I hate to say it, but if we don't want to become and obscured conference (might be too late) we should poach the MWC of San Diego St., San Jose St., Boise State, and Nevada. Regionally it makes sense and travel cost doesn't really change much. Conference is definitely weaker, but it became weaker when USC and UCLA bolted......Oregon and Washington may have put the nail in the coffin

Trumpanzee said:

---

I hate to say it, but if we don't want to become and obscured conference (might be too late) we should poach the MWC of San Diego St., San Jose St., Boise State, and Nevada. Regionally it makes sense and travel cost doesn't really change much. Conference is definitely weaker, but it became weaker when USC and UCLA bolted......Oregon and Washington may have put the nail in the coffin

---

That may be the best option at this point.

You can hang on to that option. Many of us want nothing to do with garbage like that.

Trumpanzee said:

---

I hate to say it, but if we don't want to become and obscured conference (might be too late) we should poach the MWC of San Diego St., San Jose St., Boise State, and Nevada. Regionally it makes sense and travel cost doesn't really change much. Conference is definitely weaker, but it became weaker when USC and UCLA bolted......Oregon and Washington may have put the nail in the coffin

---

what happened to FSU, LV, Davis, even, over SJS?

Trumpanzee said:

---

I hate to say it, but if we don't want to become and obscured conference (might be too late) we should poach the MWC of San Diego St., San Jose St., Boise State, and Nevada. Regionally it makes sense and travel cost doesn't really change much. Conference is definitely weaker, but it became weaker when USC and UCLA bolted......Oregon and Washington may have put the nail in the coffin

---

The above is a moot point, because the buyout math is too high.

And even if the above math worked, I'd rather fold football than team with the MWC. We need to exhaust all avenues and think outside and inside every box to find our way into one of the four Power conferences left.

75bear said:

---

Trumpanzee said:

---

I hate to say it, but if we don't want to become and obscured conference (might be too late) we should poach the MWC of San Diego St., San Jose St., Boise State, and Nevada. Regionally it makes sense and travel cost doesn't really change much. Conference is definitely weaker, but it became weaker when USC and UCLA bolted......Oregon and Washington may have put the nail in the coffin

---

The above is a moot point, because the buyout math is too high.

And even if the above math worked, I'd rather fold football than team with the MWC. We need to exhaust all avenues and think outside and inside every box to find our way into one of the four Power conferences left.

---

A part of thinks that if the Pac-4 does grab some Mountain West schools, it won't be until after their contract runs its course. The Pac-4 has no money for buy-outs. Also, I don't want the Mountain West schools (though I'm cool with joining up with SDSU), but if it comes to that, I think we wait.

MWC exit fee not tied to an active contract (can't just wait out the contract):

"The conference bylaws state that schools leaving the Mountain West must pay three times the average yearly conference distribution if they give timely notice by June 30 of the prior year, roughly $17 million.

However, for a team to withdraw from the Mountain West in time for the 2024-25 season, when the Pac-12 loses eight members to the Big Ten and Big 12, the school will have to pay an exit fee double the timely notice fee, around $34 million."

https://www.reviewjournal.com/sports/unlv/unlv-football/crippling-exit-fee-could-keep-unlv-from-joining-pac-12-ad-says-2883990/amp/

Trumpanzee said:

---

I hate to say it, but if we don't want to become and obscured conference (might be too late) we should poach the MWC of San Diego St., San Jose St., Boise State, and Nevada. Regionally it makes sense and travel cost doesn't really change much. Conference is definitely weaker, but it became weaker when USC and UCLA bolted......Oregon and Washington may have put the nail in the coffin

---

Pac 4 should merge with the entire MWC and by doing so avoid the MWC's high exit fees. That would create a 16-team conference in football. It's not an ideal situation for Cal financially, but if we want to continue playing football, I think it's about the only option we have at this point.

PaulCali said:

---

Trumpanzee said:

---

I hate to say it, but if we don't want to become and obscured conference (might be too late) we should poach the MWC of San Diego St., San Jose St., Boise State, and Nevada. Regionally it makes sense and travel cost doesn't really change much. Conference is definitely weaker, but it became weaker when USC and UCLA bolted......Oregon and Washington may have put the nail in the coffin

---

Pac 4 should merge with the entire MWC and by doing so avoid the MWC's high exit fees. That would create a 16-team conference in football. It's not an ideal situation for Cal financially, but if we want to continue playing football, I think it's about the only option we have at this point.

---

Why not just get the 4 schools needed to keep the cfp benefit? Some of the 420 windfall could go to pay off SDSU, SMU probably is willing to join for peanuts so we just need two more schools. Would Rice, and Tulane cost too much to add?

Econ141 said:

---

PaulCali said:

---

Trumpanzee said:

---

I hate to say it, but if we don't want to become and obscured conference (might be too late) we should poach the MWC of San Diego St., San Jose St., Boise State, and Nevada. Regionally it makes sense and travel cost doesn't really change much. Conference is definitely weaker, but it became weaker when USC and UCLA bolted......Oregon and Washington may have put the nail in the coffin

---

Pac 4 should merge with the entire MWC and by doing so avoid the MWC's high exit fees. That would create a 16-team conference in football. It's not an ideal situation for Cal financially, but if we want to continue playing football, I think it's about the only option we have at this point.

---

Why not just get the 4 schools needed to keep the cfp benefit? Some of the 420 windfall could go to pay off SDSU, SMU probably is willing to join for peanuts so we just need two more schools. Would Rice, and Tulane cost too much to add?

---

Of the sad alternatives mentioned in this thread I prefer this one. Just no Fresno State please! Also, I am sorry, but any team with an unnaturally colored home field should be off the table.

I feel fairly confident that, at some point, we will be in one "power conference" or another, hopefully one of the best, like the B1G. That is what we should be shooting for.

That said, as long as we are playing football and basketball at any level, I will continue to be a Cal fan, to follow the Bears and go to a lot of the games. To those who would cease being fans if we end up playing at a lower level, hey, that is certainly your prerogative, but I don't get it. Still, we need to do everything we can do to be competing and hopefully winning at the highest level.

Econ141 said:

---

PaulCali said:

---

Trumpanzee said:

---

I hate to say it, but if we don't want to become and obscured conference (might be too late) we should poach the MWC of San Diego St., San Jose St., Boise State, and Nevada. Regionally it makes sense and travel cost doesn't really change much. Conference is definitely weaker, but it became weaker when USC and UCLA bolted......Oregon and Washington may have put the nail in the coffin

---

Pac 4 should merge with the entire MWC and by doing so avoid the MWC's high exit fees. That would create a 16-team conference in football. It's not an ideal situation for Cal financially, but if we want to continue playing football, I think it's about the only option we have at this point.

---

Why not just get the 4 schools needed to keep the cfp benefit? Some of the 420 windfall could go to pay off SDSU, SMU probably is willing to join for peanuts so we just need two more schools. Would Rice, and Tulane cost too much to add?

---

If that is our strategy, then SDSU, SMU (at a discount), UCONN and UMASS may make the most sense since the east cost schools are both independents, and would not require a buyout.

I just dont see the TV contract being any good.

I'm also curious to know how ownership of the P12 network works with everyone leaving. Do they still get a share? Can we sell it for parts and distribute the money to the remaining Pac 4 schools?

golden sloth said:

---

Econ141 said:

---

PaulCali said:

---

Trumpanzee said:

---

I hate to say it, but if we don't want to become and obscured conference (might be too late) we should poach the MWC of San Diego St., San Jose St., Boise State, and Nevada. Regionally it makes sense and travel cost doesn't really change much. Conference is definitely weaker, but it became weaker when USC and UCLA bolted......Oregon and Washington may have put the nail in the coffin

---

Pac 4 should merge with the entire MWC and by doing so avoid the MWC's high exit fees. That would create a 16-team conference in football. It's not an ideal situation for Cal financially, but if we want to continue playing football, I think it's about the only option we have at this point.

---

Why not just get the 4 schools needed to keep the cfp benefit? Some of the 420 windfall could go to pay off SDSU, SMU probably is willing to join for peanuts so we just need two more schools. Would Rice, and Tulane cost too much to add?

---

If that is our strategy, then SDSU, SMU (at a discount), UCONN and UMASS may make the most sense since the east cost schools are both independents, and would not require a buyout.

I just dont see the TV contract being any good.

I'm also curious to know how ownership of the P12 network works with everyone leaving. Do they still get a share? Can we sell it for parts and distribute the money to the remaining Pac 4 schools?

---

I am reading in several,places that if we are still in the pac4 by next August, the money is split 4 ways. Not sure if true.

oskidunker said:

---

golden sloth said:

---

Econ141 said:

---

PaulCali said:

---

Trumpanzee said:

---

I hate to say it, but if we don't want to become and obscured conference (might be too late) we should poach the MWC of San Diego St., San Jose St., Boise State, and Nevada. Regionally it makes sense and travel cost doesn't really change much. Conference is definitely weaker, but it became weaker when USC and UCLA bolted......Oregon and Washington may have put the nail in the coffin

---

Pac 4 should merge with the entire MWC and by doing so avoid the MWC's high exit fees. That would create a 16-team conference in football. It's not an ideal situation for Cal financially, but if we want to continue playing football, I think it's about the only option we have at this point.

---

Why not just get the 4 schools needed to keep the cfp benefit? Some of the 420 windfall could go to pay off SDSU, SMU probably is willing to join for peanuts so we just need two more schools. Would Rice, and Tulane cost too much to add?

---

If that is our strategy, then SDSU, SMU (at a discount), UCONN and UMASS may make the most sense since the east cost schools are both independents, and would not require a buyout.

I just dont see the TV contract being any good.

I'm also curious to know how ownership of the P12 network works with everyone leaving. Do they still get a share? Can we sell it for parts and distribute the money to the remaining Pac 4 schools?

---

I am reading in several,places that if we are still in the pac4 by next August, the money is split 4 ways. Not sure if true.

---

By NCAA rules, which the CFP will also observe, we can play as the PAC-4 for 2024 and 2025 with a great path to the CFP and any money from that split among only 4. Apple streaming deal at a minimum. We need a conference to work with us for 2024 scheduling.

Goal is the PAC-8 reconstituted as a west coast pod of the B1G or Cal and Stanford jumping to B1G or ACC. Worst case is add 4 or more teams in 2026 when the MWC GORs expire.

If during that time Spavital and Madsen have us looking good without losing players….

Rushinbear said:

---

Trumpanzee said:

---

I hate to say it, but if we don't want to become and obscured conference (might be too late) we should poach the MWC of San Diego St., San Jose St., Boise State, and Nevada. Regionally it makes sense and travel cost doesn't really change much. Conference is definitely weaker, but it became weaker when USC and UCLA bolted......Oregon and Washington may have put the nail in the coffin

---

what happened to FSU, LV, Davis, even, over SJS?

---

I'd rather rake leaves than watch Cal play any of those four schools. Give me a break.


When they're the cupcake coming to town once or twice per year, fine, but not as our conference peers.

Chapman_is_Gone said:

---

Rushinbear said:

---

Trumpanzee said:

---

I hate to say it, but if we don't want to become and obscured conference (might be too late) we should poach the MWC of San Diego St., San Jose St., Boise State, and Nevada. Regionally it makes sense and travel cost doesn't really change much. Conference is definitely weaker, but it became weaker when USC and UCLA bolted......Oregon and Washington may have put the nail in the coffin

---

what happened to FSU, LV, Davis, even, over SJS?

---

I'd rather rake leaves than watch Cal play any of those four schools. Give me a break.


When they're the cupcake coming to town once or twice per year, fine, but not as our conference peers.

---

.. errant comment

calumnus said:

---

oskidunker said:

---

golden sloth said:

---

Econ141 said:

---

PaulCali said:

---

---

---

---

---

By NCAA rules, which the CFP will also observe, we can play as the PAC-4 for 2024 and 2025 with a great path to the CFP and any money from that split among only 4. Apple streaming deal at a minimum. We need a conference to work with us for 2024 scheduling.

Goal is the PAC-8 reconstituted as a west coast pod of the B1G or Cal and Stanford jumping to B1G or ACC. Worst case is add 4 or more teams in 2026 when the MWC GORs expire.

If during that time Spavital and Madsen have us looking good without losing players….

---

The Pac-4 won't have a great path to the CFP, because the new CFP rules, effective this season, give autobids to the 6 conference champs that are highest rated in the CFP committee's top 25 poll. I.e., those bids go to the 6 highest-ranked teams among the champs of the 10 conferences.

For 2024, each of the Pac-4 has to scramble to schedule 6 new games almost immediately. (Each has 3 non-con games already scheduled, and playing the others makes 3 more.) Each will end up with a poor strength of schedule and could well get passed over by the committee's poll even if undefeated.

But, there is at least theoretically a chance.

Rushinbear said:

---

Trumpanzee said:

---

I hate to say it, but if we don't want to become and obscured conference (might be too late) we should poach the MWC of San Diego St., San Jose St., Boise State, and Nevada. Regionally it makes sense and travel cost doesn't really change much. Conference is definitely weaker, but it became weaker when USC and UCLA bolted......Oregon and Washington may have put the nail in the coffin

---

what happened to FSU, LV, Davis, even, over SJS?

---

I like Fresno, ok San Jose is out. I'm voting myself the new Pac-8 President. I won't take the 50 million paycheck like that previous deadbeat, I'll settle on half......

CFP? Lol. These remaining 4 teams will have just as much of a chance of making the playoffs as members of the Pac4 as they will this season.

No to Fresno. No to Boise.

I like UNLV, SDSU, SMU (wants to join a conference), Rice (great school and partner to SMU), and Tulane (also a good school).

To me, looking at this strictly through idealistic glasses, my overwhelming preference would be for the B1G to take in the final 4 Pac schools, and create (as it always should have been) the Pac 8, reconstituted as the western division.

By doing this, the B1G would be nodding to tradition. By doing this, the B1g would be restoring rivalries. By doing this, the B1g would be respecting the history between these two conferences largely revolving around the history of the Rose Bowl. And by doing this, the B1G could set up an east/west conference championship, played at the Rose Bowl, thus restoring the history, tradition and relationship the two proud conferences once had.

I would like to see the final four push hard for ALL of them to be included in order to make this the old Pac 8, a conference I never wanted to see expand in the first place.

TomBear said:

---

To me, looking at this strictly through idealistic glasses, my overwhelming preference would be for the B1G to take in the final 4 Pac schools, and create (as it always should have been) the Pac 8, reconstituted as the western division.

By doing this, the B1G would be nodding to tradition. By doing this, the B1g would be restoring rivalries. By doing this, the B1g would be respecting the history between these two conferences largely revolving around the history of the Rose Bowl. And by doing this, the B1G could set up an east/west conference championship, played at the Rose Bowl, thus restoring the history, tradition and relationship the two proud conferences once had.

I would like to see the final four push hard for ALL of them to be included in order to make this the old Pac 8, a conference I never wanted to see expand in the first place.

---

Sadly, that ship has sailed.

southseasbear said:

---

No to Fresno. No to Boise.

I like UNLV, SDSU, SMU (wants to join a conference), Rice (great school and partner to SMU), and Tulane (also a good school).

---

This thought process, shared by your admin, is why Cal is where they are…..

Fresno and Boise are the best football conference members and the biggest TV draws. Form the conference with SMU, SDSU, Rice UNLV and Tulane pulls the 4th and last draw in the MWC. Your value lies in the 7:30 western time slot.

Leaving either school in a healthy MWC merely provides the linear networks with leverage to use against you in negotiations. Absorb 9 MWC members, disband the MWC and now you have the leverage and you might get a decent TV package. Taking the lowest draw schools based on academics will only hurt your ratings and ability to move recover.

Sactowndog said:

---

southseasbear said:

---

No to Fresno. No to Boise.

I like UNLV, SDSU, SMU (wants to join a conference), Rice (great school and partner to SMU), and Tulane (also a good school).

---

This thought process, shared by your admin, is why Cal is where they are…..

Fresno and Boise are the best football conference members and the biggest TV draws. Form the conference with SMU, SDSU and Tulane. Your value lies in the 7:30 time slot.

Leaving either school in a healthy MWC merely provides the linear networks with leverage to use against you in negotiations. Absorb 9 MWC members, disband the MWC and now you have the leverage and you might get a decent TV package. Taking the lowest draw schools based on academics will only hurt your ratings and ability to move recover.

---

Yeah, Tulane was mediocre in football last year, right?
And SDSU was mediocre in basketball last year, right?

southseasbear said:

---

Sactowndog said:

---

southseasbear said:

---

No to Fresno. No to Boise.

I like UNLV, SDSU, SMU (wants to join a conference), Rice (great school and partner to SMU), and Tulane (also a good school).

---

This thought process, shared by your admin, is why Cal is where they are…..

Fresno and Boise are the best football conference members and the biggest TV draws. Form the conference with SMU, SDSU and Tulane. Your value lies in the 7:30 time slot.

Leaving either school in a healthy MWC merely provides the linear networks with leverage to use against you in negotiations. Absorb 9 MWC members, disband the MWC and now you have the leverage and you might get a decent TV package. Taking the lowest draw schools based on academics will only hurt your ratings and ability to move recover.

---

Yeah, Tulane was mediocre in football last year, right?
And SDSU was mediocre in basketball last year, right?

---

I'm talking TV draw in the 7:30 pm window. Tulane is great but no one from Louisiana is staying up to watch Tulane and no one watches UNLV at all. They historically have the fewest games picked up by Fox/CBS.

Your Cal / Tulane game at 7:30 pm will draw horrible ratings. Rice, SMU and Tulane are all small private colleges on central time. It will have the same problem had by the WAC which had SMU, Rice, Tulsa and La Tech. But sure go ahead and recreate the WAC and see how it goes.

Sactowndog said:

---

southseasbear said:

---

No to Fresno. No to Boise.

I like UNLV, SDSU, SMU (wants to join a conference), Rice (great school and partner to SMU), and Tulane (also a good school).

---

This thought process, shared by your admin, is why Cal is where they are…..

Fresno and Boise are the best football conference members and the biggest TV draws. Form the conference with SMU, SDSU, Rice UNLV and Tulane pulls the 4th and last draw in the MWC. Your value lies in the 7:30 western time slot.

---

For some reason this just brought home how interested I will be if we move to MWC to watch these games that have no impact on the national scene. Going out on Saturday nights and seeing these late Boise St games playing through the window as I walk past bars and not giving it a second glance because "who cares.". Ugh are we really headed there?!

How are we worth so much less than I of A and Colorado?!?! Makes no sense.

Econ141 said:

---

Sactowndog said:

---

southseasbear said:

---

No to Fresno. No to Boise.

I like UNLV, SDSU, SMU (wants to join a conference), Rice (great school and partner to SMU), and Tulane (also a good school).

---

This thought process, shared by your admin, is why Cal is where they are…..

Fresno and Boise are the best football conference members and the biggest TV draws. Form the conference with SMU, SDSU, Rice UNLV and Tulane pulls the 4th and last draw in the MWC. Your value lies in the 7:30 western time slot.

---

For some reason this just brought home how interested I will be if we move to MWC to watch these games that have no impact on the national scene. Going out on Saturday nights and seeing these late Boise St games playing through the window as I walk past bars and not giving it a second glance because "who cares.". Ugh are we really headed there?!

How are we worth so much less than I of A and Colorado?!?! Makes no sense.

---

I won't bother answering your question but I will point out a couple items:

1) it will matter because top 6 conference champs make the play-offs. So it will impact the national scene.

2) join a conference with small private Midwest schools and combine it with a dis-spirited PAC-4 fan base and those TV ratings are going to be brutal.

Maybe better to just drop football now and search for a partner to join the Big West.

Big C said:

---

I feel fairly confident that, at some point, we will be in one "power conference" or another, hopefully one of the best, like the B1G. That is what we should be shooting for.

That said, as long as we are playing football and basketball at any level, I will continue to be a Cal fan, to follow the Bears and go to a lot of the games. To those who would cease being fans if we end up playing at a lower level, hey, that is certainly your prerogative, but I don't get it. Still, we need to do everything we can do to be competing and hopefully winning at the highest level.

---

I understand what you're saying and a big part of me also wants to support Cal and be a fan irrespective of whatever level they play.

But it's hard. Kind of like being in an abusive relationship, where one person can't help but love the other while that other person doesn't seem to care or appreciate that love and will continue to do things that hurt the other person.

If Cal is relegated, it will be of their own doing. Cal doesn't seem to care about my fandom and will continue to make decisions and do things that will hurt me.

At some point, like in an actual abusive relationship, you just gotta pull the ripcord and get out for your own well-being, and I don't want to keep supporting and loving a program that not only doesn't love or appreciate me back, but even takes that love for granted and keep finding ways to hurt me.

Trumpanzee said:

---

I hate to say it, but if we don't want to become and obscured conference (might be too late) we should poach the MWC of San Diego St., San Jose St., Boise State, and Nevada. Regionally it makes sense and travel cost doesn't really change much. Conference is definitely weaker, but it became weaker when USC and UCLA bolted......Oregon and Washington may have put the nail in the coffin

---

USC put the nail in the coffin. Oregon pulled a Beatrix digging herself out of the grave from Kill Bill.

edwinbear said:

---

Big C said:

---

I feel fairly confident that, at some point, we will be in one "power conference" or another, hopefully one of the best, like the B1G. That is what we should be shooting for.

That said, as long as we are playing football and basketball at any level, I will continue to be a Cal fan, to follow the Bears and go to a lot of the games. To those who would cease being fans if we end up playing at a lower level, hey, that is certainly your prerogative, but I don't get it. Still, we need to do everything we can do to be competing and hopefully winning at the highest level.

---

I understand what you're saying and a big part of me also wants to support Cal and be a fan irrespective of whatever level they play.

But it's hard. Kind of like being in an abusive relationship, where one person can't help but love the other while that other person doesn't seem to care or appreciate that love and will continue to do things that hurt the other person.

If Cal is relegated, it will be of their own doing. Cal doesn't seem to care about my fandom and will continue to make decisions and do things that will hurt me.

At some point, like in an actual abusive relationship, you just gotta pull the ripcord and get out for your own well-being, and I don't want to keep supporting and loving a program that not only doesn't love or appreciate me back, but even takes that love for granted and keep finding ways to hurt me.

---

I totally understand what you're saying and I respect people's right to be fans on the terms that they decide, because it's all about how to spend one's leisure time.

I will be super-disappointed if we have to "drop down". Let's do everything we can to keep that from happening.

But of the things in life that I love, three are , Cal, football and basketball, so I will always be a fan. Any level, to me, is better than no level at all.

And while I agree with TomBear, I also agree with you. That ship has most likely sailed. Toto, we ain't in Kansas anymore.

PtownBear1 said:

---

CFP? Lol. These remaining 4 teams will have just as much of a chance of making the playoffs as members of the Pac4 as they will this season.

---

The CFP in 2024 will take the 6 highest rated conference champs. If we were the PAC-4 last year, Oregon State would have been selected and it isn't even close.

southseasbear said:

---

TomBear said:

---

To me, looking at this strictly through idealistic glasses, my overwhelming preference would be for the B1G to take in the final 4 Pac schools, and create (as it always should have been) the Pac 8, reconstituted as the western division.

By doing this, the B1G would be nodding to tradition. By doing this, the B1g would be restoring rivalries. By doing this, the B1g would be respecting the history between these two conferences largely revolving around the history of the Rose Bowl. And by doing this, the B1G could set up an east/west conference championship, played at the Rose Bowl, thus restoring the history, tradition and relationship the two proud conferences once had.

I would like to see the final four push hard for ALL of them to be included in order to make this the old Pac 8, a conference I never wanted to see expand in the first place.

---

Sadly, that ship has sailed.

---

Ships can sail in both directions.

If we play as the PAC-4 in 2024 and maybe again in 2025, we keep the possibility of negotiating for a Pac-8 West Coast pod open. USC, UCLA, UW, Oregon and the rest of the B1G may see the logic by then.

calumnus said:

---

southseasbear said:

---

TomBear said:

---

To me, looking at this strictly through idealistic glasses, my overwhelming preference would be for the B1G to take in the final 4 Pac schools, and create (as it always should have been) the Pac 8, reconstituted as the western division.

By doing this, the B1G would be nodding to tradition. By doing this, the B1g would be restoring rivalries. By doing this, the B1g would be respecting the history between these two conferences largely revolving around the history of the Rose Bowl. And by doing this, the B1G could set up an east/west conference championship, played at the Rose Bowl, thus restoring the history, tradition and relationship the two proud conferences once had.

I would like to see the final four push hard for ALL of them to be included in order to make this the old Pac 8, a conference I never wanted to see expand in the first place.

---

Sadly, that ship has sailed.

---

Ships can sail in both directions.

If we play as the PAC-4 in 2024 and maybe again in 2025, we keep the possibility of negotiating for a Pac-8 West Coast pod open. USC, UCLA, UW, Oregon and the rest of the B1G may see the logic by then.

---

You can't play as a 4 team conference. Also, what logic is there in adding a debt burdened program with little fan support or national presence, and a program with zero fan support or national presence?

ducktilldeath said:

---

calumnus said:

---

southseasbear said:

---

TomBear said:

---

To me, looking at this strictly through idealistic glasses, my overwhelming preference would be for the B1G to take in the final 4 Pac schools, and create (as it always should have been) the Pac 8, reconstituted as the western division.

By doing this, the B1G would be nodding to tradition. By doing this, the B1g would be restoring rivalries. By doing this, the B1g would be respecting the history between these two conferences largely revolving around the history of the Rose Bowl. And by doing this, the B1G could set up an east/west conference championship, played at the Rose Bowl, thus restoring the history, tradition and relationship the two proud conferences once had.

I would like to see the final four push hard for ALL of them to be included in order to make this the old Pac 8, a conference I never wanted to see expand in the first place.

---

Sadly, that ship has sailed.

---

Ships can sail in both directions.

If we play as the PAC-4 in 2024 and maybe again in 2025, we keep the possibility of negotiating for a Pac-8 West Coast pod open. USC, UCLA, UW, Oregon and the rest of the B1G may see the logic by then.

---

You can't play as a 4 team conference. Also, what logic is there in adding a debt burdened program with little fan support or national presence, and a program with zero fan support or national presence?

---

By next year, they will want/ to add us for our charm!