SF Comicle on Cal hoops

6,076 Views | 50 Replies | Last: 3 yr ago by Chapman_is_Gone
philbert
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Seems timely....


joe amos yaks
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How long can Mike Williams tread water?
4thGenCal
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philbert said:

Seems timely....



Thanks for posting, accurate and objective article. This season will say a lot about the HC and staff development and progress, in a increasingly tough conference - where likely 6 teams will make the NCAA post season championships.
Chabbear
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The article mentions a practice facility which was a thread last week. Is the Practice facility real or a Chimera: (a thing that is hoped or wished for but in fact is illusory or impossible to achieve.)
stu
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I think the article was helpful in explaining the timeline but missed a few other things. Brown (and Thorpe) weren't Fox recruits, they had signed LOIs before Fox was hired. The players who left (with the possible exception of McNeill) did not leave because of the previous coach.

I won't fault Fox for his first recruiting class since he was hired in the spring and had to fill some holes right away. As the article mentions, his next two classes will take some time to develop so we'll be relying on players who may not be able to win a lot of conference games. That could further impact recruiting and turn a long rebuild into a downward spiral.

IMHO if Fox had been willing to work with the players he inherited he would have been able to right the ship and have time to start building his way. Without those players I think we're in a situation where if the team doesn't play better than expected this season our chances of a successful recovery will go way down. At that point Knowlton will have to decide whether to extend Fox's contract, let the contract run out, or terminate it early. To me none of those alternatives look good.
4thGenCal
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Chabbear said:

The article mentions a practice facility which was a thread last week. Is the Practice facility real or a Chimera: (a thing that is hoped or wished for but in fact is illusory or impossible to achieve.)
Its a real topic and the AD is leading the push - several factors in discussion now from scope (location/size/serving just basketball or additional sports via weightroom/training facilities etc) and thus the variance in amount of needed funds to raise. Desperately needed for both basketball teams to have any lasting ability to be conference/nationally competitive. Only conference program without one and just one of four nationally as well for D1.
Chabbear
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That makes 3 facilities that are in the planning stages with little information on progress, basketball practice, beach volleyball and softball. Any others?
puget sound cal fan
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Ideas needing big money.
ClayK
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Good to hear about the practice facility, but the "moving forward" phrase in the story is all but meaningless.
BeachedBear
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Nice to see ANY coverage of Cal hoops in local media. It would help fans tolerate the long term rebuild strategy, if the current leaders (Fox and Knowlton) would say anything . . .

ANYTHING

about what that means, what it includes, what it does not include, what it will look like, etc.

crickets is no way to sell swamp land.
philbert
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BeachedBear said:

Nice to see ANY coverage of Cal hoops in local media. It would help fans tolerate the long term rebuild strategy, if the current leaders (Fox and Knowlton) would say anything . . .

ANYTHING

about what that means, what it includes, what it does not include, what it will look like, etc.

crickets is no way to sell swamp land.
Exactly! You want fans to come fill the stands and donate money? Give us some hope. I really don't understand the cone of silence media strategy.
KoreAmBear
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philbert said:

BeachedBear said:

Nice to see ANY coverage of Cal hoops in local media. It would help fans tolerate the long term rebuild strategy, if the current leaders (Fox and Knowlton) would say anything . . .

ANYTHING

about what that means, what it includes, what it does not include, what it will look like, etc.

crickets is no way to sell swamp land.
Exactly! You want fans to come fill the stands and donate money? Give us some hope. I really don't understand the cone of silence media strategy.
It would be great if Fox was a master Xs and Os or recruiter. Then the lack of marketing would be fine. Hey Monty didn't recruit, and we were fine, because he made it up in Xs and Os. As for Fox, I'm not sure what he really does excellently at the D1 level (did you vet that AD Knowlton?). Show us coach. Overall if our program was a stock it would be heavily shorted.
calumnus
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KoreAmBear said:

philbert said:

BeachedBear said:

Nice to see ANY coverage of Cal hoops in local media. It would help fans tolerate the long term rebuild strategy, if the current leaders (Fox and Knowlton) would say anything . . .

ANYTHING

about what that means, what it includes, what it does not include, what it will look like, etc.

crickets is no way to sell swamp land.
Exactly! You want fans to come fill the stands and donate money? Give us some hope. I really don't understand the cone of silence media strategy.
It would be great if Fox was a master Xs and Os or recruiter. Then the lack of marketing would be fine. Hey Monty didn't recruit, and we were fine, because he made it up in Xs and Os. As for Fox, I'm not sure what he really does excellently at the D1 level (did you vet that AD Knowlton?). Show us coach. Overall if our program was a stock it would be heavily shorted.


Mostly Fox is known in coaching circles as a very frequent claimant of "doing it the right way" and accusing everyone else of cheating. Whenever there is a recruiting scandal he is always good for a "I am disgusted by what they are doing to the game I love" quote. That was obviously one of the things that appealed to Knowlton. Other coaches in the SEC loved him and would say the Georgia AD "just needs to give him more time." They were even saying that in his ninth year there before he was finally fired.

On the court he is known for having one of the slowest tempos in the country and for very low scoring games. Physical defense, but not efficient defense. Trying to deny any shot instead of trying to deny good shots and encourage bad shots. No discernible offense except get the ball in the hands of his best player at the end of the shot clock. It gave him a punchers chance of pulling an upset against Kentucky or losing to Vanderbilt.
Big C
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I thought the article took a rather negative tone. Painful to read. The fact that it was "accurate" (to quote 4thGenCal), made it even more painful, as I attempt to gird up for another season at Haas.

Indeed, it was a realistic assessment of where we're at.

This Ben Parker guy was quoted a lot (all super-negative about Cal) and the article claimed he used to cover Cal for a Rivals site and now covers Stanfurd. I think he should do an article about how the team he now covers has consistently WAY underperformed, especially every January-through-March.

Because schadenfreude, misery-loves-company and all that.


I'm really hoping we are somewhat of a pleasant surprise this season! Not impossible.
philbert
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Letourneau used to cover Cal hoops for the Comicle. I'm sure he and Parker ran into each other regularly while covering Cal hoops. Maybe he should have asked MB for his take on Cal hoops?
CalLifer
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Big C said:


I thought the article took a rather negative tone. Painful to read. The fact that it was "accurate" (to quote 4thGenCal), made it even more painful, as I attempt to gird up for another season at Haas.

Indeed, it was a realistic assessment of where we're at.

This Ben Parker guy was quoted a lot (all super-negative about Cal) and the article claimed he used to cover Cal for a Rivals site and now covers Stanfurd. I think he should do an article about how the team he now covers has consistently WAY underperformed, especially every January-through-March.

Because schadenfreude, misery-loves-company and all that.


I'm really hoping we are somewhat of a pleasant surprise this season! Not impossible.
I guess I'm really not sure what signs of positivity there are that should make it into an article? We've been pretty negative here as well.

And I guess to me the guy who was quoted who said the following painted a pretty negative picture:
Quote:

Well, we didn't get completely through the first year because the pandemic hit, right? You're just trying to glue it together for the next 15 months to survive the pandemic. Now it's back to trying to do all the things that we were initially identifying.
I mean, that guy is basically saying that we need to throw away the first year b/c the season ended 1 game early (we won our first game in the Pac-12 tourney, but would likely have lost the next), and that the next year didn't count. So we are basically in season 1 of the Mark Fox era. That guy is painting a very negative picture... that would be Mark Fox. I'm more worried that that guy thinks he should be treated like he is in year 1 of his tenure rather than year 3.
Big C
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CalLifer said:

Big C said:


I thought the article took a rather negative tone. Painful to read. The fact that it was "accurate" (to quote 4thGenCal), made it even more painful, as I attempt to gird up for another season at Haas.

Indeed, it was a realistic assessment of where we're at.

This Ben Parker guy was quoted a lot (all super-negative about Cal) and the article claimed he used to cover Cal for a Rivals site and now covers Stanfurd. I think he should do an article about how the team he now covers has consistently WAY underperformed, especially every January-through-March.

Because schadenfreude, misery-loves-company and all that.


I'm really hoping we are somewhat of a pleasant surprise this season! Not impossible.
I guess I'm really not sure what signs of positivity there are that should make it into an article? We've been pretty negative here as well.

And I guess to me the guy who was quoted who said the following painted a pretty negative picture:
Quote:

Well, we didn't get completely through the first year because the pandemic hit, right? You're just trying to glue it together for the next 15 months to survive the pandemic. Now it's back to trying to do all the things that we were initially identifying.
I mean, that guy is basically saying that we need to throw away the first year b/c the season ended 1 game early (we won our first game in the Pac-12 tourney, but would likely have lost the next), and that the next year didn't count. So we are basically in season 1 of the Mark Fox era. That guy is painting a very negative picture... that would be Mark Fox. I'm more worried that that guy thinks he should be treated like he is in year 1 of his tenure rather than year 3.

Yeah, I get it. Believe me, I get it.

The purpose of the article wasn't to please the likes of me, but I could've done without hearing Ben Parker saying how the Bears could go winless in the Pac 12 this season. He should stick to covering Haase's underachievements in the South Bay.

This is about me (isn't it always?), a season-ticket holder who is trying to maintain some positivity going into the season, while nevertheless fully understanding where we're at and also understanding journalistic responsibilities to report accurately.
4thGenCal
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Big C said:


I thought the article took a rather negative tone. Painful to read. The fact that it was "accurate" (to quote 4thGenCal), made it even more painful, as I attempt to gird up for another season at Haas.

Indeed, it was a realistic assessment of where we're at.

This Ben Parker guy was quoted a lot (all super-negative about Cal) and the article claimed he used to cover Cal for a Rivals site and now covers Stanfurd. I think he should do an article about how the team he now covers has consistently WAY underperformed, especially every January-through-March.

Because schadenfreude, misery-loves-company and all that.


I'm really hoping we are somewhat of a pleasant surprise this season! Not impossible.
Appreciate your "wait and see" assessment and I too am cautiously optimistic that we will see an improved team- (increased wins. and more competitive overall games.). The string has "the jury decision" decided, before seeing the outcome. Any rebuild (and Cal's was as bad a situation as a coach could inherit) takes 3 years to fairly reach a verdict. Last season as has been discussed via the Pandemic, did negatively impact the program, more than all conf teams (Stanford excepting), simply because of the City of Berkeley factor and the crucial loss of sufficient time to develop a woefully lacking overall skills/strength/depth team.

I remain neutral of Coach Fox and his staff - this is the year to show significant improvement or the nega bears are likely spot on. Amusing to read some messages that attack his basketball coaching ability (be it an isolated blow out game from 11 years ago, offensive game plans, ineffective defensive fundamentals etc). The facts are his career record is 308 wins with 213 losses. including 22 wins and 37 losses at Cal. Outstanding at Nevada, average at Georgia (163-133 overall and 77-79 conf record) twice qualified for MM and 3 times NIT in his 9 seasons there. Having spoken to numerous current and former NCAA D1 HC's (8) all were very positive in their opinion of Coach Fox record/ability to coach and knowledge of "X and O's). These conversations were in a private setting and with guys I know and thus no reason to sugar coat- Including 2 of our past successful HC's and 2 that interviewed for the HC position earlier. Maybe he flops this season and then yes, let's get a better coach/recruiter and a coach that understands the "Cal barriers" and more importantly has an effective plan to succeed.

Coach Fox is accessible and has hosted events at his home, quarterly meetings with excellence club members and is shortly hosting an open practice to the donors. Having watched earlier practices, it is clear that the development, practice plan, and coaching is superior compared to the previous couple of coaches (Monty's practices remain tops). However his fate will rest on his/staff ability, to upgrade his Cal recruiting record thus far.

When a program has won only ONE conference title in 60+ years, its simply not objective to roast/promote a HC dismissal after 2 years - in light of the situation inherited and the following year extreme obstacles previously discussed.

To be clear Coach Fox may very well prove to not be the coach to lift Cal to respectability, but let's not bury the person while still alive/coaching. Let's support the team and coaches thru this season and then completely "have at it" when the season is completed. Final point to those that say "run to the hills, ship without a rudder, plane w/o a pilot" etc "Money does not talk, it shouts"! Cal is last in many needed competitive areas and all make the job of HC even tougher than viewed from afar. IE, last in conference in charter flights for players (cuts into practice and study time), non existent for coaches recruiting effectiveness (unlike nearly all conf teams and top programs), low staff pay scale (compared to conf teams), at the near bottom (not all teams info available) for basketball support funds. No practice facility (only one in conf to not have one, one of just 4 D1 schools nationally). Just the reality and supporters and casual fans, hopefully factor in the obstacles when deriding the program. Heck - we all enjoy the banter, let's support the team in person and Go Bears!
Big C
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I will, as always, be at Haas for more than half of the games. Go Bears!
Chapman_is_Gone
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4thGenCal said:

Chabbear said:

The article mentions a practice facility which was a thread last week. Is the Practice facility real or a Chimera: (a thing that is hoped or wished for but in fact is illusory or impossible to achieve.)
Its a real topic and the AD is leading the push - several factors in discussion now from scope (location/size/serving just basketball or additional sports via weightroom/training facilities etc) and thus the variance in amount of needed funds to raise. Desperately needed for both basketball teams to have any lasting ability to be conference/nationally competitive. Only conference program without one and just one of four nationally as well for D1.
4th Gen Cal and Others,

I'm curious if you can answer this question. Why is there virtually zero information on key Cal sports issues communicated from the Athletic Department to die-hard fans? I get the sense that heavy donors get some information if they pry, but why can't all Cal fans have access to quality information? Why hide things?

Why not have a monthly "State of the Athletic Department" interview / newsletter / podcast, where issues are discussed, alternatives are considered, and fan question are addressed and answered if possible? I can think of 6 questions right off the top of my head that I've NEVER heard the Cal athletic department discuss with Cal fans:

1) Status of a practice facility for the basketball team, and an open discussion of cost estimates for everything from a bare bones facility to a spare-no-expense facility.

2) An open discussion of Learfield's benefits and costs. Is the AD even aware that there is a perception among Cal fans that the game day experience has deteriorated and the band doesn't play as much? If surveys indicate piped-in music is preferred by fans, can we get some insight into those surveys?

3) Is it true that we have stricter admissions standards for football and basketball than our peers, for no reason other than as a self-imposed limitation due to poor student athlete academic performance more than five years ago? If the higher standards are self-imposed, what goals could be achieved for those standards return to being in-line with our peers?

4) A full update on the band. How can we set a 10-year goal to increase the size of the band by 50%, including much more brass? What academic rules could be tweaked to make it more reasonable and attractive for students to devote so much time to being in the band?

5) When a new coach needs to be chosen, has the school considered the route, often proposed on this message board, of a "council of elders" who would recommend a group of finalists, rather than relying on a search firm that doesn't appreciate Cal's values and traditions?

6) What would it take for Memorial Stadium to return to natural grass? And for the rugby field to return to natural grass? What are the cost differences between natural grass and the fake stuff? Has the number of injuries suffered on grass vs. fake stuff been truly analyzed? Have the players been interviewed for their preferences? I do not believe ANY claims of artificial turf companies, having personally experienced what it's like to play on the crap (softball) to hearing just recently the best soccer players in the world complain about its effects on their bodies and on the sport (in the Champions League).

I don't feel like I am in an effective two-way communication with the Cal athletic department. I feel like poor decisions are being made, and at the very least, the fan base should be allowed to understand the rationale for decisions. That way, the logic behind those decisions can be seen, no matter how the decisions turn out. It is not healthy for die-hard Cal fans to be in the dark. Over a 5-year period I personally have gone from donating low five-figures per year to donating nothing. Doesn't Cal believe and understand that if they more effectively engaged their fan base, the result almost certainly would be positive? Why all the secrets?


dimitrig
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Bradley leaving sealed the deal with me that Fox isn't the guy we need.

He's not only not bringing in talent, but losing the talent we had!


4thGenCal
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dimitrig said:


Bradley leaving sealed the deal with me that Fox isn't the guy we need.

He's not only not bringing in talent, but losing the talent we had!


I was extremely disapointed as well and at first put the blame solely on the HC and staff, however without going into the issues (not appropriate to do so on a public forum) I realized that the outcome was likely best for both sides.
dimitrig
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4thGenCal said:

dimitrig said:


Bradley leaving sealed the deal with me that Fox isn't the guy we need.

He's not only not bringing in talent, but losing the talent we had!


I was extremely disapointed as well and at first put the blame solely on the HC and staff, however without going into the issues (not appropriate to do so on a public forum) I realized that the outcome was likely best for both sides.

Losing you best player is not a win no matter how you spin it.

If there were extenuating circumstances such as academics or personal issues then it's on the coach to figure them out to the benefit of the team. If he can't do that then he has failed.

Who else do you blame other than the HC and staff?

Certainly not the player. Players can be fickle. They will do whatever. I think we all understand that.

Are you claiming that somewhere in the administration above Fox someone made a decision both Fox and Bradley disagreed with?

If so, that's a bigger problem!

4thGenCal
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Chapman_is_Gone said:

4thGenCal said:

Chabbear said:

The article mentions a practice facility which was a thread last week. Is the Practice facility real or a Chimera: (a thing that is hoped or wished for but in fact is illusory or impossible to achieve.)
Its a real topic and the AD is leading the push - several factors in discussion now from scope (location/size/serving just basketball or additional sports via weightroom/training facilities etc) and thus the variance in amount of needed funds to raise. Desperately needed for both basketball teams to have any lasting ability to be conference/nationally competitive. Only conference program without one and just one of four nationally as well for D1.
4th Gen Cal and Others,

I'm curious if you can answer this question. Why is there virtually zero information on key Cal sports issues communicated from the Athletic Department to die-hard fans? I get the sense that heavy donors get some information if they pry, but why can't all Cal fans have access to quality information? Why hide things?

Why not have a monthly "State of the Athletic Department" interview / newsletter / podcast, where issues are discussed, alternatives are considered, and fan question are addressed and answered if possible? I can think of 6 questions right off the top of my head that I've NEVER heard the Cal athletic department discuss with Cal fans:

1) Status of a practice facility for the basketball team, and an open discussion of cost estimates for everything from a bare bones facility to a spare-no-expense facility.

2) An open discussion of Learfield's benefits and costs. Is the AD even aware that there is a perception among Cal fans that the game day experience has deteriorated and the band doesn't play as much? If surveys indicate piped-in music is preferred by fans, can we get some insight into those surveys?

3) Is it true that we have stricter admissions standards for football and basketball than our peers, for no reason other than as a self-imposed limitation due to poor student athlete academic performance more than five years ago? If the higher standards are self-imposed, what goals could be achieved for those standards return to being in-line with our peers?

4) A full update on the band. How can we set a 10-year goal to increase the size of the band by 50%, including much more brass? What academic rules could be tweaked to make it more reasonable and attractive for students to devote so much time to being in the band?

5) When a new coach needs to be chosen, has the school considered the route, often proposed on this message board, of a "council of elders" who would recommend a group of finalists, rather than relying on a search firm that doesn't appreciate Cal's values and traditions?

6) What would it take for Memorial Stadium to return to natural grass? And for the rugby field to return to natural grass? What are the cost differences between natural grass and the fake stuff? Has the number of injuries suffered on grass vs. fake stuff been truly analyzed? Have the players been interviewed for their preferences? I do not believe ANY claims of artificial turf companies, having personally experienced what it's like to play on the crap (softball) to hearing just recently the best soccer players in the world complain about its effects on their bodies and on the sport (in the Champions League).

I don't feel like I am in an effective two-way communication with the Cal athletic department. I feel like poor decisions are being made, and at the very least, the fan base should be allowed to understand the rationale for decisions. That way, the logic behind those decisions can be seen, no matter how the decisions turn out. It is not healthy for die-hard Cal fans to be in the dark. Over a 5-year period I personally have gone from donating low five-figures per year to donating nothing. Doesn't Cal believe and understand that if they more effectively engaged their fan base, the result almost certainly would be positive? Why all the secrets?



Fair points to raise and like most issues, there are some truths and some non truths to your questions. First off if one were to join either the Excellence Club and or the Grid Club, several of those questions would have been answered. There are email updates (generally monthly) from the AD and also a quarterly Cal Sports magazine sent out to the donor pool. Its well written and informative. Btw the piped in music is very popular at most major college stadiums and regarding Memorial Stadium, the music is supported by the players and the pre game music is often what they request. Love the band and especially pre game performances, but its not going to be music that the players can get pumped to consistently. And its a game depending a lot on crowd support (hence home field advantage) and sadly we don't have crowds of 50k+ (butts in seats). Piped in music at key points of the game (3rd down defense stand etc) does bring extra energy to the players. And the fans generally support it and I sit with mostly the older crowd. The band has to raise funds to support themselves and without sufficient funds, size can be impacted. I don't sense "secrets" and joining the memberships mentioned above, would address your questions directly.
philbert
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Hmm, I still donate (but no longer to hoops) and get those items. I don't think they answer CIG's questions. Maybe there are different updates for bigger donors?

The info I see tends to be fluff and not very informative regarding issues and challenges facing the AD.

Chapman_is_Gone
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Thanks for your response, 4thGenCal. But see, here's the thing. I was a small-time donor (>$1,000 per year), occasionally up to $10,000 per year) for about 5-6 years, and I don't recall ever being sent much of any kind of unique information, or told about any special clubs to join. I don't recall getting email updates. Yes, I've heard of the Grid Club, but I'm telling ya, it's not advertised very well. I never attended, and probably would have had I known more about it. And I have NEVER heard of the Excellence Club. I'm backing up what philbert said: maybe those benefits are offered only to the big donors?

As for whether or not the team would prefer to hear AC/DC on third downs or (a larger, brass heavy) band blasting away, you're asking me to TRUST what the AD is saying, and I don't trust him/them. They are controlled by Learfield and, beyond that, I'm afraid they are thoroughly unremarkable bureaucrats. I think they're pulling answers out of their behind. First off, no 18-22 year old relates to AC/DC or Guns n Roses. Second, USC seems to do just fine firing up their team with a brass-heavy band. I couldn't care less if the players listen to hip hop up to the starting gun. But during the game, I want to hear the band. It's IDIOTIC to play AC/DC and Guns n Roses, two bands from before the time the players were born.

I know I can't expect much of your time on here, and I do appreciate your response. But you kind of glossed over many of my suggestions. I'll just repeat one: Has EVERYTHING been done to determine how the band could be 50% bigger and 50% better in 10 years? They should look at it like a case study by MBA students. If we set that goal for the band, I am confident that we as an institution could get there. I'm talking class credit, partial scholarships, whatever it takes. Where there's a will, there's a way.

And, yes, we could have natural grass if we truly wanted it. Again, where there's a will, there's a way. Our current athletic department just doesn't care enough and isn't ambitious enough.



4thGenCal
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dimitrig said:

4thGenCal said:

dimitrig said:


Bradley leaving sealed the deal with me that Fox isn't the guy we need.

He's not only not bringing in talent, but losing the talent we had!


I was extremely disapointed as well and at first put the blame solely on the HC and staff, however without going into the issues (not appropriate to do so on a public forum) I realized that the outcome was likely best for both sides.

Losing you best player is not a win no matter how you spin it.

If there were extenuating circumstances such as academics or personal issues then it's on the coach to figure them out to the benefit of the team. If he can't do that then he has failed.

Who else do you blame other than the HC and staff?

Certainly not the player. Players can be fickle. They will do whatever. I think we all understand that.

Are you claiming that somewhere in the administration above Fox someone made a decision both Fox and Bradley disagreed with?

If so, that's a bigger problem!


It was a team (including player,staff and players) mutual decision - not an administrative decision. Matt made the final decision as He would have been accepted back from his entry into the Portal. Yes ultimately the result lands on the HC/staff. Matt is an outstanding young man and I wish He had stayed, as he was just one year away from receiving his Cal degree and also had a chance to become the all time leading scorer in history at Cal. I was not privy to all the issues/disruptions etc that were occuring, but being objective, while it is certainly a loss to lose your best player - team unity and individual development should improve. I wish Matt the best at SDS in his pursuit of his NBA aspirations. I also trust the staff to overcome the void.
4thGenCal
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Chapman_is_Gone said:

Thanks for your response, 4thGenCal. But see, here's the thing. I was a small-time donor (>$1,000 per year), occasionally up to $10,000 per year) for about 5-6 years, and I don't recall ever being sent much of any kind of unique information, or told about any special clubs to join. I don't recall getting email updates. Yes, I've heard of the Grid Club, but I'm telling ya, it's not advertised very well. I never attended, and probably would have had I known more about it. And I have NEVER heard of the Excellence Club. I'm backing up what philbert said: maybe those benefits are offered only to the big donors?

As for whether or not the team would prefer to hear AC/DC on third downs or (a larger, brass heavy) band blasting away, you're asking me to TRUST what the AD is saying, and I don't trust him/them. They are controlled by Learfield and, beyond that, I'm afraid they are thoroughly unremarkable bureaucrats. I think they're pulling answers out of their behind. First off, no 18-22 year old relates to AC/DC or Guns n Roses. Second, USC seems to do just fine firing up their team with a brass-heavy band. I couldn't care less if the players listen to hip hop up to the starting gun. But during the game, I want to hear the band. It's IDIOTIC to play AC/DC and Guns n Roses, two bands from before the time the players were born.

I know I can't expect much of your time on here, and I do appreciate your response. But you kind of glossed over many of my suggestions. I'll just repeat one: Has EVERYTHING been done to determine how the band could be 50% bigger and 50% better in 10 years? They should look at it like a case study by MBA students. If we set that goal for the band, I am confident that we as an institution could get there. I'm talking class credit, partial scholarships, whatever it takes. Where there's a will, there's a way.

And, yes, we could have natural grass if we truly wanted it. Again, where there's a will, there's a way. Our current athletic department just doesn't care enough and isn't ambitious enough.




Thanks for your valid questions and ongoing support. Regarding Excellence club membership - contact Alex Romagnolo: aromagnolo@berkeley.edu. Former D1 soccer player (wife is HC of the Women's soccer team at St Mary's). Grid Club Membership is very affordable to join (under $2K) John Stock is the President and there is a large BOD as well. weekly zoom and or in person luncheon during the season where the HC/staff and AD speak. Very informative and a fun way to stay in contact with supporters etc. Also the funds raised go to the Football program solely. I am not informed on the Band situation/size etc and do hope it could be a bit larger. Natural grass, questions for the staff - players and staff have supported the turf and I have not heard any complaints. I do remember from decades back the ongoing drainage issues and the muddy/or worn down field come November.
joe amos yaks
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Coach Fox was given a promise that must be kept.
Chabbear
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Thinking about the drainage issues and grass, when Cal did the renovation, they lowered the field by some feet which probably would make the drainage issues even worse than in the past. Someone else may know more but that is my guess.
RedlessWardrobe
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4thGenCal said:

dimitrig said:

4thGenCal said:

dimitrig said:


Bradley leaving sealed the deal with me that Fox isn't the guy we need.

He's not only not bringing in talent, but losing the talent we had!


I was extremely disapointed as well and at first put the blame solely on the HC and staff, however without going into the issues (not appropriate to do so on a public forum) I realized that the outcome was likely best for both sides.

Losing you best player is not a win no matter how you spin it.

If there were extenuating circumstances such as academics or personal issues then it's on the coach to figure them out to the benefit of the team. If he can't do that then he has failed.

Who else do you blame other than the HC and staff?

Certainly not the player. Players can be fickle. They will do whatever. I think we all understand that.

Are you claiming that somewhere in the administration above Fox someone made a decision both Fox and Bradley disagreed with?

If so, that's a bigger problem!


It was a team (including player,staff and players) mutual decision - not an administrative decision. Matt made the final decision as He would have been accepted back from his entry into the Portal. Yes ultimately the result lands on the HC/staff. Matt is an outstanding young man and I wish He had stayed, as he was just one year away from receiving his Cal degree and also had a chance to become the all time leading scorer in history at Cal. I was not privy to all the issues/disruptions etc that were occuring, but being objective, while it is certainly a loss to lose your best player - team unity and individual development should improve. I wish Matt the best at SDS in his pursuit of his NBA aspirations. I also trust the staff to overcome the void.
Okay, call me a simple minded guy on the issue of Bradley leaving. Once the NCAA cleared the way that in several situations a division 1 player can leave a school and play for another WITHOUT having to sit out a year, isn't it completely logical that a talented player like Bradley would like to play his final year for a team that has a realistic chance to make the NCAA tournament as opposed to a team who probably will not? And the "Cal degree" issue is irrelevant because many players go back and finish education and get it later in life. Not sure how you can hold Matt's decision against Fox.
CalLifer
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RedlessWardrobe said:

4thGenCal said:

dimitrig said:

4thGenCal said:

dimitrig said:


Bradley leaving sealed the deal with me that Fox isn't the guy we need.

He's not only not bringing in talent, but losing the talent we had!


I was extremely disapointed as well and at first put the blame solely on the HC and staff, however without going into the issues (not appropriate to do so on a public forum) I realized that the outcome was likely best for both sides.

Losing you best player is not a win no matter how you spin it.

If there were extenuating circumstances such as academics or personal issues then it's on the coach to figure them out to the benefit of the team. If he can't do that then he has failed.

Who else do you blame other than the HC and staff?

Certainly not the player. Players can be fickle. They will do whatever. I think we all understand that.

Are you claiming that somewhere in the administration above Fox someone made a decision both Fox and Bradley disagreed with?

If so, that's a bigger problem!


It was a team (including player,staff and players) mutual decision - not an administrative decision. Matt made the final decision as He would have been accepted back from his entry into the Portal. Yes ultimately the result lands on the HC/staff. Matt is an outstanding young man and I wish He had stayed, as he was just one year away from receiving his Cal degree and also had a chance to become the all time leading scorer in history at Cal. I was not privy to all the issues/disruptions etc that were occuring, but being objective, while it is certainly a loss to lose your best player - team unity and individual development should improve. I wish Matt the best at SDS in his pursuit of his NBA aspirations. I also trust the staff to overcome the void.
Okay, call me a simple minded guy on the issue of Bradley leaving. Once the NCAA cleared the way that in several situations a division 1 player can leave a school and play for another WITHOUT having to sit out a year, isn't it completely logical that a talented player like Bradley would like to play his final year for a team that has a realistic chance to make the NCAA tournament as opposed to a team who probably will not? And the "Cal degree" issue is irrelevant because many players go back and finish education and get it later in life. Not sure how you can hold Matt's decision against Fox.
To me, the indictment of Fox in your view of Bradley's decision is that Bradley (rightly) understood that there is absolutely NO chance of making the NCAA tournament if he stayed at Cal. This is a coach in his 3rd year where Bradley is still *by far* the best player on the team, and the next two most important players on the team are holdovers as well. So the coach has failed in retaining and coaching up the talent that was there when he arrived and also has not recruited players better than the ones who he inherited (even more stark if you include the ones committed under the previous regime that he kept).

I don't know anything about the behind-the-scenes issues that 4thGenCal references, but to me, Bradley's departure says everything about his expectations for Cal basketball next year, which to me should be held against Fox. It would thrill me to no end if the team made the tournament this year, and I would be happy to be wrong about Fox. But that is not a realistic expectation given what we know now.
4thGenCal
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RedlessWardrobe said:

4thGenCal said:

dimitrig said:

4thGenCal said:

dimitrig said:


Bradley leaving sealed the deal with me that Fox isn't the guy we need.

He's not only not bringing in talent, but losing the talent we had!


I was extremely disapointed as well and at first put the blame solely on the HC and staff, however without going into the issues (not appropriate to do so on a public forum) I realized that the outcome was likely best for both sides.

Losing you best player is not a win no matter how you spin it.

If there were extenuating circumstances such as academics or personal issues then it's on the coach to figure them out to the benefit of the team. If he can't do that then he has failed.

Who else do you blame other than the HC and staff?

Certainly not the player. Players can be fickle. They will do whatever. I think we all understand that.

Are you claiming that somewhere in the administration above Fox someone made a decision both Fox and Bradley disagreed with?

If so, that's a bigger problem!


It was a team (including player,staff and players) mutual decision - not an administrative decision. Matt made the final decision as He would have been accepted back from his entry into the Portal. Yes ultimately the result lands on the HC/staff. Matt is an outstanding young man and I wish He had stayed, as he was just one year away from receiving his Cal degree and also had a chance to become the all time leading scorer in history at Cal. I was not privy to all the issues/disruptions etc that were occuring, but being objective, while it is certainly a loss to lose your best player - team unity and individual development should improve. I wish Matt the best at SDS in his pursuit of his NBA aspirations. I also trust the staff to overcome the void.
Okay, call me a simple minded guy on the issue of Bradley leaving. Once the NCAA cleared the way that in several situations a division 1 player can leave a school and play for another WITHOUT having to sit out a year, isn't it completely logical that a talented player like Bradley would like to play his final year for a team that has a realistic chance to make the NCAA tournament as opposed to a team who probably will not? And the "Cal degree" issue is irrelevant because many players go back and finish education and get it later in life. Not sure how you can hold Matt's decision against Fox.
Agreed - Matt is a first rate solid guy and I am pulling for him to reach his goals. The issue had been building over the season and despite those situations, Matt gave his word that he was coming back and was not going to put his name in the Portal. The staff was not told of the change in decision and initially found out thru reviewing the Portal applicants. Its in the rear view mirror and let's support the current roster/staff and observe the anticipated team improvement. The point is valid that he has a far better opportunity to play in MM with a different team. However, changing teams (per NBA scouts) even to more visible/better teams, generally speaking does not improve draft slot selections. Matt is working his butt offand has had a PT to improve his body composition (lose some weight) and I hope he excels this season.
71Bear
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Chapman_is_Gone said:

4thGenCal said:

Chabbear said:

The article mentions a practice facility which was a thread last week. Is the Practice facility real or a Chimera: (a thing that is hoped or wished for but in fact is illusory or impossible to achieve.)
Its a real topic and the AD is leading the push - several factors in discussion now from scope (location/size/serving just basketball or additional sports via weightroom/training facilities etc) and thus the variance in amount of needed funds to raise. Desperately needed for both basketball teams to have any lasting ability to be conference/nationally competitive. Only conference program without one and just one of four nationally as well for D1.
4th Gen Cal and Others,

I'm curious if you can answer this question. Why is there virtually zero information on key Cal sports issues communicated from the Athletic Department to die-hard fans? I get the sense that heavy donors get some information if they pry, but why can't all Cal fans have access to quality information? Why hide things?

Why not have a monthly "State of the Athletic Department" interview / newsletter / podcast, where issues are discussed, alternatives are considered, and fan question are addressed and answered if possible? I can think of 6 questions right off the top of my head that I've NEVER heard the Cal athletic department discuss with Cal fans:

1) Status of a practice facility for the basketball team, and an open discussion of cost estimates for everything from a bare bones facility to a spare-no-expense facility.

2) An open discussion of Learfield's benefits and costs. Is the AD even aware that there is a perception among Cal fans that the game day experience has deteriorated and the band doesn't play as much? If surveys indicate piped-in music is preferred by fans, can we get some insight into those surveys?

3) Is it true that we have stricter admissions standards for football and basketball than our peers, for no reason other than as a self-imposed limitation due to poor student athlete academic performance more than five years ago? If the higher standards are self-imposed, what goals could be achieved for those standards return to being in-line with our peers?

4) A full update on the band. How can we set a 10-year goal to increase the size of the band by 50%, including much more brass? What academic rules could be tweaked to make it more reasonable and attractive for students to devote so much time to being in the band?

5) When a new coach needs to be chosen, has the school considered the route, often proposed on this message board, of a "council of elders" who would recommend a group of finalists, rather than relying on a search firm that doesn't appreciate Cal's values and traditions?

6) What would it take for Memorial Stadium to return to natural grass? And for the rugby field to return to natural grass? What are the cost differences between natural grass and the fake stuff? Has the number of injuries suffered on grass vs. fake stuff been truly analyzed? Have the players been interviewed for their preferences? I do not believe ANY claims of artificial turf companies, having personally experienced what it's like to play on the crap (softball) to hearing just recently the best soccer players in the world complain about its effects on their bodies and on the sport (in the Champions League).

I don't feel like I am in an effective two-way communication with the Cal athletic department. I feel like poor decisions are being made, and at the very least, the fan base should be allowed to understand the rationale for decisions. That way, the logic behind those decisions can be seen, no matter how the decisions turn out. It is not healthy for die-hard Cal fans to be in the dark. Over a 5-year period I personally have gone from donating low five-figures per year to donating nothing. Doesn't Cal believe and understand that if they more effectively engaged their fan base, the result almost certainly would be positive? Why all the secrets?



It all circles back to Cal Administration. There has not been a clearly stated vision since I have followed Cal Athletics. Yes, there has been much lip service but no real action, no commitment to producing winning results.

The current AD may be the worst of the bunch who have held that position on a permanent basis in the last several decades. He clearly does not understand the role athletics play at Cal. He is just a glad handler who works feverishly to keep smoke and mirrors in place in order to avoid being held accountable for the poorest results by Cal Athletics in several decades. And, of course, his handling of the process to select a men's BB Coach was a master class in how NOT to hire a collegiate head coach of a revenue producing program.

We constantly hear from the donor community that all is well and big things are right around the corner. Obviously, they are being hoodwinked by the master magician in the AD's office. Otherwise, we would be seeing improvement on the field and court.





HoopDreams
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4thGen:
Final point to those that say "run to the hills, ship without a rudder, plane w/o a pilot" etc "Money does not talk, it shouts"! Cal is last in many needed competitive areas and all make the job of HC even tougher than viewed from afar. IE, last in conference in charter flights for players (cuts into practice and study time), non existent for coaches recruiting effectiveness (unlike nearly all conf teams and top programs), low staff pay scale (compared to conf teams), at the near bottom (not all teams info available) for basketball support funds. No practice facility (only one in conf to not have one, one of just 4 D1 schools nationally).

Thanks 4thGen for the info. You obviously have a lot of insight into the program so your info is very appreciated. I think the right coach can break though some of our short-comings, but it's not easy. IMHO, Martin was one of those coaches, but I didn't think he would stay long term, especially after Cal didn't admit his son (which I still find very frustrating considering how good a student I understand he is)

All of our challenges that you listed (no practice facilities, fewer charters, etc) can really only be addressed with money, and the majority of that money needs to come from revenues and fund raising. Revenues is a chicken and egg issue, so the key thing to break the cycle is fund raising

As a flagship university, with many wealthy alum and supporters of the great university, why does our fund raising lag the majority of our conference and P6 schools?

I'm not talking about the USC, Oregon, Texas of the world. I'm talking about Utah, ASU, WSU and apparently even OSU.... or San Diego State, etc?

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