Nasal Mucus Goldenbear;842208373 said:

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Where was the OL better? 5 sacks allowed, making it the highest sack total all year. I counted 5 tackles for loss; there might well have been more (I stopped paying full attention some time in the third quarter). Several of the nice passes/completions by Jerad (and many of the incompletions) came under great pressure with him being hit right after release. The run game (and run blocking) was almost completely absent until Khalfani's big run late against 3rd stringers which easily more than doubled the rushing total. Jared ran more than usual (2nd highest # of carries; just one less than Ervin) because the pocket kept collapsing. OL <<< Jared.

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At LEAST three of the sacks were coverage sacks - which I either am blaming Goff for not throwing it away or "the system" for not having a way of beating a cover 2 (which is what Washington seemed to be running frequently). I don't remember them waving weakly at a speed rusher or failing to pick up stunts. Baby steps folks - you can't expect them to be all pro in a week.

Dykes is a dumb a$$. Wake me up in two years when we can dump him and try to find someone better.

this is what i'm worried about. if sd leaves in 2 years, aren't we just going to go through this qb question all over again?

"open competition"
"who has a better understanding of the new system"

qbs will transfer and we'll just be replaying the same thing over and over again.......

sluggo_Cal;842208334 said:

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This is the first sane thing I have read tonight. After the first quarter, Goff was very good. His intermediate to long throws are NFL quality. I think of the 25 yarder to Treggs from the goal line that arrived half a yard before the safety got there, the perfect 35 yard lofted ball to Treggs (or was it Harper) down the left sideline, and the amazing back shoulder throw of about 25 yards to Treggs. After so many years of crappy quarterbacking, I would be pissed if an amazing quarterback life Goff were benched because Cal fans can't face the reality that the rest of the team is not very good. And you remember those three drops (Treggs, then Powe, then Harris) because they killed three drives. As Gisele said, Goff can't catch his own passes.

The pass blocking looked a lot better. I think Goff started trusting it as the game progressed and that is why he improved. If receivers actually got some separation (not sure if it is their ability or the play calling, but almost every play requires a nearly perfect pass) I think Goff could get up to 70%.

I look forward to watching Goff improving the rest of the season, and maybe, perhaps, you never know, a win over Colorado. Do we still want their coach?

Sluggo

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Goff looked VERY good. The line was technically sound, but massively overmatched. I go to the practices, and Kline is always slower to make the decision. I guess I see what the coaches see.

I also never got on the Tedford bandwagon. Never.

:tedford

Bobodeluxe;842208443 said:

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Goff looked VERY good. The line was technically sound, but massively overmatched. I go to the practices, and Kline is always slower to make the decision. I guess I see what the coaches see.

I also never got on the Tedford bandwagon. Never.

:tedford

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This is the biggest difference between those who want to see kline play vs those who want to keep goff in, that somehow goff had a good game. Price had a good game. Mannion had a good game. Goff had one good drive! Not being intercepted was pure luck as he made plenty f bad decisions. 0 fumbles is a minimum qualification. He knows how to pad stats that don't amount to points.

heartofthebear;842208383 said:

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I'm not trying to defend Dykes anymore because I think the offensive system sucks and puts the defense on the field too much, but I don't get all the stuff coming down of Goff. Yeah he was pretty bad before, but last nigh he didn't commit a TO and ran out of trouble several times. He was sacked too much and his QBR is 32, for some reason, but I doubt Kline would have done any better.

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I think we should be clear that we support Kline and we support Goff. The idiot in this situation is Dykes. His comments about Kline this week were ridiculous. I believe Kline should have gotten a shot this week, but Goff did ok. Not great, but okay.

But how the hell, based on some of the low lows Goff has had, how can you just call the competition over? It really feels like his desire to establish who is boss with the fans is influencing his decision. This is a Mike Nolan maneuver. The guy is already acting like a coach under the gun when his seat is completely cold. Coaches that do this kind of thing lack the confidence to succeed

Bobodeluxe;842208443 said:

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Goff looked VERY good. The line was technically sound, but massively overmatched. I go to the practices, and Kline is always slower to make the decision. I guess I see what the coaches see.

I also never got on the Tedford bandwagon. Never.

:tedford

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You are proud you were never on board with two 10 win seasons in three years? It is one thing to say you got off the bandwagon early when it started to slide, but not being on board with actual success does not give you credibility for your support of 0 for FBS.

Sonny should have been honest with kline in the summer, so he did not waste his freshman year at Cal.

I told everyone, Sonny and Franklin made up their mind the first week of spring ball, because they think Goff will sell more high school tapes than Kline.

I know this sounds like a Kline fanboy v. a Cal fan, but I kind a hope that Kline transfer to another pac 12 school, and crushes Sonny. He seems like the perfect QB for Oregon St, of maybe even SC, depending on who gets the job. Sonny just strikes me as a bad guy, very insecure. This is why you should never hire a HC who never played college football.

Good.

Goff turned in his best performance by far on the road, and a better performance than what he did against OSU at home, all in a hostile environment.

The meltdowns on this board would make some sense if Goff stunk up Husky Stadium, but he didn't.

This is coming from someone who wanted Kline to start last night.

RealDrew2;842208485 said:

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Sonny should have been honest with kline in the summer, so he did not waste his freshman year at Cal.

I told everyone, Sonny and Franklin made up their mind the first week of spring ball, because they think Goff will sell more high school tapes than Kline.

I know this sounds like a Kline fanboy v. a Cal fan, but I kind a hope that Kline transfer to another pac 12 school, and crushes Sonny. He seems like the perfect QB for Oregon St, of maybe even SC, depending on who gets the job. Sonny just strikes me as a bad guy, very insecure. This is why you should never hire a HC who never played college football.

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You're like Chernobyl with a keyboard.

Goff is the better QB for this system. Dykes gave Kline a legit chance, but has made a decision to stick with Goff, and wanted everyone (including Kline) to understand that (to end the debate).

I think that's the right thing to do.

[this sounds eerily the same as the Bigelow controversy last year where the fans think they know more than the coaches]

RealDrew2;842208485 said:

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I know this sounds like a Kline fanboy v. a Cal fan, but I kind a hope that Kline transfer to another pac 12 school, and crushes Sonny. He seems like the perfect QB for Oregon St, of maybe even SC, depending on who gets the job. Sonny just strikes me as a bad guy, very insecure. This is why you should never hire a HC who never played college football.

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Sounds LIKE it? You want us to get crushed. You are a terrible Cal fan.

grandmastapoop;842208517 said:

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Sounds LIKE it? You want us to get crushed. You are a terrible Cal fan.

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Agreed. A true Cal fan would hope that he turns out to be dreadfully wrong in such a case, even if they had to make something as earth shattering as a crow-eating post.

HoopDreams;842208515 said:

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Goff is the better QB for this system. Dykes gave Kline a legit chance, but has made a decision to stick with Goff, and wanted everyone (including Kline) to understand that (to end the debate).

I think that's the right thing to do.

[this sounds eerily the same as the Bigelow controversy last year where the fans think they know more than the coaches]

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I agree. The plan is Goff, with Hinder as back-up next year, and also bringing in the highly-touted Rubenzer to develop next year.

Dykes is making things clear to Kline and I don't see anything wrong with that. And Kline in all likelihood will land in a system better suited to his talents.

Speaking of Dykes never having played football and getting in the business via nepotism, wonder how much the players appreciate his publically calling them out as mentally soft.

Still can't believe he hired a staff with no eye towards recruiting connections.

Hope we only have to put up with this for two years, not three.

BerlinerBaer;842208506 said:

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Good.

Goff turned in his best performance by far on the road, and a better performance than what he did against OSU at home, all in a hostile environment.

The meltdowns on this board would make some sense if Goff stunk up Husky Stadium, but he didn't.

This is coming from someone who wanted Kline to start last night.

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Step 1: don't stink it up during a game
Step 2: rose bowl

"Idiot" is not too strong. It started with Dykes mocking Kline - "he's not Michael Vick" in response to a reporter's question about Kline showing mobility on the field.

How many times have a top high school QB transferred, never to be heard again? Garrett Gilbert was #1 or #2 depending on the service, played in the National Championship Game as a true freshman only to now be at some small school doing nothing. Jake Heaps, handed the job at BYU and now at Kansas. Gunner Kiel was ahead of Kline, where is he? soon we'll be saying where is Kline.

Good-bye, Kline.

ayetee11;842208563 said:

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How many times have a top high school QB transferred, never to be heard again? Garrett Gilbert was #1 or #2 depending on the service, played in the National Championship Game as a true freshman only to now be at some small school doing nothing. Jake Heaps, handed the job at BYU and now at Kansas. Gunner Kiel was ahead of Kline, where is he? soon we'll be saying where is Kline.

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I believe Garrett Gilbert is starting at SMU.

ayetee11;842208563 said:

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How many times have a top high school QB transferred, never to be heard again? Garrett Gilbert was #1 or #2 depending on the service, played in the National Championship Game as a true freshman only to now be at some small school doing nothing. Jake Heaps, handed the job at BYU and now at Kansas. Gunner Kiel was ahead of Kline, where is he? soon we'll be saying where is Kline.

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Cam Newton, Ryan mallet, Russell Wilson

It happens...

tommie317;842208614 said:

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Cam Newton, Ryan mallet, Russell Wilson

It happens...

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And there are others, even some bigger names if one is willing to go back further.

Gosh, if you are 20 years old and have reason to believe that you can play at the D1 level, excel possibly, you just want a chance to start and find-out, and to see how good you might be. It doesn't have to materialize into an NFL career, but at least you will have known that it wasn't meant to be and that you did what you could so there are no regrets, wondering what might have been...

As it stands now, if Zach never sees the field again in any meaningful way, he will walk away with his performance against OSU: 14 points in less than 1 1/2 quarters, 69% passing and a very respectable 135 QBR. All of that off the bench. If me, it would leave me wondering what I can do with a staff behind me, getting the support, starts and game prep to excel...

Weigh that against the love for Cal, the deep appreciation for that degree, forged friendships and family being local, and we start to see what is being pondered.

Here's a link to the post-game press conference video. About half way through it, Dykes makes his remarks concerning the quarterbacks.

Lot of talk about execution and finding the best players... although the way his answer is worded doesn't close the door on Kline in my book.

"We'll see until there's a reason not to."

Sounds like Sonny thinks we're on "the verge" of the offense working.

BufEnuf;842208657 said:

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Here's a link to the post-game press conference video. About half way through it, Dykes makes his remarks concerning the quarterbacks.

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Thanks BugEnuf.

Nothing there surprising. I still generally like SD, which I know is not popular these days. He spoke glowingly of Kline. As some surmised, he's not in the doghouse or anything like that...

On 11/16, you guys are going down! Please?

KoreAmBear;842208384 said:

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Actually the drive where we scored our first TD, the run blocking was solid, and Ervin used the blocking for some good tough yards. That was one of the best non-big play drives of the season.

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In that drive, Ervin rushed twice, once for 6 yds and once for no gain; Khalfani rushed in the first play for 16, followed by a loss of 1.

You might be thinking of the drive in the 3rd quarter (Ervin's best drive) when he rushed twice for 6 yds each, including a 4th down conversion. Unfortunately, that drive resulted in the fumble from the fake FG.

socaltownie;842208408 said:

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At LEAST three of the sacks were coverage sacks - which I either am blaming Goff for not throwing it away or "the system" for not having a way of beating a cover 2 (which is what Washington seemed to be running frequently).

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Perhaps our collective image/timing of a "coverage sack" has been modified by our greatly lowered expectations for the line. Goff does however have to adapt and improve on throwing it away and also first going through his read progressions (at superhuman speeds lol). There was one screen pass in the first half where the receiver was immediately surrounded by 3 defenders but Jerad still slowly ballooned it out there; extremely lucky it was just an incompletion.

The rigidity of the system does bear some responsibility. Tony-Sonny seem to prefer a QB who takes sacks (despite the current limitations of the line) over one who better scrambles out of the collapsing pocket into daylight.

Despite the cover 2, their front 7 was still easily able to pressure Goff in most drives. That says a lot about our OL. Our version of the 12 Days of Christmas: 2 fumbles (1 recovered), 2 turnovers on downs, 5 three-and-outs, 5 sacks allowed, 10 gol-den punts. If Ds continue going w/ that coverage shell, Goff will have to learn to make R. Rodgers his "money" receiver for a lot more completions, put some more mustard on his short-medium passes, and Treggs & the RBs will need to get much stronger and more elusive after the catch off of short patterns.

tommie317;842208614 said:

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Cam Newton, Ryan mallet, Russell Wilson

It happens...

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Ryan Mallet and Russell Wilson were proven before transferring.

ayetee11;842208824 said:

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Ryan Mallet and Russell Wilson were proven before transferring.

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I'm not the guy you were responding too, but whether proven or not, whatever might denote "proven", it was a great move for Wilson. Three years of sub-optimal completion % (55-60), he was otherwise showing signs of being very promising. Hit stats blew-up after transferring to the Badgers offense, while they had regressed noticeably the year before at NCS...

Mallet started like 3 games before he transferred and for the season he threw in total about the number of passes Goff would in 2 1/2 games. His numbers were nothing to write home about. 43% pass completions being just one...

As I understand things, Kline always envisioned being a Cal QB, not just a college QB. The appeal to play elsewhere might not be what it is for others. There are interesting options to ponder that might still entail getting the Cal degree. We shall see...

sluggo_Cal;842208371 said:

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What criticism? Internet message boards? Maybe if his coaches criticized him, but the rest is just background noise. Or at least that is how I would think about it if I were he.

I would also think I am a freshman, I am starting in the pac12, I have already set the Cal single game yardage record, and the NFL will have a big contract waiting for me in a few years. No reason to get down.

Sluggo

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[COLOR="Blue"][SIZE="2"]
Who gives a crap about personal records when the TEAM is getting blown out week after week??? The last time I looked, YARDS and COMPLETIONS don't have a damned thing to do with putting POINTS ON THE SCOREBOARD !!!

Goff may be the prettiest passer in the country, but the GAME is still determined by SCORING !!! 500+ yds passing in a blowout LOSS is little consolation !!! I'll take a QB like Levy or Kapp anyday !!! They put the offense on their backs and inspire them to play better than they've previously been capable !!!

Point is ... Kline may have more of this quality than young Mr. Goff does, but we'll never know, unless he suffers some horrific injury. So, what was the point of inserting Hinder at game's end ?? Avoid further controversy ?? Put young Mr. Kline "in his place" ??

[/SIZE][/COLOR]

Ukrainian;842208970 said:

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[COLOR="Blue"][SIZE="2"]
Who gives a crap about personal records when the TEAM is getting blown out week after week??? The last time I looked, YARDS and COMPLETIONS don't have a damned thing to do with putting POINTS ON THE SCOREBOARD !!!

Goff may be the prettiest passer in the country, but the GAME is still determined by SCORING !!! 500+ yds passing in a blowout LOSS is little consolation !!! I'll take a QB like Levy or Kapp anyday !!! They put the offense on their backs and inspire them to play better than they've previously been capable !!!

Point is ... Kline may have more of this quality than young Mr. Goff does, but we'll never know, unless he suffers some horrific injury. So, what was the point of inserting Hinder at game's end ?? Avoid further controversy ?? Put young Mr. Kline "in his place" ??

[/SIZE][/COLOR]

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Is Hinder graduating early? Thought I heard that somewhere... If so, a chance to get him some minutes was probably a reason...

Much of your sentiment is felt here too.

tommie317;842208614 said:

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Cam Newton, Ryan mallet, Russell Wilson

It happens...

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As well as another old Cal QB - Perry Klein - played at CW Post (nothing all that special) but did so well there he was a 4th round pick, and hung around the NFL for 4-5 years.

Ukrainian;842208970 said:

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[COLOR="Blue"][SIZE="2"]
Who gives a crap about personal records when the TEAM is getting blown out week after week??? The last time I looked, YARDS and COMPLETIONS don't have a damned thing to do with putting POINTS ON THE SCOREBOARD !!!

Goff may be the prettiest passer in the country, but the GAME is still determined by SCORING !!! 500+ yds passing in a blowout LOSS is little consolation !!! I'll take a QB like Levy or Kapp anyday !!! They put the offense on their backs and inspire them to play better than they've previously been capable !!!

Point is ... Kline may have more of this quality than young Mr. Goff does, but we'll never know, unless he suffers some horrific injury. So, what was the point of inserting Hinder at game's end ?? Avoid further controversy ?? Put young Mr. Kline "in his place" ??

[/SIZE][/COLOR]

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Not sure if I understand your post. Might need more colored font and exclamation marks...

RealDrew2;842209568 said:

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As well as another old Cal QB - Perry Klein - played at CW Post (nothing all that special) but did so well there he was a 4th round pick, and hung around the NFL for 4-5 years.

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Totally forgot about Perry. There are other examples of not so famous players too.. Heck, if he got 4-5 years in the NFL, he's set retirement-wise. Good for him.

I understand the sentiment, but Kline was totally OK with Hinder going in. The way the Hinder thing is getting spun is just really off-base. When Hinder went in, it was for a hand full of plays. What would putting Kline in have done? Putting Kline in would have been an insult to Kline because the game was well over. Kline has proven himself good enough to play meaningful minutes when Goff is not doing the job. Goff was playing well so garbage time went to the new garbage time QB now that Kline has graduated, that would be Hinder.