track&field

helltopay1
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so sad to see the demise of Caltrack&field. our teams of today are only a shadow of the teams presented by Cal when I was a lad. dual meets were common . of course, neither Cal nor Stanford were nearly as good as the two powerhouses, USC and UCLA. Nevertheless, individual Cal athletes, namely don Bowden, Leamon King always competed well in the many relay events regularly held in fresno, Modesto, and Bakersfield. Those cities hosted a two-day event which featured the top high school, JC and top AAU performers as well as the top college performers of the day. We used to either hop into a car or take the bus to these cities and grab a motel for the entire weekend. Fabulous meets. Those days are long gone. Edwards stadium will soon become either a parking lot or it will become a student dormitory. I forgot to mention monte Upshaw. Leaped 25 feet four and a quarter to win the State Meet when he was a senior. He also beat the great Rafer Johnson in thev 180 lows by running 19.0 flat. johnson came in second in the identical time. Johnson won the Highs by running 14.3. Uposhaw came in second by running 14.5. Any other track and field nuts on this site???
concordtom
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What would replace Edwards if torn down? This is the first in hearing about it.
concordtom
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With the growth of multiple TV friendly entertainment sports, Track and field in general is on the decline, no?
concordtom
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You mentioned SC and UCLA being strong years ago. I wondered about the size of LA relative to NorCal - more athletes feeding into those schools?

This table is cool because it shows LA county as % of CA.

They've had that population advantage longer than I knew.

http://www.laalmanac.com/population/po02.php
SFCALBear72
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How is this topic relevant to men's basketball? There's an Olympics sports board on here which would be more appropriate.
concordtom
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You're right, along with whomever starred your comment.
Of all the offenses on this board, from cruelly criticizing 19 year olds for not shooting, jumping, dribbling etc well enough to harshly berating other posters with personalized attacks, this is the biggest offense of all: creating a thread on the wrong board!

Allow me to offer a reason for doing so:
Because nobody reads the Olympic thread! No critical mass.
concordtom
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Hers another offense worthy to pic on spelling errors and poor grammer decisions is not acceptable
helltopay1
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I clicked "new topic" when I started this thread. So my heart was in the right place. I apologize to all who are deeply offended. I will strive to improve.
SFCALBear72
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helltopay1 said:

I clicked "new topic" when I started this thread. So my heart was in the right place. I apologize to all who are deeply offended. I will strive to improve.
Hahaha. Not offended one bit. I was just pointing it out.

When you click "new topic" you should also be aware of what forum you are in. Chances are you recently posted something else in men's basketball and that's where you were when you clicked new topic.

You could have also posted it on the premium page and it would have been just fine.

Happy Memorial Day!
Big C
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helltopay1 said:

I clicked "new topic" when I started this thread. So my heart was in the right place. I apologize to all who are deeply offended. I will strive to improve.
Don't worry about it at all. Anybody that doesn't like this thread should bury it by posting a bunch of fascinating threads about Cal Basketball.

In answer to ConcordTom's question:

Okay, you know how the Athletic Dept is in a really bad financial situation, what with the debt from the Stadium rebuild? Well, the rumor is that the University would absorb a significant portion of that debt in exchange for the land under Edwards Stadium. They would then use the land for whatever they deemed to be in the University's best interests.

My initial response to that was "OMG, no!", but it might be the most practical solution to a difficult problem.

Meanwhile, I mourn the decline of track and field's popularity. To me, people running a race is exciting sports. I think it never got marketed very well.
SFCityBear
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I loved track and field. My dad was taking me to Cal meets when I was still in short pants. It is the purest of sports, the simplest in terms of objectives for each event, and the least phonied up by changes in equipment, fields of play, and constantly changing rules. It is who is fastest at different distances, who can jump highest or farthest, and who can throw some things the farthest.

Here are a few more Cal greats:

Eddie Hart 100m, 200m, 4x100 relay
Atlee Mahorn, 100m, 200m, 400m
Larry Cowling, 200m, 400m, 400m hurdles
Grover Klemmer, 400 yds
Jack Yerman, Dave Archibald, 400m
Jerry Siebert, Lon Spurrier, 800m
Andy Clifford, 1500m, mile
Dave Porath, Dave Maggard, Jr., shot put and discus

And many more.

It was the administration that created this mess with the ill-conceived and ill-managed stadium project. I think I heard the plan for the Edwards Field site is for classrooms or office space, but not housing. The Cal campus planning continues unabated, hell bent on replacing traditions with utility. I propose that we stop protesting speakers on campus, and instead protest the tearing down of historical monuments on campus like Edwards Field.





helltopay1
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here here!!!!!That's the british in me.
bearister
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bearister
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Among the athletes I saw compete at Edwards:
Tommie Smith
John Carlos
Lee Evans
Charlie Greene
Ron Clarke
Pat Matzdorf
Eamonn Coghlan
Steve Scott
Mike Boit
John Walker
Steve Prefontaine

Cancel my subscription to the Resurrection
Send my credentials to the House of Detention
I got some friends inside
mikecohen
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helltopay1 said:

so sad to see the demise of Caltrack&field. our teams of today are only a shadow of the teams presented by Cal when I was a lad. dual meets were common . of course, neither Cal nor Stanford were nearly as good as the two powerhouses, USC and UCLA. Nevertheless, individual Cal athletes, namely don Bowden, Leamon King always competed well in the many relay events regularly held in fresno, Modesto, and Bakersfield. Those cities hosted a two-day event which featured the top high school, JC and top AAU performers as well as the top college performers of the day. We used to either hop into a car or take the bus to these cities and grab a motel for the entire weekend. Fabulous meets. Those days are long gone. Edwards stadium will soon become either a parking lot or it will become a student dormitory. I forgot to mention monte Upshaw. Leaped 25 feet four and a quarter to win the State Meet when he was a senior. He also beat the great Rafer Johnson in thev 180 lows by running 19.0 flat. johnson came in second in the identical time. Johnson won the Highs by running 14.3. Uposhaw came in second by running 14.5. Any other track and field nuts on this site???
Me -FWIW -- Also, re the remarks about TV: It seems to me as though the way TV covers T&F these days is very entertaining. They've developed a format of organizing the events and videos thereof so that something is happening on-screen of particular interest at any moment. Unlike the real-time long stretches between events, which are fine in person, 'cause you can freely scan the field and race preparations for all sorts of interesting stuff while you're sitting in the stands on a great sunny day, those stretches would be death on TV.
OaktownBear
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mikecohen said:

helltopay1 said:

so sad to see the demise of Caltrack&field. our teams of today are only a shadow of the teams presented by Cal when I was a lad. dual meets were common . of course, neither Cal nor Stanford were nearly as good as the two powerhouses, USC and UCLA. Nevertheless, individual Cal athletes, namely don Bowden, Leamon King always competed well in the many relay events regularly held in fresno, Modesto, and Bakersfield. Those cities hosted a two-day event which featured the top high school, JC and top AAU performers as well as the top college performers of the day. We used to either hop into a car or take the bus to these cities and grab a motel for the entire weekend. Fabulous meets. Those days are long gone. Edwards stadium will soon become either a parking lot or it will become a student dormitory. I forgot to mention monte Upshaw. Leaped 25 feet four and a quarter to win the State Meet when he was a senior. He also beat the great Rafer Johnson in thev 180 lows by running 19.0 flat. johnson came in second in the identical time. Johnson won the Highs by running 14.3. Uposhaw came in second by running 14.5. Any other track and field nuts on this site???
Me -FWIW -- Also, re the remarks about TV: It seems to me as though the way TV covers T&F these days is very entertaining. They've developed a format of organizing the events and videos thereof so that something is happening on-screen of particular interest at any moment. Unlike the real-time long stretches between events, which are fine in person, 'cause you can freely scan the field and race preparations for all sorts of interesting stuff while you're sitting in the stands on a great sunny day, those stretches would be death on TV.


The problem with track is that the amazing part of what the athletes do doesn't happen at the track in front of the crowd. It happens on an empty track at 6:00 am every day, in the weight room, etc. The amazing thing these athletes do is train to get to that point. When they step into the blocks, though, it isn't that compelling unless you know a story behind it. I think that is why the Olympics works, but people ultimately ignore for 4 years.

I remember seeing dot racing for the first time and people calling the A's lame for doing it and the fans lame for playing along. But I felt those people didn't get that we were poking fun at ourselves as humans. Because ultimately a race is a race whether it is a human, a dog, a horse, a car, or a dot. Unless you know the back story.

One of the most compelling races I have seen was a distance race I watched years ago. It wasn't a particularly important race. What happened is there were two guys from countries that were mortal enemies in the race. Neither was supposed to win. One decided to go out front and leave the pack. The other chased. The pack didn't respect them and ignored them. The commentators did a good job in explaining the dynamic. So you are watching these two guys side by side waiting for them to break. They never did. They pushed each other to a 1-2 finish in that race.

Unfortunately, though, college track is just not compelling to most. Cal has not been good for many years. Edwards' days have been numbered for a long time when you factor in that the school needs the land. My feeling is that Christ is making a smart political move here. The school needs the land, with or without the stadium situation. The school needs to pay for the retrofit with or without Edwards. By linking two unrelated but necessary actions, it looks like a compromise instead of just doing two separate things that would each have vocal opponents.
DCW67MSW
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Jim Ryan broke mile record& who can forget Issac Curtis & our Olympic Sprinter Eddie Hart.
joe amos yaks
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Don't forget Cal excellence like Maynard Orme, Brian Maxwell (and have another Power Bar), Willie White . . .the great HJ Ed Wright . . . Shiela Hudson, Rick Brown, Brent Burns . . . Walter Christie, Brutus Hamilton . . . Bruce Kennedy, Leamon King . . . James Robinson, the great decathlete Ed Miller . . . Louise Romo, Wesley Walker, Bevan Hart, Chris Huffins.
mikecohen
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OaktownBear said:

mikecohen said:

helltopay1 said:

so sad to see the demise of Caltrack&field. our teams of today are only a shadow of the teams presented by Cal when I was a lad. dual meets were common . of course, neither Cal nor Stanford were nearly as good as the two powerhouses, USC and UCLA. Nevertheless, individual Cal athletes, namely don Bowden, Leamon King always competed well in the many relay events regularly held in fresno, Modesto, and Bakersfield. Those cities hosted a two-day event which featured the top high school, JC and top AAU performers as well as the top college performers of the day. We used to either hop into a car or take the bus to these cities and grab a motel for the entire weekend. Fabulous meets. Those days are long gone. Edwards stadium will soon become either a parking lot or it will become a student dormitory. I forgot to mention monte Upshaw. Leaped 25 feet four and a quarter to win the State Meet when he was a senior. He also beat the great Rafer Johnson in thev 180 lows by running 19.0 flat. johnson came in second in the identical time. Johnson won the Highs by running 14.3. Uposhaw came in second by running 14.5. Any other track and field nuts on this site???
Me -FWIW -- Also, re the remarks about TV: It seems to me as though the way TV covers T&F these days is very entertaining. They've developed a format of organizing the events and videos thereof so that something is happening on-screen of particular interest at any moment. Unlike the real-time long stretches between events, which are fine in person, 'cause you can freely scan the field and race preparations for all sorts of interesting stuff while you're sitting in the stands on a great sunny day, those stretches would be death on TV.


The problem with track is that the amazing part of what the athletes do doesn't happen at the track in front of the crowd. It happens on an empty track at 6:00 am every day, in the weight room, etc. The amazing thing these athletes do is train to get to that point. When they step into the blocks, though, it isn't that compelling unless you know a story behind it. I think that is why the Olympics works, but people ultimately ignore for 4 years.

I remember seeing dot racing for the first time and people calling the A's lame for doing it and the fans lame for playing along. But I felt those people didn't get that we were poking fun at ourselves as humans. Because ultimately a race is a race whether it is a human, a dog, a horse, a car, or a dot. Unless you know the back story.

One of the most compelling races I have seen was a distance race I watched years ago. It wasn't a particularly important race. What happened is there were two guys from countries that were mortal enemies in the race. Neither was supposed to win. One decided to go out front and leave the pack. The other chased. The pack didn't respect them and ignored them. The commentators did a good job in explaining the dynamic. So you are watching these two guys side by side waiting for them to break. They never did. They pushed each other to a 1-2 finish in that race.

Unfortunately, though, college track is just not compelling to most. Cal has not been good for many years. Edwards' days have been numbered for a long time when you factor in that the school needs the land. My feeling is that Christ is making a smart political move here. The school needs the land, with or without the stadium situation. The school needs to pay for the retrofit with or without Edwards. By linking two unrelated but necessary actions, it looks like a compromise instead of just doing two separate things that would each have vocal opponents.
Again, FWIW: Those back stories are perfect to fill up those empty spaces on TV - could be very compelling, and are, to the extent they have been developed as part of the form. As you point out, there is an endless number of those stories that could be of cosmic interest to even the most casual of TV viewers, maybe especially to them.
barabbas
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concordtom said:

You're right, along with whomever starred your comment.
Of all the offenses on this board, from cruelly criticizing 19 year olds for not shooting, jumping, dribbling etc well enough to harshly berating other posters with personalized attacks, this is the biggest offense of all: creating a thread on the wrong board!

Allow me to offer a reason for doing so:
Because nobody reads the Olympic thread! No critical mass.

Pretty clear the reason you don't read the Olympic/baseball board. Only those who have an interest and/or know something about those sports would have reason to go there.
RhetoriCal Bear
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bearister said:

Among the athletes I saw compete at Edwards:
Tommie Smith
John Carlos
Lee Evans
Charlie Greene
Ron Clarke
Pat Matzdorf
Eamonn Coghlan
Steve Scott
Mike Boit
John Walker
Steve Prefontaine


My highlight was seeing Steve Riddick pass Valery Borzov on the final leg of the men's 400m relay in the dual meet between the USA and USSR in 1978.

https://www.si.com/vault/1978/07/17/822811/not-quite-as-high-but-a-bit-mightier-soviet-high-jumper-vladimir-yashchenko-beat-franklin-jacobs-but-the-us-team-scored-a-rare-triumph-over-the-ussr
helltopay1
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i'm glad my post has allowed some track buffs to reach back into their memory vault. The meets in Fresno, Modesto and Bakersfield were always classics every single year.
HearstMining
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bearister said:

Among the athletes I saw compete at Edwards:
Tommie Smith
John Carlos
Lee Evans
Charlie Greene
Ron Clarke
Pat Matzdorf
Eamonn Coghlan
Steve Scott
Mike Boit
John Walker
Steve Prefontaine


I was also there for Matzdorf's WR.
Others I saw:
Edwin Moses
Jerry Lindgren
Mary (Decker) Slaney
Francie Larriue
Dr. Delano Merriwether
OJ (USC 4x100 team)
Dwight Stones
Franklin Jacobs

People can say what they want about Dave Maggert as an AD, but his track and field connections brought some great events to Edwards Field.
concordtom
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Thx for the administrative/financial reasons for dumping Edwards for classrooms!

What would replace Edwards from a sports usage need if torn down? Where would soccer teams play? Where would track be held?
59bear
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OaktownBear said:

mikecohen said:

helltopay1 said:

so sad to see the demise of Caltrack&field. our teams of today are only a shadow of the teams presented by Cal when I was a lad. dual meets were common . of course, neither Cal nor Stanford were nearly as good as the two powerhouses, USC and UCLA. Nevertheless, individual Cal athletes, namely don Bowden, Leamon King always competed well in the many relay events regularly held in fresno, Modesto, and Bakersfield. Those cities hosted a two-day event which featured the top high school, JC and top AAU performers as well as the top college performers of the day. We used to either hop into a car or take the bus to these cities and grab a motel for the entire weekend. Fabulous meets. Those days are long gone. Edwards stadium will soon become either a parking lot or it will become a student dormitory. I forgot to mention monte Upshaw. Leaped 25 feet four and a quarter to win the State Meet when he was a senior. He also beat the great Rafer Johnson in thev 180 lows by running 19.0 flat. johnson came in second in the identical time. Johnson won the Highs by running 14.3. Uposhaw came in second by running 14.5. Any other track and field nuts on this site???
Me -FWIW -- Also, re the remarks about TV: It seems to me as though the way TV covers T&F these days is very entertaining. They've developed a format of organizing the events and videos thereof so that something is happening on-screen of particular interest at any moment. Unlike the real-time long stretches between events, which are fine in person, 'cause you can freely scan the field and race preparations for all sorts of interesting stuff while you're sitting in the stands on a great sunny day, those stretches would be death on TV.


The problem with track is that the amazing part of what the athletes do doesn't happen at the track in front of the crowd. It happens on an empty track at 6:00 am every day, in the weight room, etc. The amazing thing these athletes do is train to get to that point. When they step into the blocks, though, it isn't that compelling unless you know a story behind it. I think that is why the Olympics works, but people ultimately ignore for 4 years.

I remember seeing dot racing for the first time and people calling the A's lame for doing it and the fans lame for playing along. But I felt those people didn't get that we were poking fun at ourselves as humans. Because ultimately a race is a race whether it is a human, a dog, a horse, a car, or a dot. Unless you know the back story.

One of the most compelling races I have seen was a distance race I watched years ago. It wasn't a particularly important race. What happened is there were two guys from countries that were mortal enemies in the race. Neither was supposed to win. One decided to go out front and leave the pack. The other chased. The pack didn't respect them and ignored them. The commentators did a good job in explaining the dynamic. So you are watching these two guys side by side waiting for them to break. They never did. They pushed each other to a 1-2 finish in that race.

Unfortunately, though, college track is just not compelling to most. Cal has not been good for many years. Edwards' days have been numbered for a long time when you factor in that the school needs the land. My feeling is that Christ is making a smart political move here. The school needs the land, with or without the stadium situation. The school needs to pay for the retrofit with or without Edwards. By linking two unrelated but necessary actions, it looks like a compromise instead of just doing two separate things that would each have vocal opponents.
I love track and field precisely because "a race is a race". It is, as SFCity pointed out, the purest form of competition with only minimal impact from rules, equipment or officiating.
HearstMining
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I also think the sportsmanship shown in Track and Field is terrific. We took our boys to the Olympic Trials in Sacramento in 2004 and I think it was the women's 5000, there was one runner who was just having a terrible day. Maybe injured, maybe sick. In any case, she fell way behind, but wouldn't quit. On her final lap, the crowd applauded as she went around. I'm so glad my two boys got to see that.
Also, in what other sport will you see somebody qualify for the Olympics, and then an hour later be standing behind them in line to buy ice cream bar?
MilleniaBear
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I've come to have my doubts on the validity of T&F competitions. With the exception of the Tour de France and Figure Skating T&F has more cheating than most sports. An entire nation had to be banned for the past Olympics because of organized cheating. I just don't believe Bolt and others are clean. Maybe the Pac12 is clean but I doubt it. I agree a race is one of the purest forms of competition but its just weird to announce a winner a month later because they were the only one with a clean sample.
caltagjohnson
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This really too bad. In HS I competed in both track and cross country as well as BB. I was an avid follower of Cal track and field. I got to run in the HS section of all the relays including the Modesto relays. That was the highlight of the season. The Cal-Stanford meet used to be a big deal.
caltagjohnson
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This really too bad. In HS I competed in both track and cross country as well as BB. I was an avid follower of Cal track and field. I got to run in the HS section of all the relays including the Modesto relays. That was the highlight of the season. The Cal-Stanford meet used to be a big deal. Track and field in mano a You could not blame anyone but yourself.
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