Silving Lining

ducky23
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Here's the silver lining. If you're the BYU staff, how on earth do you prepare for this offense?

Yes, the Cal offense looked awful against UNC. And I highly doubt that they looked that miserable on purpose just to throw BYU off.

But with that said, it doesn't mean that Cal's confounding offensive performance won't make it much more difficult to prepare for.

In a very limited amount of practice time, BYU now has to prepare for 3 different QB's who run 3 different types of offenses. And since Cal was fortunate enough to have a significant lead thru most of the game, it allowed Cal to run an extremely conservative, vanilla offense. No matter how bad you think Baldwin may be, I guarantee there are several wrinkles that you will see against BYU. I also think you're going to see a lot more of Dancy, who, for some reason, didn't get a single carry against UNC. So right now, the only film BYU has to look at is of Laird running extremely basic running plays up the middle. Its not a lot to go on.

On the other side of the ball, BYU had to show their hand a bit more since they had a more competitive game on their hands. And on offense, BYU is extremely predictable (and I think their coaches would even admit that). They rely on a strong o-line to open up the inside run game. Once that is established, they will run misdirection plays (jetsweeps, play action roll outs, etc) to keep the opposing defense off balance. Its not a secret what BYU wants to run, so Cal should be very well prepared. So whether we can stop the BYU offense won't have to do with scheme. It all comes down to whether we can be physical enough at the point of attack to stop their inside run game (something that is certainly unclear).

So here is where we have an advantage. Our defensive staff is top notch. We are going to have a good gameplan to stop their offense (whether we have the physical ability to do so is another question). But I think its very possible BYU's defense is going to be caught at least slightly off guard cause no one has any idea of what to expect from Cal's offense.

Yes, its very possible all of this won't matter. Its possible our offense is really so inept that no amount of schematic advantage is going to help. But I have to believe Cal's offensive performance against UNC was a bit of an aberration. It was most likely a combination of 1) cal QB and o-line playing very poorly 2) cal offensive staff being caught off guard by UNC's defense 3) extremely conservative vanilla offense 4) 1st game jitters 5) 1st game experimentation

In the end, this is the exact same offense from last year. No one is expecting them to be a juggernaut. But even an average 2017 offensive performance will give Cal a really good shot against BYU.

HungryCalBear
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Considering how well BYU contained a mobile Khalil Tate we may see more of Bowers this week. Ideally we can get by with a close win against BYU with limited offense and save all of Baldwin's "multiples" for Oregon.

I can dream can't I?
oskirules
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BYU won't be prepared for our secret weapon, the bubble screen. I don't believe I saw that play against North Carolina.
mikecohen
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oskirules said:

BYU won't be prepared for our secret weapon, the bubble screen. I don't believe I saw that play against North Carolina.

For a loss. I haven't seen that play work (at least for us) since Tedford's last really good year. But then, maybe you were being ironic.
Cal89
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Agreed that the Cal D has more relevant video to study in preparations for the BYU O than visa versa. Interviews with JW and BB lead me to believe that they see no reason to divulge any more than necessary. While I don't feel we wanted to be that inept on offense of course, I like to believe that there is a method to the madness. If so, I like it. Crafty.

Hot day in Provo (90F), but a night game though. Elevation, not much of a factor at 4,500'. Flying-out tomorrow morning?
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Strykur
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mikecohen said:

oskirules said:

BYU won't be prepared for our secret weapon, the bubble screen. I don't believe I saw that play against North Carolina.

For a loss. I haven't seen that play work (at least for us) since Tedford's last really good year. But then, maybe you were being ironic.
The last years of Tedford even going back to 2008 sucked because we couldn't run a wide receiver screen for ****, those always got read and blown up for huge losses, although I was amused when we played UCLA in 2008 and we ran inside screens all game to Jahvid Best for huge plays, the lone exception during that odd time. So seeing us run effective screens under Dykes was a welcome change from that at least.
oskirules
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mikecohen said:

oskirules said:

BYU won't be prepared for our secret weapon, the bubble screen. I don't believe I saw that play against North Carolina.

For a loss. I haven't seen that play work (at least for us) since Tedford's last really good year. But then, maybe you were being ironic.
Yes, I was being sarcastic, however, Dykes/Franklin/Spavital also had their share of success with screens.
KoreAmBear
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UNC's line looked huge and athletic on both sides of the ball. I would imagine BYU's lines will not be SEC/ACC level lol. I think that will help a lot.
Cal89
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KoreAmBear said:

UNC's line looked huge and athletic on both sides of the ball. I would imagine BYU's lines will not be SEC/ACC level lol. I think that will help a lot.
Yup. I really noticed a difference in speed with the UNC and BYU.

We so often note and even moan about the talent, a deficit of such, recruits, and how many stars, etc.... UNC had a clear edge on us in that dept (average stars, previous 4-5 recruiting classes). Their classes would be like 4th best in the Pac-12. They looked the part on the field.

BYU's classes would put them in the bottom in the Pac-12. Again, they are big, really physical and look to be conditioned very well.

As I shared in another thread, here is that BYU/Arizona game:



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oskirules
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BYU also haven't seen our tight ends play. Neither did we.
mikecohen
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oskirules said:

mikecohen said:

oskirules said:

BYU won't be prepared for our secret weapon, the bubble screen. I don't believe I saw that play against North Carolina.

For a loss. I haven't seen that play work (at least for us) since Tedford's last really good year. But then, maybe you were being ironic.
Yes, I was being sarcastic, however, Dykes/Franklin/Spavital also had their share of success with screens.
But not BUBBLE screens
ducky23
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In theory, we should be a much better bubble screening team this year with some added size with guys like ways, Hudson and bunting

mikecohen
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ducky23 said:

In theory, we should be a much better bubble screening team this year with some added size with guys like ways, Hudson and bunting


For a bubble screen, you need two things with which the team last Saturday was in short supply: speed and surprise.
FuzzyWuzzy
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mikecohen said:

ducky23 said:

In theory, we should be a much better bubble screening team this year with some added size with guys like ways, Hudson and bunting


For a bubble screen, you need two things with which the team last Saturday was in short supply: speed and surprise.
You need an outside receiver who can stalk block a corner. Size ain't everything with the stalk block, though it helps. And lining up tight ends and slot guys out there will quickly become a tell
heartofthebear
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I don't know if this has already been mentioned but there is another silver lining here.
I had suspected but now have confirmed that Arizona's OL has been hit hard with injuries.
Our OL, on the other hand is healthy and experienced.
As bad as our OL seemed last week, it was playing against a pretty good front.
BYU has a good front, but they looked much better than good because of the injury ridden OL they were facing.

Also, Cal's D is much better than Arizona's.

I am not saying Cal will win. And I think that the Goode injury plus some questions I have about Baldwin as an OC are significant enough to make this game a concern.

But I don't think Cal will lose because their DL dominates our OL.
killa22
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mikecohen said:

ducky23 said:

In theory, we should be a much better bubble screening team this year with some added size with guys like ways, Hudson and bunting


For a bubble screen, you need two things with which the team last Saturday was in short supply: speed and surprise.


Incorrect, all you need is blocking at the point of attack and the right pre snap look.

Bubble screens are determined entirely by numbers and leverage.

The idea is to use our bigger bodied TEs to block @ 2 in Trips surface plays throwing to Hawkins or Kanawai.

We accomplish the same thing with orbit motion out of compressed 2 x 2 sets to create a Trips surface and attack defensive rotation.

The Bubble also functions as the pitch component on some QB run stuff too.

Spavital ran screens incredibly well, and Tony ran excellent draw / slip screens.

What made Spavs screens so effective were that they set up play action off of fake screens - cheap, easy offense.
killa22
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The biggest problem with BYUs defense is their size and age closely resemble Stanford in terms of body type and play style.

They can be easily exposed on the back end in coverage. I spotted several holes / flaws in their coverage shells and assignment rules. No doubt the offensive staff picked up on the same things.

Cautiously optimistic that the Passing Game will be dramatically improved. Appeared to have too much an emphasis on featuring the TE position which is not a huge competitive strength at the moment.

Rays gotta capitalize on his opportunities.
killa22
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Also, honestly speaking Khalil's difficulties with BYU were of his own making and less to do with BYU.

Dude was out there trying to play hero ball & throw lasers all over instead of playing within the system and himself.
Bear8
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Cal89, maybe the method to the madness is waiting for Sept. 29, when we play the Ducks.
okaydo
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Does anybody know how Michael Silving is feeling about the game?
Cal89
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Bear8 said:

Cal89, maybe the method to the madness is waiting for Sept. 29, when we play the Ducks.
Yes, possibly. Or, maybe we'll see some of it today too...

BYU beat Arizona, a Pac-12 team. They have played Pac-12 teams very tough in recent years, including another win over Arizona, and very close losses to Utah and UCLA. A TD or less was the difference.

It seems that many here went from Cal can win in Provo or maybe Cal can do so, to it not being likely. All based upon our first game, and their first game...

Having watched that BYU / Arizona game, I see reason for hope.

For those interested, Arizona and Houston in less than 2 hours...

EDIT/ADD:


heartofthebear, yes on the Arizona offensive line. I said here earlier, or another thread that they had only one guy out there from last season. Couple that with a new HC and OC, it's what one might expect for a game one... Tate, whether there was a BYU spy or two of them, he didn't even attempt to assert his will on the ground...
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GivemTheAxe
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oskirules said:

BYU also haven't seen our tight ends play. Neither did we.

Tight ends have to learn how to hang on to the ball when it hits their hands.
BearlyClad
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I expect a large number of penalties due to each team wanting to establish their "toughness" dominance. BYU likely doesn't care much for Californians generally, in the first place, and believe they can out-muscle us. Remember BYU vs. Memphis? They will push back. Just another aspect of the game.
KenBurnski
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I seem to recall BYU playing dirty during our previous meeting. I expect Wharton to channel the funny, coked up version of Chevy Chase. Lots of pratfalls through the Gatorade table after the whistle.
oskirules
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I didn't see a screen pass tonight. We can save this for next week's silver lining thread.
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