calumnus said:

---

Putting aside our current debates over coaches and players...I see a bright future for Cal's revenue sports.

There is a major economic opportunity that has and will be created by:
1. The Niners move to Santa Clara and decline in relevance.
2. The Raiders move to Las Vegas.
3. The Warriors move to San Francisco.

This leaves a huge opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fan base as the football team for residents of SF, the East Bay and North Bay and the basketball team supported by the East Bay.

A key will be local recruiting. However, as more kids grow up as Cal fans, more will opt to play for the local team.

I think it is critical that the expansion of the fan base NOT be based on a generic pro sport style atmosphere. It has to be about emphasizing Cal traditions. Our songs, colors, mascot, band and traditions....all contribute to feelings of connection with the team and our school. The initial target for growth is the huge alumni base anyway. This will be sold to the academics as building a loyal donor base.
If local stars play for Cal, that will draw in more and more casual fans.

We need to develop the local AAU program, especially the Soldiers, as a pipeline for basketball, and all of the California JCs, but especially CCSF and Laney, as a pipeline for both sports as long as the California JCs can maintain their athletic programs.

Stanford, has not been a major force in recruiting locally for decades, has a small alumni base, shrunk their stadium and now has the Niners in their backyard. Meanwhile, USC and UCLA have to deal with an emerging LA Ram dynasty. Plus the Chargers (and the Raiders in relatively nearby Vegas). And that Ram team sports our colors and has a QB from Cal. Thus creating a great opening for the state's flagship university to recruit in the southern portion of the state.

We also should develop the world's best sports management, finance and marketing program at the Haas School of Business. Sports is a huge multi-billion dollar industry worldwide and there is no formal training for the many lucrative jobs. interns could work on projects in the AD, including marketing and fundraising campaigns, improving the ticket office or work in the nearby PAC-12 offices....This program would be a major draw for student athletes, both as undergrads and as grad transfers, and admissions preference could be given to current/former D1 athletes. We might attract highly regarded coaches who might enjoy teaching or taking classes.

I believe all of the above could make Cal a powerhouse in both the revenue and non-revenue sports.

---

calumnus said:

---

IPutting aside our current debates over coaches and players...I see a bright future for Cal's revenue sports.

There is a major economic opportunity that has and will be created by:
1. The Niners move to Santa Clara and decline in relevance.
2. The Raiders move to Las Vegas.
3. The Warriors move to San Francisco.

This leaves a huge opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fan base as the football team for residents of SF, the East Bay and North Bay and the basketball team supported by the East Bay.

A key will be local recruiting. However, as more kids grow up as Cal fans, more will opt to play for the local team.

I think it is critical that the expansion of the fan base NOT be based on a generic pro sport style atmosphere. It has to be about emphasizing Cal traditions. Our songs, colors, mascot, band and traditions....all contribute to feelings of connection with the team and our school. The initial target for growth is the huge alumni base anyway. This will be sold to the academics as building a loyal donor base.
If local stars play for Cal, that will draw in more and more casual fans.

We need to develop the local AAU program, especially the Soldiers, as a pipeline for basketball, and all of the California JCs, but especially CCSF and Laney, as a pipeline for both sports as long as the California JCs can maintain their athletic programs.

Stanford, has not been a major force in recruiting locally for decades, has a small alumni base, shrunk their stadium and now has the Niners in their backyard. Meanwhile, USC and UCLA have to deal with an emerging LA Ram dynasty. Plus the Chargers (and the Raiders in relatively nearby Vegas). And that Ram team sports our colors and has a QB from Cal. Thus creating a great opening for the state's flagship university to recruit in the southern portion of the state.

We also should develop the world's best sports management, finance and marketing program at the Haas School of Business. Sports is a huge multi-billion dollar industry worldwide and there is no formal training for the many lucrative jobs. interns could work on projects in the AD, including marketing and fundraising campaigns, improving the ticket office or work in the nearby PAC-12 offices....This program would be a major draw for student athletes, both as undergrads and as grad transfers, and admissions preference could be given to current/former D1 athletes. We might attract highly regarded coaches who might enjoy teaching or taking classes.

I believe all of the above could make Cal a powerhouse in both the revenue and non-revenue sports.

---

71Bear said:

---

calumnus said:

---

IPutting aside our current debates over coaches and players...I see a bright future for Cal's revenue sports.

There is a major economic opportunity that has and will be created by:
1. The Niners move to Santa Clara and decline in relevance.
2. The Raiders move to Las Vegas.
3. The Warriors move to San Francisco.

This leaves a huge opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fan base as the football team for residents of SF, the East Bay and North Bay and the basketball team supported by the East Bay.

A key will be local recruiting. However, as more kids grow up as Cal fans, more will opt to play for the local team.

I think it is critical that the expansion of the fan base NOT be based on a generic pro sport style atmosphere. It has to be about emphasizing Cal traditions. Our songs, colors, mascot, band and traditions....all contribute to feelings of connection with the team and our school. The initial target for growth is the huge alumni base anyway. This will be sold to the academics as building a loyal donor base.
If local stars play for Cal, that will draw in more and more casual fans.

We need to develop the local AAU program, especially the Soldiers, as a pipeline for basketball, and all of the California JCs, but especially CCSF and Laney, as a pipeline for both sports as long as the California JCs can maintain their athletic programs.

Stanford, has not been a major force in recruiting locally for decades, has a small alumni base, shrunk their stadium and now has the Niners in their backyard. Meanwhile, USC and UCLA have to deal with an emerging LA Ram dynasty. Plus the Chargers (and the Raiders in relatively nearby Vegas). And that Ram team sports our colors and has a QB from Cal. Thus creating a great opening for the state's flagship university to recruit in the southern portion of the state.

We also should develop the world's best sports management, finance and marketing program at the Haas School of Business. Sports is a huge multi-billion dollar industry worldwide and there is no formal training for the many lucrative jobs. interns could work on projects in the AD, including marketing and fundraising campaigns, improving the ticket office or work in the nearby PAC-12 offices....This program would be a major draw for student athletes, both as undergrads and as grad transfers, and admissions preference could be given to current/former D1 athletes. We might attract highly regarded coaches who might enjoy teaching or taking classes.

I believe all of the above could make Cal a powerhouse in both the revenue and non-revenue sports.

---

You made one big mistake.

You seriously underestimated the power of the Niners. They are THE crown jewel of Bay Area pro franchises. Once they get their s... together, they will suck all of the oxygen out of the sports air and that is that.

You need proof? Just think back to the 80's when they were the biggest story in the Bay Area (sports or otherwise).

---

71Bear said:

---

calumnus said:

---

IPutting aside our current debates over coaches and players...I see a bright future for Cal's revenue sports.

There is a major economic opportunity that has and will be created by:
1. The Niners move to Santa Clara and decline in relevance.
2. The Raiders move to Las Vegas.
3. The Warriors move to San Francisco.

This leaves a huge opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fan base as the football team for residents of SF, the East Bay and North Bay and the basketball team supported by the East Bay.

A key will be local recruiting. However, as more kids grow up as Cal fans, more will opt to play for the local team.

I think it is critical that the expansion of the fan base NOT be based on a generic pro sport style atmosphere. It has to be about emphasizing Cal traditions. Our songs, colors, mascot, band and traditions....all contribute to feelings of connection with the team and our school. The initial target for growth is the huge alumni base anyway. This will be sold to the academics as building a loyal donor base.
If local stars play for Cal, that will draw in more and more casual fans.

We need to develop the local AAU program, especially the Soldiers, as a pipeline for basketball, and all of the California JCs, but especially CCSF and Laney, as a pipeline for both sports as long as the California JCs can maintain their athletic programs.

Stanford, has not been a major force in recruiting locally for decades, has a small alumni base, shrunk their stadium and now has the Niners in their backyard. Meanwhile, USC and UCLA have to deal with an emerging LA Ram dynasty. Plus the Chargers (and the Raiders in relatively nearby Vegas). And that Ram team sports our colors and has a QB from Cal. Thus creating a great opening for the state's flagship university to recruit in the southern portion of the state.

We also should develop the world's best sports management, finance and marketing program at the Haas School of Business. Sports is a huge multi-billion dollar industry worldwide and there is no formal training for the many lucrative jobs. interns could work on projects in the AD, including marketing and fundraising campaigns, improving the ticket office or work in the nearby PAC-12 offices....This program would be a major draw for student athletes, both as undergrads and as grad transfers, and admissions preference could be given to current/former D1 athletes. We might attract highly regarded coaches who might enjoy teaching or taking classes.

I believe all of the above could make Cal a powerhouse in both the revenue and non-revenue sports.

---

You made one big mistake.

You seriously underestimated the power of the Niners. They are THE crown jewel of Bay Area pro franchises. Once they get their s... together, they will suck all of the oxygen out of the sports air and that is that.

You need proof? Just think back to the 80's when they were the biggest story in the Bay Area (sports or otherwise).

---

okaydo said:

---

71Bear said:

---

calumnus said:

---

IPutting aside our current debates over coaches and players...I see a bright future for Cal's revenue sports.

There is a major economic opportunity that has and will be created by:
1. The Niners move to Santa Clara and decline in relevance.
2. The Raiders move to Las Vegas.
3. The Warriors move to San Francisco.

This leaves a huge opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fan base as the football team for residents of SF, the East Bay and North Bay and the basketball team supported by the East Bay.

A key will be local recruiting. However, as more kids grow up as Cal fans, more will opt to play for the local team.

I think it is critical that the expansion of the fan base NOT be based on a generic pro sport style atmosphere. It has to be about emphasizing Cal traditions. Our songs, colors, mascot, band and traditions....all contribute to feelings of connection with the team and our school. The initial target for growth is the huge alumni base anyway. This will be sold to the academics as building a loyal donor base.
If local stars play for Cal, that will draw in more and more casual fans.

We need to develop the local AAU program, especially the Soldiers, as a pipeline for basketball, and all of the California JCs, but especially CCSF and Laney, as a pipeline for both sports as long as the California JCs can maintain their athletic programs.

Stanford, has not been a major force in recruiting locally for decades, has a small alumni base, shrunk their stadium and now has the Niners in their backyard. Meanwhile, USC and UCLA have to deal with an emerging LA Ram dynasty. Plus the Chargers (and the Raiders in relatively nearby Vegas). And that Ram team sports our colors and has a QB from Cal. Thus creating a great opening for the state's flagship university to recruit in the southern portion of the state.

We also should develop the world's best sports management, finance and marketing program at the Haas School of Business. Sports is a huge multi-billion dollar industry worldwide and there is no formal training for the many lucrative jobs. interns could work on projects in the AD, including marketing and fundraising campaigns, improving the ticket office or work in the nearby PAC-12 offices....This program would be a major draw for student athletes, both as undergrads and as grad transfers, and admissions preference could be given to current/former D1 athletes. We might attract highly regarded coaches who might enjoy teaching or taking classes.

I believe all of the above could make Cal a powerhouse in both the revenue and non-revenue sports.

---

You made one big mistake.

You seriously underestimated the power of the Niners. They are THE crown jewel of Bay Area pro franchises. Once they get their s... together, they will suck all of the oxygen out of the sports air and that is that.

You need proof? Just think back to the 80's when they were the biggest story in the Bay Area (sports or otherwise).

---

He made 2 big mistakes. He used "it's" when he should've used "its."

---

calumnus said:

---

71Bear said:

---

calumnus said:

---

IPutting aside our current debates over coaches and players...I see a bright future for Cal's revenue sports.

There is a major economic opportunity that has and will be created by:
1. The Niners move to Santa Clara and decline in relevance.
2. The Raiders move to Las Vegas.
3. The Warriors move to San Francisco.

This leaves a huge opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fan base as the football team for residents of SF, the East Bay and North Bay and the basketball team supported by the East Bay.

A key will be local recruiting. However, as more kids grow up as Cal fans, more will opt to play for the local team.

I think it is critical that the expansion of the fan base NOT be based on a generic pro sport style atmosphere. It has to be about emphasizing Cal traditions. Our songs, colors, mascot, band and traditions....all contribute to feelings of connection with the team and our school. The initial target for growth is the huge alumni base anyway. This will be sold to the academics as building a loyal donor base.
If local stars play for Cal, that will draw in more and more casual fans.

We need to develop the local AAU program, especially the Soldiers, as a pipeline for basketball, and all of the California JCs, but especially CCSF and Laney, as a pipeline for both sports as long as the California JCs can maintain their athletic programs.

Stanford, has not been a major force in recruiting locally for decades, has a small alumni base, shrunk their stadium and now has the Niners in their backyard. Meanwhile, USC and UCLA have to deal with an emerging LA Ram dynasty. Plus the Chargers (and the Raiders in relatively nearby Vegas). And that Ram team sports our colors and has a QB from Cal. Thus creating a great opening for the state's flagship university to recruit in the southern portion of the state.

We also should develop the world's best sports management, finance and marketing program at the Haas School of Business. Sports is a huge multi-billion dollar industry worldwide and there is no formal training for the many lucrative jobs. interns could work on projects in the AD, including marketing and fundraising campaigns, improving the ticket office or work in the nearby PAC-12 offices....This program would be a major draw for student athletes, both as undergrads and as grad transfers, and admissions preference could be given to current/former D1 athletes. We might attract highly regarded coaches who might enjoy teaching or taking classes.

I believe all of the above could make Cal a powerhouse in both the revenue and non-revenue sports.

---

You made one big mistake.

You seriously underestimated the power of the Niners. They are THE crown jewel of Bay Area pro franchises. Once they get their s... together, they will suck all of the oxygen out of the sports air and that is that.

You need proof? Just think back to the 80's when they were the biggest story in the Bay Area (sports or otherwise).

---

I do not underestimate the dedication of die hards like yourself who buy BOTH Cal and NFL tickets. Clearly the bigger opportunity is Cal as the East Bay team with the Raiders/Warriors moving.

The Walsh/Montana Niners were dominant in the 80s. They have won 1 NFC championship in the last 24 years. The ownership is not the same. Uniforms don't win games. However my main point is that even if they do return to prominence, the direct competition with Cal for ticket buying fans will be less than before due to their location in Santa Clara. Most of the new ticket buying fans will be drawn from Silicon Valley and the large and prosperous population of the South Bay. That is the primary reason the Niners moved to the South Bay in the first place. I don't think the possibility of a Niner improvement diminishes the opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fanbase in SF, Alameda, Contra Costa and the North Bay counties presented by the Niners move from the San Francisco MSA to the San Jose MSA.

---

OaktownBear said:

---

71Bear said:

---

calumnus said:

---

IPutting aside our current debates over coaches and players...I see a bright future for Cal's revenue sports.

There is a major economic opportunity that has and will be created by:
1. The Niners move to Santa Clara and decline in relevance.
2. The Raiders move to Las Vegas.
3. The Warriors move to San Francisco.

This leaves a huge opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fan base as the football team for residents of SF, the East Bay and North Bay and the basketball team supported by the East Bay.

A key will be local recruiting. However, as more kids grow up as Cal fans, more will opt to play for the local team.

I think it is critical that the expansion of the fan base NOT be based on a generic pro sport style atmosphere. It has to be about emphasizing Cal traditions. Our songs, colors, mascot, band and traditions....all contribute to feelings of connection with the team and our school. The initial target for growth is the huge alumni base anyway. This will be sold to the academics as building a loyal donor base.
If local stars play for Cal, that will draw in more and more casual fans.

We need to develop the local AAU program, especially the Soldiers, as a pipeline for basketball, and all of the California JCs, but especially CCSF and Laney, as a pipeline for both sports as long as the California JCs can maintain their athletic programs.

Stanford, has not been a major force in recruiting locally for decades, has a small alumni base, shrunk their stadium and now has the Niners in their backyard. Meanwhile, USC and UCLA have to deal with an emerging LA Ram dynasty. Plus the Chargers (and the Raiders in relatively nearby Vegas). And that Ram team sports our colors and has a QB from Cal. Thus creating a great opening for the state's flagship university to recruit in the southern portion of the state.

We also should develop the world's best sports management, finance and marketing program at the Haas School of Business. Sports is a huge multi-billion dollar industry worldwide and there is no formal training for the many lucrative jobs. interns could work on projects in the AD, including marketing and fundraising campaigns, improving the ticket office or work in the nearby PAC-12 offices....This program would be a major draw for student athletes, both as undergrads and as grad transfers, and admissions preference could be given to current/former D1 athletes. We might attract highly regarded coaches who might enjoy teaching or taking classes.

I believe all of the above could make Cal a powerhouse in both the revenue and non-revenue sports.

---

You made one big mistake.

You seriously underestimated the power of the Niners. They are THE crown jewel of Bay Area pro franchises. Once they get their s... together, they will suck all of the oxygen out of the sports air and that is that.

You need proof? Just think back to the 80's when they were the biggest story in the Bay Area (sports or otherwise).

---

One big mistake? Some of the ideas are good but the idea that Cal is getting fans from 2 teams that move less than 20 miles especially when most people watch on television is fantasy. Number of fans Cal draws from Niners = 0. Number of Raider fans Cal draws = 0 (anyone leaving the Raiders goes to the Niners or another NFL team. Number of fans Cal gets from the Warriors moving to SF= negative 15 - 15 old blues from the East Bay now too tired to go to Cal game after BARTing across the Bay to the Warriors game. Seriously. Fans of the best basketball team in the universe, perhaps ever, perhaps the best sports team are going to slum it to Cal games because the Warriors moved across a bridge? What was it Blublood used to say? Something with a lot of Ha's and a bunch of exclamation points?

---

71Bear said:

---

calumnus said:

---

71Bear said:

---

calumnus said:

---

IPutting aside our current debates over coaches and players...I see a bright future for Cal's revenue sports.

There is a major economic opportunity that has and will be created by:
1. The Niners move to Santa Clara and decline in relevance.
2. The Raiders move to Las Vegas.
3. The Warriors move to San Francisco.

This leaves a huge opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fan base as the football team for residents of SF, the East Bay and North Bay and the basketball team supported by the East Bay.

A key will be local recruiting. However, as more kids grow up as Cal fans, more will opt to play for the local team.

I think it is critical that the expansion of the fan base NOT be based on a generic pro sport style atmosphere. It has to be about emphasizing Cal traditions. Our songs, colors, mascot, band and traditions....all contribute to feelings of connection with the team and our school. The initial target for growth is the huge alumni base anyway. This will be sold to the academics as building a loyal donor base.
If local stars play for Cal, that will draw in more and more casual fans.

We need to develop the local AAU program, especially the Soldiers, as a pipeline for basketball, and all of the California JCs, but especially CCSF and Laney, as a pipeline for both sports as long as the California JCs can maintain their athletic programs.

Stanford, has not been a major force in recruiting locally for decades, has a small alumni base, shrunk their stadium and now has the Niners in their backyard. Meanwhile, USC and UCLA have to deal with an emerging LA Ram dynasty. Plus the Chargers (and the Raiders in relatively nearby Vegas). And that Ram team sports our colors and has a QB from Cal. Thus creating a great opening for the state's flagship university to recruit in the southern portion of the state.

We also should develop the world's best sports management, finance and marketing program at the Haas School of Business. Sports is a huge multi-billion dollar industry worldwide and there is no formal training for the many lucrative jobs. interns could work on projects in the AD, including marketing and fundraising campaigns, improving the ticket office or work in the nearby PAC-12 offices....This program would be a major draw for student athletes, both as undergrads and as grad transfers, and admissions preference could be given to current/former D1 athletes. We might attract highly regarded coaches who might enjoy teaching or taking classes.

I believe all of the above could make Cal a powerhouse in both the revenue and non-revenue sports.

---

You made one big mistake.

You seriously underestimated the power of the Niners. They are THE crown jewel of Bay Area pro franchises. Once they get their s... together, they will suck all of the oxygen out of the sports air and that is that.

You need proof? Just think back to the 80's when they were the biggest story in the Bay Area (sports or otherwise).

---

I do not underestimate the dedication of die hards like yourself who buy BOTH Cal and NFL tickets. Clearly the bigger opportunity is Cal as the East Bay team with the Raiders/Warriors moving.

The Walsh/Montana Niners were dominant in the 80s. They have won 1 NFC championship in the last 24 years. The ownership is not the same. Uniforms don't win games. However my main point is that even if they do return to prominence, the direct competition with Cal for ticket buying fans will be less than before due to their location in Santa Clara. Most of the new ticket buying fans will be drawn from Silicon Valley and the large and prosperous population of the South Bay. That is the primary reason the Niners moved to the South Bay in the first place. I don't think the possibility of a Niner improvement diminishes the opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fanbase in SF, Alameda, Contra Costa and the North Bay counties presented by the Niners move from the San Francisco MSA to the San Jose MSA.

---

Just for the record, I buy tickets to neither Cal games nor Niner games. However, I watch both teams play on television.

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calumnus said:

---

OaktownBear said:

---

71Bear said:

---

calumnus said:

---

IPutting aside our current debates over coaches and players...I see a bright future for Cal's revenue sports.

There is a major economic opportunity that has and will be created by:
1. The Niners move to Santa Clara and decline in relevance.
2. The Raiders move to Las Vegas.
3. The Warriors move to San Francisco.

This leaves a huge opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fan base as the football team for residents of SF, the East Bay and North Bay and the basketball team supported by the East Bay.

A key will be local recruiting. However, as more kids grow up as Cal fans, more will opt to play for the local team.

I think it is critical that the expansion of the fan base NOT be based on a generic pro sport style atmosphere. It has to be about emphasizing Cal traditions. Our songs, colors, mascot, band and traditions....all contribute to feelings of connection with the team and our school. The initial target for growth is the huge alumni base anyway. This will be sold to the academics as building a loyal donor base.
If local stars play for Cal, that will draw in more and more casual fans.

We need to develop the local AAU program, especially the Soldiers, as a pipeline for basketball, and all of the California JCs, but especially CCSF and Laney, as a pipeline for both sports as long as the California JCs can maintain their athletic programs.

Stanford, has not been a major force in recruiting locally for decades, has a small alumni base, shrunk their stadium and now has the Niners in their backyard. Meanwhile, USC and UCLA have to deal with an emerging LA Ram dynasty. Plus the Chargers (and the Raiders in relatively nearby Vegas). And that Ram team sports our colors and has a QB from Cal. Thus creating a great opening for the state's flagship university to recruit in the southern portion of the state.

We also should develop the world's best sports management, finance and marketing program at the Haas School of Business. Sports is a huge multi-billion dollar industry worldwide and there is no formal training for the many lucrative jobs. interns could work on projects in the AD, including marketing and fundraising campaigns, improving the ticket office or work in the nearby PAC-12 offices....This program would be a major draw for student athletes, both as undergrads and as grad transfers, and admissions preference could be given to current/former D1 athletes. We might attract highly regarded coaches who might enjoy teaching or taking classes.

I believe all of the above could make Cal a powerhouse in both the revenue and non-revenue sports.

---

You made one big mistake.

You seriously underestimated the power of the Niners. They are THE crown jewel of Bay Area pro franchises. Once they get their s... together, they will suck all of the oxygen out of the sports air and that is that.

You need proof? Just think back to the 80's when they were the biggest story in the Bay Area (sports or otherwise).

---

One big mistake? Some of the ideas are good but the idea that Cal is getting fans from 2 teams that move less than 20 miles especially when most people watch on television is fantasy. Number of fans Cal draws from Niners = 0. Number of Raider fans Cal draws = 0 (anyone leaving the Raiders goes to the Niners or another NFL team. Number of fans Cal gets from the Warriors moving to SF= negative 15 - 15 old blues from the East Bay now too tired to go to Cal game after BARTing across the Bay to the Warriors game. Seriously. Fans of the best basketball team in the universe, perhaps ever, perhaps the best sports team are going to slum it to Cal games because the Warriors moved across a bridge? What was it Blublood used to say? Something with a lot of Ha's and a bunch of exclamation points?

---

It is not all or nothing. Do you really think every Raider ticket holder will start buying Niner tickets and drive to Santa Clara to see them? We have seen this before. Some will. Some will fly to Vegas. But some who enjoy going to football games and have the money to do so might look at going to Cal games, especially the Cal grads. Even if it is "just" 10,000 fans, that would be huge for Cal.

Similarly, with the Warriors moving to SF, the current core East Bay fans are going to have increased competition from SF, *****ula and South Bay fans for tickets. Prices will be higher. That is why they are moving.

Again, I am not saying it is 100% or that it is automatic, it is an opportunity, one that would need to be successfully pursued. Also, I am not necessarily talking about the short term. A big part of it is players growing up as Cal fans, maybe going to games, and then choosing Cal because of that.

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bearsahead2 said:

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Calumnus, I like the way you think! You raise many good points hope our alma mater pursues your thoughts.

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71Bear said:

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You seriously underestimated the power of the Niners. They are THE crown jewel of Bay Area pro franchises. Once they get their s... together, they will suck all of the oxygen out of the sports air and that is that.

You need proof? Just think back to the 80's when they were the biggest story in the Bay Area (sports or otherwise).

---

Bear19 said:

---

71Bear said:

---

You seriously underestimated the power of the Niners. They are THE crown jewel of Bay Area pro franchises. Once they get their s... together, they will suck all of the oxygen out of the sports air and that is that.

You need proof? Just think back to the 80's when they were the biggest story in the Bay Area (sports or otherwise).

---

They were big in the 80's, not so much after Young retired. Also, Candlestick was not that long a drive from SF, the East Bay, North Bay. Santa Clara takes a lot more time to come & go from these areas. It has been a while since the Niners won consistently.

How many Easy Bay football fans will actually attend overpriced Niner games in Santa Clara to bake in the scortching heat even if they do more consistently compete with the Rams?

Key to getting Cal Football it's fair share of cache in Northern California, is, of course, consistently winning. calumnus' post suggests ways to make that happen. With the Raiders leaving NorCal there will be a lot of football fans with no games to attend. Opportunity looms.

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packawana said:

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I don't see how the Warriors moving helps us. East Bay basketball fans haven't been able to afford going to a Warriors game since Kerr took them to their first title.

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socaliganbear said:

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packawana said:

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I don't see how the Warriors moving helps us. East Bay basketball fans haven't been able to afford going to a Warriors game since Kerr took them to their first title.

---

Clearly, you don't go to Warrior games. Contrary to this narrative, it's not just Google employees.

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okaydo said:

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Peter Hartlaub, who is the San Francisco Chronicle's pop-culture critic and No. 2 movie critic, has no connection to UC Berkeley. (He went to Cal Poly SLO)

(He does, however, have a connection to the 49ers, as his parents have had season tickets for decades.)

Yet Hartlaub occasionally brings his kids to Cal games.

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socaliganbear said:

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packawana said:

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I don't see how the Warriors moving helps us. East Bay basketball fans haven't been able to afford going to a Warriors game since Kerr took them to their first title.

---

Clearly, you don't go to Warrior games. Contrary to this narrative, it's not just Google employees.

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calumnus said:

---

71Bear said:

---

calumnus said:

---

71Bear said:

---

calumnus said:

---

IPutting aside our current debates over coaches and players...I see a bright future for Cal's revenue sports.

There is a major economic opportunity that has and will be created by:
1. The Niners move to Santa Clara and decline in relevance.
2. The Raiders move to Las Vegas.
3. The Warriors move to San Francisco.

This leaves a huge opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fan base as the football team for residents of SF, the East Bay and North Bay and the basketball team supported by the East Bay.

A key will be local recruiting. However, as more kids grow up as Cal fans, more will opt to play for the local team.

I think it is critical that the expansion of the fan base NOT be based on a generic pro sport style atmosphere. It has to be about emphasizing Cal traditions. Our songs, colors, mascot, band and traditions....all contribute to feelings of connection with the team and our school. The initial target for growth is the huge alumni base anyway. This will be sold to the academics as building a loyal donor base.
If local stars play for Cal, that will draw in more and more casual fans.

We need to develop the local AAU program, especially the Soldiers, as a pipeline for basketball, and all of the California JCs, but especially CCSF and Laney, as a pipeline for both sports as long as the California JCs can maintain their athletic programs.

Stanford, has not been a major force in recruiting locally for decades, has a small alumni base, shrunk their stadium and now has the Niners in their backyard. Meanwhile, USC and UCLA have to deal with an emerging LA Ram dynasty. Plus the Chargers (and the Raiders in relatively nearby Vegas). And that Ram team sports our colors and has a QB from Cal. Thus creating a great opening for the state's flagship university to recruit in the southern portion of the state.

We also should develop the world's best sports management, finance and marketing program at the Haas School of Business. Sports is a huge multi-billion dollar industry worldwide and there is no formal training for the many lucrative jobs. interns could work on projects in the AD, including marketing and fundraising campaigns, improving the ticket office or work in the nearby PAC-12 offices....This program would be a major draw for student athletes, both as undergrads and as grad transfers, and admissions preference could be given to current/former D1 athletes. We might attract highly regarded coaches who might enjoy teaching or taking classes.

I believe all of the above could make Cal a powerhouse in both the revenue and non-revenue sports.

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You made one big mistake.

You seriously underestimated the power of the Niners. They are THE crown jewel of Bay Area pro franchises. Once they get their s... together, they will suck all of the oxygen out of the sports air and that is that.

You need proof? Just think back to the 80's when they were the biggest story in the Bay Area (sports or otherwise).

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I do not underestimate the dedication of die hards like yourself who buy BOTH Cal and NFL tickets. Clearly the bigger opportunity is Cal as the East Bay team with the Raiders/Warriors moving.

The Walsh/Montana Niners were dominant in the 80s. They have won 1 NFC championship in the last 24 years. The ownership is not the same. Uniforms don't win games. However my main point is that even if they do return to prominence, the direct competition with Cal for ticket buying fans will be less than before due to their location in Santa Clara. Most of the new ticket buying fans will be drawn from Silicon Valley and the large and prosperous population of the South Bay. That is the primary reason the Niners moved to the South Bay in the first place. I don't think the possibility of a Niner improvement diminishes the opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fanbase in SF, Alameda, Contra Costa and the North Bay counties presented by the Niners move from the San Francisco MSA to the San Jose MSA.

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Just for the record, I buy tickets to neither Cal games nor Niner games. However, I watch both teams play on television.

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Oh, that is surprising to me. Did you use to go to either or both?

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OaktownBear said:

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calumnus said:

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OaktownBear said:

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71Bear said:

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calumnus said:

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IPutting aside our current debates over coaches and players...I see a bright future for Cal's revenue sports.

There is a major economic opportunity that has and will be created by:
1. The Niners move to Santa Clara and decline in relevance.
2. The Raiders move to Las Vegas.
3. The Warriors move to San Francisco.

This leaves a huge opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fan base as the football team for residents of SF, the East Bay and North Bay and the basketball team supported by the East Bay.

A key will be local recruiting. However, as more kids grow up as Cal fans, more will opt to play for the local team.

I think it is critical that the expansion of the fan base NOT be based on a generic pro sport style atmosphere. It has to be about emphasizing Cal traditions. Our songs, colors, mascot, band and traditions....all contribute to feelings of connection with the team and our school. The initial target for growth is the huge alumni base anyway. This will be sold to the academics as building a loyal donor base.
If local stars play for Cal, that will draw in more and more casual fans.

We need to develop the local AAU program, especially the Soldiers, as a pipeline for basketball, and all of the California JCs, but especially CCSF and Laney, as a pipeline for both sports as long as the California JCs can maintain their athletic programs.

Stanford, has not been a major force in recruiting locally for decades, has a small alumni base, shrunk their stadium and now has the Niners in their backyard. Meanwhile, USC and UCLA have to deal with an emerging LA Ram dynasty. Plus the Chargers (and the Raiders in relatively nearby Vegas). And that Ram team sports our colors and has a QB from Cal. Thus creating a great opening for the state's flagship university to recruit in the southern portion of the state.

We also should develop the world's best sports management, finance and marketing program at the Haas School of Business. Sports is a huge multi-billion dollar industry worldwide and there is no formal training for the many lucrative jobs. interns could work on projects in the AD, including marketing and fundraising campaigns, improving the ticket office or work in the nearby PAC-12 offices....This program would be a major draw for student athletes, both as undergrads and as grad transfers, and admissions preference could be given to current/former D1 athletes. We might attract highly regarded coaches who might enjoy teaching or taking classes.

I believe all of the above could make Cal a powerhouse in both the revenue and non-revenue sports.

---

You made one big mistake.

You seriously underestimated the power of the Niners. They are THE crown jewel of Bay Area pro franchises. Once they get their s... together, they will suck all of the oxygen out of the sports air and that is that.

You need proof? Just think back to the 80's when they were the biggest story in the Bay Area (sports or otherwise).

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One big mistake? Some of the ideas are good but the idea that Cal is getting fans from 2 teams that move less than 20 miles especially when most people watch on television is fantasy. Number of fans Cal draws from Niners = 0. Number of Raider fans Cal draws = 0 (anyone leaving the Raiders goes to the Niners or another NFL team. Number of fans Cal gets from the Warriors moving to SF= negative 15 - 15 old blues from the East Bay now too tired to go to Cal game after BARTing across the Bay to the Warriors game. Seriously. Fans of the best basketball team in the universe, perhaps ever, perhaps the best sports team are going to slum it to Cal games because the Warriors moved across a bridge? What was it Blublood used to say? Something with a lot of Ha's and a bunch of exclamation points?

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It is not all or nothing. Do you really think every Raider ticket holder will start buying Niner tickets and drive to Santa Clara to see them? We have seen this before. Some will. Some will fly to Vegas. But some who enjoy going to football games and have the money to do so might look at going to Cal games, especially the Cal grads. Even if it is "just" 10,000 fans, that would be huge for Cal.

Similarly, with the Warriors moving to SF, the current core East Bay fans are going to have increased competition from SF, *****ula and South Bay fans for tickets. Prices will be higher. That is why they are moving.

Again, I am not saying it is 100% or that it is automatic, it is an opportunity, one that would need to be successfully pursued. Also, I am not necessarily talking about the short term. A big part of it is players growing up as Cal fans, maybe going to games, and then choosing Cal because of that.

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I get that you aren't saying 100%. 10,000 fans would be awesome. I'm saying it is close to 0%. I'd be shocked if Cal picked up 100 fans. I'm not sure your point on the 49ers. They already moved and our ticket sales went down. Have you seen the Warriors? They don't play the same game as anything that happens at Cal. Most East Bay Warriors fans watch most games on television and will continue to do so. The Raiders moved before and it didn't benefit Cal. They are not the same markets.

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Bobodeluxe said:

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OaktownBear said:

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okaydo said:

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Peter Hartlaub, who is the San Francisco Chronicle's pop-culture critic and No. 2 movie critic, has no connection to UC Berkeley. (He went to Cal Poly SLO)

(He does, however, have a connection to the 49ers, as his parents have had season tickets for decades.)

Yet Hartlaub occasionally brings his kids to Cal games.

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The question isn't whether there are fans of both teams. There undoubtedly are. The question is whether the three teams moving (one that already did several years ago and one that is moving like 15 miles) is going to open up a new pool of fans That wasn't there before. Obviously there have always been some fans that could go to 49ers games that choose to go to Cal games. Will any appreciable number of people who formerly chose to go to 49ers games switch to Cal because the 49ers went to Santa Clara? Question has been answered-no. Will any Raiders fans? They didn't when the Raiders moved to LA. Will any Warriors fans? It's not remotely the same product. They've always been the Bay Area team, not the East Bay team. No reason to see a switch. 10,000 fans is a pipe dream.

Calumnus has some good points. But one key point is to know your market and sell to it. Not to sell to markets that have a low percentage of hit rate. Cal needs to be selling to alums and particularly start selling to families again - a market that is open to a cheaper experience than the pros and one they abandoned when they decided we were so popular under Tedford that they didn't have to give a damned about maintaining a fan base but could just squeeze every dollar out of what they had.

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Worth repeating, over and over:

"Cal needs to be selling to alums and particularly start selling to families again - a market that is open to a cheaper experience than the pros and one they abandoned when they decided we were so popular under Tedford that they didn't have to give a damned about maintaining a fan base but could just squeeze every dollar out of what they had."

This is the same mistake Cal made when hoops moved into Haas. Screw the long time ticket holders in favor of short term gain.

Move the students to the end zone. Free tickets if needed.

First, offer the newly available seats to any season ticket holder, including all lapsed season ticket holders, at a fair price. Then let others buy in, at the same price.

All corner seats should be cheap, with season ticket purchase discount.

Fill the place as much as possible to create the image that Memorial is the place to be.

If that fails, blame Buh.

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71Bear said:

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The only way to generate any kind of interest is winning big and that is a tall order given the level of competition in the Northwest......

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BearSD said:

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71Bear said:

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The only way to generate any kind of interest is winning big and that is a tall order given the level of competition in the Northwest......

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Winning is important. And no team's attendance is ever again going to be like it was way back when there were almost no games on TV and the only options for following the game were listening on the radio or going to the stadium.

But don't throw in the towel just because you don't think Cal will win as much as Petersen at UW. Going to bowl games (almost) every year would be enough to bring more people to the stadium.

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71Bear said:

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BearSD said:

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71Bear said:

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The only way to generate any kind of interest is winning big and that is a tall order given the level of competition in the Northwest......

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Winning is important. And no team's attendance is ever again going to be like it was way back when there were almost no games on TV and the only options for following the game were listening on the radio or going to the stadium.

But don't throw in the towel just because you don't think Cal will win as much as Petersen at UW. Going to bowl games (almost) every year would be enough to bring more people to the stadium.

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I assume you mean going to mid-level bowl games. In your opinion, how many more people would attend games if Cal regularly met the "mid-level bowl win threshold". Just curious.....

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71Bear said:

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I think this discussion can be summed nicely by quoting Stewart Mandel, editor of The Athletic's college football page, in today's Mandel Mailbag (there were a couple questions relating to Bay Area college football topics - Kyler Murray turning down the A's and the Raiders playing at Memorial Stadium).

"I've always said the living in the Bay Area is not exactly the most conducive place from which to cover college football for a living".

Note: Mandel lives in the San Jose area.

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71Bear said:

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calumnus said:

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71Bear said:

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calumnus said:

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71Bear said:

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calumnus said:

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IPutting aside our current debates over coaches and players...I see a bright future for Cal's revenue sports.

There is a major economic opportunity that has and will be created by:
1. The Niners move to Santa Clara and decline in relevance.
2. The Raiders move to Las Vegas.
3. The Warriors move to San Francisco.

This leaves a huge opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fan base as the football team for residents of SF, the East Bay and North Bay and the basketball team supported by the East Bay.

A key will be local recruiting. However, as more kids grow up as Cal fans, more will opt to play for the local team.

I think it is critical that the expansion of the fan base NOT be based on a generic pro sport style atmosphere. It has to be about emphasizing Cal traditions. Our songs, colors, mascot, band and traditions....all contribute to feelings of connection with the team and our school. The initial target for growth is the huge alumni base anyway. This will be sold to the academics as building a loyal donor base.
If local stars play for Cal, that will draw in more and more casual fans.

We need to develop the local AAU program, especially the Soldiers, as a pipeline for basketball, and all of the California JCs, but especially CCSF and Laney, as a pipeline for both sports as long as the California JCs can maintain their athletic programs.

Stanford, has not been a major force in recruiting locally for decades, has a small alumni base, shrunk their stadium and now has the Niners in their backyard. Meanwhile, USC and UCLA have to deal with an emerging LA Ram dynasty. Plus the Chargers (and the Raiders in relatively nearby Vegas). And that Ram team sports our colors and has a QB from Cal. Thus creating a great opening for the state's flagship university to recruit in the southern portion of the state.

We also should develop the world's best sports management, finance and marketing program at the Haas School of Business. Sports is a huge multi-billion dollar industry worldwide and there is no formal training for the many lucrative jobs. interns could work on projects in the AD, including marketing and fundraising campaigns, improving the ticket office or work in the nearby PAC-12 offices....This program would be a major draw for student athletes, both as undergrads and as grad transfers, and admissions preference could be given to current/former D1 athletes. We might attract highly regarded coaches who might enjoy teaching or taking classes.

I believe all of the above could make Cal a powerhouse in both the revenue and non-revenue sports.

---

You made one big mistake.

You seriously underestimated the power of the Niners. They are THE crown jewel of Bay Area pro franchises. Once they get their s... together, they will suck all of the oxygen out of the sports air and that is that.

You need proof? Just think back to the 80's when they were the biggest story in the Bay Area (sports or otherwise).

---

I do not underestimate the dedication of die hards like yourself who buy BOTH Cal and NFL tickets. Clearly the bigger opportunity is Cal as the East Bay team with the Raiders/Warriors moving.

The Walsh/Montana Niners were dominant in the 80s. They have won 1 NFC championship in the last 24 years. The ownership is not the same. Uniforms don't win games. However my main point is that even if they do return to prominence, the direct competition with Cal for ticket buying fans will be less than before due to their location in Santa Clara. Most of the new ticket buying fans will be drawn from Silicon Valley and the large and prosperous population of the South Bay. That is the primary reason the Niners moved to the South Bay in the first place. I don't think the possibility of a Niner improvement diminishes the opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fanbase in SF, Alameda, Contra Costa and the North Bay counties presented by the Niners move from the San Francisco MSA to the San Jose MSA.

---

Just for the record, I buy tickets to neither Cal games nor Niner games. However, I watch both teams play on television.

---

Oh, that is surprising to me. Did you use to go to either or both?

---

Yep. I had Cal season tix 35+ years and gave them up after Barbour ruined the game day experience. I also attended a number of SF games each year.

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Bears2thDoc said:

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71Bear said:

---

calumnus said:

---

71Bear said:

---

calumnus said:

---

71Bear said:

---

calumnus said:

---

IPutting aside our current debates over coaches and players...I see a bright future for Cal's revenue sports.

There is a major economic opportunity that has and will be created by:
1. The Niners move to Santa Clara and decline in relevance.
2. The Raiders move to Las Vegas.
3. The Warriors move to San Francisco.

This leaves a huge opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fan base as the football team for residents of SF, the East Bay and North Bay and the basketball team supported by the East Bay.

A key will be local recruiting. However, as more kids grow up as Cal fans, more will opt to play for the local team.

I think it is critical that the expansion of the fan base NOT be based on a generic pro sport style atmosphere. It has to be about emphasizing Cal traditions. Our songs, colors, mascot, band and traditions....all contribute to feelings of connection with the team and our school. The initial target for growth is the huge alumni base anyway. This will be sold to the academics as building a loyal donor base.
If local stars play for Cal, that will draw in more and more casual fans.

We need to develop the local AAU program, especially the Soldiers, as a pipeline for basketball, and all of the California JCs, but especially CCSF and Laney, as a pipeline for both sports as long as the California JCs can maintain their athletic programs.

Stanford, has not been a major force in recruiting locally for decades, has a small alumni base, shrunk their stadium and now has the Niners in their backyard. Meanwhile, USC and UCLA have to deal with an emerging LA Ram dynasty. Plus the Chargers (and the Raiders in relatively nearby Vegas). And that Ram team sports our colors and has a QB from Cal. Thus creating a great opening for the state's flagship university to recruit in the southern portion of the state.

We also should develop the world's best sports management, finance and marketing program at the Haas School of Business. Sports is a huge multi-billion dollar industry worldwide and there is no formal training for the many lucrative jobs. interns could work on projects in the AD, including marketing and fundraising campaigns, improving the ticket office or work in the nearby PAC-12 offices....This program would be a major draw for student athletes, both as undergrads and as grad transfers, and admissions preference could be given to current/former D1 athletes. We might attract highly regarded coaches who might enjoy teaching or taking classes.

I believe all of the above could make Cal a powerhouse in both the revenue and non-revenue sports.

---

You made one big mistake.

You seriously underestimated the power of the Niners. They are THE crown jewel of Bay Area pro franchises. Once they get their s... together, they will suck all of the oxygen out of the sports air and that is that.

You need proof? Just think back to the 80's when they were the biggest story in the Bay Area (sports or otherwise).

---

I do not underestimate the dedication of die hards like yourself who buy BOTH Cal and NFL tickets. Clearly the bigger opportunity is Cal as the East Bay team with the Raiders/Warriors moving.

The Walsh/Montana Niners were dominant in the 80s. They have won 1 NFC championship in the last 24 years. The ownership is not the same. Uniforms don't win games. However my main point is that even if they do return to prominence, the direct competition with Cal for ticket buying fans will be less than before due to their location in Santa Clara. Most of the new ticket buying fans will be drawn from Silicon Valley and the large and prosperous population of the South Bay. That is the primary reason the Niners moved to the South Bay in the first place. I don't think the possibility of a Niner improvement diminishes the opportunity for Cal to grow it's ticket buying fanbase in SF, Alameda, Contra Costa and the North Bay counties presented by the Niners move from the San Francisco MSA to the San Jose MSA.

---

Just for the record, I buy tickets to neither Cal games nor Niner games. However, I watch both teams play on television.

---

Oh, that is surprising to me. Did you use to go to either or both?

---

Yep. I had Cal season tix 35+ years and gave them up after Barbour ruined the game day experience. I also attended a number of SF games each year.

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That's it in a f-ing nutshell......
The vast majority of attending fans hates the piped in music.......
Cal doesn't care.
The vast majority of fans wants to hear more Cal Band.....
Cal doesn't care.
The vast majority of fans on the east side would like to have drinking fountains and not garden hoses( yeah they would...if you asked them).....
Cal doesn't care.
The vast majority of fans on the east side would like REAL bathrooms......
Cal doesn't care.
The vast majority of fans would like to know how they can plan their game day more than 7 days in advance.
Cal doesn't care.
Bottom line....
There are ways to make the fan experience better, even in less than optimistic performance years.
Cal doesn't care.
All the BS regarding Fan Experience questionnaires is just an illusion so fans THINK Cal cares.
If one wants a real bathroom....Cal says 'Pay more money"
If one wants safe drinking water....Cal says "Pay more money'
Not too long ago....If one wanted to listen to the game on the radio..... Cal said, "Pay more money."
A few decades ago, there were bathrooms on the east side..... they got turned into a Club House.
Not too long ago, there were no bathrooms, let alone no showers on the east side.... well guess what, magically bathrooms and showers appeared.....then just as magically, they were removed.
Cal doesn't care about fans showing up....they only care that fans buy tickets.
Name one...just one... other D1 Football stadium in the USA where 50% of the fans have to drink water from a garden hose. Hell.....just name another college stadium that makes one do that.

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