okaydo said:

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GBear4Life said:

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So beating a terrible team from the SEC, ACC and Pac are now signs of a program in an upswing and a HC who needs excuses?

Yikes.

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See my thread about FBS wins. Of course we should beat Stanford, but they have been one of the most dominant teams in the country during our losing streak.

Before last season, Cal was 1-15 in Los Angeles under Tedford, Dykes and Wilcox. I genuinely thought that something was wrong with the players psychologically when playing down South. Wilcox changed that.

My point is getting the Stanford monkey off the team's back won't be easy.

And if Wilcox is able to knock.off a Ole Miss on the road, in a proud SEC stadium against a team with two former PAC 12 coaches, I'd say that was impressive.

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I made no claim about beating stanford. I'm criticizing the extremely low bar that's employed to excuse such losses.

Wilcox changed nothing (yet). Cal beat the worst USC team in 20 years in an ugly one and we've lost to a bad UCLA team twice, in one we were trounced.

If Wilcox beats Ole Miss on the road? In a proud SEC stadium? Lmao. Ole Miss last year was almost dead last at 1-7 conf. They are an SEC cellar dweller that couldn't finish in the top half of the Pac last year. Their proud stadium netted them two wins last year.

A road win is a road win. Kids should celebrate and feel good about themselves should they play well and win. But citing it as some notch in a Cal HCs belt is sad, and it really explains the mental, defeated attitude of Cal fans.

Like with children, you set the bar high and they will rise to it. But it starts with the parents (HC and athletic admin).

okaydo said:

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And if Wilcox is able to knock.off a Ole Miss on the road, in a proud SEC stadium against a team with two former PAC 12 head coaches, I'd say that was impressive.

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Agreed. A win @Ole Miss to go along with wins against U$C & Udbub last year are significant. It does display a change in culture. Rome was not built in a day, Cal fans should appreciate the time and effort it takes to change and then build a new culture. Clearly, the players have bought in and I am happy to support them. It is sometimes lost how hard a change is and how hard the first adopters work to create that change. I completely agree with you.

Go Bears!!

UrsineMaximus said:

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okaydo said:

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And if Wilcox is able to knock.off a Ole Miss on the road, in a proud SEC stadium against a team with two former PAC 12 head coaches, I'd say that was impressive.

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Agreed. A win @Ole Miss to go along with wins against U$C & Udbub last year are significant. It does display a change in culture. Rome was not built in a day, Cal fans should appreciate the time and effort it takes to change and then build a new culture. Clearly, the players have bought in and I am happy to support them. It is sometimes lost how hard a change is and how hard the first adopters work to create that change. I completely agree with you.

Go Bears!!

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Why is beating a 1-7 conf team significant whose lone conference win was against winless Arkansass?

Their home wins include Kent St., Southern Illinois, Louisiana-Monroe, and Texas Tech.

It's like we're ESPN trying to pump up the conference's stock by assigning kudos to any road win in the conference.

GBear4Life said:

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How many good offenses did we play last year?

This elite defense talk is pretty alarming.

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We did a good job shutting down Washington State, so it's not bogus hype, could we be best in the PAC-12, maybe, Top 5 in FBS would be pretty unreal.

On the flipside, are we facing any elite offenses in 2019? Aside from Oregon, not really (Washington State is the kind of team that sputters out in Berkeley).

Cal Strong! said:

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Okaydo posting WEAK today. Okaydo need to take hard look in the mirror. Toughen up your thinking. Stop being weak. Cal not weak. Cal STRONG!

Be more like Cal, less like you.

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I've been hoping for years that Okaydo would be less like him, but unfortunately he remains the same annoying spammy guy he's always been.

I don't disagree that any road win against a P5 conference is a really positive development for our program. Road wins aren't easy unless you're an elite team. Even then it can be tough. It's also a positive step towards qualifying for post season play.

But I don't think beating Ole Miss on the road (presuming they remain in the bottom third of FBS football) is a feather in a HC's cap.

But Cal needs to be a program, and have a HC, that is expected to beat -- whether at home or on the road -- a cellar dweller in any P5 conference.

Cal Strong! said:

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If he can't be stanfurd, he WEAK! Cal not weak. Cal need strong coach.

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No one should be stanfurd...

Cal coach strong, like Cal Strong. Cal Strong has patience, Cal Strong calm....Cal Strong understands progress because he is not weak. But Cal Strong.

Cal Strong has traveled long distance, seen many things but still Strong. Cal Strong is ready to sit and observe because he's Strong.

UrsineMaximus has written, and so it shall be done. Strong.

wifeisafurd said:

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Bear8 said:

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Without sticking my neck out too far, I'll point out overall this is a veteran team. It is a team predominantly of juniors and seniors. Historically, teams like this do well. Phil Steele usually picks veteran teams as conference winners or at least bowl participants. They just know how to win. Expect a better record.

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I'm going to clarify that and say this is an experienced team on defense. Offense you have a starting line of one soph and 4 juniors, so far okay. Assuming Duncan is healthy the other WRs are a soph and probably guys who have not played much at the college level. I'm assuming the starting TE also is redshirt frosh. There is QB and the RBs were inexperience is somewhat apparent. So a lot of this season rides on generally inexperienced offensive skill players stepping-up, which is a lot to ask. I'm thinking better, but inconsistent play from the offense and another stellar defense. I have 6 or 7 wins given the schedule, which puts Cal in the mid level of the conference, and would be happy to be wrong. Also given the number of sophomores and juniors who are starting this year, and the more favorable schedule, next year may be the year Wilcox moves the program to the upper echelon.

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Have to agree. It looks like recruiting has turned a corner, so the trajectory of the program looks good for the long-term. But this season looks a lot like last season, which is to say a battle for a bowl and not much more.

I also agree that next year looks a lot more promising, especially if Wilcox replaces the OC, which appears to be the big drag on the program right now.

Uthaithani said:

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wifeisafurd said:

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Bear8 said:

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Without sticking my neck out too far, I'll point out overall this is a veteran team. It is a team predominantly of juniors and seniors. Historically, teams like this do well. Phil Steele usually picks veteran teams as conference winners or at least bowl participants. They just know how to win. Expect a better record.

---

I'm going to clarify that and say this is an experienced team on defense. Offense you have a starting line of one soph and 4 juniors, so far okay. Assuming Duncan is healthy the other WRs are a soph and probably guys who have not played much at the college level. I'm assuming the starting TE also is redshirt frosh. There is QB and the RBs were inexperience is somewhat apparent. So a lot of this season rides on generally inexperienced offensive skill players stepping-up, which is a lot to ask. I'm thinking better, but inconsistent play from the offense and another stellar defense. I have 6 or 7 wins given the schedule, which puts Cal in the mid level of the conference, and would be happy to be wrong. Also given the number of sophomores and juniors who are starting this year, and the more favorable schedule, next year may be the year Wilcox moves the program to the upper echelon.

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Have to agree. It looks like recruiting has turned a corner, so the trajectory of the program looks good for the long-term. But this season looks a lot like last season, which is to say a battle for a bowl and not much more.

I also agree that next year looks a lot more promising, especially if Wilcox replaces the OC, which appears to be the big drag on the program right now.

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I'm not sure I see recruiting as having "turned a corner". What makes you say that? I mean, it ain't bad, we get our share of 3-star "OKG"s who seem like they will be able to play, but...

On the field next year, I am concerned about the players we will be losing on defense. We are recruiting there and, with Wilcox, we will always have a pretty good D, but it might take a step down from the past two years.

Lots of offensive players will be returning, that's great, but we have yet to show we can do anything in the current offensive system, so I'm still a little skeptical there.

I'm predicting 7-5 this season and about the same for 2020, which is why it'd be nice to somehow pull off an 8-4 this year, which might REALLY get the recruiting to turn a corner.

Given this year's schedule, 7-5 is a step up over last year. I'm still predicting the big leap to 8 wins.

Well played. Love your posts. I trust you and the family are settling in well and are ready to enjoy an epic season of Cal football!

Fyght4Cal said:

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Given this year's schedule, 7-5 is a step up over last year. I'm still predicting the big leap to 8 wins.

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Seven wins is my expectation (maybe the last one comes in a bowl game). Eight in the "regular season" is my hope . . . and I want that damned Axe back!

UrsineMaximus said:

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Well played. Love your posts. I trust you and the family are settling in well and are ready to enjoy an epic season of Cal football!

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Now UrsineMaximus toughened up his thinking. UrsineMaximus posting STRONG now . . . like Cal . . . and Cal Strong.

Family Strong enjoying Western Mass. We been here 3 weeks today. Strong houses, strong lawns, strong farms, strong bike paths, strong daycare for baby strong, and strong colleagues for Cal Strong. Wife Strong have to commute once a week to Cambridge for work, and this make Cal Strong a little nervous (especially in winter). She not entirely used to driving on strong (right) side of the road. But once a week not so bad. Overall, Cal Strong would describe Family Strong's overall situation as mostly "strong."

Cal STRONG!

Cal Strong! said:

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UrsineMaximus said:

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Well played. Love your posts. I trust you and the family are settling in well and are ready to enjoy an epic season of Cal football!

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Now UrsineMaximus toughened up his thinking. UrsineMaximus posting STRONG now . . . like Cal . . . and Cal Strong.

Family Strong enjoying Western Mass. We been here 3 weeks today. Strong houses, strong lawns, strong farms, strong bike paths, strong daycare for baby strong, and strong colleagues for Cal Strong. Wife Strong have to commute once a week to Cambridge for work, and this make Cal Strong a little nervous (especially in winter). She not entirely used to driving on strong (right) side of the road. But once a week not so bad. Overall, Cal Strong would describe Family Strong's overall situation as mostly "strong."

Cal STRONG!

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How strong are the Massachusetts smoothies?

southseasbear said:

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Cal Strong! said:

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Any Cal coach who lose to stanfurd 3 years in row need to be fired.

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I guess you would have fired Bruce Snyder (the best Cal coach since Pappy Waldorf) before he took Cal to wins in the Copper Bowl and Citrus Bowl.

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Losing to stanfurd unacceptable. Cal no have a football team to go to Copper Bowl and Citrus Bowl. Cal have football team to humiliate stanfurd. Anything else just ginger in the smoothie.

Didn't make an open practice. Drats. Yesterday last open day.

Time for the official 2-deep?

I expect victories. Plain & simple.

okaydo said:

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And if Wilcox is able to knock.off a Ole Miss on the road, in a proud SEC stadium against a team with two former PAC 12 head coaches, I'd say that was impressive.

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None of the coaches will be playing. Ol Miss does not appear to have an overabundance of talent. Beating them is expected - losing to them an embarrassment.

Ole Miss, average star, sort of like UNC, somewhat higher than us in recent years. The last couple years, about 3.2. 2016, over 3.5...

Big C said:

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Uthaithani said:

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wifeisafurd said:

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Bear8 said:

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Without sticking my neck out too far, I'll point out overall this is a veteran team. It is a team predominantly of juniors and seniors. Historically, teams like this do well. Phil Steele usually picks veteran teams as conference winners or at least bowl participants. They just know how to win. Expect a better record.

---

I'm going to clarify that and say this is an experienced team on defense. Offense you have a starting line of one soph and 4 juniors, so far okay. Assuming Duncan is healthy the other WRs are a soph and probably guys who have not played much at the college level. I'm assuming the starting TE also is redshirt frosh. There is QB and the RBs were inexperience is somewhat apparent. So a lot of this season rides on generally inexperienced offensive skill players stepping-up, which is a lot to ask. I'm thinking better, but inconsistent play from the offense and another stellar defense. I have 6 or 7 wins given the schedule, which puts Cal in the mid level of the conference, and would be happy to be wrong. Also given the number of sophomores and juniors who are starting this year, and the more favorable schedule, next year may be the year Wilcox moves the program to the upper echelon.

---

Have to agree. It looks like recruiting has turned a corner, so the trajectory of the program looks good for the long-term. But this season looks a lot like last season, which is to say a battle for a bowl and not much more.

I also agree that next year looks a lot more promising, especially if Wilcox replaces the OC, which appears to be the big drag on the program right now.

---

I'm not sure I see recruiting as having "turned a corner". What makes you say that? I mean, it ain't bad, we get our share of 3-star "OKG"s who seem like they will be able to play, but...

On the field next year, I am concerned about the players we will be losing on defense. We are recruiting there and, with Wilcox, we will always have a pretty good D, but it might take a step down from the past two years.

Lots of offensive players will be returning, that's great, but we have yet to show we can do anything in the current offensive system, so I'm still a little skeptical there.

I'm predicting 7-5 this season and about the same for 2020, which is why it'd be nice to somehow pull off an 8-4 this year, which might REALLY get the recruiting to turn a corner.

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I tend to be of the New England Patriots school when it comes to recruiting - depth over flash. And this class is shaping up to be the deepest recruiting class in years. Every commit so far is a solid 3*, some borderline 4*. Dykes never had a class that deep (and it showed). Heck, even JT toward the end had recruiting depth issues. You give me recruiting classes like this one every year, with good coaching, and you'll have a competitive program year in, year out.

Would I like to see more 4 and 5*s? Sure. But considering where the program has been over the past 6 or 7 years, this is significant progress. No, not enough to rest a hat on, but enough for cautious optimism and a relatively cool coaching seat, for now.

Uthaithani said:

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Big C said:

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Uthaithani said:

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wifeisafurd said:

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Bear8 said:

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Without sticking my neck out too far, I'll point out overall this is a veteran team. It is a team predominantly of juniors and seniors. Historically, teams like this do well. Phil Steele usually picks veteran teams as conference winners or at least bowl participants. They just know how to win. Expect a better record.

---

I'm going to clarify that and say this is an experienced team on defense. Offense you have a starting line of one soph and 4 juniors, so far okay. Assuming Duncan is healthy the other WRs are a soph and probably guys who have not played much at the college level. I'm assuming the starting TE also is redshirt frosh. There is QB and the RBs were inexperience is somewhat apparent. So a lot of this season rides on generally inexperienced offensive skill players stepping-up, which is a lot to ask. I'm thinking better, but inconsistent play from the offense and another stellar defense. I have 6 or 7 wins given the schedule, which puts Cal in the mid level of the conference, and would be happy to be wrong. Also given the number of sophomores and juniors who are starting this year, and the more favorable schedule, next year may be the year Wilcox moves the program to the upper echelon.

---

Have to agree. It looks like recruiting has turned a corner, so the trajectory of the program looks good for the long-term. But this season looks a lot like last season, which is to say a battle for a bowl and not much more.

I also agree that next year looks a lot more promising, especially if Wilcox replaces the OC, which appears to be the big drag on the program right now.

---

I'm not sure I see recruiting as having "turned a corner". What makes you say that? I mean, it ain't bad, we get our share of 3-star "OKG"s who seem like they will be able to play, but...

On the field next year, I am concerned about the players we will be losing on defense. We are recruiting there and, with Wilcox, we will always have a pretty good D, but it might take a step down from the past two years.

Lots of offensive players will be returning, that's great, but we have yet to show we can do anything in the current offensive system, so I'm still a little skeptical there.

I'm predicting 7-5 this season and about the same for 2020, which is why it'd be nice to somehow pull off an 8-4 this year, which might REALLY get the recruiting to turn a corner.

---

I tend to be of the New England Patriots school when it comes to recruiting - depth over flash. And this class is shaping up to be the deepest recruiting class in years. Every commit so far is a solid 3*, some borderline 4*. Dykes never had a class that deep (and it showed). Heck, even JT toward the end had recruiting depth issues. You give me recruiting classes like this one every year, with good coaching, and you'll have a competitive program year in, year out.

Would I like to see more 4 and 5*s? Sure. But considering where the program has been over the past 6 or 7 years, this is significant progress. No, not enough to rest a hat on, but enough for cautious optimism and a relatively cool coaching seat, for now.

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So, you're saying the "bottom half" of the recruiting class seems to have more quality, based on star ratings. If true, I agree that that constitutes better recruiting. I, also, ascribe to sayings like "It's not just about top-ten guys you sign; it's about the last ten and will they be busts, or will they contribute."

Question: We sign a lot of 3-stars. Always have; always will. My concern is, how do we know Wilcox's 3-stars are better than those of previous coaches? Is it maybe just wishful thinking because we like Wilcox and all his OKG-talk?