UCLA is right on our heels with 562.

Good disciplined football.

91 more penalty yards last night.

continuing discipline problems are the coaching staffs responsibility.

can we agree most of those penalties last night were bullshit?

MinotStateBeav;841977506 said:

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can we agree most of those penalties last night were bullshit?

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We can.

Yep.

Yes, but that doesn't explain the rest of the year. Moreover, it doesn't explain the great number of sacks or the failures on 3rd down. This team just isn't very good - that explains everything.

It has to be asked: how many of the Pac-12 teams are high on the penalty curve... maybe it has more to do with the caliber and philosophy of the refs. Wasn't that one of the things the Pac-12 emphasized it was trying to fix?

NJCalFan;841977556 said:

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It has to be asked: how many of the Pac-12 teams are high on the penalty curve... maybe it has more to do with the caliber and philosophy of the refs. Wasn't that one of the things the Pac-12 emphasized it was trying to fix?

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Avg per game, Oregon State is higher than Cal. They have only played five games. Oh yeah, they are 5-0. :p

OSu is 123 (of 124), Cal is 120, UCLA is 119, USC is 117, and Oregon is 113.

http://www.cfbstats.com/2012/leader/national/team/offense/split01/category14/sort01.html

calumnus;841977453 said:

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UCLA is right on our heels with 562.

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What's the purpose of this thread?

So how by how much are Pac-12 officials over-calling penalties? 40%-50%-60%?

There was a thread on BI about how 5 of the top 10 teams in penalties were Pac-12. What is the common denominator? Well duh.

drizzlybears brother;841977614 said:

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What's the purpose of this thread?

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You don't think it is notable when Cal leads all 120 schools in a statistical category? Stats are stats. It is worth noting and discussing.

My personal opinion is that we have greatly improved in avoiding sacks (we just built a commanding lead earlier) and most of the penalty calls against us last night were BS, as were many earlier in the season. A combination of getting MSG back and better play calling has helped us reduce the number of sacks and the number of legitimate penalties. I am personally optimistic we can continue this trend and hopefully we will relinquish our lead in these categories soon. What do you think?

calumnus;841977631 said:

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You don't think it is notable when Cal leads all 120 schools in a statistical category? Stats are stats. It is worth noting and discussing.

My personal opinion is that we have greatly improved in avoiding sacks (we just built a commanding lead earlier) and most of the penalty calls against us last night were BS, as were many earlier in the season. A combination of getting MSG back and better play calling has helped us reduce the number of sacks and the number of legitimate penalties. I am personally optimistic we can continue this trend and hopefully we will relinquish our lead in these categories soon. What do you think?

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I think you have animosity toward our head coach and thus intentionally chose to highlight two negative stats.

There are all kinds of stats you could have chosen, like the uptick in our running game - 318 is a pretty fancy number and adding to a nice developing trend - but you claim interest in penalty stats. Under this coach we've had teams that got very few penalties and some that have recieved more.

I think if you were truly interested in penalty stats then you'd be looking at the types of penalties the team is getting.

I thought we handled their dine pretty well last night. The only sacks I recall we're probably coverage sacks. I think we had 25 after ucla, so we've slowed up the hemorrhage.

Penalties remain a problem. Kam Jackson had two big ones that kept their drives alive and accounted for thirty yards.

calumnus;841977453 said:

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UCLA is right on our heels with 562.

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Eh. That stat, unlike sacks, is meaningless when the 12 most penalized teams are the pac12.

FlourBear;841977524 said:

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All those penalties bring to mind the 1991 big game when we got 7 unsportsmanlike conduct fouls. Bruce Snyder was ridiculed by the local media for having "undisciplined players". But Snyder fought back and defended his players, telling the media they were not "undisciplined". Was he also trying to tell us the calls were b.s.? We'll never know because Snyder departed soon thereafter, only to build a home deep in the desert, eventually going the way of Joe Roth and dying from melanoma.

As we come closer to sending our all-time-wins-leader packing, should we pause to ask ourselves, "Will JT also go to the desert?" and "Will melanoma play a role in his story, too?"

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is every post you make going to be about Snyder?
Holy fudge you are one dimentional.

OneKeg;841977722 said:

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hundreds of fans.

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False. Furd has zero fans. Hundreds of bandwagon whites...


Hmmmm auto correct changed whores to whites, and the comment still worked out great.

drizzlybears brother;841977646 said:

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I think if you were truly interested in penalty stats then you'd be looking at the types of penalties the team is getting.

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Which type of penalties are acceptable and which are unacceptable to you?

drizzlybears brother;841977646 said:

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I think you have animosity toward our head coach and thus intentionally chose to highlight two negative stats.

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I think you should stop trying to be a mind reader and guessing the motivations of people you know little to nothing about.

6bear6;841977690 said:

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I thought we handled their dine pretty well last night. The only sacks I recall we're probably coverage sacks. I think we had 25 after ucla, so we've slowed up the hemorrhage.

Penalties remain a problem. Kam Jackson had two big ones that kept their drives alive and accounted for thirty yards.

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Try zero.

Zero sacks on Saturday.

Seems like refs call the game differently out here. The Pac-12 is among the top three conferences in performance, but penalty yards pile up faster here than in any other conference:

#7 ASU: 32.2
#40 Zona: 46.7
#47 Furd: 49.2
National Median Penalty Yards Per Game: 55.6
#80 Colo: 59.7
#89 Wash: 62.8
#99 WSU: 67.9
#103 Utah: 70.7
#113 Ore: 73.7
#117 U$C: 78.3
#119 UCLA: 80.3
#120 Cal: 80.7
#123 OSU: 85.8

It often seems like refs favor the losing team in a blowout, as it did Saturday night up in Pullman with border line pass interference calls extending drives. The three Pac-12 teams ranked in the top-11 nationally are among the 12 most heavily penalized teams in the country.

Interesting side note... military teams:
#3 Air Force: 26.0
#4 Navy: 27.2
#11 Army: 35.0

Nasal Mucus Goldenbear;841977735 said:

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Which type of penalties are acceptable and which are unacceptable to you?
I think you should stop trying to be a mind reader and guessing the motivations of people you know little to nothing about.

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Just offering an opinion. What do you think were his motives?

As for penalties, there are categories we'd find more annoying and less annoying. Or do you find them all equal?

Phantomfan;841977700 said:

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Eh. That stat, unlike sacks, is meaningless when the 12 most penalized teams are the pac12.

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It is not "meaningless" the question is, "What does it mean?"

Personally, I feel like Pac-12 refs are bad, our oline has struggled, but more than anything it feels like we get screwed by the refs more than anyone else in the country.

calumnus;841977882 said:

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It is not "meaningless" the question is, "What does it mean?"

Personally, I feel like Pac-12 refs are bad, our oline has struggled, but more than anything it feels like we get screwed by the refs more than anyone else in the country.

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Do u think it could be payback for injury gate?

drizzlybears brother;841977646 said:

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I think you have animosity toward our head coach and thus intentionally chose to highlight two negative stats.

There are all kinds of stats you could have chosen, like the uptick in our running game - 318 is a pretty fancy number and adding to a nice developing trend - but you claim interest in penalty stats. Under this coach we've had teams that got very few penalties and some that have received more.

I think if you were truly interested in penalty stats then you'd be looking at the types of penalties the team is getting.

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Why do you think this is necessarily about Tedford? The stats are notable because we lead the nation in those stats. On Sundays I check the NCAA stats and see where Cal is in various categories and see if there is anything notable. If we lead the nation in rushing or something positive I would definitely post it. What we did in another year is pretty much irrelevant to this year's team unless you are obsessed with seeing everything as an attack on Tedford and defending him at all cost. Personally, I think the current year stats are more about our oline and Pac-12 refs. I think we have made great strides in improving the sack situation with MSG and Rodgers back and better play calling.

Again, this thread is about sacks and penalties, you are the one who is making it yet another referendum on Tedford. However, for the record, you are wrong about me. I like Tedford personally and am rooting for Tedford to turn it around. I want to win out and go to the Rose Bowl.

I think I occupy the middle ground--I see that he has made mistakes the last 5 years, and unlike many of his supporters, I don't excuse them, I am not blind to them, but unlike others that have given up on him, I believe people can change and he can fix them. I see he has been making improvements and applaud them. The past is the past. What matters is the future. I don't think offering amateur analysis and suggestions of ways we might improve is anti-Tedford, I think it is actually ultimately pro-Tedford. Suggesting that he is doing everything perfectly already and could not do anything to improve on the results he has been getting is ultimately not very helpful to his cause. If you think the play calling has improved this year and was further improved in the UCLA game (which you and I agreed upon in another thread), then you implicitly have acknowledged that earlier calls and suggestions for improved play calling were not off-base. You cannot have it both ways.

Finally, I ultimately root for Cal and the players and given Tedford's contract, the BEST outcome for Cal would be for Tedford to have great success this year and next and become the highly successful coach we all want him to be. Again, I like that we went no-huddle. I like that we have gone more hurry-up against UCLA with a better mix of our running backs. It seems like Tedford may have found a good young play caller in Arroyo and has given him more say.

It is now Monday of Big Game week. I think we can all agree, the next order of business is beating Stanford and bringing home the Axe.

calumnus;841977937 said:

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Why do you think this is necessarily about Tedford? The stats are notable because we lead the nation in those stats. If we lead the nation in rushing or something positive I would definitely post it. What we did in another year is pretty much irrelevant to this year's team unless you are obsessed with seeing everything as an attack on Tedford and defending him at all cost. Personally, I think the current year stats are more about our oline and Pac-12 refs. I think we have made great strides in improving the sack situation with MSG and Rodgers back and better play calling.

Again, this thread is about sacks and penalties, you are the one who is making it yet another referendum on Tedford. However, for the record, you are wrong about me. I like Tedford personally and am rooting for Tedford to turn it around. I want to win out and go to the Rose Bowl.

I think I occupy the middle ground--I see that he has made mistakes the last 5 years, and unlike many of his supporters, I don't excuse them, I am not blind to them, but unlike others that have given up on him, I believe people can change and he can fix them. I see he has been making improvements and applaud them. The past is the past. What matters is the future. I don't think offering amateur analysis and suggestions of ways we might improve is anti-Tedford, I think it is actually ultimately pro-Tedford. Suggesting that he is doing everything perfectly already and could not do anything to improve on the results he has been getting is ultimately not very helpful to his cause. If you think the play calling has improved this year and was further improved in the UCLA game (which you and I agreed upon in another thread), then you implicitly have acknowledged that earlier calls and suggestions for improved play calling were not off-base. You cannot have it both ways.

Finally, I ultimately root for Cal and the players and given Tedford's contract, the BEST outcome for Cal would be for Tedford to have great success this year and next and become the highly successful coach we all want him to be. Again, I like that we went no-huddle. I like that we have gone more hurry-up against UCLA with a better mix of our running backs. It seems like Tedford may have found a good young play caller in Arroyo and has given him more say.

It is now Monday of Big Game week. I think we can all agree, the next order of business is beating Stanford and bring home the Axe.

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Let's just agree to agree on this.

tommie317;841977888 said:

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Do u think it could be payback for injury gate?

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I have no idea. I have to say, it feels like Cal has been screwed by the refs for years (in football and basketball), but I fully admit that could easily be subjective bias. There is no objective way to really tell.

drizzlybears brother;841977944 said:

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Let's just agree to agree on this.

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Agreed
:gobears:

R90;841977775 said:

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Seems like refs call the game differently out here. The Pac-12 is among the top three conferences in performance, but penalty yards pile up faster here than in any other conference:

#7 ASU: 32.2
#40 Zona: 46.7
#47 Furd: 49.2
National Median Penalty Yards Per Game: 55.6
#80 Colo: 59.7
#89 Wash: 62.8
#99 WSU: 67.9
#103 Utah: 70.7
#113 Ore: 73.7
#117 U$C: 78.3
#119 UCLA: 80.3
#120 Cal: 80.7
#123 OSU: 85.8

It often seems like refs favor the losing team in a blowout, as it did Saturday night up in Pullman with border line pass interference calls extending drives. The three Pac-12 teams ranked in the top-11 nationally are among the 12 most heavily penalized teams in the country.

Interesting side note... military teams:
#3 Air Force: 26.0
#4 Navy: 27.2
#11 Army: 35.0

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Military schools and within the Pac-12, Arizona schools and Stanford, are getting the calls....maybe it political bias on the part of refs, including Pac-12 refs? Though, I am sure a good case can be made for military schools being more disciplined (and I know Stanford fans make that claim).

These stats should get better.

We have 3 new starters on the Oline, but we've had to deal with injuries to 2 key returning starters. The only returning starter without injury issues (Schwenke) has had to learn a new position. I think we underestimated how much of an impact the greenness of the Oline would have.

Also, I think a lot of the penalties early on have had to do with the team implementing the no-huddle. It probably took the players and coaching staff some getting used to.

calumnus;841977937 said:

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Again, I like that we went no-huddle. I like that we have gone more hurry-up against UCLA with a better mix of our running backs. It seems like Tedford may have found a good young play caller in Arroyo and has given him more say.

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One thing that I thought was interesting against WSU. We did not change our tempo with a lead in the 4th. Normally, we start running the clock down under 5 seconds. However, this time we didn't try to run clock at all. I noticed us snap the ball with 18 seconds on the clock on one play. We didn't even run it all the way down on the punt (which I must admit confused me a little). If my memory is right, this was the second to last drive with something like 5 minutes left. Pretty large change in philosophy.

Recognizing that the overall quality of its refs is awful, the Pac-12 brought in Mike Pereira (who was in charge of officiating for the NFL) to try to fix the problems. It's still a work in progress.

OaktownBear;841978025 said:

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One thing that I thought was interesting against WSU. We did not change our tempo with a lead in the 4th. Normally, we start running the clock down under 5 seconds. However, this time we didn't try to run clock at all. I noticed us snap the ball with 18 seconds on the clock on one play. We didn't even run it all the way down on the punt (which I must admit confused me a little). If my memory is right, this was the second to last drive with something like 5 minutes left. Pretty large change in philosophy.

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Agreed--I really liked it. Keep the pedal on the gas--if something is working and working to our advantage (faster pace) don't change that to get conservative and start trying to preserve the lead and run out the clock. That has backfired on us too many times. I will say that even though we were running plays fairly quickly, we still burned a lot of clock because we were primarily running.

drizzlybears brother;841977646 said:

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I think you have animosity toward our head coach and thus intentionally chose to highlight two negative stats.

There are all kinds of stats you could have chosen, like the uptick in our running game - 318 is a pretty fancy number and adding to a nice developing trend - but you claim interest in penalty stats. Under this coach we've had teams that got very few penalties and some that have recieved more.

I think if you were truly interested in penalty stats then you'd be looking at the types of penalties the team is getting.

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Hrmmmmm

Cal is ranked Last in 4th down conversion
Cal is ranked 6th in YPG (ahead of USC and Furd)
Cal is ranked 7th in 3rd down conversion
Cal is ranked 9th in completion %
Cal is ranked 6th in Y Average
Cal is ranked 9th in Penalty yards
Cal is ranked Last in sacks
Cal is ranked 8th in yards lost per sack
Cal is ranked 5th in YP Carry
Cal is ranked 3rd in Rushing Yards/game
Cal is 6th in sack total
Cal is 8th is yards lost per sack (defense)
Cal is 8th on passes defended
Cal is 4th on ints gained
Cal is 8th in pass YPG


A few off the top of my head...

Cal statistics are not baised. The team is just not that good.