Get ready for 11am West Coast Time Pac-12 Football
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Last: 11 yr ago by BearlyClad
Lol
Sure beats the night games...
Son-of-California;842323163 said:
Sure beats the night games...
WAY better than night games. We got home after 1am from last years Northwestern game. And that's using BART to Fremont, about a 45 minute ride.
Much better for East Coast P12 fans. And more media people will watch P12 sports and give us more attention and recognition.
Cal Geek;842323166 said:
WAY better than night games. We got home after 1am from last years Northwestern game. And that's using BART to Fremont, about a 45 minute ride.
Agree, Agree, Agree and Agree.
This has been apparent since the P12/Oregon announced the Wyoming @ Oregon game with a 11am P12 Network start. Get ready to see some absolutely atrocious crowds at 11am. I sure hope the p12 is smart enough to not simulcast games in this slot.
P12 really f'ed up this off-season when the networks offered a deal to retract the exclusivity window on the mid afternoon starts, but it was declined. Not being able to kickoff between 3-4pm when ABC/Fox carry a game really hurts the p12 and the p12 network. (I believe that's 10 games a year).
Again, this is only for p12 network games and fewer night games will come at the expense of simulcasting early games outside the network blackout window. It does not do anything to limit night games on FS1 and ESPN. So we'll get the very undesirable games at 11am on p12 network. Any guesses on who that will be? It not going to be teams that are on the national stage.
Also, this means people will have to plan around an even longer window on their Saturdays - networks will still have the right to announce conference games 12 or 6 days in advance.
I've also always maintained the complete uncertainty in start times, not the kickoff times, is what will kill attendance long term. Some people hate night games, some hate day games... but I think most will go with the flow. Most believe some variety is nice. But blocking off an entire saturday repeatedly just makes it hard on season ticket holders. It makes single game ticket sales that much harder too - people who want to go will make other plans and only go to a game if it fits.
I wish they could come up with a better system to announce game times. Maybe a NFL-like model with set game times for sept and oct with the ability to flex games in november (when they are known to be of national consequence). Or announce game times in advance, but not networks. Then let ESPN/FS1 take the better game if it's their week, and the network with lower priority just does another game in that slot. Or at least announce early that a game will kick between, say, 11-2pm or 5-8pm. And let the networks fill in the exact time later.
P12 really f'ed up this off-season when the networks offered a deal to retract the exclusivity window on the mid afternoon starts, but it was declined. Not being able to kickoff between 3-4pm when ABC/Fox carry a game really hurts the p12 and the p12 network. (I believe that's 10 games a year).
Again, this is only for p12 network games and fewer night games will come at the expense of simulcasting early games outside the network blackout window. It does not do anything to limit night games on FS1 and ESPN. So we'll get the very undesirable games at 11am on p12 network. Any guesses on who that will be? It not going to be teams that are on the national stage.
Also, this means people will have to plan around an even longer window on their Saturdays - networks will still have the right to announce conference games 12 or 6 days in advance.
I've also always maintained the complete uncertainty in start times, not the kickoff times, is what will kill attendance long term. Some people hate night games, some hate day games... but I think most will go with the flow. Most believe some variety is nice. But blocking off an entire saturday repeatedly just makes it hard on season ticket holders. It makes single game ticket sales that much harder too - people who want to go will make other plans and only go to a game if it fits.
I wish they could come up with a better system to announce game times. Maybe a NFL-like model with set game times for sept and oct with the ability to flex games in november (when they are known to be of national consequence). Or announce game times in advance, but not networks. Then let ESPN/FS1 take the better game if it's their week, and the network with lower priority just does another game in that slot. Or at least announce early that a game will kick between, say, 11-2pm or 5-8pm. And let the networks fill in the exact time later.
Cal Geek;842323166 said:
WAY better than night games. We got home after 1am from last years Northwestern game. And that's using BART to Fremont, about a 45 minute ride.
yeah that was miserable, especially after a loss.
beeasyed;842323179 said:
yeah that was miserable, especially after a loss.
Yet it was probably the pinnacle of our season. *sigh*
While I have no doubt that 11am works better than 7pm for many posters here (myself included) at their current life stage or time zone, I'm guessing that students, if forced to pick, would have preferred 7pm. Insert boilerplate "students are our future potential donors" material here. I imagine those with kids that play sports Saturday mornings (soon to be me I think) may struggle with the 11am time as well.
Of course neither time is ideal, and most (including students) would probably prefer start times between 1pm and 5pm. And all of our preferences are moot anyway before the altar of the TV gods.
But I'm worried that students are being phased out of college football, which would be an incredibly short-sighted path to take, golden goose and all. When I was a student, we had more normal game times most of the time, fewer commercials and lame promotions, no over the top alcohol enforcement, not to mention seasons when we occasionally beat FBS opponents and didn't have 11 losses. Hopefully that last shortfall is temporary.
Sure some students today are too busy with social media or whatever else to really care about Cal football, and Cal has always had plenty of good students that barely know football exists. But the real issue is that the product itself has been gradually degraded and doesn't build loyalty among new customers. 11am starts, while inevitable I guess, seem like another straw on that Carmel's back.
Of course neither time is ideal, and most (including students) would probably prefer start times between 1pm and 5pm. And all of our preferences are moot anyway before the altar of the TV gods.
But I'm worried that students are being phased out of college football, which would be an incredibly short-sighted path to take, golden goose and all. When I was a student, we had more normal game times most of the time, fewer commercials and lame promotions, no over the top alcohol enforcement, not to mention seasons when we occasionally beat FBS opponents and didn't have 11 losses. Hopefully that last shortfall is temporary.
Sure some students today are too busy with social media or whatever else to really care about Cal football, and Cal has always had plenty of good students that barely know football exists. But the real issue is that the product itself has been gradually degraded and doesn't build loyalty among new customers. 11am starts, while inevitable I guess, seem like another straw on that Carmel's back.
Once we start winning and games are actually entertaining, night games will seem cool. Right now the late return time coupled with bad team and miserable atmosphere is really not worth it.
I know people point to the UCLA game in 12' as some standard for how fun night games are but the truth is that night is an outlier and they mostly suck now.
I know people point to the UCLA game in 12' as some standard for how fun night games are but the truth is that night is an outlier and they mostly suck now.
socaliganbear;842323185 said:
Once we start winning and games are actually entertaining, night games will seem cool. Right now the late return time coupled with bad team and miserable atmosphere is really not worth it.
I know people point to the UCLA game in 12' as some standard for how fun night games are but the truth is that night is an outlier and they mostly suck now.
Seemed like everyone liked those 5pm starts (when we first busted out the gold top unis for the Oregon game in 2006 I believe).
KoreAmBear;842323187 said:
Seemed like everyone liked those 5pm starts (when we first busted out the gold top unis for the Oregon game in 2006 I believe).
I liked the winning--and whatever went with it, including Oregon style uniforms.
KoreAmBear;842323187 said:
Seemed like everyone liked those 5pm starts (when we first busted out the gold top unis for the Oregon game in 2006 I believe).
5pm is very different from 7:30pm. I'd guess 95% of our fans are completely cool with 5pm. But under the current TV contract, the 4-5pm kickoff is reserved for ONE exclusive network broadcast in most weeks. The big networks want to optimize their programming and they have tons of SEC, Big Ten, and Big 12 inventory at 5pm. They do not have any inventory at 7:30pm.... the addition of FS1 really amped up the demand for the 730 games, and I don't think anyone anticipated that when writing the contract. It was pretty silly to have 3 7pm or later games last year on weeks with 5 total p12 games. But neither FS1 or ESPN are going to give that up w/o getting a significant amount of money.
In the past when we were on the as the ABC 5pm game, we were of national interest... multiple games vs Oregon, Tenn, UCLA, USC, etc. So of course they were fun - we were good and they meant something. But under the current TV contract they likey would have been played at 7:30!
I really liked the 330-4pm starts at AT&T. That was back under the old TV contract when Cal could set its own start time if on regional TV (ie games Cal contracted with a regional partner, often for no pay, just exposure... remember the steroid PSA as 'ads'?) It was also the ONLY year under the old TV contract where Cal had access to free lights (had to pay for lights at CMS and they were not cheap). So essentially, I'm saying 2011 was the ONLY year Cal could choose start times based on getting the most fan friendly kickoff. When there were no free lights at CMS, the start times were more limited, which is why noon is seen as 'traditional'. But with lights (and of course the freedom to choose), we chose late afternoon. That is great for tailgating (or in SF going to a bar), great for families that have activities in the morning, and great for students that don't like to get up early. But again, those times are now contractually not an option, which is really too bad. According to Wilner, during this last offseason, the networks offered to allow them for some other NON MONETARY concessions. P12 chose to keep the current arrangement, but favor the early simulcast starts on P12 network. But I'd even say long term, it would be worth real money to stop jerking fans around.
If Cal starts winning, kickoff times will seem a heck-of-a lot less important.
KoreAmBear;842323187 said:
Seemed like everyone liked those 5pm starts (when we first busted out the gold top unis for the Oregon game in 2006 I believe).
Yeah.... those are not what I would call "night games" in 2014. Getting home at 1:30am (in the bay no less) . . . now THAT'S a night game.
Anyhow, that's pretty much my point, "night games" like that 06 game and the UCLA 2012 game are fun, sure. But for starters, we won both of those games (anyone think we'll beat either UCLA or Oregon this season?) AND they really weren't that late to begin with...
Another reason for students not to show up.
So much for tailgating before games.
ColoradoBear1;842323176 said:
This has been apparent since the P12/Oregon announced the Wyoming @ Oregon game with a 11am P12 Network start. Get ready to see some absolutely atrocious crowds at 11am. I sure hope the p12 is smart enough to not simulcast games in this slot.
P12 really f'ed up this off-season when the networks offered a deal to retract the exclusivity window on the mid afternoon starts, but it was declined. Not being able to kickoff between 3-4pm when ABC/Fox carry a game really hurts the p12 and the p12 network. (I believe that's 10 games a year).
Again, this is only for p12 network games and fewer night games will come at the expense of simulcasting early games outside the network blackout window. It does not do anything to limit night games on FS1 and ESPN. So we'll get the very undesirable games at 11am on p12 network. Any guesses on who that will be? It not going to be teams that are on the national stage.
Also, this means people will have to plan around an even longer window on their Saturdays - networks will still have the right to announce conference games 12 or 6 days in advance.
I've also always maintained the complete uncertainty in start times, not the kickoff times, is what will kill attendance long term. Some people hate night games, some hate day games... but I think most will go with the flow. Most believe some variety is nice. But blocking off an entire saturday repeatedly just makes it hard on season ticket holders. It makes single game ticket sales that much harder too - people who want to go will make other plans and only go to a game if it fits.
I wish they could come up with a better system to announce game times. Maybe a NFL-like model with set game times for sept and oct with the ability to flex games in november (when they are known to be of national consequence). Or announce game times in advance, but not networks. Then let ESPN/FS1 take the better game if it's their week, and the network with lower priority just does another game in that slot. Or at least announce early that a game will kick between, say, 11-2pm or 5-8pm. And let the networks fill in the exact time later.
It depends on how the team does. If we're winning, the times don't matter, fans we'll come. If we're not winning, an 11 a.m. game is far preferable in terms of the game-day experience than 7 or 8 p.m.
philbert;842323204 said:
So much for tailgating before games.
Not necessarily. Introducing the "Tailgate Brunch".
GivemTheAxe;842323207 said:
Not necessarily. Introducing the "Tailgate Brunch".
Doing it.
All those late night games for us East Coast Bears kinda sucked last year.
Son-of-California;842323163 said:
Sure beats the night games...
Amen! I'll take 11:00am games anytime over 7:00pm games.
Jeff82;842323205 said:
It depends on how the team does. If we're winning, the times don't matter, fans we'll come. If we're not winning, an 11 a.m. game is far preferable in terms of the game-day experience than 7 or 8 p.m.
My point was more that games between 3pm and 6pm are far better than either 11am or 8pm. Our TV contract doesn't allow that, but then networks were offering a deal.
Cal isn't going to be picked for many national network games this year, so I'm guessing we'll get fairly well acquainted with 11am. Though if we aren't winning, it will be hard to separate the effects of 11am versus just not being good.
Also, there's nothing to stop ESPN and FS1 from moving more games to night as the P12 network moves to the day. The networks put 16 games at night last year. P12 network put 17. The season is 14 weeks long. The WAC is dead. MWC has limited interest. I'm sure that FS1/ESPN would love it if they could each put a game on at 7:30pm every week of the season (ie 28).
I also wonder if the P12 will give schools themselves the option to schedule 11am or 8pm when not national?
philbert;842323204 said:
So much for tailgating before games.
Why not tailgate after the game? It can be a celebration if we win, or a drown-your-sorrows if we don't.
:bravo
auberge;842323242 said:
Why not tailgate after the game? It can be a celebration if we win, or a drown-your-sorrows if we don't.
Using last year as a guide, I don't recall a single game where my group felt like tailgating after a game (and that includes the win over Portland).
Also, the noon game tailgates were never as lively as the ones for later games, so bumping everything up by an hour won't improve the atmosphere.
socaliganbear;842323185 said:
Once we start winning and games are actually entertaining, night games will seem cool. Right now the late return time coupled with bad team and miserable atmosphere is really not worth it.
I know people point to the UCLA game in 12' as some standard for how fun night games are but the truth is that night is an outlier and they mostly suck now.
Not disparaging your post, Socaliganbear, but rather just lamenting the fact that after spending half a billion $ on a stadium, we have die-hard fans referring to our live game experience as a "miserable atmosphere." Even with a bad team, you'd think the renovated Memorial Stadium experience would have enough redeeming quality to make it a good time. Kind of like Pac Bell Park - a fun experience regardless of how the Giants are playing.
Sigh.
11 am? 8 pm? The TBA game times make planning game days more expensive and hard to fit into my weekend. For Bears who live within an hour, it may not matter, or it wouldn't to me. But I am a lot farther away. If this were 2004 with this sort of scheduing, I'd still miss at least two home games. The new stadium? I always looked at the entire project being something to assist the coaches in recruiting a better team. As a fan, I never much cared about improving the stadium itself. If I can see the Golden Gate from the stadium, that meets my needs.
BearBones;842323200 said:
If Cal starts winning, kickoff times will seem a heck-of-a lot less important.
And Cal will be featured in time slots much more attractive to the average fan. Even the BI fan.
Bring back more of the traditional 1 pm games....please...
Cal Geek;842323343 said:
Bring back more of the traditional 1 pm games....please...
In a perfect world for me, all our game would start at 4pm PST.
NYCGOBEARS;842323344 said:
In a perfect world for me, all our game would start at 4pm PST.
+1. 4 pm starts allow for things to get done earlier for families with younger kids, and games end early enough for dining out.
get WINS!!!
go bears!
go bears!
11 a.m. Is a terrible start time for us in Southern California. Coming from LA means catching an 8 a.m. plane which will arrive at 9:15. By the time you get a rental car and drive to CMS its 10:30. That's assuming the plane leaves when scheduled and cutting it close. Then finally getting to your seat by kickoff...maybe
It probably means we have to fly up the night before and get a hotel room. A nice additional and unnecessary expense. Since SW doesn't have many flights late, it cuts into your workday to say nothing of Friday night traffic to the airport.
All in all, 11 a.m. starts really kill it for fans down south.
It probably means we have to fly up the night before and get a hotel room. A nice additional and unnecessary expense. Since SW doesn't have many flights late, it cuts into your workday to say nothing of Friday night traffic to the airport.
All in all, 11 a.m. starts really kill it for fans down south.
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