Big C said:SFCityBear said:I was unable to see McGruder play all his games in person, but I did see a fair amount in '96, less in '97, due to a serious illness in my family. My impression was that McGruder was an outstanding defender, not known as much for his offensive skills as a point guard, even his best offensive year. The statistics we are able to look up easily only tell us how good a player's offense was, and almost nothing about his defense. In '96, Jelani Gardner was still the Cal point guard, after having a good freshman season. Bozeman was not a coach who had much respect for defense. He respected star power, which meant offensive production. The fact that McGruder did get to start a few games in '96 may have been due to the fact that Jelani was diagnosed with kidney disease, and it may have affected his play, which had dropped off offensively from '95. He dropped out of Cal due to the illness at or before the season ended. After Bozeman was fired, Braun took over a roster in '97 where the best choice to start for point guard was McGruder. And as Braun respected defense more than did Bozeman, it worked out very well for Braun and Cal to have McGruder leading the team on the floor, at both ends of the floor.Big C said:drizzlybear said:Big C said:HearstMining said:Coming from the Ivy League, I think Betley is used to having another 10th of a second to get his shot off and that's not happening against Pac12 teams. I think he's smart, tough, a good rebounder, but just not athletic enough and needs a bit more time to get his shot off. I was not impressed with the very first game of the year against OSU, then he played well against the OOC teams and I got my hopes up. But really, he's largely disappeared against Pac12 opponents - only four games of 10pts or more.HoopDreams said:
this team is just so frustratingly close to beat the bottom half of the conference on a regular basis, and doing so would mean Cal would be in the top half of the conference (although not top 4)
I keep thinking that we just need players to make a play, but it's not happening, except for Bradley and Kelly.
Brown had several chances to be that guy at the end of games, but over penetrated or been out of control, and turned the ball over multiple times. That is a disaster in crunch time. Your point guard is suppose to be your most reliable player with the ball, and is supported to settle everyone else down when things get frantic
We've had countless open looks from 3, from our 'shooters' which I'm saying is Foreman, Betley, Grant (tier 1) and Hyder, Celestine (tier 2) and 2K and Bowser (tier 3).
I'm not including Bradley (tier 1) above, because he's clutch.
How many times do we hear an opposing team's bench player "hitting his first 3", or 'hitting only his second three and a 26% 3 point shooter?
How many times has the ball just rolled off (Celestine) or a 14 foot open jumper hitting front rim (Grant, and everyone else who shot it there vs UW)
Collectively it feels to me like confidence. Besides Bradley and Kelly, and maybe Celestine, our confidence seems to be wavering. Betley's confidence is completely shot. You can not explain his poor shooting as only better defenders. He's getting plenty of open looks. The result of players losing confidence is playing tentative, not wanting to take the big shot, and just not making plays in critical times of the game.
Can an offseason help that?
Yes, as experience should help players be more confident, but shooters sometimes go through cold spells no matter how experienced they are
But I do have my hopes for Hyder. He needs to improve his vision - you can tell when he makes up his mind he's going to look for a shot regardless of who is open. And his handle is too loose. But with maturity and practice, those things can be fixed.
Hyder compares (maybe) to Prentice McGruder, who transferred to Cal from JC and had his first (and only) good season as a senior. There is some hope for these freshmen and sophomores.
I've always seen Brown as the potential reincarnation of Prentice McGruder, and I've seen them both in the mold of Rajon Rondo: long and wiry, ultra quick and able to penetrate at will, can't shoot a lick, but supreme at finding teammates for great looks especially off penetration. I do not see Hyder as that style of PG. I'm not sure Hyder has the body/athleticism to be an effective P12 PG, nor the shot to offset that. Of course, I'm also not sure Brown can develop into that McGruder level of play, but he has the potential, given his body/athleticism and pass-first mentality.
Edit: Civil Bear, I just saw your post and realize I pretty much duplicated it (right down to "can't shoot a lick"). My bad.
A note about Prentice McGruder: His first two years after HS, he was at a JC. The year after that (first year at Cal), he scored 2.5 ppg and dished out 2.6 apg. He finally broke out in '96-'97, averaging 5.1 ppg and 6.4 apg (that last number must've been at or near the top of the Pac 10).
My point being, Prentice McGruder "wasn't Prentice McGruder" until his senior year, so there might well still be hope for both Brown and Hyder! (and, yes, I had to look up those McGruder stats)
When we fans talk here about how good a player and his abilities are, we tend to talk primarily, maybe 95% of the time, only about his offensive skills and production, often leaving out the defensive side, which is 50% of the game, give or take a percent or two. Prentice McGruder was a whale of a defensive player, and he was likely a very good defender before he signed with Cal. I doubt that he learned to play defense under Bozeman or even under Braun.
I haven't been impressed yet with Hyder's defense (or his offense) and need to see him more. Brown is an excellent on ball defender. I'd like to see him take a few less risks, but sometimes a steal is worth the risk. He has the defensive ability to start on even a good team. Even as a junior, McGruder did not hurt his team on offense. Brown's offensive ability I worry about, not so much his shooting, but his mind set, his sense of where his teammates are, and the decisions he makes, leading to steals, turnovers, and missed shots, costing his team some buckets. Hopefully it is fixable.
Wow, I don't remember EVER hearing about Jelani Gardner's kidney disease. My recollection of his departure was that it was more based on a sack of cash, or lack thereof.
Yeah, McGruder was a good defender and a good "game manager" on offense.
I'm not sure Bozeman "respected" offense over defense. In fact, I think he really had his players getting after it on both ends of the court. The problem was, his only "trick" was to get the players to "play hard". If we won, it was because we "played hard". If we lost: "My players didn't play hard." A recruiter and a motivator (and a cheater), but not really a coach, per se. Just my recollection.
Anyway, there are plenty of instance of Cal PGs getting substantially better after two years. Two examples that come to mind are Ayinde Ubaka and Keith Smith. Hoping for the best for Brown and Hyder. That's all we can do, at this point.
I don't agree with the idea that Prentice was a game manager or a defensive player. He was an excellent distributor. He made plays, just for others. IMO, he was excellent at everything except scoring, which made his distribution even more noteworthy since the defense didn't need to guard against his shot.
