I've got a kid who's bright and hard working. >4.0 GPA with IB courses, etc. Which in modern times guarantees nothing. She wants sun (ie leaving the PNW) and probably something in the sciences / pre-med.

How do I get from point A to point B for her? What resources do people use? Furd, Cal and UCLA are the obvious ones in CA but with things as competitive as they are I'm basically counting on them not happening. What's a solid next tier?

Out of state UC tuition is $50k next academic year, unreal! The private colleges are now actually cheaper because they have more financial support.

Cal88 said:

---

Out of state UC tuition is $50k next academic year, unreal! The private colleges are now actually cheaper because they have more financial support.

---

Thank you for that piece of info. And Holy F!

tequila4kapp said:

---

Cal88 said:

---

Out of state UC tuition is $50k next academic year, unreal! The private colleges are now actually cheaper because they have more financial support.

---

Thank you for that piece of info. And Holy F!

---

Yes indeed. That might put decent local schools like USF or SCU in play for miss Tequila, good luck to her!

Cal88 said:

---

tequila4kapp said:

---

Cal88 said:

---

Out of state UC tuition is $50k next academic year, unreal! The private colleges are now actually cheaper because they have more financial support.

---

Thank you for that piece of info. And Holy F!

---

Yes indeed. That might put decent local schools like USF or SCU in play for miss Tequila, good luck to her!

---

After X number of years, the student qualifies as a CA resident, right? (What's "X"? 1? 2?)

UC Davis, Cal Poly, any other UC not yet mentioned...

tequila4kapp said:

---

I've got a kid who's bright and hard working. >4.0 GPA with IB courses, etc. Which in modern times guarantees nothing. She wants sun (ie leaving the PNW) and probably something in the sciences / pre-med.

How do I get from point A to point B for her? What resources do people use? Furd, Cal and UCLA are the obvious ones in CA but with things as competitive as they are I'm basically counting on them not happening. What's a solid next tier?

---

What about University of Texas?

Also, Colorado is a good school and surprisingly a lot of sunny days.

We recruit heavily from both schools and while the average student is not on par with Cal, Stanford, UCLA, MIT, the top students hold their ground with anyone and most importantly they really enjoyed their experience. Many can't wait to move back to Colorado in particular despite not being from there originally.

If she's a sun goddess type then Arizona has a good medical program as well.

If she can stomach being in the South then Vandy, Duke, and Georgia Tech would all be worth looking at but Georgia Tech isn't a school a lot of people enjoy. It's like Cal in terms of tough grading.

Those are the best sunshine schools. Maybe also Florida and UNC.

dimitrig said:

---

If she can stomach being in the South then Vandy, Duke, and Georgia Tech would all be worth looking at but Georgia Tech isn't a school a lot of people enjoy. It's like Cal in terms of tough grading.

Those are the best sunshine schools. Maybe also Florida and UNC.

---

UCSD and Cal are both a bit cutthroat for premed, due to tougher grading and a more competitive student body mindset, large number of very studious students competing for a relatively limited number of spots.

https://www.medschoolcoach.com/best-non-ivy-league-schools-pre-med/

Rice is a good place, nice campus and the only walkable neighborhood in Houston, great weather (during the academic year that is) but also a huge medical center with lots of access to internships, and the small student body means that those are readily available. My nephew was premed there and got accepted to Baylor (top med school in the SW) on a full ride. I would guess their med school acceptance rates are higher than Cals.

Georgetown is a really nice place, a lot of fun to attend, The campus itself is not that remarkable but the area is very nice and lively, urban but not overwhelming. I did a Summer session there in the 1980s and had an incredible time. Like Rice, GU also is well connected to top-notch local hospitals. 4 season weather a bit milder than NYC or Boston.

Cal88 said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

If she can stomach being in the South then Vandy, Duke, and Georgia Tech would all be worth looking at but Georgia Tech isn't a school a lot of people enjoy. It's like Cal in terms of tough grading.

Those are the best sunshine schools. Maybe also Florida and UNC.

---

UCSD and Cal are both a bit cutthroat for premed, due to tougher grading and a more competitive student body mindset, large number of very studious students competing for a relatively limited number of spots.

https://www.medschoolcoach.com/best-non-ivy-league-schools-pre-med/

Rice is a good place, nice campus and the only walkable neighborhood in Houston, great weather (during the academic year that is) but also a huge medical center with lots of access to internships, and the small student body means that those are readily available. My nephew was premed there and got accepted to Baylor (top med school in the SW) on a full ride. I would guess their med school acceptance rates are higher than Cals.

Georgetown is a really nice place, a lot of fun to attend, The campus itself is not that remarkable but the area is very nice and lively, urban but not overwhelming. I did a Summer session there in the 1980s and had an incredible time. Like Rice, GU also is well connected to top-notch local hospitals. 4 season weather a bit milder than NYC or Boston.

---

Yes, Rice would be a good option as well.

I excluded anything in Virginia (UVA, etc) because I don't consider the weather there to be particularly great for people looking for sunshine. Lots of gloomy gray skies most of the school year.

dimitrig said:

---

Cal88 said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

If she can stomach being in the South then Vandy, Duke, and Georgia Tech would all be worth looking at but Georgia Tech isn't a school a lot of people enjoy. It's like Cal in terms of tough grading.

Those are the best sunshine schools. Maybe also Florida and UNC.

---

UCSD and Cal are both a bit cutthroat for premed, due to tougher grading and a more competitive student body mindset, large number of very studious students competing for a relatively limited number of spots.

https://www.medschoolcoach.com/best-non-ivy-league-schools-pre-med/

Rice is a good place, nice campus and the only walkable neighborhood in Houston, great weather (during the academic year that is) but also a huge medical center with lots of access to internships, and the small student body means that those are readily available. My nephew was premed there and got accepted to Baylor (top med school in the SW) on a full ride. I would guess their med school acceptance rates are higher than Cals.

Georgetown is a really nice place, a lot of fun to attend, The campus itself is not that remarkable but the area is very nice and lively, urban but not overwhelming. I did a Summer session there in the 1980s and had an incredible time. Like Rice, GU also is well connected to top-notch local hospitals. 4 season weather a bit milder than NYC or Boston.

---

Yes, Rice would be a good option as well.

I excluded anything in Virginia (UVA, etc) because I don't consider the weather there to be particularly great for people looking for sunshine. Lots of gloomy gray skies most of the school year.

---

UT (Austin weather is too hot or cold IMO) but a great school, Harvey Mudd given her STEM perceptive, UCSD (but that is a tough admissions school), Carnegie Mellon (great for sciences, but not great on the weather side), North Carolina, Georgia Tech, Rice, Texas A&M, honors college at SDSU, Cal Poly, and even USC (lousy football team, but decent academics these days, and lots of scholarship money to throw around). The sleeper in here is Georgia Tech which surprisingly gets great ratings in sciences, and has 217 sunny days per year on average, assuming your daughter is willing to live in the Deep South.

This is going to piss people off, but down in SoCal, UCI has a bad rep. While known for sciences, it has a lousy rep as a commuter school, high rent costs, and no real school activities. The closest thing to an internet school. Also, limited course offerings in certain majors and departments and limited research opportunities and resources. In other words, top local students don't go there.

^ Agreed on Irvine, worst setting and campus atmosphere for a UC campus.

Cal88 said:

---

^ Agreed on Irvine, worst setting and campus atmosphere for a UC campus.

---

I have friends who went to UCI and I have hired from there. The students seem pretty good and the main activity is the beach as it is just down the road from Corona Del Mar. I am surprised it isn't considered a beach school. I would rather be at UCI than Davis, Riverside, or Merced.

dimitrig said:

---

Cal88 said:

---

^ Agreed on Irvine, worst setting and campus atmosphere for a UC campus.

---

I have friends who went to UCI and I have hired from there. The students seem pretty good and the main activity is the beach as it is just down the road from Corona Del Mar. I am surprised it isn't considered a beach school. I would rather be at UCI than Davis, Riverside, or Merced.

---

How old are your friends?

UCI is not a beach school these days, at the risk of understatement. CDR beach is good for families, but unless you study tidepools....Not a surfing beach because of the jetty blocks the waves (need to go the Wedge). Really dominated by families with young kids, and not a college social scene, For whatever reason, surfers don't got to UCI these days. Also, the $28 per day parking fees may not make it conducive to the college crowd pocket book, though you can try to find a parking space above the cliffs in CDR proper (good luck) and try to carry stuff down. But more simply, the school demographics are not for a beach crowd. The school is completely surrounded by suburban (non-student) housing in one of the costliest areas in the State, and there really is not much available for shopping, social life and other needs a student may have until you get way past the suburban belt (ss the song goes, there are nice bars down Newport way for Harry. Ask your buddies about wifi in the dorms. Biggest other complaint is no school spirit, because there is nothing to do.

I can't speak about Davis, Riverside or Merced, but among the local kids in the OC, no one wants to be stuck at UCI.

Might want to check out Harvey Mudd.

The president there (back in 2006) became a leading advocate for women in STEM.
Tuition and room and board all-in is $82,000. Roughly 70% of freshmen receive financial aid.

Harvey Mudd College - Wikipedia

Best of luck to your daughter Tequila.

Geez good luck with that

DiabloWags said:

---

Might want to check out Harvey Mudd.

The president there (back in 2006) became a leading advocate for women in STEM.
Tuition and room and board all-in is $82,000. Roughly 70% of freshmen receive financial aid.

Harvey Mudd College - Wikipedia

Best of luck to your daughter Tequila.

---

I knew his brother, Harry Mudd.

The college application process has grown more and more competitive with each decade since we all applied to colleges.

First, it is easier to apply to multiple schools thanks to Common App, etc. The result is increased volume of applications to schools. This growth in applications is accelerated with growing population.

Which leads to the second point: the number of freshman spots available. While the volume of applicants at each school has grown, the freshman class sizes have not grown commensurate with applicants.

Privates like Santa Clara and U$C pay substantial merit based scholarship money to buy the best students available.

I cannot tell you all how much I appreciate the input. Thank you. (and keep it coming, if there is more)

An interesting rub for me as a dad (and her coach, I suppose) is that she's an aspiring college athlete. Her profile on that side of the ledger doesn't match her academic profile. I suspect she may have opportunities to keep playing at a substantially different tier of institution than what is listed above. Her life, her choice...but I hope she hangs them up and focuses on school at a legit institution.

tequila4kapp said:

---

I cannot tell you all how much I appreciate the input. Thank you. (and keep it coming, if there is more)

An interesting rub for me as a dad (and her coach, I suppose) is that she's an aspiring college athlete. Her profile on that side of the ledger doesn't match her academic profile. I suspect she may have opportunities to keep playing at a substantially different tier of institution than what is listed above. Her life, her choice...but I hope she hangs them up and focuses on school at a legit institution.

---

I was wait-listed at one of the Claremont schools and a coach called me to see if I wanted to play. I reckon I could have gotten off the wait list if I wanted to play sports there, but I wasn't interested at the time as I wanted to focus on academics and other things.

oski003 said:

---

tequila4kapp said:

---

I cannot tell you all how much I appreciate the input. Thank you. (and keep it coming, if there is more)

An interesting rub for me as a dad (and her coach, I suppose) is that she's an aspiring college athlete. Her profile on that side of the ledger doesn't match her academic profile. I suspect she may have opportunities to keep playing at a substantially different tier of institution than what is listed above. Her life, her choice...but I hope she hangs them up and focuses on school at a legit institution.

---

I was wait-listed at one of the Claremont schools and a coach called me to see if I wanted to play. I reckon I could have gotten off the wait list if I wanted to play sports there, but I wasn't interested at the time as I wanted to focus on academics and other things.

---

This is an excellent point. Every opportunity should be explored. Perhaps sports is a way in at the Claremont school level of academics and sports. Lots of options there.


Leave no stone unturned. As I tell all parents as they start the college application process for the first time. It is a grind. Treat it like a job hunt.

tequila4kapp said:

---

I cannot tell you all how much I appreciate the input. Thank you. (and keep it coming, if there is more)

An interesting rub for me as a dad (and her coach, I suppose) is that she's an aspiring college athlete. Her profile on that side of the ledger doesn't match her academic profile. I suspect she may have opportunities to keep playing at a substantially different tier of institution than what is listed above. Her life, her choice...but I hope she hangs them up and focuses on school at a legit institution.

---

Consider Harvey Mudd which meets the science orientation, and has less competitive athletic teams. Also, it is a short plane ride home to get parents to do her laundry.

AunBear89 said:

---

This is an excellent point. Every opportunity should be explored. Perhaps sports is a way in at the Claremont school level of academics and sports. Lots of options there.


Leave no stone unturned. As I tell all parents as they start the college application process for the first time. It is a grind. Treat it like a job hunt.

---

wifeisafurd said:

---

Consider Harvey Mudd which meets the science orientation, and has less competitive athletic teams. Also, it is a short plane ride home to get parents to do her laundry.

---

This is why I chimed in about Harvey Mudd (the science school) and ignored my self-imposed ban of OT.

Your daughter can still explore her competitive fire and athletic career and it may also help her gain admission.

For the class of 2026, Harvey Mudd had a 13.4% acceptance rate out of 4,440 applicants. Being able to still play will allow her to continue with a structured "routine" that she has grown comfortable with as an athlete and allow her to ease into the uncertainty of college life with a bit of an "identity". She will be able to continue to experience an athletic "family" of sorts. If it doesnt work out, she can always transfer out and use her residency in CA to ease the financial burden at another school . . . IF you've jumped through all of the hoops to show that she's been in CA for 366 days and been financially independent during her residency.

Claremont was voted the best suburb in the West by Sunset Magazine in 2016.
It's sophisticated, yet has that small town appeal. Mediterranean climate and relatively "safe".

Seems like a no-brainer to check out Harvey Mudd.

Best of Luck!

tequila4kapp said:

---

I've got a kid who's bright and hard working. >4.0 GPA with IB courses, etc. Which in modern times guarantees nothing. She wants sun (ie leaving the PNW) and probably something in the sciences / pre-med.

How do I get from point A to point B for her? What resources do people use? Furd, Cal and UCLA are the obvious ones in CA but with things as competitive as they are I'm basically counting on them not happening. What's a solid next tier?

---

Some things not mentioned so far:
1) Does she play a musical instrument? If so, many times you can get into your dream school via the marching band director. My daughter's boyfriend got into UCLA this way.

2) Top colleges put a lot of weight on leadership and community service. Have her join a club that she can lead and make sure she has as many volunteer hours performing community service as possible.

3) Take a peek at collegeconfidential.com for lots of advice from people going through the same process.

4) Is she part Hispanic or other minority? There are myriad special programs and scholarships available if you can check off that box, regardless of your financial position.

5) If money is an issue, many fine schools, especially the Arizona public universities, give generous scholarships to high performing California students. She will get many offers in the mail. Another great route is through the CA community college system which may enable her to get into a UC that she couldn't get into as a freshman.

^ The local CC route might also enable her to gain California residency, and a huge break on UC tuition?

Cal88 said:

---

^ The local CC route might also enable her to gain California residency, and a huge break on UC tuition?

---

It's difficult.
But it can be done.
You have to relinquish all ties to your State.


Here is how to establish intent:

• Remain in California when school is not in session.
• Register to vote and vote in California elections.
• Designate your California address as permanent on all legal matters such as school and employment records, including current military records, taxes, bank statements, etc.
• Obtain a California driver's license within 10 days of settling in California, and no later than the campus deadline. (Nondrivers must obtain a California identification card.)
• If you own a car, obtain a California motor vehicle registration within 20 days of settling in California.
• Work in California and file California resident income tax returns effective from the date of residency in the state. Income earned outside of California after that date must also be declared in California.
• Surrender all out-of-state identification (including driver's license).
• Establish a permanent home in California where your belongings are kept.
• Obtain a license for professional practice in California, if applicable.

You will need to relinquish out-of-state ties and demonstrate intent while simultaneously meeting the physical presence requirement.

Absences from California

In order to demonstrate intent, it is important to stay in California during nonacademic periods. If you're a nonresident student who is in the process of establishing California residency, and you leave California for more than one month during the summer before the term in which you are establishing resident status, your intent will be questioned. Absences exceeding 6 weeks during the one-year qualification period is disqualifying.
Graduate and professional degree students who must leave for nonacademic-related reasons for more than a month during the summer should contact the campus residence deputy to seek advice prior to leaving and filing for classification.

Financial independence

Nonresident undergraduates

This requirement makes it extremely difficult for most undergraduates who are not financially dependent on a California-resident parent to qualify for classification as a California resident.
If you're an unmarried undergraduate under the age of 24 and your parent(s) are not California residents, you must be able to document (for example, using tax returns, W-2 forms, bank statements) that you have been totally self-sufficient starting one full year prior to the residence determination date, supporting yourself, through jobs, financial aid, commercial/institutional loans in your name only, and documentable savings from your earnings. This also means you can't have been claimed as an income tax dependent by any individual or have accepted gifts (cash or other support) that contributed to your subsistence for the tax year immediately preceding the term.


How to establish residency | Understanding residency for purposes of UC tuition (ucop.edu)

AunBear89 said:

---

With her academic resume, good test scores, and strong personal statements, she should be competitive in most application pools.

The real differentiator at competitive school, all other things being equal, will be the personal statement portion of applications.

Fortunately, many schools still have virtual campus tours available ( legacy of COVID) so she can look at lots of schools online before narrowing to a list of in person visits.

A competitive personal statement addresses specific details about the university, its programs, its professors, its institutes - whatever interests the student. So lots of additional research ahead.

It's a competitive environment, but she is well equipped. She didn't get where she is without hard work, and that's what the college selection process takes too. A little due diligence and she will be fine.

---

Here's a question which stumped the Cal undergrad leading the Cal tour for my students a few years back:

How does admissions know that an applicant's parents didn't hire somebody to write the "personal statement", or. at the very least, coach the applicant about what to write? Because offhand, this seems tons easier to cheat on compared to fancy SAT prep courses... or just about anything else.

AunBear89 said:

---

With her academic resume, good test scores, and strong personal statements, she should be competitive in most application pools.

The real differentiator at competitive school, all other things being equal, will be the personal statement portion of applications.

Fortunately, many schools still have virtual campus tours available ( legacy of COVID) so she can look at lots of schools online before narrowing to a list of in person visits.

A competitive personal statement addresses specific details about the university, its programs, its professors, its institutes - whatever interests the student. So lots of additional research ahead.

It's a competitive environment, but she is well equipped. She didn't get where she is without hard work, and that's what the college selection process takes too. A little due diligence and she will be fine.

---

Agree the distinguishing part of the application is likely the personal statement.

Excellent qualifications, meaningful letters of recommendation and a strong, thoughtful personal statement will get her to a school she's looking for.

Just don't make the same mistake I made, and apply to only one school without a back-up plan, which was the only stupid thing I did. (Luckily, I got in on appeal, which -- as my experience shows -- can also be decisive.)

dimitrig said:

---

DiabloWags said:

---

AunBear89 said:

---

If some think Irvine is boring it is like Las Vegas compared to Claremont.

---

---

---

I would suggest that a college athlete has very little time to enjoy the "fruits" of the city their college is in.

Big C said:

---

AunBear89 said:

---

With her academic resume, good test scores, and strong personal statements, she should be competitive in most application pools.

The real differentiator at competitive school, all other things being equal, will be the personal statement portion of applications.

Fortunately, many schools still have virtual campus tours available ( legacy of COVID) so she can look at lots of schools online before narrowing to a list of in person visits.

A competitive personal statement addresses specific details about the university, its programs, its professors, its institutes - whatever interests the student. So lots of additional research ahead.

It's a competitive environment, but she is well equipped. She didn't get where she is without hard work, and that's what the college selection process takes too. A little due diligence and she will be fine.

---

Here's a question which stumped the Cal undergrad leading the Cal tour for my students a few years back:

How does admissions know that an applicant's parents didn't hire somebody to write the "personal statement", or. at the very least, coach the applicant about what to write? Because offhand, this seems tons easier to cheat on compared to fancy SAT prep courses... or just about anything else.

---

From this article:

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2023-11-26/post-affirmative-action-asian-american-students-stress-college-admissions

It's important to note that the above article from the LA Times was one that tried to address how Asian Americans can navigate/avoid anti-Asian discrimination.

In the first college application season since the U.S. Supreme Court struck down affirmative action, Asian American students are more stressed out than ever. Race-conscious admissions were widely seen to have disadvantaged them, as borne out by disparities in the test scores of admitted students but many feel that race will still be a hidden factor and that standards are even more opaque than before.

From @WSJopinion: America faces a formidable range of calamities. Every one of them can be traced wholly or in large part to a single source: the corruption of higher education by radical political activists, writes John Ellis. https://t.co/RsBfi76zWx

— The Wall Street Journal (@WSJ) December 5, 2023

Your kid may learn to hate you while they're gone.