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HKBear97!
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Big C said:

HKBear97! said:

Big C said:


These "death" analogies are way off base, IMO. There's no coming back from death, but if we commit to the practice facility we get a solid coach, we're back in it. Heck, we do one of those and it's a start (and one helps with the other).

This is absolutely not a hopeless situation, although it does take a pretty significant investment.


This is college sports. The ONLY thing we need is a good coach. Tedford (early years Tedford, not late) took an absolute mess of a program and made it exciting again. You can do that even faster in basketball with the right hire. Do that and everything else will come to fruition.

Where we stand now, coaches who might be the "right hire" look at us and see the only school in the conference without a practice facility. They don't even bother to interview. We're trying to compete with one hand tied behind our back. Check that... we're not really trying to compete.


Then they are not the "right hire". This program is an opportunity to build something. Great school, great location, fairly strong basketball tradition. We've heard there's a plan in place for a practice facility, so there is support there provided a leader comes in to take it to the next level. If a coach can't see the potential then they clearly are not the "right hire."
socaltownie
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HKBear97! said:

Big C said:

HKBear97! said:

Big C said:


These "death" analogies are way off base, IMO. There's no coming back from death, but if we commit to the practice facility we get a solid coach, we're back in it. Heck, we do one of those and it's a start (and one helps with the other).

This is absolutely not a hopeless situation, although it does take a pretty significant investment.


This is college sports. The ONLY thing we need is a good coach. Tedford (early years Tedford, not late) took an absolute mess of a program and made it exciting again. You can do that even faster in basketball with the right hire. Do that and everything else will come to fruition.

Where we stand now, coaches who might be the "right hire" look at us and see the only school in the conference without a practice facility. They don't even bother to interview. We're trying to compete with one hand tied behind our back. Check that... we're not really trying to compete.


Then they are not the "right hire". This program is an opportunity to build something. Great school, great location, fairly strong basketball tradition. We've heard there's a plan in place for a practice facility, so there is support there provided a leader comes in to take it to the next level. If a coach can't see the potential then they clearly are not the "right hire."
AND arguably - a conference that is in a great place to compete - with UCLA resurgent, U of A looking great, Oregon being Oregon under ALtman and USC locking down Andy E. We are not at ACC level (which so benefits from ESPN hype) but we have a solid core that should do well in this years dance and beyond.
Take care of your Chicken
Big C
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HKBear97! said:

Big C said:

HKBear97! said:

Big C said:


These "death" analogies are way off base, IMO. There's no coming back from death, but if we commit to the practice facility we get a solid coach, we're back in it. Heck, we do one of those and it's a start (and one helps with the other).

This is absolutely not a hopeless situation, although it does take a pretty significant investment.


This is college sports. The ONLY thing we need is a good coach. Tedford (early years Tedford, not late) took an absolute mess of a program and made it exciting again. You can do that even faster in basketball with the right hire. Do that and everything else will come to fruition.

Where we stand now, coaches who might be the "right hire" look at us and see the only school in the conference without a practice facility. They don't even bother to interview. We're trying to compete with one hand tied behind our back. Check that... we're not really trying to compete.


Then they are not the "right hire". This program is an opportunity to build something. Great school, great location, fairly strong basketball tradition. We've heard there's a plan in place for a practice facility, so there is support there provided a leader comes in to take it to the next level. If a coach can't see the potential then they clearly are not the "right hire."

You and I love Cal, but prospective coaches might not see it as we do. This might be why the candidates list hasn't looked too impressive, the past few times we've been hiring.
HKBear97!
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Big C said:

HKBear97! said:

Big C said:

HKBear97! said:

Big C said:


These "death" analogies are way off base, IMO. There's no coming back from death, but if we commit to the practice facility we get a solid coach, we're back in it. Heck, we do one of those and it's a start (and one helps with the other).

This is absolutely not a hopeless situation, although it does take a pretty significant investment.


This is college sports. The ONLY thing we need is a good coach. Tedford (early years Tedford, not late) took an absolute mess of a program and made it exciting again. You can do that even faster in basketball with the right hire. Do that and everything else will come to fruition.

Where we stand now, coaches who might be the "right hire" look at us and see the only school in the conference without a practice facility. They don't even bother to interview. We're trying to compete with one hand tied behind our back. Check that... we're not really trying to compete.


Then they are not the "right hire". This program is an opportunity to build something. Great school, great location, fairly strong basketball tradition. We've heard there's a plan in place for a practice facility, so there is support there provided a leader comes in to take it to the next level. If a coach can't see the potential then they clearly are not the "right hire."

You and I love Cal, but prospective coaches might not see it as we do. This might be why the candidates list hasn't looked too impressive, the past few times we've been hiring.


The last two hires (Wyking and Fox) say more about the one doing the hiring than the interest list.
calumnus
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HKBear97! said:

Big C said:

HKBear97! said:

Big C said:

HKBear97! said:

Big C said:


These "death" analogies are way off base, IMO. There's no coming back from death, but if we commit to the practice facility we get a solid coach, we're back in it. Heck, we do one of those and it's a start (and one helps with the other).

This is absolutely not a hopeless situation, although it does take a pretty significant investment.


This is college sports. The ONLY thing we need is a good coach. Tedford (early years Tedford, not late) took an absolute mess of a program and made it exciting again. You can do that even faster in basketball with the right hire. Do that and everything else will come to fruition.

Where we stand now, coaches who might be the "right hire" look at us and see the only school in the conference without a practice facility. They don't even bother to interview. We're trying to compete with one hand tied behind our back. Check that... we're not really trying to compete.


Then they are not the "right hire". This program is an opportunity to build something. Great school, great location, fairly strong basketball tradition. We've heard there's a plan in place for a practice facility, so there is support there provided a leader comes in to take it to the next level. If a coach can't see the potential then they clearly are not the "right hire."

You and I love Cal, but prospective coaches might not see it as we do. This might be why the candidates list hasn't looked too impressive, the past few times we've been hiring.


The last two hires (Wyking and Fox) say more about the one doing the hiring than the interest list.


Exactly. Jason Kidd, currently HC of the Dallas Mavericks, was a "special assistant" for the Lakers at the time and told a reporter Cal was the only college job he was interested in. Eric Musselman lobbied hard for the Cal job. Mike Montgomery was already a Hall of Famer and could have taken almost any job in the country, but took Cal. Cuonzo Martin had just taken Tennessee to the Sweet 16 when he took the Cal job, and we had no plans for a dedicated practice facility then.

Besides, we are talking about promoting a coach from someplace like Montana, Portland, Cleveland State or USF. We pay $millions more than those places. Talk about Cal being undesirable for a coach like that is ridiculous.
Big C
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calumnus said:

HKBear97! said:

Big C said:

HKBear97! said:

Big C said:

HKBear97! said:

Big C said:


These "death" analogies are way off base, IMO. There's no coming back from death, but if we commit to the practice facility we get a solid coach, we're back in it. Heck, we do one of those and it's a start (and one helps with the other).

This is absolutely not a hopeless situation, although it does take a pretty significant investment.


This is college sports. The ONLY thing we need is a good coach. Tedford (early years Tedford, not late) took an absolute mess of a program and made it exciting again. You can do that even faster in basketball with the right hire. Do that and everything else will come to fruition.

Where we stand now, coaches who might be the "right hire" look at us and see the only school in the conference without a practice facility. They don't even bother to interview. We're trying to compete with one hand tied behind our back. Check that... we're not really trying to compete.


Then they are not the "right hire". This program is an opportunity to build something. Great school, great location, fairly strong basketball tradition. We've heard there's a plan in place for a practice facility, so there is support there provided a leader comes in to take it to the next level. If a coach can't see the potential then they clearly are not the "right hire."

You and I love Cal, but prospective coaches might not see it as we do. This might be why the candidates list hasn't looked too impressive, the past few times we've been hiring.


The last two hires (Wyking and Fox) say more about the one doing the hiring than the interest list.


Exactly. Jason Kidd, currently HC of the Dallas Mavericks, was a "special assistant" for the Lakers at the time and told a reporter Cal was the only college job he was interested in. Eric Musselman lobbied hard for the Cal job. Mike Montgomery was already a Hall of Famer and could have taken almost any job in the country, but took Cal. Cuonzo Martin had just taken Tennessee to the Sweet 16 when he took the Cal job, and we had no plans for a dedicated practice facility then.

Besides, we are talking about promoting a coach from someplace like Montana, Portland, Cleveland State or USF. We pay $millions more than those places. Talk about Cal being undesirable for a coach like that is ridiculous.

Which is it? Your first paragraph, where we supposedly get all these great candidates?
Or your second, where we need to hire from Montana, Portland, Cleveland State and USF?

Jason Kidd: People say things to reporters. Let's revisit when he takes the job.
Montgomery: Fifteen years ago, we weren't as undesirable. Also he wasn't coaching when we hired him.
Martin: Cal was a halfway desirable place to be after Montgomery. It's because of the way we treated Cuonzo Martin that we are now not very desirable.

The practice facility thing has only become an issue in the past ten years, as everybody else in our conference has one now and we don't. Look at the candidate list we ourselves have drawn up: Mostly people in lesser jobs who have a Cal connection. What does that tell you when "we pay $millions more than those places" and yet that is our pool?

I'll believe Cal is a desirable place to coach basketball when we can attract coaches who are currently employed at a job that pays at least 65% of what we would pay them.
sonofabear51
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HKBear97!
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Those prospects from the smaller schools are good coaching candidates. We're not and should not be hiring a big name, established coach. We need to find an up-and-comer to fill this role and that is where an experienced and strong AD comes in.

And I still disagree that we can't entertain a good list of candidates. From all reports, there was a very intriguing list of options for Williams when Cuonzo was hired away. He simply made a terrible decision. As for the Fox hire, Knowlton took two days - TWO FREAKING DAYS - to interview people. That was after reversing course on firing, no keeping, no firing Wyking. A competent AD would have had many more options.
Big C
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HKBear97! said:

Those prospects from the smaller schools are good coaching candidates. We're not and should not be hiring a big name, established coach. We need to find an up-and-comer to fill this role and that is where an experienced and strong AD comes in.

And I still disagree that we can't entertain a good list of candidates. From all reports, there was a very intriguing list of options for Williams when Cuonzo was hired away. He simply made a terrible decision. As for the Fox hire, Knowlton took two days - TWO FREAKING DAYS - to interview people. That was after reversing course on firing, no keeping, no firing Wyking. A competent AD would have had many more options.

We probably agree on all this more than we disagree (and I always agree more than I disagree with Calumnus).

Cal has a lot going for it and can be a desirable place to be for a coach, but the past several years, I feel like we're a school that doesn't look like we're serious about winning men's basketball. Some of it is the lack of a practice facility, which didn't used to be a thing, but has become a thing. Some of it is the way we jerked around Cuonzo Martin. Some of it is the way the ADs have driven the program downward with the last two coaching hires.

We all agree we can do better in terms of coaching. I just think that, in addition, getting a practice facility makes it easier for us to attract the coaches and players we want. Many people agree with this, which is why we're trying to move forward with it. Go Bears!
bearister
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I am not competent to opine whether The Sheriff would be a good coach for Cal or not. What I do know is that I have always liked the cut of that man's jib. If I was a business employer, I have the strong feeling that after the interview, I would shake his hand and hire him on the spot. A frivolous person, he isn't. I have had my fill of bullsh@itters and posers. Kyle Smith is the same type of guy. They are "share a foxhole with" type of dudes.
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Bobodeluxe
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stu said:

Civil Bear said:

I get the jest of what you are saying, but the program hardly had talent or momentum coming off of Martin's last year. The best returning offensive player by a wide margin was Coleman, and the last game had like 500 fans.
None of whom wanted to see more.
Last game I paid to attend. Last year I donated to the program.

Con was horrible. Rich, but horrible.
calumnus
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Big C said:

HKBear97! said:

Those prospects from the smaller schools are good coaching candidates. We're not and should not be hiring a big name, established coach. We need to find an up-and-comer to fill this role and that is where an experienced and strong AD comes in.

And I still disagree that we can't entertain a good list of candidates. From all reports, there was a very intriguing list of options for Williams when Cuonzo was hired away. He simply made a terrible decision. As for the Fox hire, Knowlton took two days - TWO FREAKING DAYS - to interview people. That was after reversing course on firing, no keeping, no firing Wyking. A competent AD would have had many more options.

We probably agree on all this more than we disagree (and I always agree more than I disagree with Calumnus).

Cal has a lot going for it and can be a desirable place to be for a coach, but the past several years, I feel like we're a school that doesn't look like we're serious about winning men's basketball. Some of it is the lack of a practice facility, which didn't used to be a thing, but has become a thing. Some of it is the way we jerked around Cuonzo Martin. Some of it is the way the ADs have driven the program downward with the last two coaching hires.

We all agree we can do better in terms of coaching. I just think that, in addition, getting a practice facility makes it easier for us to attract the coaches and players we want. Many people agree with this, which is why we're trying to move forward with it. Go Bears!


Yes,all things being equal we would be more attractive and should be able to get a better coach with a dedicated practice facility. Just like, all things considered we should be able to hire far better football coaches with the half a $billion upgrade in our football facilities. We still have always hired up and comers in football and our success has always depended on the quality of the up and comer we hire. We have had worse on the field results after the facilities were built than before. It is the coaching.

In basketball, we have actually hired two established coaches: Montgomery and Martin, and we had our best success under them since Kidd. Still, we mostly hire up and comers, we just don't always choose well, especially the last two.

There are plans on the board for the faculty you want, but the best way to get it is to hire a good up and coming coach who can start winning and inspire the donors. That is how we did it in football.

Though I still think expensive practice facilities will be anachronisms on the era of NIL.

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