All-Time Cal Basketball Team

SFCityBear
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barabbas said:

UrsaMajor said:

I an see Yogi over Imhoff only because he had a far better NBA career (personally, I'd take Imhoff)

Don't agree at all!!! Imhoff played 12 years and made the 1967 all star team. Yogi played about 8 and was never close to being an all star.
+1. I don't know what UrsaMajor could have been thinking when he wrote that Yogi had a far better NBA career than Imhoff.

I'll expand a little on what you wrote by adding the NBA statistics of both players (from Basketball-Reference.com). The stats are incomplete, because there were no stats kept for games started, steals and shot blocks during the course of Darrall Imhoff's career. You can bet he had plenty of all three, however.

Seasons played: Imhoff 12, Yogi 8
Games played: Imhoff 801, Yogi 286
Average minutes played: Imhoff 22, Yogi 11
Rebounds per game: Imhoff 8, Yogi 3
Assists per game: Imhoff 2, Yogi 0.3
Blocks per game: Imhoff unknown, Yogi 1.0
Points per game: Imhoff 7.2, Yogi 2.2

Yogi was a starter for only one season, 1998, when he started 37 games, averaged 22 minutes, 6.6 rebounds, 2 blocks, and 4.6 points. He started a total of only 6 games over the next 7 seasons.

Imhoff was a starter for much of his NBA career. In the five years from 1967-1971, Imhoff averaged 80 games per season, 30 minutes per game, 10 rebounds, 3 assists, and 10 points.

Imhoff was, as you said an NBA All-Star in 1967. In that season he was 1st in games played with 81, and 7th in the NBA in rebounds. In 1970 he was 2nd in the NBA in FG% at 0.540.

Yogi never won any awards, and was never on any leaderboard for any statistics in the NBA. He was a decent journeyman NBA player, but nothing to compare with Imhoff

SFCityBear
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concordtom said:

Excellent discussion, both of you guys!
So, who is you starting 5, and 5 backups, SFCity?
I like to discuss former players, but I am not interested in selecting some and excluding others, all of whom have contributed to Cal basketball. This is a team game, so here is a list of my All-Time Cal teams:

1. 1959 25-4, 1st AAWU, 1st NCAA
2. 1960 28-2, 1st AAWU, 2nd NCAA
3. 1958 19-9, t-1st PCC, Elite 8 loss, NCAA
4. 1957 21-5, 1st PCC, Elite 8 loss NCAA
5. 1946 30-6, 1st PCC, 4th NCAA
6. 1926 14-0, 1st PCC
7. 1927 13-0, 1st PCC
8. 1929 17-3, 1st PCC
9. 1932 16-8, 1st PCC
10. 2010 24-11, 1st PCC

To make my list, a team would have to win something, at least win their conference, not just win some games. To make the top half of my list, a team would have to win their conference, and win at least a Sweet 16 game in the NCAA. I realize I am in a minority among modern Cal fans. I understand that many fans would place Cal's 1993 and 1997 teams high on their own list of All-Time Cal teams. I liked those teams very much as well, but considering Cal's history in basketball prior to the 1970s, I just feel that those teams did not have enough success to compare with the teams which won their conference or teams which made a deeper run in the NCAA.




Grigsby
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No love for Hartmut Ortmann?
dbush518
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Staff
I saw the 59-60 teams play many times and have seen every Cal team since. Imhoff has to be the all-time center. His defense was the most important factor in their winning the title and finishing second the next year. He had a decent pro career (i know about Wilt's 100, but he fouled out). He did make an All-Star team.

Presley might have had the most talent but he had no business at Cal. Had he gone to less challenging academic school and had some guidance he could have been terrific. He wasn't stupid, just didn't know how to study and function in an academic environment, and he had no real guidance ever. The late Herb Michelson wrote a good book about him "Almost a Famous Person." Worth finding if you can.

I love Chenier and Charlie Johnson. but my backcourt would be Kidd and Kevin Johnson.

Forwards would be Sharif (a one-year wonder, but he got his degree) and Leon Powe.

A tip of the hat to Andy Wolfe...All-American in the 1940s, still around. Bill Sharman said Wolfe was the toughest guy he ever played against college or pro. The game was so different then, but he was one of the best
SFCityBear
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dbush518 said:

I saw the 59-60 teams play many times and have seen every Cal team since. Imhoff has to be the all-time center. His defense was the most important factor in their winning the title and finishing second the next year. He had a decent pro career (i know about Wilt's 100, but he fouled out). He did make an All-Star team.

Presley might have had the most talent but he had no business at Cal. Had he gone to less challenging academic school and had some guidance he could have been terrific. He wasn't stupid, just didn't know how to study and function in an academic environment, and he had no real guidance ever. The late Herb Michelson wrote a good book about him "Almost a Famous Person." Worth finding if you can.

I love Chenier and Charlie Johnson. but my backcourt would be Kidd and Kevin Johnson.

Forwards would be Sharif (a one-year wonder, but he got his degree) and Leon Powe.

A tip of the hat to Andy Wolfe...All-American in the 1940s, still around. Bill Sharman said Wolfe was the toughest guy he ever played against college or pro. The game was so different then, but he was one of the best
Thanks for this. I hadn't heard the Bill Sharman comment about Andy Wolfe before. I checked Amazon.com, and they have several copies of MIchelson's book for sale.
oskidunker
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Just ordered the book on amazon
Up with the Blue and Gold. Down with the Red!
oskidunker
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The book "Almosta FamousPerson" is a great read. MAny insightd into Bob Presley. 69 I was. In the band. We only knew Bob as a pkayer. No idea of how he got here or what his life was really like.

I was never a fan of Jim Padgett and my belief that he could not coach was confirmed. Although I felt sorry fir BOB in the begining , I ended up not really liking him at the end. He didnt have the drive to play hard all the time or the ability to maximize his talent. Overall, very sad story.
Up with the Blue and Gold. Down with the Red!
kelly09
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SFCITYBEAR knows more about Cal basketball than anyone on this board That includes me. But I saw every Cal game in the championship year. In fact, I saw every Cal game (I mean home games) in 57/58. That said, there was no Cal team ever that Don McIntosh wouldn't start.
SFCityBear
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kelly09 said:

SFCITYBEAR knows more about Cal basketball than anyone on this board That includes me. But I saw every Cal game in the championship year. In fact, I saw every Cal game (I mean home games) in 57/58. That said, there was no Cal team ever that Don McIntosh wouldn't start.
Thanks, Kelly, but there are lots of fans who know more Cal basketball than I do. Every time I visit here, I read something about a player, a coach, or a game that I need to check the internet to see if it was right, and I read things that I never heard before, and need to check on that too. I hate the internet, because it is such an addiction, but when I use it to discuss stuff with other Cal fans, I learn a lot. I might remember more stories than most, especially from the time when I was in school, because I played with and became friends with some Cal team members. Harmon was a special place, and Cal a special school, and the Cal basketball team has a great history. We all hope that soon Cal will regain a spot among the good basketball programs. If it doesn't, well, we still have the memories, and if I and others like you can make them real for young Cal fans reading the Bear Insider, that is the least we can do.

Don McIntosh was a helluva center. Imagine at 6'-6" tall, going up against Wilt Chamberlain. Really smooth player, and had no deficiencies. Remember that game at the Cow Palace against Seattle and Elgin Baylor? If only Al Buch hadn't missed that little floater at the end of regulation, Cal would have won their first NCAA title. Cal was a better team than Kentucky that season, according to Newell. I agree McIntosh would start somewhere on a Cal all-time team, I should think.







puget sound cal fan
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I think it was Dick Doughty, wasn't it?
puget sound cal fan
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In my book, you could add Pressley to McNamara and Imhoff as top Centers.
RichyBear
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Doughty was drafted by the New York Knicks of the NBA (51st player drafted). Pressley wasn't drafted by any N team.
BTW- Back in the champonship season, Doughty played most of a Friday-Saturday 2 game set against Stanford because Imhoff got in Foul trouble. Doughty made 'Player of the Week'.
SFCityBear
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RichyBear said:

Doughty was drafted by the New York Knicks of the NBA (51st player drafted). Pressley wasn't drafted by any N team.
BTW- Back in the champonship season, Doughty played most of a Friday-Saturday 2 game set against Stanford because Imhoff got in Foul trouble. Doughty made 'Player of the Week'.
According to RealGM, Bob Presley was drafted in the 1969 NBA draft, by the Milwaukee Bucks, as the #2 pick of round 11. https://basketball.realgm.com/player/Bob-Presley/Summary/68180

Dick Doughty also played much or most of the game in the 1960 NCAA Final which Cal lost to Ohio State, as Darrall Imhoff had a bad cold or the flu. Not to mention Imhoff had played nearly all the game the night before in a tough win over Cincinnati .
joe amos yaks
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Just putting his name out there because I think he's been overlooked:

1972-75 left-handed G Rickie Hawthorne, team scoring leader in 1975.

He played on teams with John Coughran, Brady Allen, Carl Meier, Eric Long, Connie White and Carl Bird.
sonofabear51
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IIRC, really enjoyed watching Rickie Hawthorne play, and then also Gene Ransom. Both were incredible, to me as a teenager. I also remember Ray Murry, who hit a couple free throws during that epic Oregon 5 OT game. Correct me if I am wrong. Thanks joe yaks. Also remember Connie White and Carl Bird ( Jabari's Dad), and the others you mentioned. Harmon was rocking' then!
Big C
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Ray Murray: Nice mention! 6-5 or 6-6 small forward, kinda heavy. Had this hiiiiiiiigh arching jump shot that, his senior year, often drew nothing but net. He only got two points each for those shots, too. Nowadays, he'd have quite the scoring average.

As for Ricky Hawthorne, I seem to remember him going for 37 or so in an overtime game against U$C, his senior year.
HearstMining
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sonofabear51 said:

IIRC, really enjoyed watching Rickie Hawthorne play, and then also Gene Ransom. Both were incredible, to me as a teenager. I also remember Ray Murry, who hit a couple free throws during that epic Oregon 5 OT game. Correct me if I am wrong. Thanks joe yaks. Also remember Connie White and Carl Bird ( Jabari's Dad), and the others you mentioned. Harmon was rocking' then!

I don't remember specific dunks, but Connie White had some serious hops. Not a great outside shooter, but he could sky!
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