dont want pro teams

3,579 Views | 40 Replies | Last: 4 days ago by calumnus
TomBear
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Sorry Minot. I was provoked and should have let it go.

I wanted to try to chime in with something germaine. But frankly, I can't keep up with all the legalese and numbers. It's one of the reasons I'm feeling increasingly divorced from college football. It increasingly seems more like a business than a game. I know some argue it always has been that way, but it certainly wasn't as it is now.
socaltownie
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calumnus said:



Cal's horrible leadership in the 5 years up until realignment (huge recency bias, since Stanford suffered the same fate) is the main reason we are where we are, but Cal has the potential to be hugely successful if we survive the next 5 years.


I just fundamentally believe that is magical thinking. We can be BETTER than the horrific product put on the field during the woeful days of Sonny. We can improve upon Wilcox's "meh" performance and perhaps win 8 games.

But It just shows that Cal fans don't have a CLUE as to the commitment that "real" football schools make to winning. I am NOT advocating for that. But it would so fundamentally transform Cal as that it boggles the mind.

I doin't even want to focus on "jocks versus geeks". That debate is pointless and always ends up with "But look at Michigan". So I will use another way that football schools are "all in"......

They are not in a perpetual war with their host town or, if they are, they crush it into GOOOO.

So consider a "real school". A REAL school closes the stadium debt by hosting taylor swift concerts at CMS and tells the townies to pound sand. If they sue they get the state capital to pass a law. **** the GOVERNOR goes and moons the litigants. They close the streets down on game day and say "screw the locals". They put on the worlds largest cocktail party and love it. They COMMIT to the whole 9 yards.

Do any of you ever believe the City of Berkeley is doing that? Of COURSE NOT. Nor is the university. That gap is what pisses me off the most about this board - because rather than accept the brutal reality of the limitations many just wish them away.

And since football is a zero sum game (they win, you lose) even if if doesn't matter THAT MUCH it still provides the all in schools with small advantages that add up over time and why Cal is the longest of long shots to make the CFP.
socaltownie
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MinotStateBeav said:

HearstMining said:

Why would Trump even care about this? I can think of two reasons:
  • He wants to put in place restrictions/requirements that will give HIS federal government more leverage over universities similar to the threatened withdrawal of federal research grants.
  • Regardless of what he does, or if he actually does nothing, the SEC / B1G will inevitably come out ahead. By being involved, he can claim credit when they do.
In his heart-of-hearts, Trump has wanted to own an NFL team since the early 1980s, but the owners have always rebuffed him. Why? Simple. They're smart business people who have a monopoly based on mutual agreements (occasionally broken by people like Jerry Jones). The last thing they want is somebody like Trump in the club, who will happily screw his partners, but even more importantly, has a reputation for driving his businesses into the ground. He has always been out for revenge here. One example is making a big deal about the kneeling for the national anthem protest a few years ago, and reigniting the Redskins naming issue in the last few weeks, putting their new stadium plans at risk.


Trump actually enjoys college football and he see's the entire structure of the sport is going downhill very quickly so decided to act in order to help curtail the rapid decline. Most of your criticism is just partisan and there's no point in arguing about that.


Saban has Trump's ear and the Alabama's are a deep risk in the new world order because Alabama is a poor state that doesn't mint billionaires. Or put in this way, the Tide better get on the long term project to find Larry Ellison his next Sugerbaby ;-)
socaltownie
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coachdeke said:

I would never have gone to Cal if they didn't have major college sports; in fact, I probably wouldn't have gone to a school that branded themselves "Berkeley."

Anecdote is not data. The fact that UCSD is nearly as competitive (and more so in many majors) as UCB suggests that CURRENT students, as a population, do not share your views.
calumnus
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MinotStateBeav said:

This is not appropriate on the football board and you know it, come on.

I was just responding to Tom's question but you are right, it is OT so I deleted my answer. I do standby my original statement.
calumnus
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socaltownie said:

calumnus said:



Cal's horrible leadership in the 5 years up until realignment (huge recency bias, since Stanford suffered the same fate) is the main reason we are where we are, but Cal has the potential to be hugely successful if we survive the next 5 years.


I just fundamentally believe that is magical thinking. We can be BETTER than the horrific product put on the field during the woeful days of Sonny. We can improve upon Wilcox's "meh" performance and perhaps win 8 games.

But It just shows that Cal fans don't have a CLUE as to the commitment that "real" football schools make to winning. I am NOT advocating for that. But it would so fundamentally transform Cal as that it boggles the mind.

I doin't even want to focus on "jocks versus geeks". That debate is pointless and always ends up with "But look at Michigan". So I will use another way that football schools are "all in"......

They are not in a perpetual war with their host town or, if they are, they crush it into GOOOO.

So consider a "real school". A REAL school closes the stadium debt by hosting taylor swift concerts at CMS and tells the townies to pound sand. If they sue they get the state capital to pass a law. **** the GOVERNOR goes and moons the litigants. They close the streets down on game day and say "screw the locals". They put on the worlds largest cocktail party and love it. They COMMIT to the whole 9 yards.

Do any of you ever believe the City of Berkeley is doing that? Of COURSE NOT. Nor is the university. That gap is what pisses me off the most about this board - because rather than accept the brutal reality of the limitations many just wish them away.

And since football is a zero sum game (they win, you lose) even if if doesn't matter THAT MUCH it still provides the all in schools with small advantages that add up over time and why Cal is the longest of long shots to make the CFP.


I don't wish them away. I knew what we had with Tedford in 2004 was possible in 2000 when people here were making exactly the same argument you are making as an excuse for Tom Holmoe. When we have good coaches: White, Snyder, first half of Tedford, we can compete at the highest level. When we have bad coaches people blame the city, the university, the students….

Moreover, when was the last time Cal did not have the Raiders and/or Niners within 20 miles of CMS? When was the last time we did not have the Warriors in the East Bay? We have NEVER had a Cal alum as chancellor before. The opportunity now has not been seen in 70 years, if ever. However, it takes entirely new thinking.

The City of Berkeley can be a partner instead of a perceived "enemy." Mayor Adena Ishii is a Cal alum (Haas undergrad) originally from SoCal who transferred from Berkeley City College and started Cal's "Transfer Service Community." (Offer free or low cost student tickets to Cal students AND community college, even CSEB and CCSF students). Her monthly newsletter is a photo of her at CMS with I House in the background. Cal sports brings a lot of revenue to Berkeley businesses and to the city.

People whose politics do not align with the majority in Berkeley and Oakland resist this, but the Calgorithm knows that Cal's comparative advantage, its natural brand, is leaning into our progressive and multicultural reputation, not running from it. Note that some people will tune in to root against the "hippies from Berkeley" and that is actually a good thing. Similarly, when we have local stars like Marshawn Lynch and Jason Kidd our games sell out. Pushing out our entire RB room was a mistake. I think the Jet could have been a huge star and draw this year. But it all starts with winning.

Our easy window to win big was last year and this year. Hiring Ron Rivera from the NFL could have made a big splash but we lessened it by putting him in the background instead of making him the head coach. The financial crunch is about to hit the university. Things are about to get dire. It may be only a 50-50 chance we even survive. However, if we survive, it will be because we got a good coach (or somehow Wilcox became one) and then we have the <opportunity> to fulfill our potential and build a great, regional, statewide and national brand. Remember, we don't have to be everyone's favorite team, just entertaining, some people's second favorite team, other people's favorite team to root against. If that happens, we will easily be the favorite to be the next West Coast addition to the B1G in the next realignment.
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