ducky23;842771303 said:
Show me where I said cal would absolutely win 10 games with kiffen. I said kiffen is the only one who conceivably could.
It's very simple. Kiffen is the only candidate who could possibly help deliver Najee. You get Najee, any thing is possible.
grandmastapoop;842771310 said:
Can he play 3 positions on defense at the same time?
ducky23;842771349 said:
Hey any things possible
But really, you get Najee the defense becomes better immediately since we could potentially have a dominant running game.
grandmastapoop;842771459 said:
I don't think it's that simple. However, upon sleeping on this, Kiffin/Tosh or Wilcox/Tosh sure would be exciting, and Cal football has turned stale. I just want to be entertained, damnit!
ducky23;842771349 said:
Hey any things possible
But really, you get Najee the defense becomes better immediately since we could potentially have a dominant running game.
grandmastapoop;842771459 said:
I don't think it's that simple. However, upon sleeping on this, Kiffin/Tosh or Wilcox/Tosh sure would be exciting, and Cal football has turned stale. I just want to be entertained, damnit!
ducky23;842771039 said:
This is in response to both you and Oaktownbear. I hear what you're saying. but you have to concede, that Kiffin wasn't just in a bad situation, he was in historically bad situations. The Raiders job was easily the worst in the NFL at the time, I don't think that's even debateable. The Raiders at that time make the niners today look like the niners of the 80's.
I'd argue he did fine with Tennessee. He took a 5-7 team to a 7-5 team with two top recruiting classes. If Kiffen took us to 7-5 next year with two top recruiting classes, people here would be doing hand flips.
And for some reason, people are ignoring the fact that SC was under sanctions at the time (and he still won 10 games). Not just minor sanctions, some of the heaviest sanctions ever meted out by the NCAA. So c'mon, lets not compare his Raiders/SC situation to Dykes
----
I'll end with this. Kiffen is obviously a risk. But he has (in my opinion) the highest upside. You bring in Kiffen, you almost assuredly get Tosh. You get Tosh/Kiffen/hometown factor, you've got more than a decent shot at Najee (I've been hearing that Najee has tentatively scheduled an official visit at Cal - which would be his last visit- you telling me tosh/kiffen aren't going to close the kid).
So you get Najee and hopefully Hansen stays (plus you still have Drob). You arguably have the best RB and WR in the entire country. You get some healthy bodies back on defense, maybe add some Tosh recruits who can play immediately, and you have a 10 win team in YEAR 1. You going to tell me any other coach on anyone else's list has a better chance of getting a 10 win season in year 1. no sorry.
With Oregon and UCLA down and SC kinda down, Cal with Kiffen/Tosh could start recruiting like we used to.
Again, there's a ton of downside, and you don't hire a coach just cause you think he can deliver one player (although he's a once in a lifetime player). But you at least interview the dude because of his upside.
ducky23;842771349 said:
Hey any things possible
But really, you get Najee the defense becomes better immediately since we could potentially have a dominant running game.
jamonit;842771504 said:
Our running game was good. Muhammad 827 yards 5.4 yards a carry, Watson 709 yards 5.0 yards a carry, Enwere 336 yards 5.5 yards a carry, Laird 59 yards 7.4 yards per carry, McCrary 39 yards 6.5 yards per carry. That is all our RB carries. Collectively they ran 370 times for 1970 yards and 9 TDs for a 5.32 average. How much more yards do you think Najee could average per carry?
ducky23;842771349 said:
Hey any things possible
But really, you get Najee the defense becomes better immediately since we could potentially have a dominant running game.
TheSouseFamily;842770891 said:
ducky23;842770883 said:
Ok, so why do fans of the Raiders, Vols and Trojans hate Kiffen so much? I am obviously not intimate with any of these programs, so I just have a very outsiders view, so I would be very interested to get an insider's perspective on what exactly what went wrong and why Kiffen is so horrible.
Raiders: I have no idea what happened here. To me, it looks like he just wasn't ready (at the age of 31?) for an NFL job (I mean who would be at that age and with that little experience). And then Al threw him under the bus. If its a fight between Al Davis v. Anyone, I'll tend to side with Anyone.
Tennessee: Started slow, but had some really good wins over top teams. Bought in a top recruiting class. Then bolted for SC just as Vol fans were warming up to him. Yes, he could've handled things better, but this also seems like something where Vol fans just overreacted because they are Vols fans and football is everything. I mean, how is this that different from Mooch? Were Cal fans burning **** in the streets when he left? He also had some minor recruiting violations here (which led to very minor penalties), but was found to have no major violations (this is a slight worry for me, but you gotta think he learned from his mistakes here)
SC: Had one 10-2 season and a couple really mediocre seasons (especially for SC standards), but this was during the probation era. So in my view, maybe a different coach could have done better with such heavy sanctions, but I still think Kiffen was unfairly made out to be the scapegoat for Petey's transgressions.
Again, I'm just looking at this from the outside, so someone please correct me. But, he's not the first one to get into a fight with Al Davis. And with the Vols and SC, those are just crazy fanbases that have impossible expectations. Especially the Vols fans who think they are football royalty, so they have a hissy fit when a coach leaves after 1 year cause Kiffen owes it to them for some reason to spend at least 3-4 years with them (even though he's offered his dream job)
Look, Kiffen said some stupid stuff along the way. Those minor recruiting violations weren't great either. But I have to believe he's learned from some of his mistakes now that he's older. But at every stop, he's been able to recruit. And he's had some successful seasons in some very bad circumstances.
I just don't see why some people make him out to be the devil.
Dark Reverie;842771807 said:
Allow me to speak on this from a Tennessee perspective.
When he was first hired exactly eight years ago today, he promised that Tennessee would get back to winning championships left and right. He promised that we would beat our rivals consistently as long as he was there. He promised that the Volunteers would "sing 'Rocky Top' all night long after beating Florida," who along with Alabama was the scourge of the SEC at the time. He frequently made a fool out of himself by taking verbal cheapshots at our rivals. It turns out he was all bark and no bite, as the Volunteers only went 7-6, ending the season by getting blown out by Virginia Tech in the Chick-Fil-A Bowl.
He did recruit well, but he kept recruiting players with noticeable character flaws. The night he bolted for Southern California started a chain reaction that led to several highly-rated recruits jumping ship and leaving Tennessee in dire straits just 17 days before National Signing Day. If Tennessee had not hired Derek Dooley just three days after Kiffin left, we probably would have lost most of the non-early enrollees.
Oh, and speaking of that, defensive line coach and recruiting coordinator Ed Orgeron, who was just hired as the new full-time head coach at LSU, decided to go with him. He reportedly called the eight early enrollees and told them not to go to class, thinking that if they did not go to class, they could also jump ship and follow them to USC.
After all of the promises, all of the smack talk, all of the bravado, there were lukewarm results. Many people believed that he was going to be there for the long haul. That's the impression he gave many people within the Tennessee family and outside it, as well. And after one season, he was gone. Many people felt betrayed, lied to, and used.
Tennessee is a proud program. Everyone who has been associated with the Orange and White has an immense sense of pride in their school and their football program. I'm sure it is that way everywhere, especially at California. But understand that football is like a religion in Knoxville, across the state, and across the South. It's more or less a way of life. At times, Neyland Stadium can hold well over 100,000 for every home game. That shows you just how invested people are and have always been in Tennessee. They are among the ten winningest college football programs in history. We don't like to see our program as a stepping stone, but as a destination job.
I'lTo many, Lane Kiffin didn't see it as a destination job. It was a transition from his failed venture with the Raiders to his dream job at Southern California. Personally, I have no problem with him going after his dream job. For me, the timing of the move and the manner in which he left, an abrupt announcement and a 60-second, cursorily arranged press conference where he made said announcement and left without taking questions or explaining his decision rubbed me and others the wrong way. For many, though, it was a slap in the face. It was a stab in the back. And they weren't going to stand for it.
Another thing that is important to consider is that prior to Kiffin's brief tenure at Tennessee, the Volunteers had had only two head coaches in 32 years: Johnny Majors (1976-1992) and Philip Fulmer (1992-2008). We had been a model of coaching continuity during that time. From 2008-2010, Tennessee had three head coaches: Fulmer, Kiffin, and Dooley. This was tough for many Tennessee fans to swallow and while many blame Dooley for Tennessee's futility in this decade, others still harbor hard feelings for Kiffin for exacerbating it and turning Tennessee into a laughingstock.
I will say that the mattress burning and demonstrations on campus after his resignation were over the top and completely unnecessary. Thank God I was not there when it happened.
That's why it's even more painful to see Kiffin coaching offense at Alabama and coaching circles around Tennessee's defenses.
It all may seem trivial, but if you put yourself in the position of a Tennessee fan, alumnus, booster, administration, or his own players, you'll understand the hard feelings.
ducky23;842771826 said:
Thanks for sharing. It's great to get a perspective from an actual Tennessee fan. I think what your thoughts really highlight is the difference between how the south treats football and how Californians treat football.
Kiffen's actions are pretty similarly mirrored by the actions of two of our former coaches. Steve mariucci came in with a lot of promise and talk as well. And I think most, if not all, cal fans bought it cause, damn, mooch is charismatic. Then after just one season at cal he bolts for the niners at the last second and leaves cal in a bad position that cal never dug out of until hiring Tedford. As for the recruiting stuff kiffen did before leaving, tosh did almost the same (probably even worse). We had arguably the top class in the country (I know, crazy to even imagine right). Once tosh was done, we had no recruits left. To make matters worse, tosh is a cal grad. He's one of us. And he completely f'ed us over.
What's interesting in contrasting the situations is that cal fans have completely absolved mooch and while tosh hasn't been completely forgiven, it looks like a sizeable number are willing to give him another try. I realize that of course there may be slight differences between what kiffen did and what tosh/mooch did. But not that different. Not so different that one fan base is rioting and the other would be willing to welcome back the culprits with open arms.
And herein lies my argument. it's my theory that all this kiffen hate is overblown for three main reasons:
1. Kiffen is young and handsome and thus easy to hate (if it was some old fat dude it think the reactions towards him would be different.
2. Kiffen was at three super high profile programs and
3. All three programs (two in particular) feel that they are football royalty so there's going to be a sense of entitlement. So any slight is going to be perceived as more egregious. And the reaction to the perceived slight is going to be more intense.
If kiffen had done the exact same things with the titans, Indiana and Oregon state, I guarantee you there wouldn't be this narrative that kiffen is the most hated man in football.
This is not to excuse some of his actions. I think some of the things he did were extremely regrettable. But is he any worse than tosh? Arguably. (Let's for a second imagine what would've happened if what tosh did to cal he actually did to a place like Alabama - he wouldn't have made it out of the state alive) But in my opinion, I can live with his past transgressions. I've got to believe that he's learned from his mistakes and that he would thrive in an environment (like cal) that is more low key and way less high profile. I think that's exactly what he's looking for at this point in his career.
Big C_Cal;842771854 said:
I've always thought Kiffen's face looks like a sack of pus.
BeggarEd;842771856 said:
Kiffin. Trivial detail, but seems like its mispelled more often than not.
BeggarEd;842771856 said:
Kiffin. Trivial detail, but seems like its mispelled more often than not.
ducky23;842771826 said:
Kiffen is young and handsome
blungld;842772322 said:
---stop right there!
Kiffin is the form (as in Plato's cave allegory) of the visage of true male douchiness. All others are simply shadows.
TheSouseFamily;842770891 said:
