...counseling Myles Garrett on how to best personally foul the Jets' nameless QB tonight on MNF. Tosh keeps falling upwards. Mark my words he will be a head coach of an NFL or major college team one day

Sure enough.... the exact same player(Garrett) that Tosh was counseling to keep doing what he was doing just got another 15 yard personal foul for roughing the passer on the very next drive. And it results in a gruesome injury for the Jets backup. Tosh is a cancer. Karma is coming for the Browns

offshorebear said:

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...counseling Myles Garrett on how to best personally foul the Jets' nameless QB tonight on MNF. Tosh keeps falling upwards. Mark my words he will be a head coach of an NFL or major college team one day

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Being stripped of play calling duties at Alabama before being asked to pursue other opportunities and landing a DL gig in Cleveland doesn't really sound like failing up to me. That said, you may be right that he's a future head coach. The people in Alabama seem to think he'd be a better head coach than someone who has to face the challenge of coordinating and play calling.

offshorebear said:

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Tosh keeps falling upwards. Mark my words he will be a head coach of an NFL or major college team one day

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Pretty sure he's taking over a 50% pay cut to coach in the NFL. Does seem like a situation for him to hone his coaching side of the game since there's no recruiting in the NFL.

I'm not sure Tosh would make a good NFL HC. If he's a subpar coordinator I don't know how he manages the clock or makes game decisions. To get to that point takes study, dedication, etc. Tosh always seemed like Mr. Shortcut, hence his Bama DC failure and all the other crap he pulled. I get he might have the personality to draw people together but the NFL is littered with these guys...FB guys, great guy, people follow him into warfare but no. OTOH, maybe he catches a trend like the youth HC trend and Kingsbury in AZ.

Knucklehead

Bear19 said:

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OH MY GOD!! More Tosh Tosh Tosh? In the name of all that's Holy, GIVE UP THIS OBSESSION with this lying, thug recruiting, double faced SNAKE. Wake-up, give it up, move on, stop polluting this board with Tosh, Tosh, Tosh.

Andy Buh is Vince Lombardi in comparison to the uncontested DAMAGE that this snake inflicted upon Jeff Tedford & Cal. Tosh doesn't give a rat's patutti about Cal - please afford this double crossing, motor boat loving, drunken head coach loving, back stabbing liar the same courtesy. Only a blind fool cares a twit about this where this snake is slithering.

There is not a quality football program that would consider hiring this snake from PeeWee football on up.

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https://athlonsports.com/college-football/tosh-lupoi-gives-washington-sarkisian-dream-coaching-staff

Amazing the vitriol toward Tosh, without understanding the full story - He is extremely well respected in the college coaching ranks. Saban twice raised his salary to keep him and to call him a failure at Bama (one NC and a runner up) is ridiculous. You should know that Coach Wilcox reached out twice to Tosh and an offer was extended to be back on our staff. Anyways, its far in the past, I wish him well and do know he would love to be HC at Cal at some point.

BearGoggles said:

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4thGenCal said:

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Amazing the vitriol toward Tosh, without understanding the full story - He is extremely well respected in the college coaching ranks. Saban twice raised his salary to keep him and to call him a failure at Bama (one NC and a runner up) is ridiculous. You should know that Coach Wilcox reached out twice to Tosh and an offer was extended to be back on our staff. Anyways, its far in the past, I wish him well and do know he would love to be HC at Cal at some point.

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There are always two sides to a story. I'm sure Tosh had legitimate grievances at Cal (making him the scapegoat for fake injuries was awful). But the way he handled himself when leaving (and the timing) justify the vitriol - particularly given that he is an alum. Can you name ANY other assistant who has blown out of a place the way that Tosh did when leaving Cal? He literally recruited players for UW while still working at Cal.

Tosh may not have been a failure at Alabama, but clearly he was asked to leave (or some might say fired). My thought is that he's a victim of his own ambition and success. He was such a valuable recruiter (and reasonably good DL coach), that he was able to parlay that into rapidly improved jobs. Cal to UW to USC (almost) and then Alabama from assistant to co-DC. And at each and every stop, Tosh made sure Tosh got paid and promoted - incredible drive and ambition (that is often but not always a good thing). He is a mercenary.

Unfortunately, Tosh's rapid assent did not really prepare him to be a DC - yet he wanted and got the job at an incredibly high profile place. He is young and really didn't pay his dues in terms of learning the x's and o's of coaching - he was an awful DC last year and got blown out. In truth, Tosh needed more coaching (as opposed to recruiting) experience - and Cal under DeRuyter/WIlcox would have been ideal for him. But he, again, decided to go for the money.

Maybe Tosh learns how to actually coach defense in Cleveland. But at this point, even ignoring his history, I wouldn't want him at Cal as a DC, much less a head coach. He's totally unprepared for those roles.

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Totally agree. A perfect example of the Peter principle.

An Alabama perspective on why Tosh left Alabama.

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Even before Nick Saban promoted Tosh Lupoi to defensive coordinator, there were internal questions within the Alabama program about whether he'd be up for the job.

Lupoi, who played defensive line at Cal, had zero experience working with the defensive secondary, a critical component of Saban's defense. Lupoi was known as a tireless worker and talented position coach during his three years as Alabama's outside linebackers coach but there were concerns about whether he'd be up to the task in areas like situational play-calling and recognizing what an opponent is doing in-game and being able to adjust on the fly, which had been a big strength of previous Tide defensive coordinators Kirby Smart and Jeremy Pruitt.

However, Lupoi was the staff's best recruiter -- he's a big reason stars Tua Tagovailoa, Najee Harris and others picked Alabama -- and he was going to have interest from other programs. If Saban didn't promote Lupoi to defensive coordinator, he was likely to lose him. And after overhauling his staff to get more aggressive on the recruiting trail following the 2017 title, Saban didn't think he could afford to let Lupoi go.

Yet, a little more than a year after the bump in title and responsibilities, Lupoi is off to Cleveland to join Freddie Kitchens' staff as defensive line coach. Why would Lupoi take a lesser role and what is likely a sizable pay cut after making $1.1 million this past year? It was actually a decision months in the making after early struggles as Alabama's defensive coordinator.

It wasn't long after Alabama's disastrous national championship game loss to Clemson that word began spreading Lupoi was unlikely to return to Alabama next season as part of a massive staff shakeup. But the inevitable breakup didn't happen because of one bad defensive performance on a national scale. In fact, sources had indicated to AL.com for a while that Lupoi was likely to leave for another job after the season.

After some early struggles during the season, Saban stripped Lupoi of defensive play-calling responsibilities and handed them over to co-defensive coordinator Pete Golding, according to sources. Saban had poached Golding from UT-San Antonio in the offseason in part to alleviate concerns about Lupoi's inexperience with the secondary and as a play-caller. Still, word is Lupoi seemed overwhelmed during practices and didn't totally grasp situational play-calling. While he was still heavily involved in the defensive game-planning, there was no question Golding taking over play-calling represented a demotion of sorts for Lupoi barely into the start of his defensive coordinator stint. Additionally, it was clear within the program how much Saban valued Golding, especially given he fended off other schools including Ole Miss in order to keep Golding at Alabama. It gave Lupoi reason enough to look for a soft landing place once Alabama's season ended.

Moving to Cleveland allows Lupoi to focus on and coach a position he is supremely familiar and confident in after coaching the defensive line at California and Washington. He'll get to work under a well-regarded defensive coordinator in Steve Wilks who should help continue to groom him. Despite his struggles as a first-time defensive coordinator, there is still a strong belief within the coaching community that Lupoi could be a good head coach one day.

For Alabama, Saban will have to replace his staff's top recruiter amidst multiple other staff openings. Lupoi was incredibly popular with recruits and players and really helped Alabama have success on the West Coast, particularly in California. As long as Saban is the head coach, Alabama's recruiting machine will keep chugging. Still, Lupoi is a sizable recruiting loss and won't be easily replaced.

However, it was a move that had to happen. It was clear that Alabama's defense wasn't up to snuff this season and that reared its head in the ugly title game loss. Saban knew he needed to make an upgrade as far as defensive staffing, which is why the most recruiting-obsessed head coach in college football history seemingly didn't fight to keep his best recruiter.


https://www.al.com/alabamafootball/2019/01/why-tosh-lupoi-leaving-alabama-was-long-expected.html?outputType=amp

Quote:

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Tosh always seemed like Mr. Shortcut, hence his Bama DC failure

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Quote:

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Lupoi was known as a tireless worker

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Zero chance he is hired and promoted by the best coach in generations if he were "Mr. Shortcut." It just doesnt pass the smell test.

LunchTime said:

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Quote:

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Tosh always seemed like Mr. Shortcut, hence his Bama DC failure

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Quote:

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Lupoi was known as a tireless worker

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Zero chance he is hired and promoted by the best coach in generations if he were "Mr. Shortcut." It just doesnt pass the smell test.

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Okay not Mr. Shortcut but rather Mr. Recrutiing Cheat, as in stealing Cal's recruit for UW.

But technically could be correct, he might have worked his butt of on that cheat and steal...and against your alma mater?

Does everybody around here seem to ignore or forget Tosh seemingly being thrown under the bus by Tedford after Oregon in 2010 as where the enmity started?

Strykur said:

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Does everybody around here seem to ignore or forget Tosh seemingly being thrown under the bus by Tedford after Oregon in 2010 as where the enmity started?

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No. I specifically mentioned this above. And I don't think that's necessarily where it all started, but it could be. Tosh had that and other legitimate grievances. That does not excuse how he handled those and behaved in many people's view, which is why there is "vitriol." Lots of people criticize Tedford's handling of Tosh and many other issues. But Tedford wasn't an arsonist when he left. In fact, I can't think of a single situation in all of college football (much less Cal) recent history where an assistant left in such an unscrupulous manner. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

4thGenCal said:

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BearGoggles said:

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4thGenCal said:

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Amazing the vitriol toward Tosh, without understanding the full story - He is extremely well respected in the college coaching ranks. Saban twice raised his salary to keep him and to call him a failure at Bama (one NC and a runner up) is ridiculous. You should know that Coach Wilcox reached out twice to Tosh and an offer was extended to be back on our staff. Anyways, its far in the past, I wish him well and do know he would love to be HC at Cal at some point.

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There are always two sides to a story. I'm sure Tosh had legitimate grievances at Cal (making him the scapegoat for fake injuries was awful). But the way he handled himself when leaving (and the timing) justify the vitriol - particularly given that he is an alum. Can you name ANY other assistant who has blown out of a place the way that Tosh did when leaving Cal? He literally recruited players for UW while still working at Cal.

Tosh may not have been a failure at Alabama, but clearly he was asked to leave (or some might say fired). My thought is that he's a victim of his own ambition and success. He was such a valuable recruiter (and reasonably good DL coach), that he was able to parlay that into rapidly improved jobs. Cal to UW to USC (almost) and then Alabama from assistant to co-DC. And at each and every stop, Tosh made sure Tosh got paid and promoted - incredible drive and ambition (that is often but not always a good thing). He is a mercenary.

Unfortunately, Tosh's rapid assent did not really prepare him to be a DC - yet he wanted and got the job at an incredibly high profile place. He is young and really didn't pay his dues in terms of learning the x's and o's of coaching - he was an awful DC last year and got blown out. In truth, Tosh needed more coaching (as opposed to recruiting) experience - and Cal under DeRuyter/WIlcox would have been ideal for him. But he, again, decided to go for the money.

Maybe Tosh learns how to actually coach defense in Cleveland. But at this point, even ignoring his history, I wouldn't want him at Cal as a DC, much less a head coach. He's totally unprepared for those roles.

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Enjoy the banter and differing view. Knowing Tosh well, he remains contrite on how he handled things at an extremely emotional time and frankly immature/wrong reaction on his part. However the manner he was used and the mistakes on not keeping him, when time after time it should have been resolved by the HC, play an equally important role. Nuff said on his mistakes and agree with you mostly. My disagreement is around the thoughts that he was "an awful DC last year "clearly asked to leave", "may not have been a failure at Bama". In his 3 seasons under Saban his teams went 14-1 (runner up) 13-1(NC) and 14-1 (runner up) olb coach, co dc /olb and dc coach. amazing collective staff record in his 3 years. yes the final game was a blow out loss where Bama was soundly beaten in All Phases. Saban did not ask him to leave (he did put increased pressure on Tosh with expectations and Tosh and 2 other coaches felt his wrath) however Tosh could have stayed - he simply felt it was time to move on from a job where the boss is unbelievably difficult to work for. Was an aside 2 very prominent college programs offered him DC jobs. His goal is to be HC in the college ranks and he feels gaining experience in the NFL and proving his worth there, will speed up his career goal. Tosh is very highly regarded by Coach Wilcox and others within the program.

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I know you have a soft spot in your heart for Tosh and an even greater love of Cal. You know Tosh and I have no reason to doubt what you say.

However, if Tosh is truly contrite or has any regrets about how he acted, I can't help but feel he might have said so publicly by now. And to do so now - when he's not angling for a job at Cal or elsewhere - which would show true contrition and sincerity . If that happened, lots of people (including me) would feel more sympathetic since Tosh's grievances were legitimate.

And just to be clear, being offered a DC job elsewhere and/or the opportunity to stay at Alabama with a reduced role doesn't mean he's a good dc. Tosh is a great recruiter and decent dl/lb coach - I'm sure lots of teams would take that package of skills for their dc. That doesn't make him a good dc now - my guess is that with his drive and ambition eventually he will be. But not today.

Wilcox's love of Tosh - one of his best friends - means nothing to me. When Cal hired Wilcox, my only reservation was his still unclear role in Tosh-gate. Primary responsibility is with Tosh, but Wilcox was right there with him. I only give Wilcox a pass because he wasn't working for Cal, I have no specific knowledge what Wilcox's role was (i.e., did he encourage Tosh to do the slimy things he did or just aggressively recruit him), and ultimately Tosh is responsible for his own actions. In addition, there has been no other indication that Wilcox has questionable character in any other of his dealings (whereas Tosh reportedly bends/breaks rules).

In any event, I'm highly confident that Wilcox doesn't want Tosh as his DC today. He should be very happy with DeRuyter and my guess is that Sirmon (and possibly even Alexander) would be offered that job next before Tosh.

BearGoggles said:

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Strykur said:

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Does everybody around here seem to ignore or forget Tosh seemingly being thrown under the bus by Tedford after Oregon in 2010 as where the enmity started?

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No. I specifically mentioned this above. And I don't think that's necessarily where it all started, but it could be. Tosh had that and other legitimate grievances. That does not excuse how he handled those and behaved in many people's view, which is why there is "vitriol." Lots of people criticize Tedford's handling of Tosh and many other issues. But Tedford wasn't an arsonist when he left. In fact, I can't think of a single situation in all of college football (much less Cal) recent history where an assistant left in such an unscrupulous manner. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

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Yes you mentioned being thrown under the bus - but going forward and then in reverse more accurate. Tosh did not authorize the "injury gate" and was adamently against it. The DC did and when the league commissioner called our AD and said you will enforce an suspension of the "coach" who is responsible and if not then i will impose a one game suspension to the HC. Then Tedford was contacted by our AD and selected Tosh as the fall guy. To make matters even worse, a reporter called Tosh to get his reaction BEFORE Tedford was able to reach Tosh. Then Tosh watched the game from Tightwad Hill. The real problem was that Tedford (whom i highly respect and his overall accomplishments at Cal) did not like the accolades / recruiting credit that Tosh was being given. JT would tell us time and again that the recruiting wins were "a staff win, where multiple coaches played roles in gaining commitments. however that was rarely the case - the kids by and large Loved Tosh and he was accepted by many families. His passion, his drive and his ability to relate to these young men is and was unique. JT would have kept Tosh with initially increasing his salary to $225k (was at $125k total after factoring in various payments). However despite JT being able to have that needed money (over 3 year deal) via boosters. he resisted, because that meant having more seasoned assistants (LB coach etc) making less. I implored him to get the coaches in a room and solve it - JT was headstrong and choose not to initially. then the bidding started and Tosh literally was being hounded hourly by Washington (and others). The final deal was in excess of $300k annually plus other living benefits/ girl friend admission etc. Yes Tosh "recruited players away" but they wanted to play for him and very strong trusting relationships had been built. Tosh was wrong in how he handled it, but JT had the chance to take care of Tosh up front and failed to do so. Coupling that with injury gate created a distrust that could not be mended. Those who know Tosh personally know he would literally put them ahead of him whenever possible. He is a passionate, fun guy, who will become a HC in college and be very successful. Coach Wilcox along with many many people admire and love him. I wish Tosh the very best.