Two more cents: there's a lot written about the long tradition of violence in Canadian/North American hockey. It's a long time societal issue, sort of on the scale of soccer hooliganism but different. One thing is the fights are engineered, or were. Designated goons/brawlers (big guys who can't play that well but can fight), CTE for those guys, etc. Behind all that politeness is weirdness like any other place.

beelzebear;842618521 said:

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Two more cents: there's a lot written about the long tradition of violence in Canadian/North American hockey. It's a long time societal issue, sort of on the scale of soccer hooliganism but different. One thing is the fights are engineered, or were. Designated goons/brawlers (big guys who can't play that well but can fight), CTE for those guys, etc. Behind all that politeness is weirdness like any other place.

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http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0075918/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_77

bearister;842618527 said:

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http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0075918/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_77

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The wikipedia entry on LINK: Fighting in Ice Hockey is actually a decent summary, how it's long been institutionalized and part of the game.

CAL6371;842618496 said:

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Cal82-85 - Thanks for the info - I agree, there must be a line and the hockey prosecutions listed in this thread show that it is appropriate to use the criminal justice system at times. It will be interesting to follow this matter. Did your friend think it should be prosecuted?

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Since he had limited facts beyond seeing the video, he didn't have a firm opinion about whether it should be prosecuted. From just seeing the video, he felt like it was enough in the gray area where if the school/sports suspension was a strong enough punishment, the DA's resources shouldn't be wasted. He didn't think he had enough facts to form an opinion about whether the school/sports suspension was sufficient.

Good summary 8285. One game suspension, one day of school, and eighteen days from team seems a bit late. My son is in that school district and he has served much longer suspensions for lesser incidents. Maybe if they stepped up the penalties then the criminal case filing would have been avoided.

I wonder if I can sue my teammate who broke my nose in practice I think to be funny, the year after I had to have nose surgery and had to sit out for the rest of the year....

Cal8285;842618493 said:

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I haven't seen the video, but I know a prosecutor (who doesn't work in Contra Costa County) who has. Says if it happened any place other than in a competitive athletic event, it would be a no-brainer. A guy intentionally kicks or knees someone in the face, breaks his nose, a pretty slam dunk case. The email said "the opposing player's nose was inadvertently broken." The guy who saw the video said, "The accused may not have intended to break his nose, but if you intentionally hit a guy hard in the face, it doesn't really matter if you intended to break his nose. It is assault and battery. The email is misleading, it doesn't acknowledge the intent of the act and the vicious nature of the act."

There is a cultural notion that, even if it is away from the play and a violent act not allowed by the rules of the sport, anything happening on the athletic field should be taken care of by the sport, not law enforcement. Juan Marichal clubs John Roseboro over the head with a baseball bat? Hey, it was in a baseball game, so let his ejection and MLB's suspension take care of it, no need for criminal prosecution, even though clearly, it was a criminal act.

Playing football, hockey, baseball, water polo, shouldn't be a license to commit assault that isn't part of the game with zero law enforcement consequences. It shouldn't subject one to being a victim of assault and battery. It isn't necessarily an easy line to draw. A typical late hit to the QB isn't assault. A hit to the QB five seconds after the pass is gone, when the play is over and the QB made no effort to be involved in the play after he threw the pass? Assault and battery. Intentionally throwing an an opposing batter's head? Hard question. Juan Marichal taking a bat to Roseboro's head? Assault and battery.

Whether a case is worthy of prosecution given the consequences given by the sport's governing body is another matter, especially given the cultural notions that could contribute to an acquittal. At some point, however, we can't just let the sport governing body handle criminal behavior, but where that point is really hard to say. There are, however, cases that clearly cross the line.

The review of the video was enough to cause the player to be suspended for a game, suspended from school for a day, and suspended from the team for 18 days. Those consequences don't get handed out for an inadvertent act in transition to defense like the email suggests. I don't know what happened, I don't know if the line was crossed that should lead to criminal prosecution, but even in sports, there has to be a line.

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I too haven't seen the video, but I have played and watched my share of water polo. On virtually every turnover, there is pushing off, kicking, puling, yanking, and yes, sometimes hitting. I've seen noses broken and heads split open on clean plays (i.e., a backhand shot attempt). Watch any Cal game and look at the two meters - you'll see this and more.

I think a kick intended for the the chest could easily hit someone in face - unintentionally. In this case, I have no idea what happened - but the fact that a kid was kicked in the face does not necessarily show intent. It strikes me that the prosecutors will have a hard time proving intent (or reckless disregard) which is an element of the crime.

Anyone who thinks this is a felony is a raging p*ssy. Sorry not sorry.

To borrow a phrase from down under: harden the f*ck up.

Thank you for posting that.

BeggarEd;842618657 said:

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Anyone who thinks this is a felony is a raging p*ssy. Sorry not sorry.

To borrow a phrase from down under: harden the f*ck up.

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Truth.

My old fraternity brother, Russ Stryker. What a small world. Guarantee he wouldn't press charges over a knee in the face. Retribution, sure. Charges, no.

BancroftBear93;842618685 said:

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My old fraternity brother, Russ Stryker. What a small world. Guarantee he wouldn't press charges over a knee in the face. Retribution, sure. Charges, no.

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Another one of those rare names that constitutes a complete sentence.