New post here:
http://calfootballstrategy.blogspot.com/2014/09/defending-trips-with-cover-4-treggs-ot.html
This one looks at Cover-4 variants against trips, and the way we used one of our common passing concepts to beat one of them for a big score.

Very nice man

Excellent. I grokked it on my first cup of coffee.

berk18;842368958 said:

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New post here:
http://calfootballstrategy.blogspot.com/2014/09/defending-trips-with-cover-4-treggs-ot.html
This one looks at Cover-4 variants against trips, and the way we used one of our common passing concepts to beat one of them for a big score.

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Love it. Thank you. So, was this the first time in the game for the adjustment by the Bear offense. Did they pull this off for the first time in OT?

Excellent!
Really enjoy this class. What do I have to do to get credit for it?

Having a deep WR corps really helps us spread the Ds there, all four receivers lining up are threats that have to be taken seriously.

thx berk 18 for your time and breakdown

berk18;842368958 said:

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New post here:
http://calfootballstrategy.blogspot.com/2014/09/defending-trips-with-cover-4-treggs-ot.html
This one looks at Cover-4 variants against trips, and the way we used one of our common passing concepts to beat one of them for a big score.

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Tony Franklin "McGuyver".
Yeah but too bad the TFS won't work at the D1 level. ;-)

Wow.

Nice write-up, berk.

What do you make of our defense against WSU. We played lots of man-to-man the last two weeks. Do you think we'll see more zone now that we won't have a running game to worry about, particularly a running QB?

BerlinerBaer;842369158 said:

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Nice write-up, berk.

What do you make of our defense against WSU. We played lots of man-to-man the last two weeks. Do you think we'll see more zone now that we won't have a running game to worry about, particularly a running QB?

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I don't even want to think about our defense vs. WSU. We either need to score 60 or win the turnover battle by a few. That's all assuming WSU's QB is adequate, but if that's not the case this could look more like the Northwestern game.

We do run some straight man coverages (Cover-0 and Cover-1), but it's almost exclusively short yardage and goal line stuff. When we use man-elements otherwise, it's only the CB's playing press on the outside WR's, but it's still Cover-4 structurally. So basically, the CB's play press-man on any route that's outside or vertical, but if the WR took an immediate inside release, they'd let him go and zone it.

The big problem is that pressing is by far the best way to get tight coverage on slants and hitches, but our CB's have been unable to hang playing press. If we play off, we're probably conceding the slants and hitches but helping them out against the fade. If we play press, we'll be close but not quite there on fades, slants, and hitches. We just don't have the combination of size, strength, and technique that we need at CB to do what we want to do schematically.

berk18;842369353 said:

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I don't even want to think about our defense vs. WSU. We either need to score 60 or win the turnover battle by a few. That's all assuming WSU's QB is adequate, but if that's not the case this could look more like the Northwestern game.

We do run some straight man coverages (Cover-0 and Cover-1), but it's almost exclusively short yardage and goal line stuff. When we use man-elements otherwise, it's only the CB's playing press on the outside WR's, but it's still Cover-4 structurally. So basically, the CB's play press-man on any route that's outside or vertical, but if the WR took an immediate inside release, they'd let him go and zone it.

The big problem is that pressing is by far the best way to get tight coverage on slants and hitches, but our CB's have been unable to hang playing press. If we play off, we're probably conceding the slants and hitches but helping them out against the fade. If we play press, we'll be close but not quite there on fades, slants, and hitches. We just don't have the combination of size, strength, and technique that we need at CB to do what we want to do schematically.

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It's very clear that at the corner position (one in particular) that we just don't have the size/speed/technique to get it done in press man coverage. We keep biting on the double move, and when they just do a straight go route they are still able to beat us by going over the top to the sideline where the safety can almost never make it unless the ball is floated. More times than not they are making that play and we aren't winning the one-on-one balls. As you've noted before, with WSU's spread there's no real way we can get out of anything other than cover 4. I wonder if we might play our corners 5-7 off and see if we can't get in better position on the deep ball and concede more of the short stuff, but then they will just dink us to death. Really hoping we can get some turnovers to swing momentum and get a few extra possessions. If we keep scoring and putting them under pressure I'm hoping that good things will happen.

Bottom line is, even when well covered, when the receiver is 6'3"+ going against a smaller corner it's just too easy (I'm looking at you Cayleb Jones). It's like we are going against megatron every week and doing so with a defensive line that can't get consistent pressure on the QB without blitzing. It's just a nightmare for the defensive secondary.

trigga is clinical

jones is a push off artist hands down .. runs well catches well but pushes off with no calls even better

Vandalus;842369391 said:

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It's very clear that at the corner position (one in particular) that we just don't have the size/speed/technique to get it done in press man coverage. We keep biting on the double move, and when they just do a straight go route they are still able to beat us by going over the top to the sideline where the safety can almost never make it unless the ball is floated. More times than not they are making that play and we aren't winning the one-on-one balls. As you've noted before, with WSU's spread there's no real way we can get out of anything other than cover 4. I wonder if we might play our corners 5-7 off and see if we can't get in better position on the deep ball and concede more of the short stuff, but then they will just dink us to death. Really hoping we can get some turnovers to swing momentum and get a few extra possessions. If we keep scoring and putting them under pressure I'm hoping that good things will happen.

Bottom line is, even when well covered, when the receiver is 6'3"+ going against a smaller corner it's just too easy (I'm looking at you Cayleb Jones). It's like we are going against megatron every week and doing so with a defensive line that can't get consistent pressure on the QB without blitzing. It's just a nightmare for the defensive secondary.

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At this point after the CU game I'd like to see what we could do with more of a 2-read style coverage. Have both the CB and S read #2, with the CB playing outside leverage on #1. If #2 goes deep, the CB will man up on #1 on anything deep or outside while the S takes #2. If #2 doesn't go deep, the safety immediately gets width and depth over #1 and the CB becomes a normal Cover-2 flat defender, funneling #1 inside, sinking under the deep stuff and rallying to the short stuff only once the QB commits his shoulders. This won't solve the slant problem, but it will help with some of the other quick game stuff we saw against Sac St. and CU. The other thing I'd love to see is some well-placed Cover-3 rotations, kind of like Northwestern did last season: http://calfootballstrategy.blogspot.com/2014/08/defending-bear-raid-with-cover-3.html

I don't know if I've seen us play Cover-3 all season, though, but it'd be nice if we could cause some confusion with late rotations to at least take the QB away from the slant.

89Bear;842369007 said:

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Love it. Thank you. So, was this the first time in the game for the adjustment by the Bear offense. Did they pull this off for the first time in OT?

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Sorry it's taken me a while to get back to this, but this really is the key question in determining how smart TF's play call was. I'm watching the game play-by-play now, and CU is starting to go to this adjustment starting about 2/3's of the way through 2nd quarter. At 5:12 in the 2nd they're in exactly the coverage I discussed against the same trips formation, but they haven't been running it consistently. I'll keep an eye out in the 3rd and 4th to see if it picks up.

So is this what Tony Franklin thinks about when makes that walk up to the stadium each day?

Is it heretical to think that Treggs might be an even better cornerback than WR? Just think, if he could be a lockdown corner (in the manner of Deltha) what that would mean to our defense and how many more games would suddenly become very winnable.

His tackling would be suspect. I've seen him fly a few feet bc someone bumped into him

jy1988;842370749 said:

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Is it heretical to think that Treggs might be an even better cornerback than WR? Just think, if he could be a lockdown corner (in the manner of Deltha) what that would mean to our defense and how many more games would suddenly become very winnable.

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not worth any more discussion ... Treggs is a WR

jy1988;842370749 said:

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Is it heretical to think that Treggs might be an even better cornerback than WR? Just think, if he could be a lockdown corner (in the manner of Deltha) what that would mean to our defense and how many more games would suddenly become very winnable.

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mr. treggs would have an aneurysm. would never happen LOL.