Jaylen Brown or Kawhi Leonard

GoCalBears
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http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/23826138/kawhi-leonard-trades-boston-celtics-offer

hope it doesn't happen.

would you trade brown [plus others] for leonard?
UCBerkGrad
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Hell yeah
GMP
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UCBerkGrad said:

Hell yeah
Kawhi presents some problems. One, the injury. It's unclear how bad it is. Two, he's shown that when he isn't where he wants to be, he won't play ball. Three, if you trade for him, you better have an agreement on an extension, and he's going to want the super max - which means you're committing probably $37.6M per year for five years to Kawhi. That means you'd be paying Leonard 8x what you are paying Jaylen Brown, who is getting paid less than $12M total for the next two years, and is then a restricted free agent in the summer of 2020.

So it's not as easy as "Kawhi" is better. There's a lot of risk and a lot less roster flexibility that comes with him. However, I think most teams would ultimately pull the trigger.
philbert
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Are you sure Brown would be a restricted FA after his rookie deal runs out? I thought 1st rounders become unrestricted FAs after their rookie deal runs out.

2nd rounders can become restricted FAs after their deals run out.
concordtom
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Is this talk anything more than "what if" speculation?
GMP
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philbert said:

Are you sure Brown would be a restricted FA after his rookie deal runs out? I thought 1st rounders become unrestricted FAs after their rookie deal runs out.

2nd rounders can become restricted FAs after their deals run out.
http://www.spotrac.com/nba/boston-celtics/yearly/cap/

As long as they give him a QO, he'll be restricted. And they will.

And btw, my numbers on Kawhi came from here:

http://www.sportingnews.com/g00/nba/news/nba-trade-rumors-kawhi-leonard-news-spurs-contract-status-extension-supermax-lakers-clippers-celtics/11nkg4xtpfb5w1kh3c5h1mushk?i10c.encReferrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8%3D&i10c.ua=1&i10c.dv=14

Yogi Bear
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philbert said:

Are you sure Brown would be a restricted FA after his rookie deal runs out? I thought 1st rounders become unrestricted FAs after their rookie deal runs out.

2nd rounders can become restricted FAs after their deals run out.
First rounders are restricted free agents at the end of their rookie contract.
http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q47
philbert
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GMP said:

philbert said:

Are you sure Brown would be a restricted FA after his rookie deal runs out? I thought 1st rounders become unrestricted FAs after their rookie deal runs out.

2nd rounders can become restricted FAs after their deals run out.
http://www.spotrac.com/nba/boston-celtics/yearly/cap/

As long as they give him a QO, he'll be restricted. And they will.

And btw, my numbers on Kawhi came from here:

http://www.sportingnews.com/g00/nba/news/nba-trade-rumors-kawhi-leonard-news-spurs-contract-status-extension-supermax-lakers-clippers-celtics/11nkg4xtpfb5w1kh3c5h1mushk?i10c.encReferrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8%3D&i10c.ua=1&i10c.dv=14


Ok. I was confused because 1st rounders can get a "max" contract in free agency after their rookie deals are done. In this case, he still can get a big money contract, like Harrison Barnes did. However, Boston could match. (although I think the NBA tweaked the rules a bit after HB got his contract)

2nd rounders who are restricted FAs are much more limited in what they earn, due to their initial contract length.

Ugh. NBA free agency rules suck.
south bender
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All this speculation about trading Jaylen ignores his potential, especially given his huge jump from Cal to his first to his second NBA year.

If his rate of improvement continues to match what it has been in his first two years out of Cal, Jaylen may be a really dominant all star player in the NBA.

My guess is that the Celtics are alert to this and will not easily include him in a trade. As I recall Leonard in his first NBA years, he was no great offensive player . Jaylen offensively may have outdone him, comparing both guys' first two years.

Finally, I would think any team would be a little hesitant to assume that Kawhi will be as good in the future as he was before an injury which cost him an entire year. Ditto with Hayward. Ditto with Irving.
ColoradoBear
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Dang was hoping kawhi goes to the Cavs so he can quit on LeBron mid year.

Another Bear
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I've been a fan of Popovich team play method, but it seems he threw Leonard under the bus in April. Leonard wanted a second opinion on his injury which is reasonable when it's your career. The Spurs didn't agree. Whatever the circumstances, you simply don't bag on your franchise player, and take him for granted. I think Pop has lost it, and that's sad.

P.s. knew some guys who played for Pop at Pomona.

BeachedBear
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Another Bear said:

I've been a fan of Popovich team play method, but it seems he threw Leonard under the bus in April. Leonard wanted a second opinion on his injury which is reasonable when it's your career. The Spurs didn't agree. Whatever the circumstances, you simply don't bag on your franchise player, and take him for granted. I think Pop has lost it, and that's sad.

P.s. knew some guys who played for Pop at Pomona.


I'm not sure Pop has lost it (for good), but he definitely had rough year. It may be evidence of how much the franchise relies on him to be at the top of his game for them to keep clicking year after year.
Another Bear
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Yeah, rough season for Pop. I read somewhere the real issue is after Duncan left, the roster was bare or old (Parker, Ginobili are ancient) and they had to get Aldridge, who hasn't been Tim Duncan. The Spurs rode Leonard and took him for granted. I hope Pop can recover...and find a young coach to pass the torch to...although his coaching tree is healthy.
hanky1
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Getting traded to the Spurs would not necessarily be a bad thing for Jaylen. That's a good org. So are the Celtics, but things could be much worse for Jaylen.
tequila4kapp
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Leonard - sans injury - is the better player right now.

Pop...I think I read his wife was seriously ill and died this year. If so, yeah,rough times for him.
Yogi Bear
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tequila4kapp said:

Leonard - sans injury - is the better player right now.

Pop...I think I read his wife was seriously ill and died this year. If so, yeah,rough times for him.
Yes, it's so
Another Bear
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Pop gets a pass due to his wife...but Tony PARCKER doesn't. Apparently Leonard didn't appreciate Parker's statement that he had the same injury but 100 x worse, and he got over it in 8 months. How dumb was that to say?
philbert
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interesting analysis

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/23847072/zach-lowe-kawhi-leonard-jaylen-brown-celtics-spurs-trades
BearSD
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tequila4kapp said:

Leonard - sans injury - is the better player right now.
Leonard sans injury may be a thing of the past.

If you're a team looking to trade for Leonard, you have to think there are three possibilities, and two of them are not good at all: (1) Leonard genuinely couldn't play last season but will play next season and be as good as he was two years ago; (2) Leonard may never again be the player he was, or even close to it; or (3) Leonard exaggerated the severity of his injury because he doesn't want to play for the Spurs anymore.

I enjoy watching Kawhi play, and I hope (3) is not true. But I suspect (2) is true.


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