Pac 12 changes in conference transfer rule and increases payouts to teams

2,782 Views | 18 Replies | Last: 4 yr ago by Big C
BearGreg
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Staff
Per ESPN - Pac 12 Revenue Drops but payouts increase
wifeisafurd
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A certain AD (not the one at Cal) indicated that the drop in men's basketball revenue cost each school almost $1 million. A lot of that is declining revenue sharing from post-season play, because the Pac men's basketball programs are getting to post-season in small number, and the few teams that do, are not advancing. So tennis Larry is supposed to be working on initiatives to improve both football and men's basketball. Reading the article suggests that Tennis Larry said improve OOC scheduling. So let's see how this works in football:

I get that you have to play regional teams that may stink, but the OOC the California teams usually play isn't comparable to most teams. Cal which went to the lowest ranked Pac bowl game may have the weakest OOC among the California schools at it plays a tough North Texas team and a SEC school, Ole Miss, away. Okay, it has a breather with Davis. But then you look at Sun Bowl Furd: At UCF, a highly ranked team in preseason polls that has lost 1 game in two years, Notre Dame, and for the easy game, Northwestern. Non-bowl eiigible SC is foolish enough to go to Fresno State, and then play BYU and Notre Dame. I guess BYU is the breather. Non-eligible UCLA away at a good Cincy team (11-2 last year), always tough SDSU, and then freaking Oklahoma.

Holiday Bowl WSU play: NM State, Northern Colorado, and Houston (non P5, okay game). Who does defending southern conference champ Utah play: BYU (real game I grant you), Idaho State and Northern Illinois. Who does Rose Bowl Udub play: Hawaii, Eastern Washington and BYU, mot a power team among them though bYU s/b decent. Sensing a trend here: the top conference football teams in the last couple years get places because they play easy OOC schedules. So Tennis Larry says play tougher team. I see how this is more equitable to the California schools, but how exactly does that help situation of getting teams into more lucrative bowl games or the play-offs. And how does tennis Larry get these teams to pay tougher opponents? Does a SEC school get some advantage playing a physical Utah team instead of a local cream-puff?

I'm not sure how it works in basketball either, but I'm wiling to listen.

BearSD
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The solution in basketball is for Arizona to keep the NCAA and FBI away, and for UCLA to have a head coach who runs the program competently.
71Bear
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wifeisafurd said:

A certain AD (not the one at Cal) indicated that the drop in men's basketball revenue cost each school almost $1 million. A lot of that is declining revenue sharing from post-season play, because the Pac men's basketball programs are getting to post-season in small number, and the few teams that do, are not advancing. So tennis Larry is supposed to be working on initiatives to improve both football and men's basketball. Reading the article suggests that Tennis Larry said improve OOC scheduling. So let's see how this works in football:

I get that you have to play regional teams that may stink, but the OOC the California teams usually play isn't comparable to most teams. Cal which went to the lowest ranked Pac bowl game may have the weakest OOC among the California schools at it plays a tough North Texas team and a SEC school, Ole Miss, away. Okay, it has a breather with Davis. But then you look at Sun Bowl Furd: At UCF, a highly ranked team in preseason polls that has lost 1 game in two years, Notre Dame, and for the easy game, Northwestern. Non-bowl eiigible SC is foolish enough to go to Fresno State, and then play BYU and Notre Dame. I guess BYU is the breather. Non-eligible UCLA away at a good Cincy team (11-2 last year), always tough SDSU, and then freaking Oklahoma.

Holiday Bowl WSU play: NM State, Northern Colorado, and Houston (non P5, okay game). Who does defending southern conference champ Utah play: BYU (real game I grant you), Idaho State and Northern Illinois. Who does Rose Bowl Udub play: Hawaii, Eastern Washington and BYU, mot a power team among them though bYU s/b decent. Sensing a trend here: the top conference football teams in the last couple years get places because they play easy OOC schedules. So Tennis Larry says play tougher team. I see how this is more equitable to the California schools, but how exactly does that help situation of getting teams into more lucrative bowl games or the play-offs. And how does tennis Larry get these teams to pay tougher opponents? Does a SEC school get some advantage playing a physical Utah team instead of a local cream-puff?

I'm not sure how it works in basketball either, but I'm wiling to listen.


I'm confused. I thought the initiative approved today applied to hoops. Who said anything about football?
wifeisafurd
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71Bear said:

wifeisafurd said:

A certain AD (not the one at Cal) indicated that the drop in men's basketball revenue cost each school almost $1 million. A lot of that is declining revenue sharing from post-season play, because the Pac men's basketball programs are getting to post-season in small number, and the few teams that do, are not advancing. So tennis Larry is supposed to be working on initiatives to improve both football and men's basketball. Reading the article suggests that Tennis Larry said improve OOC scheduling. So let's see how this works in football:

I get that you have to play regional teams that may stink, but the OOC the California teams usually play isn't comparable to most teams. Cal which went to the lowest ranked Pac bowl game may have the weakest OOC among the California schools at it plays a tough North Texas team and a SEC school, Ole Miss, away. Okay, it has a breather with Davis. But then you look at Sun Bowl Furd: At UCF, a highly ranked team in preseason polls that has lost 1 game in two years, Notre Dame, and for the easy game, Northwestern. Non-bowl eiigible SC is foolish enough to go to Fresno State, and then play BYU and Notre Dame. I guess BYU is the breather. Non-eligible UCLA away at a good Cincy team (11-2 last year), always tough SDSU, and then freaking Oklahoma.

Holiday Bowl WSU play: NM State, Northern Colorado, and Houston (non P5, okay game). Who does defending southern conference champ Utah play: BYU (real game I grant you), Idaho State and Northern Illinois. Who does Rose Bowl Udub play: Hawaii, Eastern Washington and BYU, mot a power team among them though bYU s/b decent. Sensing a trend here: the top conference football teams in the last couple years get places because they play easy OOC schedules. So Tennis Larry says play tougher team. I see how this is more equitable to the California schools, but how exactly does that help situation of getting teams into more lucrative bowl games or the play-offs. And how does tennis Larry get these teams to pay tougher opponents? Does a SEC school get some advantage playing a physical Utah team instead of a local cream-puff?

I'm not sure how it works in basketball either, but I'm wiling to listen.


I'm confused. I thought the initiative approved today applied to hoops. Who said anything about football?
Muir.
71Bear
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wifeisafurd said:

71Bear said:

wifeisafurd said:

A certain AD (not the one at Cal) indicated that the drop in men's basketball revenue cost each school almost $1 million. A lot of that is declining revenue sharing from post-season play, because the Pac men's basketball programs are getting to post-season in small number, and the few teams that do, are not advancing. So tennis Larry is supposed to be working on initiatives to improve both football and men's basketball. Reading the article suggests that Tennis Larry said improve OOC scheduling. So let's see how this works in football:

I get that you have to play regional teams that may stink, but the OOC the California teams usually play isn't comparable to most teams. Cal which went to the lowest ranked Pac bowl game may have the weakest OOC among the California schools at it plays a tough North Texas team and a SEC school, Ole Miss, away. Okay, it has a breather with Davis. But then you look at Sun Bowl Furd: At UCF, a highly ranked team in preseason polls that has lost 1 game in two years, Notre Dame, and for the easy game, Northwestern. Non-bowl eiigible SC is foolish enough to go to Fresno State, and then play BYU and Notre Dame. I guess BYU is the breather. Non-eligible UCLA away at a good Cincy team (11-2 last year), always tough SDSU, and then freaking Oklahoma.

Holiday Bowl WSU play: NM State, Northern Colorado, and Houston (non P5, okay game). Who does defending southern conference champ Utah play: BYU (real game I grant you), Idaho State and Northern Illinois. Who does Rose Bowl Udub play: Hawaii, Eastern Washington and BYU, mot a power team among them though bYU s/b decent. Sensing a trend here: the top conference football teams in the last couple years get places because they play easy OOC schedules. So Tennis Larry says play tougher team. I see how this is more equitable to the California schools, but how exactly does that help situation of getting teams into more lucrative bowl games or the play-offs. And how does tennis Larry get these teams to pay tougher opponents? Does a SEC school get some advantage playing a physical Utah team instead of a local cream-puff?

I'm not sure how it works in basketball either, but I'm wiling to listen.


I'm confused. I thought the initiative approved today applied to hoops. Who said anything about football?
Muir.
Just one guy's opinion. The conference doesn't need to improve its football scheduling. For the most part it is quite reasonable....
wifeisafurd
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71Bear said:

wifeisafurd said:

71Bear said:

wifeisafurd said:

A certain AD (not the one at Cal) indicated that the drop in men's basketball revenue cost each school almost $1 million. A lot of that is declining revenue sharing from post-season play, because the Pac men's basketball programs are getting to post-season in small number, and the few teams that do, are not advancing. So tennis Larry is supposed to be working on initiatives to improve both football and men's basketball. Reading the article suggests that Tennis Larry said improve OOC scheduling. So let's see how this works in football:

I get that you have to play regional teams that may stink, but the OOC the California teams usually play isn't comparable to most teams. Cal which went to the lowest ranked Pac bowl game may have the weakest OOC among the California schools at it plays a tough North Texas team and a SEC school, Ole Miss, away. Okay, it has a breather with Davis. But then you look at Sun Bowl Furd: At UCF, a highly ranked team in preseason polls that has lost 1 game in two years, Notre Dame, and for the easy game, Northwestern. Non-bowl eiigible SC is foolish enough to go to Fresno State, and then play BYU and Notre Dame. I guess BYU is the breather. Non-eligible UCLA away at a good Cincy team (11-2 last year), always tough SDSU, and then freaking Oklahoma.

Holiday Bowl WSU play: NM State, Northern Colorado, and Houston (non P5, okay game). Who does defending southern conference champ Utah play: BYU (real game I grant you), Idaho State and Northern Illinois. Who does Rose Bowl Udub play: Hawaii, Eastern Washington and BYU, mot a power team among them though bYU s/b decent. Sensing a trend here: the top conference football teams in the last couple years get places because they play easy OOC schedules. So Tennis Larry says play tougher team. I see how this is more equitable to the California schools, but how exactly does that help situation of getting teams into more lucrative bowl games or the play-offs. And how does tennis Larry get these teams to pay tougher opponents? Does a SEC school get some advantage playing a physical Utah team instead of a local cream-puff?

I'm not sure how it works in basketball either, but I'm wiling to listen.


I'm confused. I thought the initiative approved today applied to hoops. Who said anything about football?
Muir.
Just one guy's opinion. The conference doesn't need to improve its football scheduling. For the most part it is quite reasonable....
Not his opinion. Statement as to what conference is doing. He would know.
71Bear
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wifeisafurd said:

71Bear said:

wifeisafurd said:

71Bear said:

wifeisafurd said:

A certain AD (not the one at Cal) indicated that the drop in men's basketball revenue cost each school almost $1 million. A lot of that is declining revenue sharing from post-season play, because the Pac men's basketball programs are getting to post-season in small number, and the few teams that do, are not advancing. So tennis Larry is supposed to be working on initiatives to improve both football and men's basketball. Reading the article suggests that Tennis Larry said improve OOC scheduling. So let's see how this works in football:

I get that you have to play regional teams that may stink, but the OOC the California teams usually play isn't comparable to most teams. Cal which went to the lowest ranked Pac bowl game may have the weakest OOC among the California schools at it plays a tough North Texas team and a SEC school, Ole Miss, away. Okay, it has a breather with Davis. But then you look at Sun Bowl Furd: At UCF, a highly ranked team in preseason polls that has lost 1 game in two years, Notre Dame, and for the easy game, Northwestern. Non-bowl eiigible SC is foolish enough to go to Fresno State, and then play BYU and Notre Dame. I guess BYU is the breather. Non-eligible UCLA away at a good Cincy team (11-2 last year), always tough SDSU, and then freaking Oklahoma.

Holiday Bowl WSU play: NM State, Northern Colorado, and Houston (non P5, okay game). Who does defending southern conference champ Utah play: BYU (real game I grant you), Idaho State and Northern Illinois. Who does Rose Bowl Udub play: Hawaii, Eastern Washington and BYU, mot a power team among them though bYU s/b decent. Sensing a trend here: the top conference football teams in the last couple years get places because they play easy OOC schedules. So Tennis Larry says play tougher team. I see how this is more equitable to the California schools, but how exactly does that help situation of getting teams into more lucrative bowl games or the play-offs. And how does tennis Larry get these teams to pay tougher opponents? Does a SEC school get some advantage playing a physical Utah team instead of a local cream-puff?

I'm not sure how it works in basketball either, but I'm wiling to listen.


I'm confused. I thought the initiative approved today applied to hoops. Who said anything about football?
Muir.
Just one guy's opinion. The conference doesn't need to improve its football scheduling. For the most part it is quite reasonable....
Not his opinion. Statement as to what conference is doing. He would know.
Well, he is definitely wrong. As we have seen over the last several years, playing a strong schedule and losing a game is far worse than playing a mediocre schedule and winning every game. If the P12 wants to get serious about getting a team in the playoffs, they need to cut their conference schedule to eight games and play a meh OOC slate. That is the formula followed by our friends in Alabama and South Carolina. Muir is an idiot if he thinks otherwise....
BearSD
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After LSJU loses to Central Florida, ending their playoff chances in week 3, someone should ask Muir about that again.
Bear19
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71Bear said:

[quoteAs we have seen over the last several years, playing a strong schedule and losing a game is far worse than playing a mediocre schedule and winning every game. If the P12 wants to get serious about getting a team in the playoffs, they need to cut their conference schedule to eight games and play a meh OOC slate. That is the formula followed by our friends in Alabama and South Carolina. Muir is an idiot if he thinks otherwise....
Exactly. Playing The Citadel never hurt Alabama.
TheSouseFamily
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Also announced after the spring meetings: Larry Scott getting a $500K raise. Will now make $5.3M.
ColoradoBear
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Interesting thing about the repoeted revenue 'decrease' is that non-Rose Bowl related revenue would have actually gone up by ~ $26 million year over year. The primary ESPN/Fox TV contract has yearly escalators of about $13 million per year.

So something else actually caused $13 million INCREASE in p12 conferenence revenue.

Rose Bowl Rev should really be averaged over a 3 year cycle to accurately reflect real changes in revenue. Pac12 holds back and smooths its payouts to equalize the 1 of 3 year gap from the playoffs occupying Pasadena.
ColoradoBear
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BearSD said:

The solution in basketball is for Arizona to keep the NCAA and FBI away, and for UCLA to have a head coach who runs the program competently.



Both need to hire more competent handlers. Maybe ask around the SEC to see how it's done for real.
wifeisafurd
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71Bear said:

wifeisafurd said:

71Bear said:

wifeisafurd said:

71Bear said:

wifeisafurd said:

A certain AD (not the one at Cal) indicated that the drop in men's basketball revenue cost each school almost $1 million. A lot of that is declining revenue sharing from post-season play, because the Pac men's basketball programs are getting to post-season in small number, and the few teams that do, are not advancing. So tennis Larry is supposed to be working on initiatives to improve both football and men's basketball. Reading the article suggests that Tennis Larry said improve OOC scheduling. So let's see how this works in football:

I get that you have to play regional teams that may stink, but the OOC the California teams usually play isn't comparable to most teams. Cal which went to the lowest ranked Pac bowl game may have the weakest OOC among the California schools at it plays a tough North Texas team and a SEC school, Ole Miss, away. Okay, it has a breather with Davis. But then you look at Sun Bowl Furd: At UCF, a highly ranked team in preseason polls that has lost 1 game in two years, Notre Dame, and for the easy game, Northwestern. Non-bowl eiigible SC is foolish enough to go to Fresno State, and then play BYU and Notre Dame. I guess BYU is the breather. Non-eligible UCLA away at a good Cincy team (11-2 last year), always tough SDSU, and then freaking Oklahoma.

Holiday Bowl WSU play: NM State, Northern Colorado, and Houston (non P5, okay game). Who does defending southern conference champ Utah play: BYU (real game I grant you), Idaho State and Northern Illinois. Who does Rose Bowl Udub play: Hawaii, Eastern Washington and BYU, mot a power team among them though bYU s/b decent. Sensing a trend here: the top conference football teams in the last couple years get places because they play easy OOC schedules. So Tennis Larry says play tougher team. I see how this is more equitable to the California schools, but how exactly does that help situation of getting teams into more lucrative bowl games or the play-offs. And how does tennis Larry get these teams to pay tougher opponents? Does a SEC school get some advantage playing a physical Utah team instead of a local cream-puff?

I'm not sure how it works in basketball either, but I'm wiling to listen.


I'm confused. I thought the initiative approved today applied to hoops. Who said anything about football?
Muir.
Just one guy's opinion. The conference doesn't need to improve its football scheduling. For the most part it is quite reasonable....
Not his opinion. Statement as to what conference is doing. He would know.
Well, he is definitely wrong. As we have seen over the last several years, playing a strong schedule and losing a game is far worse than playing a mediocre schedule and winning every game. If the P12 wants to get serious about getting a team in the playoffs, they need to cut their conference schedule to eight games and play a meh OOC slate. That is the formula followed by our friends in Alabama and South Carolina. Muir is an idiot if he thinks otherwise....
NO Scott is an idiot to think this initiative will succeed. Muir didn't say it was going to happen, just that the same initiative for basketball is happening in football (please read the post and the article again). Tennis Larry was directed to undertake these initiatives because the Pac is losing money by having lousy (on a relative basis) programs in the two revenue sports, and this is one of the things he came up with for the conference to be competitive.. I then said it would not work, just like you did. . You basically just made the same case I made (I used a different comparison to try and make the point). Some times you just have to agree with people who agree with you.
wifeisafurd
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BearSD said:

After LSJU loses to Central Florida, ending their playoff chances in week 3, someone should ask Muir about that again.
Muir just said this was part of Tennis Larry's initiatives to improve the conference's two revenue programs that are not keeping-up with the other P5 conferences. He did not, in any way, suggest any part of the initiatives would or would not work. He simply stated what was happening at the conference level to improve revenue to a bunch of people. The article said the same thing discussing basketball. The only thing I would add is the initiative also includes football per Muir.

I'm not sure how anyone got that Muir thought this was a good idea. I responded to a know it all comment that this initiative did not apply to football, by saying who my source was. The fact that the poster then said Muir was an idiot is not my problem - he read something in that was not there. Moreover, I (not Muir who provided no opinion) said it was a bad idea.


PtownBear1
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TheSouseFamily said:

Also announced after the spring meetings: Larry Scott getting a $500K raise. Will now make $5.3M.
https://www.oregonlive.com/ducks/2019/05/canzano-pac-12s-biggest-news-commissioner-larry-scott-got-a-raise-to-5300000-a-year.html

Something definitely isn't right
wifeisafurd
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PtownBear1 said:

TheSouseFamily said:

Also announced after the spring meetings: Larry Scott getting a $500K raise. Will now make $5.3M.
https://www.oregonlive.com/ducks/2019/05/canzano-pac-12s-biggest-news-commissioner-larry-scott-got-a-raise-to-5300000-a-year.html

Something definitely isn't right
My read by public comments is that Cal, Oregon, Utah, Furd and UCLA do not support Scott. No one knows about the SC's new President. WSU's former AD had some nasty comments about Scott, but who knows with them or the other schools. This means Scott could have the support of the majority of schools. Also, I don't know how many votes you need to fire Scott - it may be more than a majority.
71Bear
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wifeisafurd said:

71Bear said:

wifeisafurd said:

71Bear said:

wifeisafurd said:

71Bear said:

wifeisafurd said:

A certain AD (not the one at Cal) indicated that the drop in men's basketball revenue cost each school almost $1 million. A lot of that is declining revenue sharing from post-season play, because the Pac men's basketball programs are getting to post-season in small number, and the few teams that do, are not advancing. So tennis Larry is supposed to be working on initiatives to improve both football and men's basketball. Reading the article suggests that Tennis Larry said improve OOC scheduling. So let's see how this works in football:

I get that you have to play regional teams that may stink, but the OOC the California teams usually play isn't comparable to most teams. Cal which went to the lowest ranked Pac bowl game may have the weakest OOC among the California schools at it plays a tough North Texas team and a SEC school, Ole Miss, away. Okay, it has a breather with Davis. But then you look at Sun Bowl Furd: At UCF, a highly ranked team in preseason polls that has lost 1 game in two years, Notre Dame, and for the easy game, Northwestern. Non-bowl eiigible SC is foolish enough to go to Fresno State, and then play BYU and Notre Dame. I guess BYU is the breather. Non-eligible UCLA away at a good Cincy team (11-2 last year), always tough SDSU, and then freaking Oklahoma.

Holiday Bowl WSU play: NM State, Northern Colorado, and Houston (non P5, okay game). Who does defending southern conference champ Utah play: BYU (real game I grant you), Idaho State and Northern Illinois. Who does Rose Bowl Udub play: Hawaii, Eastern Washington and BYU, mot a power team among them though bYU s/b decent. Sensing a trend here: the top conference football teams in the last couple years get places because they play easy OOC schedules. So Tennis Larry says play tougher team. I see how this is more equitable to the California schools, but how exactly does that help situation of getting teams into more lucrative bowl games or the play-offs. And how does tennis Larry get these teams to pay tougher opponents? Does a SEC school get some advantage playing a physical Utah team instead of a local cream-puff?

I'm not sure how it works in basketball either, but I'm wiling to listen.


I'm confused. I thought the initiative approved today applied to hoops. Who said anything about football?
Muir.
Just one guy's opinion. The conference doesn't need to improve its football scheduling. For the most part it is quite reasonable....
Not his opinion. Statement as to what conference is doing. He would know.
Well, he is definitely wrong. As we have seen over the last several years, playing a strong schedule and losing a game is far worse than playing a mediocre schedule and winning every game. If the P12 wants to get serious about getting a team in the playoffs, they need to cut their conference schedule to eight games and play a meh OOC slate. That is the formula followed by our friends in Alabama and South Carolina. Muir is an idiot if he thinks otherwise....
NO Scott is an idiot to think this initiative will succeed. Muir didn't say it was going to happen, just that the same initiative for basketball is happening in football (please read the post and the article again). Tennis Larry was directed to undertake these initiatives because the Pac is losing money by having lousy (on a relative basis) programs in the two revenue sports, and this is one of the things he came up with for the conference to be competitive.. I then said it would not work, just like you did. . You basically just made the same case I made (I used a different comparison to try and make the point). Some times you just have to agree with people who agree with you.
Well, we all know that Scott is in way over his head. However, as long as he has the support of the Presidents/Chancellors, he will continue to push his initiatives (whether they are conference-friendly or not).

As for the scheduling issue, I think the hoops changes that have been approved are very good and will help the conference. As for football, an ABC approach is still the best. The problem is there are few C programs in the west that are at the FBS level. If there was a Sun Belt level conference in this part of the country, it wouldn't be necessary to schedule FCS schools. Cal has an excellent scheduling model, I hope they don't change it.

Lastly, is it really possible we agreed on something? Yikes!
wifeisafurd
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71Bear said:



Lastly, is it really possible we agreed on something? Yikes!
No wonder you missed it (smiley face intended).
Big C
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TheSouseFamily said:

Also announced after the spring meetings: Larry Scott getting a $500K raise. Will now make $5.3M.
It's about time! I always thought he didn't make enough. Imagine a guy with his talent, doing all he was doing, and making UNDER five million! And they say public school teachers are underpaid! The next time my wife complains about her salary, I'll tell her to zip it until she has started the Oakland Teachers Television Network, then come back with demands. It doesn't even need to be picked up by Direct TV!
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