Free throw shooting

15,406 Views | 58 Replies | Last: 7 yr ago by SFCityBear
UrsaMajor
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I know we did well at the line on Saturday, so this post isn't about Cal.

I heard an interesting discussion about improving FT shooting by a former college coach who made the point that almost every team practices FT shooting incorrectly. Players are typically asked to shoot X number of FT's at the end (or beginning) of practice. His point was that shooting 25 or 50 in a row--it's easier to correct your mistakes and seem to be shooting a higher percentage. Unfortunately, that's not how FT's are shot in games. In the game, you go to the line after having just been running up/down the court and often involved in a collision. Then you step to the line, shoot twice, and that's it. Different state of mind, different state of body, and no chance to fine tune your shot. He said that when he coached, he would randomly stop practice and ask someone to shoot two FT's, then resume the drills. This was a better way to mimic game situations.

My basketball coaching ended with middle school, so I'm wondering what others who have more experience or have thought about it more (SFCity? HD?) think of this.
BeachedBear
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I too have seen and used this method. Again (my experience was maxed at youth level), but I would also blast some crowd noise on a boom box. I actually recorded the noise from a gym during CYO 8th grade playoffs at Tice Valley gym. It included some audible personal insults from grandparents and the like.
Big C
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You probably have to do both: Shoot many, many FTs to refine the mechanics and repeat them until it's in your muscle memory. Then practice shooting 1 or 2 under a simulated game situation.

What I never understood is, why when there is a player who has obviously flawed mechanics (as do most poor FT shooters) they can't watch video of themselves, compared to a fundamentally sound shooter, and gradually refine their stroke.
SRBear
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yea...tried that in golf....needless to say, I couldn't emulate young Jack.
UrsaMajor
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Big C said:



What I never understood is, why when there is a player who has obviously flawed mechanics (as do most poor FT shooters) they can't watch video of themselves, compared to a fundamentally sound shooter, and gradually refine their stroke.
I think it is the same reason that duffers can't improve their golf strokes easily. I spent years trying to refine my tennis serve, and while I had a serviceable serve (pun intended), I never could emulate the ones I saw on video. Meanwhile my son, who was overall an average tennis player could routinely hit 130 mph bullets (actually measured w/ a radar gun).
smokeyrover
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Hard to prove, but ft percentage isn't just about technique and practice. Nerves and familiarity with being at the line in a college arena game setting plays a huge part.

Case in point -- Roger Moute a Bidias. Sophomore year he shot 11-24, 46% from the line. Senior year he shot 29-34, 85%. Did technique and repetition really improve his stroke that much, or was it just that he was more used to being on the line? Maybe some of both, but I tend to think more of the latter.
HoopDreams
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Good discussion! A few thoughts...

I think good FT shooting is a factor of:

Shooting technique
Repetition
Mental state
Physical state

Practicing should be for all 4 and you try to do it with different techniques at different times. Unfortunately, there is not nearly enough practice time to do all 4 given there are so many other things to cover

Most practice time is spent on team activities such as teach and practice your offense because it takes a long time to get players comfortable and instinctive inside a structured offense.

Ditto for defense although it' doesn't need as much time as offense (some coaches may disagree). To me defense is about fundamentals, concepts/principals and playing hard.

Therefore a poor FT shooter is unlikely to improve much simply from the regular practice time because they won't get the repetitions needed.

Sometimes the coaches need some time to work with a single or small group of players. So you have the other players practice FTs (3 at a basket). You make it a competition of who can shoot the highest FT% with ten shots each, but they should only shoot two at a time, and then rotate to the next player.

You might put free throws at the end of practice sometimes to experience shooting when tired (shots will probably be short because players will use less legs)

You can put pressure on them by having the entire team run lines every time a player doesn't hit both FTs

Correcting shooting form might be a one-on-one teaching but needs repetition and game experience because rebuilding a shot will take a long time to become natural.

You typically only get a major jump in shooting % by rebuilding someone's shooting form. Easier to do on the FT line than in live game situations because a player can go through a kinda mental checklist before shooting a FT, which is not possible to do when shooting a jump shot with a defender in your face.

So different coaching techniques are used to hit the four elements of FT shooting, but again it's hard to do enough of it in practice
UrsaMajor
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smokeyrover said:

Hard to prove, but ft percentage isn't just about technique and practice. Nerves and familiarity with being at the line in a college arena game setting plays a huge part.

Case in point -- Roger Moute a Bidias. Sophomore year he shot 11-24, 46% from the line. Senior year he shot 29-34, 85%. Did technique and repetition really improve his stroke that much, or was it just that he was more used to being on the line? Maybe some of both, but I tend to think more of the latter.
I remember reading that when Jason Kidd was at Cal, his overall FT%age was so-so, but his %age in the last 2 minutes of close games (single digits) was around 15 points higher.
SFCityBear
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UrsaMajor said:

Big C said:



What I never understood is, why when there is a player who has obviously flawed mechanics (as do most poor FT shooters) they can't watch video of themselves, compared to a fundamentally sound shooter, and gradually refine their stroke.
I think it is the same reason that duffers can't improve their golf strokes easily. I spent years trying to refine my tennis serve, and while I had a serviceable serve (pun intended), I never could emulate the ones I saw on video. Meanwhile my son, who was overall an average tennis player could routinely hit 130 mph bullets (actually measured w/ a radar gun).
Not to worry. It was all in the modern equipment. If you are like me, when I was growing up, my racquet was a Jack Kramer Wilson model, made of wood and strung with catgut, when I could finally afford it. In those days, the fastest serve was that of Pancho Gonzales at 113 mph, followed by Jack Kramer at 107 mph, I believe. Now, the ladies are serving faster than that. Youth will be served (pun also intended), but I would rather have seen them do it with a wooden racquet. Bill Tilden was supposedly timed at 163 mph with the wood racquet, but there are questions about the equipment and accuracy of that.

Also, you know it is not the speed but the spin and the placement. Pancho not only had the most powerful serve of his day, but he was effortless, and could hit his serve high or low, and place it anywhere in the service court, with different spins, just about any time he wanted. So I figure you still could beat your son in a match, even if he was serving 130 mph, right? My father was on Cal's tennis team, and in my prime, he beat me like a drum.
SFCityBear
UrsaMajor
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SFCityBear said:

UrsaMajor said:

Big C said:



What I never understood is, why when there is a player who has obviously flawed mechanics (as do most poor FT shooters) they can't watch video of themselves, compared to a fundamentally sound shooter, and gradually refine their stroke.
I think it is the same reason that duffers can't improve their golf strokes easily. I spent years trying to refine my tennis serve, and while I had a serviceable serve (pun intended), I never could emulate the ones I saw on video. Meanwhile my son, who was overall an average tennis player could routinely hit 130 mph bullets (actually measured w/ a radar gun).
Not to worry. It was all in the modern equipment. If you are like me, when I was growing up, my racquet was a Jack Kramer Wilson model, made of wood and strung with catgut, when I could finally afford it. In those days, the fastest serve was that of Pancho Gonzales at 113 mph, followed by Jack Kramer at 107 mph, I believe. Now, the ladies are serving faster than that. Youth will be served (pun also intended), but I would rather have seen them do it with a wooden racquet. Bill Tilden was supposedly timed at 163 mph with the wood racquet, but there are questions about the equipment and accuracy of that.

Also, you know it is not the speed but the spin and the placement. Pancho not only had the most powerful serve of his day, but he was effortless, and could hit his serve high or low, and place it anywhere in the service court, with different spins, just about any time he wanted. So I figure you still could beat your son in a match, even if he was serving 130 mph, right? My father was on Cal's tennis team, and in my prime, he beat me like a drum.
Unfortunately, he had a wicked twist serve for his 2nd serve, but I was able to win my share (mostly he'd choke if he got close to beating me...)
Big C
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UrsaMajor said:

Big C said:



What I never understood is, why when there is a player who has obviously flawed mechanics (as do most poor FT shooters) they can't watch video of themselves, compared to a fundamentally sound shooter, and gradually refine their stroke.
I think it is the same reason that duffers can't improve their golf strokes easily. I spent years trying to refine my tennis serve, and while I had a serviceable serve (pun intended), I never could emulate the ones I saw on video. Meanwhile my son, who was overall an average tennis player could routinely hit 130 mph bullets (actually measured w/ a radar gun).
To me, a golf swing is more complicated... and with a MUCH smaller margin of error. I'm a mediocre basketball player, but when we used to shoot for teams at the gym we used to rent out, I'd look great (until the games started). I think I learned to shoot FTs just by watching good players, analyzing the mechanics and then trying to replicate that.

Golf was a whole different story, for me. I got serious for a year or so, then put it aside "for a while", out of frustration. That was thirty+ years ago and I have never felt compelled to play again. When I say I don't like golf, it is out of respect for the game and for the players that can hit the ball well.

When I watch lousy FT shooters shoot, more often than not they have flawed mechanics and I always wonder "Why doesn't somebody tell them to just _____!"
bearister
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Art Garfunkel once went OCD over shooting free throws and made a huge number of them in a row. Trying to find a story on it.


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“I love Cal deeply. What are the directions to The Portal from Sproul Plaza?”
SFCityBear
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BeachedBear said:

I too have seen and used this method. Again (my experience was maxed at youth level), but I would also blast some crowd noise on a boom box. I actually recorded the noise from a gym during CYO 8th grade playoffs at Tice Valley gym. It included some audible personal insults from grandparents and the like.
I'm guessing that coaches and players today sort of expect to do a lot of game simulation at practice, including more scrimmaging than repetitive drills on fundamentals, so I guess free throws would be no exception. Your idea is interesting, so what success did you have? Did the kids shoot FTs any better?

Free throw shooting style or technique hasn't changed much since I was a kid, except that there are glass backboards everywhere, which gives a fairly uniform look. It would be a challenge to prepare for all the different arenas, noise level, insult intensity, etc. ASU fans do that craziness behind the basket to distract the shooter, and other schools do other things to distract shooters. Back in the days of Harmon, the Cal rooting section used to occupy the West side of the gym, and for some years, the opponents' band was given some seats behind and a little to the east of the north basket, at floor level. Those opponent bands were fans as well, and they jeered and did all they could to disrupt Cal free throw shooters. Then Cal decided to change and they gave the opponent fans and their band seats up near the rafters in the corner, where you could barely hear them, and they could not bother Cal shooters. Every school or arena will have its own characteristic fans and their methods.

My former roommate at Cal later ended up attending medical school in Bologna, Italy. This city was governed by Communists, and was a hot bed of Communist activity in Italy. One day, the U.S.S.R. National team came to Bologna to have a game against the Italian National team. My former roommate attended the game. He was curious to see which team the fans in Bologna would support, the Italian National team or the team representing the Communist Soviet Union. Generally, the fans were very polite and applauded or got excited when there was a good play from either side. It was a very close game that went down to the wire. The game came down to the last second, with the Italian team leading by one point, A Soviet player was fouled, and awarded two free throws. As he prepared to shoot, nearly everyone in the arena seats pulled out their handkerchiefs, and started waving them furiously to try and distract the Soviet player. He missed both, and the Italian team won the game.

Nationalism trumped Communism that day. (Pun not intended, but recognized, so I left it in)






SFCityBear
helltopay1
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Generally, good shooters make free throws the great majority of the time. Pretty good shooters make free throws most of the time. Mediocre shooters make free throws about half the time. Poor shooters usually shoot less than 50% of the time. also, really good players get to the line a lot. They are not afraid to drive. also, they know they will make most of their free throws. It's a pity I didn't drive more when I was playing. ( 10 years) I once made 83 of 85 free throws ( in practice) I settled for perimeter shots.
bearsandgiants
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I always bring my boom box to the course.
BeachedBear
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SFCityBear said:

BeachedBear said:

I too have seen and used this method. Again (my experience was maxed at youth level), but I would also blast some crowd noise on a boom box. I actually recorded the noise from a gym during CYO 8th grade playoffs at Tice Valley gym. It included some audible personal insults from grandparents and the like.
I'm guessing that coaches and players today sort of expect to do a lot of game simulation at practice, including more scrimmaging than repetitive drills on fundamentals, so I guess free throws would be no exception. Your idea is interesting, so what success did you have? Did the kids shoot FTs any better?

.....

As a youth coach, FTs were a challenge. I was happy to get to 50%. At younger ages, you're trying to help them with good form, while their physical development makes a 15 footer quite a challenge. Once they get to 6th grade or so, it is still A LOT of mechanics and repetition, but lots of of the mental parts of the game. The relative importance of free throws, encouraging them to practice in the driveway/playground, focus and ignoring the crowd. We had lots of chatter that created distractions, so I had my wife record some crowd noise at games. It turned out to be hilarious and after a few laughs during practice, it really helped the boys and girls tune out and focus. Here is what I had....

For anyone that has been to a youth AAU or CYO game, the situation with grandparents is sort of classic. Imagine a gym with two or three simultaneous games going on. Lots of general noise of squeaky sneakers, whistles, yelling coaches and players and a very small crowd - pretty much parents, grandparents and dragged along siblings.

Then you get a free throw situation, with no whistles and sneakers. The players are usually catching their breath and the coaches calm down. So, the only noise left is the sparse crowd. Most of the usual parents are generally quiet, but the visiting grandparents (who may be a little hard of hearing) start coming through the noise loud and clear. My recording had these three gems from the crowd of grandparents...(Note: Steven was the player on my team taking the free throws and his grandparents were the ones recorded)

1. (Grandpa) That mother***ing ref is an idiot! When I played ball, that bull**** would have been an ejection! Somebody needs to go out there and let 'em know what the **** is going down!

2. (Grandma) I don't think Steven looks good with that haircut.

3 (Grandpa) Do you think he's gay?

*Steven's name was changed to protect the innocent and he found it all hilarious.

As for better FT shooting, my experience as a youth coach was all about reinforcing mechanics and encouraging the kids to practice, practice, practice on their own. Since team practice time was short, actual free throw practice was limited to scrimmages and what I described earlier (which I only used for 7th and 8th grade).

As an aside, I was big on mechanics. I would try to teach good form and would generally be ignored. I had Frank Allocco (who was HC at De La Salle at the time) come with his kids and do the same thing (I learned from Frank). He was pretty much ignored as well. Then I had a couple of St Mary's players stop by and do it again for 5 minutes and all the kids would duplicate them like robots!!! Worked wonders! BTW, I would also include parents in the hope that they would go shoot hoops with their kids and re-inforce good habits (turns out lots of parents in Moraga did not know good technique, but thought they did and would reinforce bad habits).
UrsaMajor
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Love the anecdote. When my son was in high school, he did a science project trying to study the effect of pressure and/or disruption on FT shooting. He took a bunch of kids--some playing on their team, others not BB players and had them shoot 10 FT's each under 3 conditions: regular practice, with others yelling various things, and a "pressure" situation where they could win $$ for makes and lose it for misses. Small sample and nothing conclusive, but what he found was that the better shooters (70% or better ) did BETTER under pressure or with disruption, while the mediocre shooters did worse. (I've always wondered what would happen if the entire arena got dead quiet when a visiting player was shooting or got dead quiet with one designated individual to make some kind of loud noise just as the shooter was going to release)
helltopay1
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someone should instruct the Cal rooting section ( all 48 of them---sorry---could not resist that) to go totally silent when the opposing player shoots----I have a hunch the silence will prove to be a major distraction.
BeachedBear
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helltopay1 said:

someone should instruct the Cal rooting section ( all 48 of them---sorry---could not resist that) to go totally silent when the opposing player shoots----I have a hunch the silence will prove to be a major distraction.
I like this idea! But one person (I nominate helltopay1) should ask the shooter some awkward question in a loud voice to add to the distraction. Something like...

"Hey, is this the same guy we saw at the strip club last night?"
UrsaMajor
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BeachedBear said:

helltopay1 said:

someone should instruct the Cal rooting section ( all 48 of them---sorry---could not resist that) to go totally silent when the opposing player shoots----I have a hunch the silence will prove to be a major distraction.
I like this idea! But one person (I nominate helltopay1) should ask the shooter some awkward question in a loud voice to add to the distraction. Something like...

"Hey, is this the same guy we saw at the strip club last night?"
How long has it been since "Victoria?"
concordtom
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I shot 87% in HS and 82% in JC back east.
I knew I needed to have the same routine every time. So I tinkered with lots of different motions, but then settled on one I could repeat over a over again no matter the situation. I recall hearing Tommy Heinsohn say during some Celtics-Lakers broadcast that "if you live by the jumper you die by the jumper, and the legs are the first thing to go in the 4th quarter", so I decided that I needed to use my biggest muscles to get the ball up to the rim, with my smallest muscles (fingers, wrist) being the ones to tickle the twine.

Thus, my motion started with some deep knee bends, repeated so I could get the right rhythm down, even when tired. I'd start with my head looking down, and then slowly raise it as I continued to do the squats. Eventually I worked upward with the ball above my head and the bouncing motion eventually led to my shot from over my forehead. It was really odd and ugly and there were many times I wanted to give it up. But it was what I trained myself to do and it was successful so I never did.

I'd say that whatever motion a kid decide upon, that he be able to shoot a ton in a row, correct and fine tune it, as per the OP. However, then he'd need to be able to replicate that in any situation. I think if you just focus and get your routine down... I don't see how some shoot so poorly. It's mental in so many ways.
KenBurnski
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I wish BA would do a treatment of CCTs reliable free throw routine.
Civil Bear
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KenBurnski said:

I wish BA would do a treatment of CCTs reliable free throw routine.


I think the average free throw percentage of BI posters was about 85% back in the day.
UrsaMajor
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Civil Bear said:

KenBurnski said:

I wish BA would do a treatment of CCTs reliable free throw routine.


I think the average free throw percentage of BI posters was about 85% back in the day.
As they get older, the misses get forgotten, and the percentage goes up.
concordtom
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Civil Bear said:

KenBurnski said:

I wish BA would do a treatment of CCTs reliable free throw routine.


I think the average free throw percentage of BI posters was about 85% back in the day.


Lol.
Yeah, but...

I am into genealogy for the past 12 years when one snowy January day I found a book on my in-laws den. It was a report someone had done in the 70's on a family branch from South Dakota. It connected my wife to New England in the 16-1700's. She had Rev War ancestors. I was jealous, all I knew was I was a California Mutt.

By digging around online that same day, I found a tree posted online that included my great grandfather's mom, whose I had not previously known about. And it also went to Central CT in the 1600's. I was shocked and thrilled to discover all this. I became an addict and now have about 3700 people in my family tree.

I discovered I am not only 10th cousins with my wife, but she is with my uncle, my brother-in-law... I am 1st cousins with Ben Franklin, grandchild of William Brewster... we are cousins with 7 presidents, and scores and scores of other famous people.

The conclusion is, yes, we are ALL related, and you don't need to do all this research to be able to say so: but it's nice to have the paperwork to prove it!
I also have the paperwork to prove 85%.
petalumabear
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concordtom said:

Civil Bear said:

KenBurnski said:

MI wish BA would do a treatment of CCTs reliable free throw routine.


I think the average free throw percentage of BI posters was about 85% back in the day.


Lol.
Yeah, but...
I also have the paperwork to prove 85%.
Tom, for all we know you are related to all of our garbage men... We don't give a rats behind. Show us certified proof of that 85% or it didn't happen. (Sort of like our gladly departed Schlocky and his tutor @ Cal).
SFCityBear
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UrsaMajor said:

I know we did well at the line on Saturday, so this post isn't about Cal.

I heard an interesting discussion about improving FT shooting by a former college coach who made the point that almost every team practices FT shooting incorrectly. Players are typically asked to shoot X number of FT's at the end (or beginning) of practice. His point was that shooting 25 or 50 in a row--it's easier to correct your mistakes and seem to be shooting a higher percentage. Unfortunately, that's not how FT's are shot in games. In the game, you go to the line after having just been running up/down the court and often involved in a collision. Then you step to the line, shoot twice, and that's it. Different state of mind, different state of body, and no chance to fine tune your shot. He said that when he coached, he would randomly stop practice and ask someone to shoot two FT's, then resume the drills. This was a better way to mimic game situations.

My basketball coaching ended with middle school, so I'm wondering what others who have more experience or have thought about it more (SFCity? HD?) think of this.
Thanks but I may not be the right person to ask about how to teach players to improve their free throw shooting. No one ever taught me how to shoot free throws and I never taught anyone else to shoot them. I would defer to Beached Bear and Hoop Dreams, and listen to what they have to say. I think you have hit upon something, and that free throws are more mental than physical, and to improve free throw shooting, the mental side should get the lion's share of attention, IMO.

As to shooting, I was almost entirely self-taught. I shot free throws at well over 90% in competition over a brief 10+ year career. But even at that percentage, I still wanted to improve. I wanted to shoot 100%. No one ever has. You can do it for a game or a few games. I was 24-24 during my senior year in high school. I was primarily a perimeter shooter, so I didn't have too many free throw attempts. I never thought that was a big deal, until a couple of years ago, a friend told me that 24-24 was pretty cool. I guess it was, but I never thought about it.

I taught myself to shoot. I did not understand what I was doing then, but over 60 years later, I can finally begin to understand how I did it. My dad tried to teach me to shoot at first, when I was a little tyke. A two-handed set shot, and an underhanded free throw style. I had already played a lot of tennis, so my right arm was much more developed than my left, and all two-handed shots went way off line. He took me to some Cal games and I watched some players shooting one-handed push shots from the ear, a la Hank Luisetti, I guess. I watched players like Dick Tamberg. Bob Matheny was my idol. But I developed my own style, shooting from the hip, with a high arc, almost straight up, to avoid getting the shot blocked. I shot all my free throws one handed. I aimed for perfection, to drop the ball through the center of the hoop and touch as little net as possible. That way, if I was a little bit off and grazed the rim, I'd still make the shot. I tried different spins, different amounts of spin. Backspin was the most natural, but I tried no spin and a combo of backspin and horizontal circular spin for longer shots I loved to shoot the latter one, but I was afraid to try it in games and risk getting benched.

In about the 6th grade, the best player in our neighborhood, who captained our team, and went on to play a CB in the NFL for 5 years, showed up at the playground sporting a two-handed jump shot, where he shot the ball from way behind his head. We all tried to copy it. There was not one TV set in the neighborhood, so we had little chance to see games. I went to a Saturday matinee at the Haight Theatre for a dime, and the newsreel showed a game clip of Robin Freeman, the nation's leading scorer from Ohio State. I tried to copy his jump shot. So I now had two shots, a one hand push and a jumper. I always liked traditional hook shots, with hand, arm, and both shoulders all lined up with the hoop, probably because Bob Mckeen of Cal was another idol of mine. To avoid ever getting it blocked, I used to shoot it up in the air and falling away, my own invention. Then I invented a drive parallel to the baseline across the paint, and as I passed the basket I'd rise and fall away from the hoop. The shot was unblockable. The only player I ever saw use a similar shot was Jerry Lucas. He used to play near the basket to one side. He catch a pass, and then instead os shooting, he used to quickly dribble out to the opposite elbow, and shoot a fade away hook from there. Deadly.

We had an older player in the neighborhood, who was an All-City guard from Poly High, For some reason, he did not show up all summer in the schoolyard to shoot hoops. Right before Fall practice, he showed up. He was shooting every single shot, set shots, jumpers, hooks off the backboard. Bank shots. I asked him why. He said he had gotten into an awful slump when he couldn't buy a basket, so he decided to try something different. He was just as deadly with the new method. He made the All-City team again. I decided to try it, and got pretty good at it, so now I had another new shot I could use, throwing my hooks and mid-range jumpers off the glass.

As to practicing free throws, I never did it like has been described in this thread, except maybe a little like the OP. If any coach brought in recorded sounds from a basketball game to get us to focus better, all of us kids would have thought him off his rocker. If any coach told me to shoot 60 or 100 free throws in a row, I would have tried some way to avoid such drudgery. You have to simulate game conditions in your mind when practicing, and you never shoot many in a row in a game. Not only that, it would be boring to shoot a bunch of free throws. I know there are these guys who can make 2000 in a row in exhibitions, but how many can they make in a game, where you shoot one and many not get another until 20 minutes later? Rick Barry made 60 consecutive one season. I shot alone, by myself, for hours, and I shot all my shots, layups, mid range jumpers, hook shots with either hand, and perimeter shots. When I missed a shot, I'd run and rebound the ball and shoot from that point, or I would dribble to another spot and shoot from there. If the rebound was short, I'd shoot a mid range jumper or a hook, if it was long, I'd shoot a perimeter shot. If I made the basket, I might say, "Good. Let's try that one again, and make it nothing but net." Every so often I'd sprinkle in a trip to the free throw line and try one or two. If I missed, sometimes I'd stay there until I made two. If the first ones were way off, I might shoot ten of them. I hardly ever shot more than ten in a row, and that was usually just to challenge myself before I went home to dinner. Also, I always practiced a lot of shots from 30-45 feet. I seldom shot from there in a game, but I felt that if I became a good shot from far way, then the shorter shots would be a piece of cake.

One thing about copying other players, I think a player should pick out some star who is around the same height to copy. Most taller players have so much trouble shooting them, then it might be worth looking for a good tall player to copy, say Kevin Durant or Larry Bird, but not Calvin Murphy, Mark Price or Steph Curry.

Shooting free throws is perhaps 90% mental, or it was for me. The whole idea in training the mental side is developing confidence, that's obvious. Fear of failure is a big motivator. When I was a gangly uncoordinated kid of 10 years, we had games every day at lunchtime in the schoolyard. The way we picked who got to play was we all lined up to shoot one free throw. The first 10 players to make their free throw got to play in the game. The ones who did not make their free throws could go play volleyball or dodgeball with the girls. And get teased unmercifully. There was no way I was going to miss that one free throw and go play with the girls. Nowadays, the girls would also be playing basketball at lunchtime, maybe even better than the boys. When I played on teams, the only way I would get to play is if I could score, otherwise I rode the pine, because I was maybe the least athletic kid on any team I played for. Everyone in my family was an athlete, father, uncles, and older cousins. I simply had to be one too, just to hold my head up high at family dinners, and the only way I could make a basketball team was to shoot better than anyone else. If I made the team, then the coaches might teach me all the other stuff like teamwork, passing, rebounding and defense. I never thought about missing a free throw. I used to look at it as a free chance to make a shot and impress the coach, so I could stay in the game.




SFCityBear
SFCityBear
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concordtom said:

Civil Bear said:

KenBurnski said:

I wish BA would do a treatment of CCTs reliable free throw routine.


I think the average free throw percentage of BI posters was about 85% back in the day.


Lol.
Yeah, but...

I am into genealogy for the past 12 years when one snowy January day I found a book on my in-laws den. It was a report someone had done in the 70's on a family branch from South Dakota. It connected my wife to New England in the 16-1700's. She had Rev War ancestors. I was jealous, all I knew was I was a California Mutt.

By digging around online that same day, I found a tree posted online that included my great grandfather's mom, whose I had not previously known about. And it also went to Central CT in the 1600's. I was shocked and thrilled to discover all this. I became an addict and now have about 3700 people in my family tree.

I discovered I am not only 10th cousins with my wife, but she is with my uncle, my brother-in-law... I am 1st cousins with Ben Franklin, grandchild of William Brewster... we are cousins with 7 presidents, and scores and scores of other famous people.

The conclusion is, yes, we are ALL related, and you don't need to do all this research to be able to say so: but it's nice to have the paperwork to prove it!
I also have the paperwork to prove 85%.
I believe you Tom. And I respect what you did. Besides, if you went through that unusual routine on the free throw line, and didn't make the free throws, you'd have been treated worse by your teammates than the treatment you are getting here from fellow Cal fans. What do these fans know? You are the only one who was there. Stick to your guns Tom.


SFCityBear
MSaviolives
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petalumabear said:

concordtom said:

Civil Bear said:

KenBurnski said:

NMI wish BA would do a treatment of CCTs reliable free throw routine.


I think the average free throw percentage of BI posters was about 85% back in the day.


Lol.
Yeah, but...
I also have the paperwork to prove 85%.
Tom, for all we know you are related to all of our garbage men... We don't give a rats behind. Show us certified proof of that 85% or it didn't happen. (Sort of like our gladly departed Schlocky and his tutor @ Cal).

We need a BI free throw contest

I'll bring a tailgate and bar set up
bearmanpg
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MSaviolives said:

petalumabear said:

concordtom said:

Civil Bear said:

KenBurnski said:

NMI wish BA would do a treatment of CCTs reliable free throw routine.


I think the average free throw percentage of BI posters was about 85% back in the day.


Lol.
Yeah, but...
I also have the paperwork to prove 85%.
Tom, for all we know you are related to all of our garbage men... We don't give a rats behind. Show us certified proof of that 85% or it didn't happen. (Sort of like our gladly departed Schlocky and his tutor @ Cal).

We need a BI free throw contest

I'll bring a tailgate and bar set up
In this contest, do we have to actually touch a basketball or can we just sit back on our phones and type about how many we made??
HoopDreams
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SFCityBear said:

UrsaMajor said:

I know we did well at the line on Saturday, so this post isn't about Cal.

I heard an interesting discussion about improving FT shooting by a former college coach who made the point that almost every team practices FT shooting incorrectly. Players are typically asked to shoot X number of FT's at the end (or beginning) of practice. His point was that shooting 25 or 50 in a row--it's easier to correct your mistakes and seem to be shooting a higher percentage. Unfortunately, that's not how FT's are shot in games. In the game, you go to the line after having just been running up/down the court and often involved in a collision. Then you step to the line, shoot twice, and that's it. Different state of mind, different state of body, and no chance to fine tune your shot. He said that when he coached, he would randomly stop practice and ask someone to shoot two FT's, then resume the drills. This was a better way to mimic game situations.

My basketball coaching ended with middle school, so I'm wondering what others who have more experience or have thought about it more (SFCity? HD?) think of this.
Thanks but I may not be the right person to ask about how to teach players to improve their free throw shooting. No one ever taught me how to shoot free throws and I never taught anyone else to shoot them. I would defer to Beached Bear and Hoop Dreams, and listen to what they have to say. I think you have hit upon something, and that free throws are more mental than physical, and to improve free throw shooting, the mental side should get the lion's share of attention, IMO.

As to shooting, I was almost entirely self-taught. I shot free throws at well over 90% in competition over a brief 10+ year career. But even at that percentage, I still wanted to improve. I wanted to shoot 100%. No one ever has. You can do it for a game or a few games. I was 24-24 during my senior year in high school. I was primarily a perimeter shooter, so I didn't have too many free throw attempts. I never thought that was a big deal, until a couple of years ago, a friend told me that 24-24 was pretty cool. I guess it was, but I never thought about it.

I taught myself to shoot. I did not understand what I was doing then, but over 60 years later, I can finally begin to understand how I did it. My dad tried to teach me to shoot at first, when I was a little tyke. A two-handed set shot, and an underhanded free throw style. I had already played a lot of tennis, so my right arm was much more developed than my left, and all two-handed shots went way off line. He took me to some Cal games and I watched some players shooting one-handed push shots from the ear, a la Hank Luisetti, I guess. I watched players like Dick Tamberg. Bob Matheny was my idol. But I developed my own style, shooting from the hip, with a high arc, almost straight up, to avoid getting the shot blocked. I shot all my free throws one handed. I aimed for perfection, to drop the ball through the center of the hoop and touch as little net as possible. That way, if I was a little bit off and grazed the rim, I'd still make the shot. I tried different spins, different amounts of spin. Backspin was the most natural, but I tried no spin and a combo of backspin and horizontal circular spin for longer shots I loved to shoot the latter one, but I was afraid to try it in games and risk getting benched.

In about the 6th grade, the best player in our neighborhood, who captained our team, and went on to play a CB in the NFL for 5 years, showed up at the playground sporting a two-handed jump shot, where he shot the ball from way behind his head. We all tried to copy it. There was not one TV set in the neighborhood, so we had little chance to see games. I went to a Saturday matinee at the Haight Theatre for a dime, and the newsreel showed a game clip of Robin Freeman, the nation's leading scorer from Ohio State. I tried to copy his jump shot. So I now had two shots, a one hand push and a jumper. I always liked traditional hook shots, with hand, arm, and both shoulders all lined up with the hoop, probably because Bob Mckeen of Cal was another idol of mine. To avoid ever getting it blocked, I used to shoot it up in the air and falling away, my own invention. Then I invented a drive parallel to the baseline across the paint, and as I passed the basket I'd rise and fall away from the hoop. The shot was unblockable. The only player I ever saw use a similar shot was Jerry Lucas. He used to play near the basket to one side. He catch a pass, and then instead os shooting, he used to quickly dribble out to the opposite elbow, and shoot a fade away hook from there. Deadly.

We had an older player in the neighborhood, who was an All-City guard from Poly High, For some reason, he did not show up all summer in the schoolyard to shoot hoops. Right before Fall practice, he showed up. He was shooting every single shot, set shots, jumpers, hooks off the backboard. Bank shots. I asked him why. He said he had gotten into an awful slump when he couldn't buy a basket, so he decided to try something different. He was just as deadly with the new method. He made the All-City team again. I decided to try it, and got pretty good at it, so now I had another new shot I could use, throwing my hooks and mid-range jumpers off the glass.

As to practicing free throws, I never did it like has been described in this thread, except maybe a little like the OP. If any coach brought in recorded sounds from a basketball game to get us to focus better, all of us kids would have thought him off his rocker. If any coach told me to shoot 60 or 100 free throws in a row, I would have tried some way to avoid such drudgery. You have to simulate game conditions in your mind when practicing, and you never shoot many in a row in a game. Not only that, it would be boring to shoot a bunch of free throws. I know there are these guys who can make 2000 in a row in exhibitions, but how many can they make in a game, where you shoot one and many not get another until 20 minutes later? Rick Barry made 60 consecutive one season. I shot alone, by myself, for hours, and I shot all my shots, layups, mid range jumpers, hook shots with either hand, and perimeter shots. When I missed a shot, I'd run and rebound the ball and shoot from that point, or I would dribble to another spot and shoot from there. If the rebound was short, I'd shoot a mid range jumper or a hook, if it was long, I'd shoot a perimeter shot. If I made the basket, I might say, "Good. Let's try that one again, and make it nothing but net." Every so often I'd sprinkle in a trip to the free throw line and try one or two. If I missed, sometimes I'd stay there until I made two. If the first ones were way off, I might shoot ten of them. I hardly ever shot more than ten in a row, and that was usually just to challenge myself before I went home to dinner. Also, I always practiced a lot of shots from 30-45 feet. I seldom shot from there in a game, but I felt that if I became a good shot from far way, then the shorter shots would be a piece of cake.

One thing about copying other players, I think a player should pick out some star who is around the same height to copy. Most taller players have so much trouble shooting them, then it might be worth looking for a good tall player to copy, say Kevin Durant or Larry Bird, but not Calvin Murphy, Mark Price or Steph Curry.

Shooting free throws is perhaps 90% mental, or it was for me. The whole idea in training the mental side is developing confidence, that's obvious. Fear of failure is a big motivator. When I was a gangly uncoordinated kid of 10 years, we had games every day at lunchtime in the schoolyard. The way we picked who got to play was we all lined up to shoot one free throw. The first 10 players to make their free throw got to play in the game. The ones who did not make their free throws could go play volleyball or dodgeball with the girls. And get teased unmercifully. There was no way I was going to miss that one free throw and go play with the girls. Nowadays, the girls would also be playing basketball at lunchtime, maybe even better than the boys. When I played on teams, the only way I would get to play is if I could score, otherwise I rode the pine, because I was maybe the least athletic kid on any team I played for. Everyone in my family was an athlete, father, uncles, and older cousins. I simply had to be one too, just to hold my head up high at family dinners, and the only way I could make a basketball team was to shoot better than anyone else. If I made the team, then the coaches might teach me all the other stuff like teamwork, passing, rebounding and defense. I never thought about missing a free throw. I used to look at it as a free chance to make a shot and impress the coach, so I could stay in the game.






I think it's mostly mental AFTER a player has a solid repeatable shooting form
different unorthodox shooting forms can work, but I think the majority of good shooters have at least a few things in common ...

their shooting arm is vertical (the ball would not fall off their hand if they dropped their other hand)
they shoot with a relatively high arc
they have done enough repetitions that their shooting form is fundamentally the same every time

my guess, is all three is true for SF
roqmoq
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Back in the day, the FT shooter did not move from the line after taking the first of two FTs. Nor did the player slap hands with teammates.

Now, it's common practice to move either forward or backward to slap hands with teammates.

Does this make a difference? I think it's best to stand still and not move about.

Of course, there are today's players who do the hand slaps and shoot a high FT percentage. So, this practice has not affected everyone, but could some players do better by not moving around?
MSaviolives
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Don't forget the importance of foot-on-nail

Quote:

At a lot of basketball courts, you will see a nail right there in the middle, which should be dead center to the basket. I always put my right foot right in the middle of that.
http://ninertimes.com/2016/06/free-throws-with-mark-price/
SFCityBear
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roqmoq said:

Back in the day, the FT shooter did not move from the line after taking the first of two FTs. Nor did the player slap hands with teammates.

Now, it's common practice to move either forward or backward to slap hands with teammates.

Does this make a difference? I think it's best to stand still and not move about.

Of course, there are today's players who do the hand slaps and shoot a high FT percentage. So, this practice has not affected everyone, but could some players do better by not moving around?
That is an interesting thought.

What I don't understand is that they slap hands even after a missed free throw. So the purpose is not always to celebrate. I think they slap hands after a make or a miss. Maybe they do it for bonding.
SFCityBear
UrsaMajor
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It's like celebrating a sack or a first down--even if you're down 35-7.
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