Granted, I have never played center before. But it seems to me that it really can't be too hard to accurately and consistently snap the ball to the quarterback in a shotgun formation. It has to be one of the easier parts of the job.

It just seems to take three things: concentration, coaching, and repetitions. So which one of these three factors is missing, and what will it take to correct it?

Brazinski was one of the highest rated centers in his HS class (#2, I believe), and he is one of the smartest and strongest guys on the team. Cochran was also highly ranked out of HS. So why can't they consistently and accurately snap the ball to the quarterback?

We struggled with this all last year, and it made a so-so QB look very bad at times. Can someone fill me in on why we can't get this right?

Centers have a lot more responsibilities in Dykes' offensive system. I think that may be a contributing factor

The Duke!;842105195 said:

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Brazinski was one of the highest rated centers in his HS class (#2, I believe), and he is one of the smartest and strongest guys on the team. Cochran was also highly ranked out of HS. So why can't they consistently and accurately snap the ball to the quarterback?

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Brazinski was so highly touted, yet in his 5th year he has nothing done anything special or significant. And he cannot snap a ball says it all.

It says it all, really.

The Duke!;842105195 said:

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Granted, I have never played center before. But it seems to me that it really can't be too hard to accurately and consistently snap the ball to the quarterback in a shotgun formation. It has to be one of the easier parts of the job.

?

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Au contraire. Think about it. The C has to get set over the ball, grasp it right, look up to see what the D is doing, call line signals (now expanded in SD's Bear Raid), call signals again when the D shifts, look back to find the QB, throw the ball back between his legs to a small target that looks upsidedown to him, then get his throwing hand back in front of himself quickly enough to block a NG who is charging at the first movement of the ball. Some C's have mastered it without having to look back.

Think about having to drive the ball straight down the fairway and then getting ready to defend yourself before your opponent's caddy throws your golf bag at you. Consistently.

Center is the toughest OL position, now going to be even tougher.

Rushinbear;842105219 said:

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Au contraire. Think about it. The C has to get set over the ball, grasp it right, look up to see what the D is doing, call line signals (now expanded in SD's Bear Raid), call signals again when the D shifts, look back to find the QB, throw the ball back between his legs to a small target that looks upsidedown to him, then get his throwing hand back in front of himself quickly enough to block a NG who is charging at the first movement of the ball. Some C's have mastered it without having to look back.

Think about having to drive the ball straight down the fairway and then getting ready to defend yourself before your opponent's caddy throws your golf bag at you. Consistently.

Center is the toughest OL position, now going to be even tougher.

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Okay, I see your point. There is a lot going on in addition to snapping the ball that divides a center's attention.

But we are one of the worst schools in the country at executing this very fundamental task. I watch a lot of college football, and our centers are just plain bad when you compare them to other schools who run shotgun formations. So what gives?

It isn't the lack of intellectual ability to juggle a bunch of things at once -- Brazinski is a really smart guy (admitted to Penn, all Pac-12 academic, etc.).

And it isn't the extra duties Franklin assigns to the center position. Our centers were bad at snapping the ball the last few years under Tedford. Sonny's LT teams didn't seem to have this problem.

So why do our centers "struggle" (to say it politely) with a task that other school's centers execute fairly well.

Patience is the KEY for fans ... coaches are VERY aware of what needs to be done.

Snap for Marshawn's run was high, right ... THAT would have been awful if it had gone a bit farther right and Marshawn had to recover the "fumble" ... oh my ... :p

ah, hell, they'll work on it and get it done ... reps, reps and more reps

SonOfCalVa;842105229 said:

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Patience is the KEY for fans ... coaches are VERY aware of what needs to be done.

Snap for Marshawn's run was high, right ... THAT would have been awful if it had gone a bit farther right and Marshawn had to recover the "fumble" ... oh my ... :p

ah, hell, they'll work on it and get it done ... reps, reps and more reps

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I think this is one area where we don't need to be so patient. The centers need to get this fixed immediately.

Rushinbear;842105219 said:

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Au contraire. Think about it. The C has to get set over the ball, grasp it right, look up to see what the D is doing, call line signals (now expanded in SD's Bear Raid), call signals again when the D shifts, look back to find the QB, throw the ball back between his legs to a small target that looks upsidedown to him, then get his throwing hand back in front of himself quickly enough to block a NG who is charging at the first movement of the ball. Some C's have mastered it without having to look back.

Think about having to drive the ball straight down the fairway and then getting ready to defend yourself before your opponent's caddy throws your golf bag at you. Consistently.

Center is the toughest OL position, now going to be even tougher.

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I think you are using the wrong analogy. People see it as similar to standing over a tap-in putt. Every Saturday and Sunday we watch the centers of other teams get it right. It might be a difficult task, but it seems many others get it done.

The Duke!;842105236 said:

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I think this is one area where we don't need to be so patient. The centers need to get this fixed immediately.

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I might normally say, "Well, they have all summer to practice" but the reason I am going to agree with you is that it disrupts the offense and keeps the other players (QBs, RBs and WRs) from getting quality reps.

Hopefully they practice, practice, practice and have it down when fall camp opens.

buster99;842105237 said:

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I think you are using the wrong analogy. People see it as similar to standing over a tap-in putt. Every Saturday and Sunday we watch the centers of other teams get it right. It might be a difficult task, but it seems many others get it done.

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Well, people can see it as a tap-in all they want. I still like my analogy better (even if only what the mental image conjures up). It's tough to do.

Nonetheless, I see the point. Why do so many other Cs do it well, but our guys have not going back several years (all under JT til now, and, no, I'm not beating a dead horse, just trying to explain it)? Is it recruiting, practice reps, what? It IS a good question.

We struggled with this all last year, and it made a so-so QB look very bad at times. Can someone fill me in on why we can't get this right?

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Schwenke, with no prior experience, did an excellent job and will be recognized in the NFL draft for his performance.

There is no hope for Braz at center - can he play guard? Cochran will be the man, but who can back him up if there is a injury?

The Duke!;842105236 said:

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I think this is one area where we don't need to be so patient. The centers need to get this fixed immediately.

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well ... unless YOU are in a position to "fix it immediately" .. ha ...
patience is all that's available to you
... hope you have a large supply of antacid and "happy happy" pills, if that's not sufficient. :p

:gobears:

They took their motto "No Schnacks" the wrong way

The Duke!;842105227 said:

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Okay, I see your point. There is a lot going on in addition to snapping the ball that divides a center's attention.

But we are one of the worst schools in the country at executing this very fundamental task. I watch a lot of college football, and our centers are just plain bad when you compare them to other schools who run shotgun formations. So what gives?

It isn't the lack of intellectual ability to juggle a bunch of things at once -- Brazinski is a really smart guy (admitted to Penn, all Pac-12 academic, etc.).

And it isn't the extra duties Franklin assigns to the center position. Our centers were bad at snapping the ball the last few years under Tedford. Sonny's LT teams didn't seem to have this problem.

So why do our centers "struggle" (to say it politely) with a task that other school's centers execute fairly well.

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I get the feeling that Braz is actually more focused on academics than football at this point.

SonOfCalVa;842105279 said:

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well ... unless YOU are in a position to "fix it immediately" .. ha ...
patience is all that's available to you
... hope you have a large supply of antacid and "happy happy" pills, if that's not sufficient. :p

:gobears:

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You can say that about pretty much any question on any of these boards, including many of the food ones.

You seem incredibly impatient with people you judge to be impatient. But patience is all that is available to you, as I am pretty sure most Cal fans find the high snaps to be highly problematic at best and inexcusable at worst.

StillNoStanfurdium;842105301 said:

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I get the feeling that Braz is actually more focused on academics than football at this point.

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I'd agree with you if he wasn't also breaking weight lifting records. He just can't seem to put it all together on the field, despite his considerable strength and intelligence. Very disappointing.

The high snaps were worrisome but I think there were similar issues last season to start but were ironed out.

It's going to take a little time to get use to the new snap system where: a) the Center looks straight ahead for the read, b) the QB hand signals he's ready, c) the RG reads the QB signal - tells the Center and d) the Center makes a blind snap

The blind snap seems like a touch play given he's not looking. That will take time to get down.

B.A. Bearacus;842105295 said:

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When did the Bruins get 2 new cheer leaders?

dinan3;842105267 said:

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We struggled with this all last year, and it made a so-so QB look very bad at times. Can someone fill me in on why we can't get this right?

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Schwenke, with no prior experience, did an excellent job and will be recognized in the NFL draft for his performance.

There is no hope for Braz at center - can he play guard? Cochran will be the man, but who can back him up if there is a injury?

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Brazinski will be moved to guard (those snaps are horrid for someone who has been a center for 8 years) and Adcock will be the backup (or starting?) center. Adcock may be the starting guard and backup center. I just can't see Brazinski playing center unless Cochran and Adcock both go down with injuries. But like I said, total guess based on few observations. Aren't internet boards great?

I kinda remember a couple of longsnappers who went onto lengthy careers in the NFL. Their names escape me. I wonder if their coach(es) are available to add to our staff. They seemed to have definitely known what they were doing.

tenplay;842105436 said:

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I kinda remember a couple of longsnappers who went onto lengthy careers in the NFL. Their names escape me. I wonder if their coach(es) are available to add to our staff. They seemed to have definitely known what they were doing.

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Since we've now had a couple of kids who just couldn't get this down (Galas and Brazinski) I think we have to have a quicker 'hook'. If after a year of practicing shotgun snaps (your redshirt year?) you still don't have it down it's time to move to guard or tackle or d-line. The constant errant snaps have such a negative impact on the offense you just don't have time to mess around and hope these guys get it. Even though Schwenke was perfect last year you could tell he was a big improvement over Galas after not much time. Obviously he had some sort of mental/physical makeup that allowed him to make the snap without nearly the practice time Galas had. Cochran seems to be already well ahead of Brazinski in this regard.

David Binn made a pretty nice, long career of long snapping in the NFL. LP Ladoceur (Dallas) is doing fine, as is someone with the Redskins whose name escapes me.

taxbear;842105492 said:

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David Binn made a pretty nice, long career of long snapping in the NFL. LP Ladoceur (Dallas) is doing fine, as is someone with the Redskins whose name escapes me.

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Nick Sundberg

If Braz keeps up these bad snaps he can have a nice career with the Raiders

taxbear;842105492 said:

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David Binn made a pretty nice, long career of long snapping in the NFL. LP Ladoceur (Dallas) is doing fine, as is someone with the Redskins whose name escapes me.

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Parents, teach your boys to be long snappers.

Thanks!

Our centers should be practicing like this all summer.

Rushinbear;842105219 said:

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Some C's have mastered it without having to look back.

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I tend to agree with most of what you said - I think it's harder than it looks.

But I don't think there are any centers at the college level who look back at the QB while snapping the ball. They may take a quick look just before they snap the ball, but they would get absolutely plowed over if they were still looking back at the moment of the actual snap. Maybe that's what you meant though.

This is no excuse but it could still have something to do with it: We haven't had a returning starter at center since 2010.
2010 Chris Guarnero
2011 Dominic Galas/Chris Adcock
2012 Brian Schwenke
2013 Mark Brazinski/Matt Cochran

Now the center position is more important. Are we currently offering any centers for 2014? No
But we have 13 WR offers out.
Yes it is early, but something's wrong with that picture, especially since Cochran will be the only center on the roster after this year, unless you want to include Adcock, who will be gone the year after. We can always convert OGs and continue to flirt with the same problems in the future.

The top rated recruit at center, Connor Mays, has received offers from Colorado, Washington St. and Duke, among others. It seems that he is willing to come west and can attend an academic school. What's stopping us from offering him?

I watched the tape of Saturday's scrimmage last night. I don't recall seeing any really bad snaps, at least not as bad as the past two years. I must admit that I wasn't watching the scrimmage very closely. The snaps were regularly at face level of the QB. Is that bad? Never having played C or QB, I don't know much about it.

tenplay;842105974 said:

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I watched the tape of Saturday's scrimmage last night. I don't recall seeing any really bad snaps, at least not as bad as the past two years. I must admit that I wasn't watching the scrimmage very closely. The snaps were regularly at face level of the QB. Is that bad? Never having played C or QB, I don't know much about it.

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I remember them being mostly from Brazinski but I'd defer to someone who kept stats on this.

Last year, the snapping motion itself was difficult to do consistently right, because the center had two types of snaps to make, one to the QB standing over center, and a completely different one to the QB standing in a shotgun. This varied a lot from play to play, and sometimes even changed right before the start of play, in the case where the QB called an audible to another play.

Also, last year, the bad snaps were usually low, which is the toughest bad snap for a QB to field. Maynard got pretty good at fielding those grounders. Still, the low snap is worse than the high snap, because of the high probability of a fumble with the low snap.

It is not an ideal situation with all the high snaps, but all our QB's seem pretty adept at fielding these high balls. We might get plays that never get started or the play's timing is thrown off, but that is better than fumbles. I think the snapping will improve with practice, and if it doesn't, I'd rather live with high snaps than low ones.

Snapping the football is more complicated than it looks. To do it well requires accuracy and velocity. Shotgun snaps are typically 5 yards, while field goal snaps are 7 yards and punt snaps are 14 yards. After snapping the ball, the center must also execute a blocking assignment. Patrick Mannelley has an entire web site on this topic at longsnapper.com.

Youtube has quite a few links to demonstrations of long snapping, here.

A long snap disaster video is here.

This PDF suggests that high shotgun snaps may be prevented if the center keeps his tail lower.

:cheer:cheer

The Duke!;842105195 said:

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Brazinski was one of the highest rated centers in his HS class (#2, I believe), and he is one of the smartest and strongest guys on the team.

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What makes you say he is one of the smartest guys on the team? He seems to be more of a clown. Does this look like someone who takes football and being the center of a D1 program seriously?