. And the H.C. is young as well.

    During the last 14 hours I've heard a lot about the superiority of Mike Montgomery's coaching: "Maybe we need better coaches." "If only MM could crack down on these wild women, hopefully it will help." Etc. Well, yes, and duh--he's only been at it for 35 years or so.

    According to his on-line Cal bio: "Before helping Stanford's ascend to the national stage, Montgomery oversaw the Montana program for eight years (1978-86). His teams averaged 19 wins per year, never had a losing season and earned two NIT selections. Montgomery guided the Grizzlies to five runner-up finishes in the Big Sky Conference and won at least 20 games each of his last four seasons."

    What? No NCAA appearances during the Great God Monty's first H.C. stint? And Montana put up with this inferior effort?! (Yeah, yeah--sarcasm.)

    Montgomery's a very fine coach now, but he had to work for years to get to that point. Gottlieb strikes me as a down-to-earth person, and I can't imagine she wouldn't consult him about getting the best effort from our talented, but young and inconsistent, players.

  14. #14

    You are Trying to Defend Bad Coaching with a Bad Example

    Quote Originally Posted by BearBint View Post
    Quite. And the H.C. is young as well.

    During the last 14 hours I've heard a lot about the superiority of Mike Montgomery's coaching: "Maybe we need better coaches." "If only MM could crack down on these wild women, hopefully it will help." Etc. Well, yes, and duh--he's only been at it for 35 years or so.

    According to his on-line Cal bio: "Before helping Stanford's ascend to the national stage, Montgomery oversaw the Montana program for eight years (1978-86). His teams averaged 19 wins per year, never had a losing season and earned two NIT selections. Montgomery guided the Grizzlies to five runner-up finishes in the Big Sky Conference and won at least 20 games each of his last four seasons."

    What? No NCAA appearances during the Great God Monty's first H.C. stint? And Montana put up with this inferior effort?! (Yeah, yeah--sarcasm.)

    Montgomery's a very fine coach now, but he had to work for years to get to that point. Gottlieb strikes me as a down-to-earth person, and I can't imagine she wouldn't consult him about getting the best effort from our talented, but young and inconsistent, players.
    Montgomery has always be ahead of the curve as a coach. I have followed his career since his Montana days. Using Monty's Montana record to make your point is useless. Montana was then, and is still pretty much, a non-entity in college basketball. Whereas Cal is a member of the Pac-12 conference and is right in the heart of furtile recruiting grounds, California. The facilities at Cal are the Taj Mahal compared to Montana at that time. In other words, Monty was at a distinct competitive disadvantage, unlike Lindsay who has a very nice base to work from. Second problem with your comparison is that back in the day, the NCAA tournament had almost no At-large bids. It had a much smaller field and it was much more difficult to get an invite. Bob Boyd's marvelous SC teams would end up with 2 losses, both to UCLA, and they would stay home at the time because there were no at-large bids! So, using Monty's early career at Montana is not a good example.

    As for the criticism of Lindsay's coaching against SC, I think people are being too harsh on her. She could have done a better job and I will admit she had me scratching my head a couple times. While theis team needs to be better coached, and will not remind anyone of Monty's well-oiled machine, in the final analysis the reason we lost this game was the refs. The call on Layshia was one of the worst single calls I have seen in 40 years of watching basketball at all levels. That ref should be disciplined by the league office.

    Let's not forget that last week we at the MBB game vs Arizona saw Cal jobbed by one of the worst whistle-to-whistle referee performances in the history of Harmon/Haas. Just like Lindsay last night, Monty's team was robbed of a win by incompetent officiating. Even the opposing coach said at halftime that if the officiating continued the same in the 2nd half as the 1st half, he was pretty confident of victory! My point being that sometimes it has nothing to do with the coach and the level of play of the team. Sometimes, college officials think they need to dictate the game rather than officate it. And that sort of officiating happens in the Pac-12 way too often. If Larry Scott, who was at courtside for the Cal/AZ game, was the commish some people think he is, then he would find a way to employ competent officials.

    One more thing. I am a season ticket holder for Cal MBB, WBB and the Warriors. The NBA refs are the best. Period. MBB refs are far above the WBB refs. The WBB refs are hardly superior to the high school level. In fact, they are generally an embarrasement to the game of basketball. Those who love the women's game need to be more vocal about the incompetence of many WBB crews. I was actually proud that the crowd Saturday night booed the refs off the court. That needs to happen more often until the Pac-12 conference steps up and addresses the situation. Meanwhile, we will see more games in which refs take the game to a new low.

  15. #15
    Thanks for the thoughts, GoCal73. You know more about basketball than I do, and so I shall consider carefully what you've said.

    (By the way, I also wrote an e-mail to Larry Scott and Sandi Barbour expressing my dissatisfaction with the officiating, especially that terrible, stupid call on Layshia.)

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