My Cal Bears lovin' heart says we'll be able to do it. We'll somehow find one or two playmakers (ideally local) who look at Cal and say "These guys need help and I'd really like to bring them to the next level, rather than join a more proven winner at furd, usc, or ucla." And once we do, everything else will flow from there.

My head says it's highly unlikely that we can do so - that Wilcox, despite being awesome and doing so much for Cal in so many ways, is limited by his defense-only skill set, and has no clue how to be a HC that's strong on both sides of the ball. Hell, if I were a stud DC, I don't know if I'd be able to manage O as a HC.

Who's right?

Cal can do it, because we've done it. Super recently too. Can this O staff? No.

socaliganbear said:

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Cal can do it, because we've done it. Super recently too. Can this O staff? No.

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That's a problem, because those guys from 10 years ago aren't walking back through this door (even though the door has been nicely renovated since they've been here)

510 Bear said:

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My Cal Bears lovin' heart says we'll be able to do it. We'll somehow find one or two playmakers (ideally local) who look at Cal and say "These guys need help and I'd really like to bring them to the next level, rather than join a more proven winner at furd, usc, or ucla." And once we do, everything else will flow from there.

My head says it's highly unlikely that we can do so - that Wilcox, despite being awesome and doing so much for Cal in so many ways, is limited by his defense-only skill set, and has no clue how to be a HC that's strong on both sides of the ball. Hell, if I were a stud DC, I don't know if I'd be able to manage O as a HC.

Who's right?

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In general terms: If UCLA can do it; if Northwestern can do it; if Stanford can do it, then we can do it. Michigan and Wisco are academically tough - they do it.

One thing Shaw does that I believe in: go find good big O-linemen who are smart (they are out there). Once you have a good O-line, you can make those 3* backs and receivers look a lot better.

One thing we are doing right - building a tough, hard-nosed defensive culture.

I'm not generally a "sunshine pumper", but I think overall we are on the right track. I think we need an O-coordinator who is Tim De Ruyter's equal in terms of ability. Maybe it's just me, but some of what I see with this offense isn't so much who we recruited, but scheme.

Let's also be honest enough to admit that the injury bug bit the WRs and OL bad, and that transfers left us thin at RB.

Wilcox should be able to recruit off of this season. He's shown improvement and has taken the team further than Sonny Dykes did.

Talent is a major issue on the offensive side of the ball, in that it isn't good enough to overcome injuries in November and can't make the coaching staff look better than it is.

To disagree with the OP to an extent, we don't need to find another Vernon Adams as much as we need a dozen or so good players on the OL and out wide. If these guys are just above average, that would be good enough. These players can't be recruited in just one season. Not only that, but if Wilcox wants job security maybe half of these players need to already be on the squad.

BerlinerBaer said:

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Talent is a major issue on the offensive side of the ball, in that it isn't good enough to overcome injuries in November and can't make the coaching staff look better than it is.

To disagree with the OP to an extent, we don't need to find another Vernon Adams as much as we need a dozen or so good players on the OL and out wide. If these guys are just above average, that would be good enough. These players can't be recruited in just one season. Not only that, but if Wilcox wants job security maybe half of these players need to already be on the squad.

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Agree for the most part. But our receivers won't do us much good if our QB is inaccurate. The Duncan missed TD pass today is a good example of that.

510 Bear said:

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socaliganbear said:

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Cal can do it, because we've done it. Super recently too. Can this O staff? No.

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That's a problem, because those guys from 10 years ago aren't walking back through this door (even though the door has been nicely renovated since they've been here)

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Brilliant

01Bear said:

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Agree for the most part. But our receivers won't do us much good if our QB is inaccurate. The Duncan missed TD pass today is a good example of that.

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There were also 3 or 4 crucial drops by receivers on passes that hit them right in the hands or chest. It's been a huge problem all season long and it's simply unacceptable when you are a defense oriented team. There is just no room for dumb mental errors on offense. Garbers is far from perfect but I put more blame on his supporting cast. He has no playmakers around him at all and isn't getting great protection either. A dependable WR is a must for next year.

johngalenhoward said:

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01Bear said:

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Agree for the most part. But our receivers won't do us much good if our QB is inaccurate. The Duncan missed TD pass today is a good example of that.

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There were also 3 or 4 crucial drops by receivers on passes that hit them right in the hands or chest. It's been a huge problem all season long and it's simply unacceptable when you are a defense oriented team. There is just no room for dumb mental errors on offense. Garbers is far from perfect but I put more blame on his supporting cast. He has no playmakers around him at all and isn't getting great protection either. A dependable WR is a must for next year.

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I'm not disagreeing that our receivers have not played up to snuff. I'm just stating that even if we have Tim Brown, Michael Irvin, Larry Fitzgerald, and Jerry Rice redux, if the QB can't get the ball to them, it won't do any good.

Wouldn't hurt to have had Noa, Robertson and Stovall on the field today. No speed and our best possession receiver out.

01Bear said:

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I'm not disagreeing that our receivers have not played up to snuff. I'm just stating that even if we have Tim Brown, Michael Irvin, Larry Fitzgerald, and Jerry Rice redux, if the QB can't get the ball to them, it won't do any good.

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My sense is that we would have a much higher opinion of Garbers if he had a great receiver somewhere on this team. He can get the ball to them most of the time. I think he's probably got tools similar to Kevin Riley- not amazing, but good enough to lead an average offense. That may be faint praise, but if our team had an average offense this year we'd have 10-12 wins.

Point being, he needs to improve, but there are bigger problems on offense than QB right now.

johngalenhoward said:

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01Bear said:

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I'm not disagreeing that our receivers have not played up to snuff. I'm just stating that even if we have Tim Brown, Michael Irvin, Larry Fitzgerald, and Jerry Rice redux, if the QB can't get the ball to them, it won't do any good.

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My sense is that we would have a much higher opinion of Garbers if he had a great receiver somewhere on this team. He can get the ball to them most of the time. I think he's probably got tools similar to Kevin Riley- not amazing, but good enough to lead an average offense. That may be faint praise, but if our team had an average offense this year we'd have 10-12 wins.

Point being, he needs to improve, but there are bigger problems on offense than QB right now.

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I understand. I just wonder if we're not looking at a chicken and egg issue, as well, re QBs and receivers.

Then again, I wonder if the problem is not the coaching more than the players.

hotlanta said:

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Wouldn't hurt to have had Noa, Robertson and Stovall on the field today. No speed and our best possession receiver out.

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It's about time we stopped thinking about Robertson and it's long past time we stopped thinking about Stovall.

Speaking of offensive players who are no longer here did anybody else read the quote about guys playing for Stats to get to the NFL rather than for wins under Dykes..... I think we know a big reason why at least one of those guys left.... And if he ever makes the league after he finishes up in Hawaii I will be shocked.

With this offensive staff, I think we're screwed. They've showed no ability to recruit talent so far.

I blame Buh.

Two years ago the same thread existed for defense. It's mainly the offensive coaching staff. Their combination of recruiting and coaching is bad. Up to Wilcox to change this. It will make or break him.

I think we can recruit 'em. Look, we are now 7-5, headed to a bowl game, beat the PAC-12 champs AND USC in the Coliseum and have a proven defense - that puts us light years ahead of where we were a year ago. No, we won't pull in a dozen 5-star recruits in the next cycle, but I think Wilcox should be able to show we are a solid team. and in a much more positive place than last year.