we knew it would be tough, and the Bears would have to win by hitting a lot of 3s, limiting turnovers and rebounding

well strike one, two and three

I worried that Grant is the type of player who can be defended if they keyed on him

I worried that longer, athletic 2s could limit Bradley's scoring (ditto South)

I worried that longer, athletic bigs could limit Kelly's scoring

all that was true today

On the other hand, Duke is extremely talented and deep, and is the best defense we will see this year. I also don't think we will see a center as dominant as Duke's center, which I think was the key to the game

I was impressed by Brown's and Thorp's play, and Kuany's potential is intriguing. Brown should have had at least 3 more assists, but either our guy didn't finish (e.g. the perfect pocket pass to Lars right under the basket, or the great pass to Kelly who got blocked) Thorp had the best box score on the team, and Kuany's got real potential on defense.

Paris was disappointing offensively (forcing it too much), but it's his defense which is the real problem. Coach is trying with him as I saw him get subbed out right after he watched a duke player drive by him without Paris even moving his feet. Then there was another play where Paris didn't cut off the baseline resulting in an easy duke score. I'm no longer surprised that coach starts Brown over Paris

HoopDreams said:

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1. I worried that Grant is the type of player who can be defended if they keyed on him

2. I worried that longer, athletic 2s could limit Bradley's scoring (ditto South)

3. I worried that longer, athletic bigs could limit Kelly's scoring

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1 & 2: Wow

3: Kelly should have played an inside-outside game. Make his defender come out to defend his jumper, then dribble by him or pass & screen.

The only way less athletic teams can compete with teams like this is with a lot of backscreening and cutting like in a Princeton offense and we don't run that. So you accept the disparity in athleticism and skill and hopefully something useful came from the experience.

Unfortunately, HD, I do think we're gonna see a lot of other posts who may pose a similar challenge: Nnaji at Arizona, Okongwu at SC and the 2 UW freshman come to mind. All those guys aren't just big but skilled and versatile. The performance of Carey was a shock to most Duke people because he was a perimeter player in HS and hadn't played much as a traditional post.

Totally agree that the Brown/Austin distribution of minutes would trend more and more in Brown's favor. It's also becoming clear that Thiemann isn't quite ready to play. Perhaps he will be down the road but at this point, we're getting essentially nothing from his minutes. There's no great option on the roster but Thorpe seems to have earned some more run and I'd like to see that.

Pigskin Pete said:

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HoopDreams said:

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1. I worried that Grant is the type of player who can be defended if they keyed on him

2. I worried that longer, athletic 2s could limit Bradley's scoring (ditto South)

3. I worried that longer, athletic bigs could limit Kelly's scoring

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1 & 2: Wow

3: Kelly should have played an inside-outside game. Make his defender come out to defend his jumper, then dribble by him or pass & screen.

.

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Exactly. There's still certain people on this board who question the value of a 5 being able to shoot threes. Well, this is exactly one of those times where a vanover type would've come in handy

While not ideal, if cal would've played 5 out, at least you get Carey away from the basket and you could either try to dribble penetrate or backscreen. Kelly is a good enough shooter where Carey would've had to respect his shot and come out to defend

Instead, cal played exactly into duke's hands by trying to play 2 posts. As Mel Gibson said in the Patriot, 'going muzzle to muzzle with the redcoats in an open field..it's madness.'

All of these comments are good.

I'd add a few more:

You have to know that when you play a traditional powerhouse like Duke, along with a coach America loves, and play them in Madison Square Garden, you won't be getting many breaks from the officials. They awarded many more free throws to Duke than to Cal. They missed a whole lot of calls on Duke that they should have made. On one play, Carey was standing alone in the paint at the elbow for 6 seconds by my count. Finally someone saw him open, fed him the ball, and he turned around and sank a jumper from there. The announcers said it was an amazing play, because he had to work to get open. Ridiculous. On another play, I think it was Moore who drove laterally and then into the basket, crashing into a Cal defender outside the little semicircle, and no charge was called. Then Bradley gets called for pushing off. Bradley is not a highly ranked player, and he will be called for stuff that the highly ranked players get away with. I remember Jaylen Brown used to get away with punching defenders in the chest on some of his drives. Never called for it, that I saw. Basketball is rough. Teams and players have to earn the respect of officials, to limit the calls against them.

15 turnovers vs Duke was a lot better than 22 vs Prairie View, but still way too many. We need to be under 10. There was one play where Brown was lazily dribbling the ball in front of himself, in a great imitation of Deschon Winston, and he got the ball swiped from him, just like Deschon did. And we still don't make many assists. We are often negative in the assist to turnover ratio, which is flat out awful. Guys are not passing enough, and when we do pass enough we are not finishing. We are not careful who we pass to and when. The passers need to get the ball to the shooter when he is open for the shot. if not open, pull the ball back out and start over. Other Cal players were careless with the ball. Paris on an inbounds pass, threw the ball up for grabs into a crowd.

I understand Fox using a zone against Duke, because you need all the help you can get to stop Duke's penetration, and Duke had not shot threes well this season. But once they started dropping threes, I think we could have gone to man, or at least mixed in some man defense. Once the game became a blowout, I think it would have been good to switch to a man defense, because these players need to learn how to best stop someone individually. There never going to learn defensive fundamentals which are used in both types of defenses by playing passive zone defenses. We don't have the personnel to trap anyone, let alone trap Duke athletes. And he does too much dribbling around the perimeter, in an imitation of Ayinde Ubaka as a freshman. Paris is a 5th year senior, and should know better. It is one reason that Brown may become your point guard.

Once Cal fell behind, they started trying to do too much by themselves. Too many times the ball handler drove one on two or one on three, and failed to achieve anything. If you are going to do that, then a teammate should be open, and the ball handler should find him. Players need to work harder to get open. These things are correctable, with players learning to play with each other and learn each other's tendencies. I only hope they will realize this, and keep their confidence and spirit up after playing Duke. Cal's team fell apart a while ago in Maui after losing to Wichita State, and it ruined the whole season. We have a better and experienced coach now, and that shouldn't happen this year.

" ...along with a coach America loves"

The discerning know that he is a sanctimonious pr@ick.

bearister said:

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" ...along with a coach America loves"

The discerning know that he is a sanctimonious pr@ick.

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Well, my Polish friends love him. Both of them. I've never been accused of being discerning.

SFCityBear said:

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All of these comments are good.

I'd add a few more:

You have to know that when you play a traditional powerhouse like Duke, along with a coach America loves, and play them in Madison Square Garden, you won't be getting many breaks from the officials. They awarded many more free throws to Duke than to Cal. They missed a whole lot of calls on Duke that they should have made. On one play, Carey was standing alone in the paint at the elbow for 6 seconds by my count. Finally someone saw him open, fed him the ball, and he turned around and sank a jumper from there. The announcers said it was an amazing play, because he had to work to get open. Ridiculous. On another play, I think it was Moore who drove laterally and then into the basket, crashing into a Cal defender outside the little semicircle, and no charge was called. Then Bradley gets called for pushing off. Bradley is not a highly ranked player, and he will be called for stuff that the highly ranked players get away with. I remember Jaylen Brown used to get away with punching defenders in the chest on some of his drives. Never called for it, that I saw. Basketball is rough. Teams and players have to earn the respect of officials, to limit the calls against them.

15 turnovers vs Duke was a lot better than 22 vs Prairie View, but still way too many. We need to be under 10. There was one play where Brown was lazily dribbling the ball in front of himself, in a great imitation of Deschon Winston, and he got the ball swiped from him, just like Deschon did. And we still don't make many assists. We are often negative in the assist to turnover ratio, which is flat out awful. Guys are not passing enough, and when we do pass enough we are not finishing. We are not careful who we pass to and when. The passers need to get the ball to the shooter when he is open for the shot. if not open, pull the ball back out and start over. Other Cal players were careless with the ball. Paris on an inbounds pass, threw the ball up for grabs into a crowd.

I understand Fox using a zone against Duke, because you need all the help you can get to stop Duke's penetration, and Duke had not shot threes well this season. But once they started dropping threes, I think we could have gone to man, or at least mixed in some man defense. Once the game became a blowout, I think it would have been good to switch to a man defense, because these players need to learn how to best stop someone individually. There never going to learn defensive fundamentals which are used in both types of defenses by playing passive zone defenses. We don't have the personnel to trap anyone, let alone trap Duke athletes. And he does too much dribbling around the perimeter, in an imitation of Ayinde Ubaka as a freshman. Paris is a 5th year senior, and should know better. It is one reason that Brown may become your point guard.

Once Cal fell behind, they started trying to do too much by themselves. Too many times the ball handler drove one on two or one on three, and failed to achieve anything. If you are going to do that, then a teammate should be open, and the ball handler should find him. Players need to work harder to get open. These things are correctable, with players learning to play with each other and learn each other's tendencies. I only hope they will realize this, and keep their confidence and spirit up after playing Duke. Cal's team fell apart a while ago in Maui after losing to Wichita State, and it ruined the whole season. We have a better and experienced coach now, and that shouldn't happen this year.

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good post