I know Chase is gone and hopefully whoever our new QB is, will quickly gain command of Musgrave's system. I hope this is not another case of the offense having another year of a steep learning curve, which dates back to Baldwin.

But what is acceptable?

A winning conference season? Getting to the conference championship game? Getting to a minor bowl game or a NY6 bowl game?

For me, a winning conference season would be a start -- which ensures at least a minor bowl game, if not a more prestigious bowl game. Then we can build on that. At this point in Wilcox' term (year 6) I think it's reasonable to say that another losing conference record is NOT acceptable any longer. The culture has been upgraded from the last years of JT and then Sonny. But bottom line Wilcox is here to win, not make Cal football a friendly place to play football. He has yet to do that.

Are we arranging deck chairs on the Titanic or are we looking to improve our standing for realignment?

I would love a winning conference schedule and to beat UCLA and USC. But mostly care about whether we will have a real program in a few seasons and I don't known to what extent this season's performance will impact that.

I was thinking 8-4 overall regular season, without any blow-out losses. But yes - in specific - a winning conference record would be great to see.

RJABear said:

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I was thinking 8-4 overall regular season, without any blow-out losses. But yes - in specific - a winning conference record would be great to see.

---

We have to have a winning conference record.

If the defense projects to be the best in the Pac 12 as Yogi Roth and a few others have said, and the offense improves with a more consistent running attack coupled with modest improvement in special teams play (all doable with the existing talent) then we will have a winning record and a bowl game.

But I agree with other posters- a winning conference record, retaining the axe, and winning at least two of the games against ND, USC, UCLA, Oregon, would make me very happy.

Winning conference record, and an eye test that we're competitive even in losses. If we have a bad season, I see a vast talent outflow via the portal due to our record and the uncertainty about the future. 22-23 is basically going to be the last semi-normal football season as we've known it. We have to take advantage.

Beat Davis, Vegas and AZ to start 3-1

Split the next 4

Win the last 3 vs Beavs, furd and the powder blue ***** ass traitors

8-4

Go Bears

The only acceptable outcome now is an unfathomable one - we have to make the rose bowl and look entertaining while doing it ... show some modicum of fan interest on top of that and just maybe squeak into B1G.

Unfortunately, my interest in this season is lost given that we are not going to have a viable program after this year. All our good players will transfer and the coaches will bounce to not have to try and rebuild.

I am more than ever certain that Cal will be relegated to the MWC - I just don't see Carol Christ and Jim K fighting for us and no one outside the program cares about us.

To me this is the last "next season," unless last year was.

Wins over the California schools. I don't care if we go 3-6 and have games cancelled for COVID.

As much as I would love to see a pile of muddy ashes covering the Rose Bowl, I think my fantasies are better targeted at winning a trillion dollar lottery.

fat_slice said:

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The only acceptable outcome now is an unfathomable one - we have to make the rose bowl and look entertaining while doing it ... show some modicum of fan interest on top of that and just maybe squeak into B1G.

Unfortunately, my interest in this season is lost given that we are not going to have a viable program after this year. All our good players will transfer and the coaches will bounce to not have to try and rebuild.

I am more than ever certain that Cal will be relegated to the MWC - I just don't see Carol Christ and Jim K fighting for us and no one outside the program cares about us.

---

Let's gooooooooooo

I also hope we don't pull punches. Idc if we're rolling Davis or Arizona or UNLV by 25 in the 3rd, put the foot on the gas and win by 40

No politeness or sparing their feelings or anything like that

What is 'acceptable'?

SINCE 5-7 is deemed worthy of a raise and extension for the coach, 4-8 is clearly 'acceptable' for Cal football especially if the Bears manage a meaningless upset win over a name program in an off year. Even 3-9 is probably 'acceptable' and excusable if that includes a meaningless W over Oregon or SC or 7-pt loss to ND, OR wins in the 'Big' Game plus Ucla to close out the season.

What you and I find 'acceptable' is drastically different from the view of our decision-makers.

eastcoastcal said:

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I also hope we don't pull punches. Idc if we're rolling Davis or Arizona or UNLV by 25 in the 3rd, put the foot on the gas and win by 40

No politeness or sparing their feelings or anything like that

---

Not sure about the offense but the defense will blitz like hell until the clock is all zeroes.

Absolute minimum: More wins than losses

Expectation and hope: Winning conference record, make a good showing in South Bend, retain the Axe and hand (F)UCLA a massive beatdown in Berkeley on 11/26.

As stated earlier, in the longer term, "acceptable" has a ton to do with where Cal ends up in the CFB rat race.

For this regular season:

"Acceptable" to me would be 8-4 with a Big Game win and no more than 1 embarrassing loss (like our losses last year where we essentially had little hope of winning in the second half against WSU at home and UCLA on the road... I mean Nevada was embarrassing too, and really UW as well, and of course Arizona... but at least those were close.).

My prediction: 6-6 with at least a couple embarrassing losses. I.e. - not acceptable, but so what? Contract extensions all around probably. I can't believe Knowlton has the contract he has.

If this is really going to be the 2nd to the last year of the Pac 12 and being connected to the Rose Bowl then there's only one option for us...WIN. THE WHOLE. F*&^KN. THING!!!

Acceptable, to me, is a Cal offense that ranks in the top 3 in the conference and top 30 nationally. Everything else will take care of itself from there.

My wish list (in order):

beat ND
beat $C
beat fucla
beat furd

After that I really don't care, but if the above comes true the rest of the games should be OK. Starting to lose interest in college football.

So, here's what's just acceptable for me:

• 5-4 in conference, 7-5 overall
• Wins against Stanford and UCLA
• No blow-out losses. A strong defensive team shouldn't get blown out.
• An offensive line that can move defenders when it's 4th and two.
• MOST IMPORTANTLY: When UCLA comes on the field at CMS on 11/26, they are boo'ed more loudly than any visiting team has ever been boo'ed. Louder than the Elway teams, louder than USC teams of John McKay and Pete Carroll, and the boo-ing occurs every time the Bruin offense comes to the line for a critical play.

A reasonable stretch goal: 6-3 and 8-4.

In addition:

• Wilcox stops listening to the ghost of Ray Willsey that sits on his shoulder, meaning he needs to demand that Musgrave be imaginative and aggressive on offense. And I want to see Sirmon blitz more often - the defense needs to set up the offense (with a turnover or great field position) once or twice per game.
• The backup QB, whether Plummer or Millner, needs to play at least a quarter in the first two games and I'd be happy if he played more. If the passing game has been just so-so after the the first 3-4 games, I want to see changes at QB and/or WR.
• I'd like to see a consistent power running game the way it worked against Stanford last year and I want to see Ott get the ball 5-6 times in each of the non-conference games to see what he can do.

OneKeg said:

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As stated earlier, in the longer term, "acceptable" has a ton to do with where Cal ends up in the CFB rat race.

For this regular season:

"Acceptable" to me would be 8-4 with a Big Game win and no more than 1 embarrassing loss (like our losses last year where we essentially had little hope of winning in the second half against WSU at home and UCLA on the road... I mean Nevada was embarrassing too, and really UW as well, and of course Arizona... but at least those were close.).

My prediction: 6-6 with at least a couple embarrassing losses. I.e. - not acceptable, but so what? Contract extensions all around probably. I can't believe Knowlton has the contract he has.

---

I would say "6-6? You nega-bear! No way this team doesn't end up at least 7-5!"

Problem is, I said that to people a year ago... and look what happened. Hell, I almost bet lots of my own $$$ on the "over". So instead, I will just say that this really looks like a team that can go 7-5 or better. Fingers crossed.


Maybe most important season ever. And (F)UCLA comes to Berkeley on Nov. 26th.

Big C said:

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OneKeg said:

---

As stated earlier, in the longer term, "acceptable" has a ton to do with where Cal ends up in the CFB rat race.

For this regular season:

"Acceptable" to me would be 8-4 with a Big Game win and no more than 1 embarrassing loss (like our losses last year where we essentially had little hope of winning in the second half against WSU at home and UCLA on the road... I mean Nevada was embarrassing too, and really UW as well, and of course Arizona... but at least those were close.).

My prediction: 6-6 with at least a couple embarrassing losses. I.e. - not acceptable, but so what? Contract extensions all around probably. I can't believe Knowlton has the contract he has.

---

I would say "6-6? You nega-bear! No way this team doesn't end up at least 7-5!"

Problem is, I said that to people a year ago... and look what happened. Hell, I almost bet lots of my own $$$ on the "over". So instead, I will just say that this really looks like a team that can go 7-5 or better. Fingers crossed.


Maybe most important season ever. And (F)UCLA comes to Berkeley on Nov. 26th.

---

You mean the last season (for cal) ever.

Same ole. Barely beat the non conference teams, suffer injuries, no depth then get crushed by good teams

oskidunker said:

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Same ole. Barely beat the non conference teams, suffer injuries, no depth then get crushed by good teams

---

The one distinction this team has no excuses on, except maybe on the oline, is lack of depth. It is a relatively young team. I'm thinking 7 to 8 wins. Oh, and keep the Axe.

15-0, and an invite to the NFL.

Let's hope we have prepared for Covid contingencies…

fat_slice said:

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Big C said:

---

OneKeg said:

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As stated earlier, in the longer term, "acceptable" has a ton to do with where Cal ends up in the CFB rat race.

For this regular season:

"Acceptable" to me would be 8-4 with a Big Game win and no more than 1 embarrassing loss (like our losses last year where we essentially had little hope of winning in the second half against WSU at home and UCLA on the road... I mean Nevada was embarrassing too, and really UW as well, and of course Arizona... but at least those were close.).

My prediction: 6-6 with at least a couple embarrassing losses. I.e. - not acceptable, but so what? Contract extensions all around probably. I can't believe Knowlton has the contract he has.

---

I would say "6-6? You nega-bear! No way this team doesn't end up at least 7-5!"

Problem is, I said that to people a year ago... and look what happened. Hell, I almost bet lots of my own $$$ on the "over". So instead, I will just say that this really looks like a team that can go 7-5 or better. Fingers crossed.


Maybe most important season ever. And (F)UCLA comes to Berkeley on Nov. 26th.

---

You mean the last season (for cal) ever.

---

fat_slice, you bring the passion and I love that, but man, you have the most negative outlook ever. Maybe it helps you get yourself prepared to deal with the worst outcomes and, goodness knows there have been those...

But we don't know how this is gonna end, You could be right, but other possibilities are also reasonable.

Go Bears, my brother, and (F)UCLA.

We need to have a record good enough to keep Knowlton from having to fire Wilcox and hire a new coach. To steal and paraphrase a line from Family Vacation, "You think you hate it now, wait 'till you see the new coach".

[Off topic cal football, sorrry.]
thanks bb. reminds of the guy inside data's skin, who released his first novel (not half bad) about threats to spiner's life. available at better public libraries everwhere..

> "Brent Spiner's explosive and hilarious novel is a personal look at the slightly askew relationship between a celebrity and his fans. If the Coen Brothers were to make a Star Trek movie, involving the complexity of fan obsession and sci-fi, this noir comedy might just be the one. Set in 1991, just as Star Trek: The Next Generation has rocketed the cast to global fame, the young and impressionable actor Brent Spiner receives a mysterious package and a series of disturbing letters, that take him on a terrifying and bizarre journey that enlists Paramount Security, the LAPD, and even the FBI in putting a stop to the danger that has his life and career hanging in the balance. Featuring a cast of characters from Patrick Stewart to Levar Burton to Trek creator Gene Roddenberry, to some completely imagined, this is the fictional autobiography that takes readers into the life of Brent Spiner, and tells an amazing tale about the trappings of celebrity and the fear he has carried with him his entire life.
https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000653

Wow, lots of GOOD stuff being smoked here! Blind optimism continues...

You really think we're gonna beat $C and fUCLA this year? They're on a MAJOR upward trajectory with very bright futures. Their players have been told, "We're entering the big leagues, boys! Time to step up and act like you belong!" Promises of hundreds of millions of dollars coming into their programs. Recruits will be falling at their doorsteps for a chance to join them.

The other side? Cal athletics: "Oh well, here we are. Let's make the best of it." Coaches have NOTHING to sell their players. "Chin up, kid! We might be playing in the MWC!" Future looks seriously dim. Revenues looking shaky at best. Major debt. Recruiting will be a NIGHTMARE! If you're a potential star on Cal's roster, why the hell are you sticking around?

We're gonna get stomped by $C and fUCLA this year.

The BEST thing we should do?

As brilliantly suggested by a family member, the P12 should cancel $C and fUCLA's P12 schedules ACROSS THE BOARD. All sports. No more games for you! This is the ONLY way we can shove it in their faces. Let's not give them a national stage to prove to the Big10 that they deserve to be there. Let 'em scramble last minute to fill their schedules. P12 teams only lose two opponents, they lose all but three (their OOC games)! And I'd suggest the P12 pay their opponents to NOT show up to really put it to them. They'd be screwed. If the P12 REALLY cared about preserving a P5 west coast athletic conference, and our traditions, they'd do this.

Why doesn't the P12 have any balls? Or the Regents?

And if this strategy blows up in their faces, who cares? We're doomed either way it seems.

TandemBear said:

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Wow, lots of GOOD stuff being smoked here! Blind optimism continues...

You really think we're gonna beat $C and fUCLA this year? They're on a MAJOR upward trajectory with very bright futures. Their players have been told, "We're entering the big leagues, boys! Time to step up and act like you belong!" Promises of hundreds of millions of dollars coming into their programs. Recruits will be falling at their doorsteps for a chance to join them.

The other side? Cal athletics: "Oh well, here we are. Let's make the best of it." Coaches have NOTHING to sell their players. "Chin up, kid! We might be playing in the MWC!" Future looks seriously dim. Revenues looking shaky at best. Major debt. Recruiting will be a NIGHTMARE! If you're a potential star on Cal's roster, why the hell are you sticking around?

We're gonna get stomped by $C and fUCLA this year.

The BEST thing we should do?

As brilliantly suggested by a family member, the P12 should cancel $C and fUCLA's P12 schedules ACROSS THE BOARD. All sports. No more games for you! This is the ONLY way we can shove it in their faces. Let's not give them a national stage to prove to the Big10 that they deserve to be there. Let 'em scramble last minute to fill their schedules. P12 teams only lose two opponents, they lose all but three (their OOC games)! And I'd suggest the P12 pay their opponents to NOT show up to really put it to them. They'd be screwed. If the P12 REALLY cared about preserving a P5 west coast athletic conference, and our traditions, they'd do this.

Why doesn't the P12 have any balls? Or the Regents?

And if this strategy blows up in their faces, who cares? We're doomed either way it seems.

---

Exactly right - this season is meaningless. There will be no pride for being the pac-12 champs this year because pac-12 is no longer a going concern. It would just be salt on a gaping wound if either USC or fUCLA wins. My gosh.

I'm even surprised people are still talking about this year. I am too angry and butt hurt about this whole thing lol.

TandemBear said:

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Wow, lots of GOOD stuff being smoked here! Blind optimism continues...

You really think we're gonna beat $C and fUCLA this year? They're on a MAJOR upward trajectory with very bright futures. Their players have been told, "We're entering the big leagues, boys! Time to step up and act like you belong!" Promises of hundreds of millions of dollars coming into their programs. Recruits will be falling at their doorsteps for a chance to join them.

The other side? Cal athletics: "Oh well, here we are. Let's make the best of it." Coaches have NOTHING to sell their players. "Chin up, kid! We might be playing in the MWC!" Future looks seriously dim. Revenues looking shaky at best. Major debt. Recruiting will be a NIGHTMARE! If you're a potential star on Cal's roster, why the hell are you sticking around?

We're gonna get stomped by $C and fUCLA this year.

The BEST thing we should do?

As brilliantly suggested by a family member, the P12 should cancel $C and fUCLA's P12 schedules ACROSS THE BOARD. All sports. No more games for you! This is the ONLY way we can shove it in their faces. Let's not give them a national stage to prove to the Big10 that they deserve to be there. Let 'em scramble last minute to fill their schedules. P12 teams only lose two opponents, they lose all but three (their OOC games)! And I'd suggest the P12 pay their opponents to NOT show up to really put it to them. They'd be screwed. If the P12 REALLY cared about preserving a P5 west coast athletic conference, and our traditions, they'd do this.

Why doesn't the P12 have any balls? Or the Regents?

And if this strategy blows up in their faces, who cares? We're doomed either way it seems.

---

The best reason we might get stomped by (F)UCLA this season is that they stomped us last season (better team?).

The worst reason is that their players have something to play for and ours don't (paraphrase.) If anything, they're going to be fat and sassy and we're going to be looking to kick their Bruin asses. "We don't get no respect" has always been a powerful motivator.

Now, after this season, if all this continues as it has been and is starting to be reflected in recruiting, all bets are off. In the meantime, let's go to the game this Nov. 26th and see the Golden Bears whup the Bruins!

First off, I don't want to think in terms of what's "acceptable". That kind of thinking is losing right off the bat.

I haven't really thought about this, so this post will be mostly emotional, not well thought out, and may (as time evolves) look really stupid later as I look back on it.

But here's my bottom line: Cal MUST win 9 games. Don't tell me it can't be done because blah blah blah. They simply must do it.

In the three losses, (and I'm assuming the most likely losses will be ND, $C, and either Oregon or Washington), they must be super competitive (ESPECIALLY against ND) and not lose any one of those games by more than 5 points.

I know it's a tall order for a short guy. But given the situation that's been handed to us, and our hopes to keep Cal associated with a top conference, anything short of this will be unacceptable to me.

You don't become great by being "acceptable". You become great by exceeding expectations. When you do that, you get noticed. And right now, we all know we need eyes on this team, both in house and across the nation (especially in the midwest).

TomBear said:

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First off, I don't want to think in terms of what's "acceptable". That kind of thinking is losing right off the bat.

I haven't really thought about this, so this post will be mostly emotional, not well thought out, and may (as time evolves) look really stupid later as I look back on it.

But here's my bottom line: Cal MUST win 9 games. Don't tell me it can't be done because blah blah blah. They simply must do it.

In the three losses, (and I'm assuming the most likely losses will be ND, $C, and either Oregon or Washington), they must be super competitive (ESPECIALLY against ND) and not lose any one of those games by more than 5 points.

I know it's a tall order for a short guy. But given the situation that's been handed to us, and our hopes to keep Cal associated with a top conference, anything short of this will be unacceptable to me.

You don't become great by being "acceptable". You become great by exceeding expectations. When you do that, you get noticed. And right now, we all know we need eyes on this team, both in house and across the nation (especially in the midwest).

---

I don't think we differ too much in our thoughts, but I do want to establish a baseline. And that baseline is at least a winning conference record, because we have never done it under Wilcox which is annoying af. Acceptable just means minimum really at this point. I say this because seems like every year under Wilcox we have a few stages: a promising early stage (non-conference), a w t f stage (our offense looking like crap), and a pull together enough to have a respectable finish stage (in discussions for a minor bowl game, defense gels and steps up). Then we forget that we had an entirely mediocre season and start talking up what a good guy Wilcox is, culture and recruiting again (after losing some of our best recruits). Rinse and repeat. Nah, let's establish a baseline -- winning conference record. Then go from there, even within the season.

[sorry for the edits -- too many asterisks to clear lol]

Can we get real for a second:

UC Davis - not much to say here.
UNLV - horrid.
Arizona - just as bad.
Colorado - going nowhere under Karl Dorrell.
Washington - actually finished worse than us last year (4-8).
Stanford - sucks.

That right there is bowl eligibility.

Washington State
Oregon State

These two both went 7-6 last year, lost their bowl games, and we went 1-1 them against last year. We can win both.

Notre Dame
Oregon
USC
UCLA

Domers aside, who here might be special? We almost pulled it out last year in Eugene, SC had a ton of turnover and will improve but who knows by how much, UCLA is a question mark but they have won only twice in Berkeley since 2000.

Winning record may ass, win the North with this schedule.