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oobay oobay is offline
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Why are we passing to our RB's so much? - 09-24-2011, 02:35 PM

in critical situations? We're overthinking things. Just throw the rock up for KA and MJ.
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TheOldBlue TheOldBlue is offline
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Really? Sofele is your receiver on 4th down? - 09-24-2011, 02:41 PM

4th and 3....run the option with Maynard
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grumpybear grumpybear is offline
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Who's the coach? - 09-24-2011, 02:45 PM

Tedford.
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drunkoski drunkoski is offline
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09-25-2011, 11:25 AM

Yet not a single rb screen this year
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pappysghost pappysghost is offline
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09-25-2011, 11:41 AM

The RB's have to be part of a good passing game. The one to Debo was probably not a good choice by Maynard, but heck you can't always be right. The one to Isi he should have caught although I don't think much of him as a receiver. The idea of using the backs in the passing game I support. I think we should throw to them more, but yeah if Jones and Allen are always open just go to them. I'm down with that. That did seem to be the case Saturday. How about we try to throw to Allen or Jones instead of running Isi up the gut??
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BTUR BTUR is offline
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09-25-2011, 11:44 AM

Have you considered the possibility that they aren't the first read but the other guys are covered? That maybe the defense, in passing situations, keys on Jones and Allen a bit more? I haven't watched film to see if any of the throws were made at the expense of an open WR, so I can't give you an answer to those questions...but my initial guess is that they weren't the primary option on the play and it was just the progression of reads getting to them. I mean, our RB's combined for 5 catches yesterday. Allen/Jones had 16. We're very obviously trying to get the ball to the WR's, and succeeding in doing so.
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Ace4eVer Ace4eVer is offline
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09-25-2011, 11:45 AM

It is odd that we are throwing to them but not out of screens. I think we ran one screen against Fresno St and it was a poorly thrown ball that could have been picked. I guess we just aren't good at the short stuff.
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09-25-2011, 11:50 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BTUR View Post
Have you considered the possibility that they aren't the first read but the other guys are covered? That maybe the defense, in passing situations, keys on Jones and Allen a bit more? I haven't watched film to see if any of the throws were made at the expense of an open WR, so I can't give you an answer to those questions...but my initial guess is that they weren't the primary option on the play and it was just the progression of reads getting to them. I mean, our RB's combined for 5 catches yesterday. Allen/Jones had 16. We're very obviously trying to get the ball to the WR's, and succeeding in doing so.
You are way too reasonable for this site . . . get out now.
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BTUR BTUR is offline
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09-25-2011, 12:15 PM

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Originally Posted by Ace4eVer View Post
It is odd that we are throwing to them but not out of screens. I think we ran one screen against Fresno St and it was a poorly thrown ball that could have been picked. I guess we just aren't good at the short stuff.
I don't think it's odd. RB's are a part of the passing game - often the safety valve for a passing play. They should get some catches. That said, we are splitting them out wide some, so that's something a bit unusual (we've only really done that before to get talents like Marshawn and Shane on the field while they were backups). Maybe we don't feel too good about our WR depth at the moment? As for screens, it hasn't seemed all that necessary so far - teams haven't seemed to me to be blitzing much or getting tons of pressure on our QB, which are generally what screens are designed to take advantage of. I welcome the lack of screens, I think the past couple of seasons have seen the offense relying on them too much. I like what Maynard's been able to do throwing the ball downfield - I think his deep pass accuracy has been poor so far, but he's been very good in the ~10-15 yard passes. I think that's an area we've really struggled with since Longshore got hurt.
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Ace4eVer Ace4eVer is offline
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09-25-2011, 04:00 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BTUR View Post
I don't think it's odd. RB's are a part of the passing game - often the safety valve for a passing play. They should get some catches. That said, we are splitting them out wide some, so that's something a bit unusual (we've only really done that before to get talents like Marshawn and Shane on the field while they were backups). Maybe we don't feel too good about our WR depth at the moment? As for screens, it hasn't seemed all that necessary so far - teams haven't seemed to me to be blitzing much or getting tons of pressure on our QB, which are generally what screens are designed to take advantage of. I welcome the lack of screens, I think the past couple of seasons have seen the offense relying on them too much. I like what Maynard's been able to do throwing the ball downfield - I think his deep pass accuracy has been poor so far, but he's been very good in the ~10-15 yard passes. I think that's an area we've really struggled with since Longshore got hurt.
I agree that typically the RB is a safety outlet, much like a TE should be. However, I still think we keep our RBs in to block quite often and whenever they head out into the field I feel like its a designed play to them. We threw that wheel type route to CDJ twice and I don't think that was a coincidence. The other play was a crucial 4th down where we had Isi split out wide. Seems like a strange decision.

I welcome the lack of that poor bubble screen we would always throw, but I don't remember a lot of RB screens the past few years, mostly because they were always thrown poorly. The KA21 delayed middle screen is very popular now and I hope they add a wrinkle to it. I think the depth at WR is a good observation. Calvin had a good catch but I don't think he had to leave his feet for it. Other than that, I thiink Harris is our 4th receiver. Hopefully Clay makes it back from whatever has him banished and I don't know what to make of Edmonds.

I am absolutely loving the intermediate routes though, it just feels like the other aspects of the passing game are neglected. I wouldn't mind so much if I didn't think KA21 has an athletic advantage over just about any DB any Pac12 team can throw out there.
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berk18 berk18 is offline
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09-25-2011, 08:18 PM

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Originally Posted by Ace4eVer View Post
The other play was a crucial 4th down where we had Isi split out wide. Seems like a strange decision.
This isn't that weird. When a defense is playing zone, the CB's are generally playing the outside zones. So you split the back out wide and make the D waste their best pass defender on a guy who's not a threat. If the CB cheats, you throw to the back. If he doesn't, you have your real receivers inside where they're matched up on safeties and LB's. I'm not sure if that's what happened and if that's why Maynard threw to the back, but we've done it a lot in empty sets, splitting out TE's and even FB's as well.
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BTUR BTUR is offline
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09-26-2011, 09:22 AM

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Originally Posted by berk18 View Post
This isn't that weird. When a defense is playing zone, the CB's are generally playing the outside zones. So you split the back out wide and make the D waste their best pass defender on a guy who's not a threat. If the CB cheats, you throw to the back. If he doesn't, you have your real receivers inside where they're matched up on safeties and LB's. I'm not sure if that's what happened and if that's why Maynard threw to the back, but we've done it a lot in empty sets, splitting out TE's and even FB's as well.
The other thing to keep in mind is in the huddle, it's not obvious you're going 5 wide. You can do a lot of different plays/formations with 3 WR's/1 RB/1 TE, or something similar, so that's a reason to have those guys in there when you go 5 wide. Make it tougher on the defensive play caller.
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Our Domicile Our Domicile is offline
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09-26-2011, 10:39 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BTUR View Post
Have you considered the possibility that they aren't the first read but the other guys are covered? That maybe the defense, in passing situations, keys on Jones and Allen a bit more? I haven't watched film to see if any of the throws were made at the expense of an open WR, so I can't give you an answer to those questions...but my initial guess is that they weren't the primary option on the play and it was just the progression of reads getting to them. I mean, our RB's combined for 5 catches yesterday. Allen/Jones had 16. We're very obviously trying to get the ball to the WR's, and succeeding in doing so.
Sorry, but the critical 3rd down pass to RB Debo down the sideline was a primary option because ZM went to him from the beginning.

A lot people think our QB have progressions on every single pass play. However, in some cases, it's a set play to a primary receiver from the get-go.

Like DO above, I don't see why Cal has to get fancy with complex RB-routes when the simple RB-screen is available and we don't run it.

Too many geniuses on the sideline, I guess.
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sycasey sycasey is online now
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09-26-2011, 10:55 AM

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Originally Posted by Our Domicile View Post
Sorry, but the critical 3rd down pass to RB Debo down the sideline was a primary option because ZM went to him from the beginning.

A lot people think our QB have progressions on every single pass play. However, in some cases, it's a set play to a primary receiver from the get-go.

Like DO above, I don't see why Cal has to get fancy with complex RB-routes when the simple RB-screen is available and we don't run it.

Too many geniuses on the sideline, I guess.
The wheel route (Debo down the sideline) is a play we've run for many years and often works for a big gain. The defense sniffed it out this time and it didn't, but that doesn't mean it's a bad play.
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Our Domicile Our Domicile is offline
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09-26-2011, 11:02 AM

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Originally Posted by sycasey View Post
The wheel route (Debo down the sideline) is a play we've run for many years and often works for a big gain. The defense sniffed it out this time and it didn't, but that doesn't mean it's a bad play.
How come Debo = pass when he comes in at RB? That's sniffing it out, alright.
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