So I had 2 things/ideas I wondered about in respect to the Ducks gimmick attack.

A) I would ABSOLUTELY let my Defensive Coordinator have absolute authority to call TO's when you have the Ducks in 3rd and longish to get set up. Yes. You "might" need them at the end of the game/half but - if you lose by 24 - it doesn't matter. It is CRITICAL to disrupt the Duck's pace/flow/tempo and the right time is on 3rd down when you can stall their drives and get the right package in.

B) If you are back on you heels, for example, if your defense is getting winded and tired, I wouldn't be at all afraid to take an encroachment penalty. Too bad they made College football for sissies but honestly a nice nose guard gap stunt to take the QB's head off would be nice. While you will be defending against some 1sts and 5s it is FAR better to slow down the pace rather than let the ducklings dictate. My guess is that on a nice encroachment penalty it buys you about 45-60 seconds from the nice that the whistle blows, the ball is marked off, and the clock wound.

Other "gimmicks" that people have seen work from the D's that have slowed Duckies down?

....and I was hoping to see college football at its best, too?......

I don't have a problem with faking a leg cramp. Just stay down and grab your leg. Get it rubbed down on the sidelines. I'd go that route before I start taking shots at the QB or using timeouts. I'd do the leg cramp thing 2 or 3 times a half.

I just don't want the Ducks pantsing us again on a 2 pointer.

socaltownie;585368 said:

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So I had 2 things/ideas I wondered about in respect to the Ducks gimmick attack.

A) I would ABSOLUTELY let my Defensive Coordinator have absolute authority to call TO's when you have the Ducks in 3rd and longish to get set up. Yes. You "might" need them at the end of the game/half but - if you lose by 24 - it doesn't matter. It is CRITICAL to disrupt the Duck's pace/flow/tempo and the right time is on 3rd down when you can stall their drives and get the right package in.

B) If you are back on you heels, for example, if your defense is getting winded and tired, I wouldn't be at all afraid to take an encroachment penalty. Too bad they made College football for sissies but honestly a nice nose guard gap stunt to take the QB's head off would be nice. While you will be defending against some 1sts and 5s it is FAR better to slow down the pace rather than let the ducklings dictate. My guess is that on a nice encroachment penalty it buys you about 45-60 seconds from the nice that the whistle blows, the ball is marked off, and the clock wound.

Other "gimmicks" that people have seen work from the D's that have slowed Duckies down?

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We just need to platoon on defense. Wholesale substitutions planned for and ready to go, automatically. Their offense isn't complicated. Turn their strategy on its head. We are deeper on defense than they are on offense. Watch THEM get tired out from battling wave after wave of OUR defensive linemen.

SacCityBear;585413 said:

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Instruct your defensive line to flatten the offensive line every single time they get up out of their stance to look to the sidelines for the playcall.

If the refs throw a flag, ask them how that isn't a false start.

Repeat as necessary until the officials start flagging Oregon and Oregon's offensive line is scared.

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we do the same thing sometimes - but not nearly as often

I agree though with your thought - I don't understand why this isn't a false start - maybe the OL just need to be "set" for a period of time prior to a snap? anyone know?

SacCityBear;585413 said:

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Instruct your defensive line to flatten the offensive line every single time they get up out of their stance to look to the sidelines for the playcall.

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Our offense does this too.

pappysghost;585392 said:

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I don't have a problem with faking a leg cramp. Just stay down and grab your leg. Get it rubbed down on the sidelines. I'd go that route before I start taking shots at the QB or using timeouts. I'd do the leg cramp thing 2 or 3 times a half.

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IMO, it's unethical. If it were other teams that were faking injuries to stop us, I'd think it was total BS.

If the OL has their forearms on their knees, they can reset. Once their hand goes to the ground in a stance, they can not reset.

socaltownie;585368 said:

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So I had 2 things/ideas I wondered about in respect to the Ducks gimmick attack.

A) I would ABSOLUTELY let my Defensive Coordinator have absolute authority to call TO's when you have the Ducks in 3rd and longish to get set up. Yes. You "might" need them at the end of the game/half but - if you lose by 24 - it doesn't matter. It is CRITICAL to disrupt the Duck's pace/flow/tempo and the right time is on 3rd down when you can stall their drives and get the right package in.

B) If you are back on you heels, for example, if your defense is getting winded and tired, I wouldn't be at all afraid to take an encroachment penalty. Too bad they made College football for sissies but honestly a nice nose guard gap stunt to take the QB's head off would be nice. While you will be defending against some 1sts and 5s it is FAR better to slow down the pace rather than let the ducklings dictate. My guess is that on a nice encroachment penalty it buys you about 45-60 seconds from the nice that the whistle blows, the ball is marked off, and the clock wound.

Other "gimmicks" that people have seen work from the D's that have slowed Duckies down?

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A) Calling time out if we thought we were TOTALLY caught with our pants down is one thing, but I wouldn't do it too often.

B) I kind of like the encroachment idea! Did you think it up yourself, or have you seen it done before? (I haven't.)

Bottom line, I think in football, the offense has the right to dictate tempo. If we need to, just sub more judiciously. Down and distance should be enough of a clue for us what they're going to run. Once you need to think about skirting the rules in order to keep up with the offense, I think you've already lost, mentally.

This whole issue begs the question: Would it be a good strategy for a really deep offense to always speed up the tempo against a less-deep defense? It'd be kinda like a deep basketball team wanting to run and press, to wear out another team that only goes 6-7 deep...

Guys guys guys! This is where we fans can actually help!

When their offense is rolling and it looks like we need time to be stopped, we can streak the field! They have to stop play until the streakers are caught and ushered off the field. We'll have to have at least 5 people queued up for critical moments.

Who's in?!

:cheer:cheer:cheer:cheer

RealBear65;585429 said:

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If the OL has their forearms on their knees, they can reset. Once their hand goes to the ground in a stance, they can not reset.

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thanks realbear - I didn't know this - I'll be watching for this on Thursday

Big C_Cal;585436 said:

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A) Calling time out if we thought we were TOTALLY caught with our pants down is one thing, but I wouldn't do it too often.

B) I kind of like the encroachment idea! Did you think it up yourself, or have you seen it done before? (I haven't.)

Bottom line, I think in football, the offense has the right to dictate tempo. If we need to, just sub more judiciously. Down and distance should be enough of a clue for us what they're going to run. Once you need to think about skirting the rules in order to keep up with the offense, I think you've already lost, mentally.

This whole issue begs the question: Would it be a good strategy for a really deep offense to always speed up the tempo against a less-deep defense? It'd be kinda like a deep basketball team wanting to run and press, to wear out another team that only goes 6-7 deep...

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The thing is, defenses tend to be deeper (other than at corner) than offenses. Our defense is VERY deep--especially on the DL. If we plan ahead, we can substitute liberally and negate any advantage from speed of play. maybe even turn it to OUR advantage. They don't do that many different things.

calumnus;585416 said:

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We are deeper on defense than they are on offense.

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This is a pretty bold claim imo...
Do you mean across the board, or just on the lines?

SouthBayPhenom;585418 said:

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we do the same thing sometimes - but not nearly as often

I agree though with your thought - I don't understand why this isn't a false start - maybe the OL just need to be "set" for a period of time prior to a snap? anyone know?

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The key is, once set, they are not allowed to make "a football" move, or something similar to that. So, if their movement in getting up to look back at the sideline is easily distinguished from either firing off the line or twitching, then they can do it. It's how we (and many others) have the guard tap the center to alert him to snap the ball. that's movement when set, but its clearly not a football move, so there is no penalty. (I saw the colts doing this also with their rookie center who was replacing jeff saturday on MNF)

BellottiBold;585453 said:

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This is a pretty bold claim imo...
Do you mean across the board, or just on the lines?

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I would say with confidence that our d line is deeper than your o-line. but, that's true everywhere - its a product of football that o linemen don't get substituted for anything other than injuries, whereas d-line are constantly getting subbed because it takes more energy to play d-line than oline.

But not deeper across the board.

BellottiBold;585453 said:

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This is a pretty bold claim imo...
Do you mean across the board, or just on the lines?

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i'm guessing he meant along the lines - notably our DL against your OL - because our secondary is laughably thin.

BellottiBold;585453 said:

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This is a pretty bold claim imo...
Do you mean across the board, or just on the lines?

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The front seven. Same would be true for for your defense versus our offense. That is just the way it is generally in football. As someone once said, "Offensive line is building a house, defensive line is tearing down a house." It is a lot easier to platoon defensive linemen than offensive linemen.

However, our defensive front seven is particularly deep, especially on the line thanks to Tosh Lupoi's recruiting. We have four and even five star recruits as DL backups.

The opposite is true at cornerback, which I am pretty sure Chip Kelly said is one of the keys to the development of his offense, i.e.: "God makes more wide receivers than cornerbacks." The idea is to liberally substitute at WR, and speed up the tempo to wear out the other side's corners, then feast on them in the second half. We, like most football teams, are not deep at cornerback.

The point is to press your advantage where you have an advantage. Tempo favors the offense in the WR versus CB matchup. However, if played smart, tempo can actually be turned to the defense's advantage for the front seven.

The key is not to to try to run "business as usual," not to make situational substitutions, and not to see what the offense shows before you substitute. Instead, have wholesale substitutions planned and have the next group ready and waiting.

Vandalus;585456 said:

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The key is, once set, they are not allowed to make "a football" move, or something similar to that.

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You cannot even try to hold off a sneeze once you're set.

freshfunk;585439 said:

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Guys guys guys! This is where we fans can actually help!

When their offense is rolling and it looks like we need time to be stopped, we can streak the field! They have to stop play until the streakers are caught and ushered off the field. We'll have to have at least 5 people queued up for critical moments.

Who's in?!

:cheer:cheer:cheer:cheer

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I love that idea, though I'd prefer that we pay hotties to do it. They won't care if they miss the rest of the game anyway.

I actually don't under the whole platoon of D-subs. INsn't the whole point of the ducks hurry up to get to the line asap so that you don't have TIME to sub - unless you start runnign the MOMENT the whistle sounds? and I mean the MOMENT. Even then you risk too many men on the field unless you are VERY fast.

Anyone time how fast Oregon can get line up after the whistle?

socaltownie;585547 said:

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I actually don't under the whole platoon of D-subs. INsn't the whole point of the ducks hurry up to get to the line asap so that you don't have TIME to sub - unless you start runnign the MOMENT the whistle sounds? and I mean the MOMENT. Even then you risk too many men on the field unless you are VERY fast.

Anyone time how fast Oregon can get line up after the whistle?

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Not only get to the line quickly, but to get you really tired. Hence, the need for fresh bodies in and out, if possible.

BellottiBold;585453 said:

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This is a pretty bold claim imo...
Do you mean across the board, or just on the lines?

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Can you give us at least that?! Geez, throw us a bone.

One thing I do hope our coaches do is ask the referee's to set the ball ready for play at the same tempo/pace as they do when we have the ball. I didn't like last year watching the refs scramble to set it for oregon then watching them lolly gag the ball to set it when we were on offense. Yes it doesn't disrupt our offense, but it seems like it is aiding the other team when they have it.

socaltownie;585547 said:

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I actually don't under the whole platoon of D-subs. INsn't the whole point of the ducks hurry up to get to the line asap so that you don't have TIME to sub - unless you start runnign the MOMENT the whistle sounds? and I mean the MOMENT. Even then you risk too many men on the field unless you are VERY fast.

Anyone time how fast Oregon can get line up after the whistle?

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That is not an issue. The same group could play one set of downs. The new group would come in if Oregon makes substitutions or if play stops to move the chains. You would still keep your guys fresher than theirs.

The group on the sidelines would receive most of their coaching and instructions before they went in.

TheBears;585520 said:

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You cannot even try to hold off a sneeze once you're set.

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"No interior lineman may move abruptly after taking or simulating a three-point stance."

"No player of offensive team may charge or move abruptly, after assuming set position, in such manner as to lead defense to believe snap has started."

http://www.nfl.com/rulebook/positionofplayers

This is essentially what I am saying. A non-abrupt movement will not be called a false start, even after assuming a set position.

Vandalus;585602 said:

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A non-abrupt movement will not be called a false start, even after assuming a set position.

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I'd love to see video of an example.

TheBears;585604 said:

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I'd love to see video of an example.

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You've been seeing other teams do it for a few years now, including us this year.

BB,
I think we are deeper in talent but U of O's scheme is such that it is difficult to defend. We did well last year but I am not yet convinced (yet hopeful) that our D can shut down U of O's O this year.

freshfunk;585439 said:

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Guys guys guys! This is where we fans can actually help!

When their offense is rolling and it looks like we need time to be stopped, we can streak the field! They have to stop play until the streakers are caught and ushered off the field. We'll have to have at least 5 people queued up for critical moments.

Who's in?!

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Yes, and if they could all be better-looking women, well that would be.... better looking.

pjlbear;585709 said:

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BB,
I think we are deeper in talent but U of O's scheme is such that it is difficult to defend. We did well last year but I am not yet convinced (yet hopeful) that our D can shut down U of O's O this year.

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Agreed, Oregon has multiple aspects to its success on offense. The pace of play is just one, but much of its success as a tactic is due to coaches not being prepared for it and trying to go about defensive substitutions and adjustments in the same way they always have. The Ducks can still (and probably will) beat you on scheme and skill, but they should not beat you based on a tactic like pace of play that you can prepare for and counter.