A Plea to Temper Expectations on New Players

5,644 Views | 48 Replies | Last: 1 yr ago by BeachedBear
GMP
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I would like to make this plea to temper expectations of our new hoopers.

There is a lot of excitement around our basketball program right now. I am more excited about Cal basketball than I've been in 7 years. It's clear a lot of you feel the same way. With the commitment of Aikmak and the hoped-for commitment of Cone, we all have watched the highlights and man...they look great. The numbers look good, too.

But they are still college basketball players. And they have flaws like every other college basketball player. They aren't at Duke (as an example), for a reason. But even players at Duke have flaws - and have bad games, weeks, and months.

In 2016, we had Jaylen Brown. He was a 5*, top 4 rated in his class, as I recall. He came with another highly recruited players in Ivan Rabb, who was ranked in the top 10. Brown and Rabb joined other accomplished guys like Tyrone Wallace, Jabari Bird, and Jordan Mathews. The team did well - our highest seed ever and went undefeated at home.

But that season there was a very vocal contingent of Cal fans on this board who ripped Brown - called his game ugly, said he was selfish, called him a bull in a china shop, said he couldn't shoot.

Brown was not a finished product and he worked hard on his game. He is very likely going to be named to the All-NBA First Team this season. His game is light years beyond what it was in college. But...he was still really good in college. Rabb had his own flaws, too. But again, he was also a really good player.

Brown and Rabb weren't saviors. Neither is Aimak. Neither is Cone. But the rhetoric around them (including a quote from Aimak) himself has be concerned that we could see similar backlash against them next season if we are not a Top 10 team.

Ignore my concerns if you wish. I just think we'd all be happier, and this board a more pleasant place, if we all temper our expectations and enjoy the ride.
85Bear
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I'm just happy for signs of life in our program and hopefully a return to relevance, and last but not least, I am happy that our coach is engaging the fans and media to develop a connection and rooting interest.
socaltownie
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Oh absolutely. Just have on your computer a short cut to "Go back and root for the picket fence".

There is a contingent of posters here who are not happy with the general direction the sport has taken over the past 50 years and take it out on the players. Ignore is your friend. I believe most of these people also think Steph is too much of a ball hog and isn't good for the game since he doesn't shot a push jump shot.
GMP
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85Bear said:

I'm just happy for signs of life in our program and hopefully a return to relevance, and last but not least, I am happy that our coach is engaging the fans and media to develop a connection and rooting interest.

100%
parentswerebears
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This is my feeling too!
BeachedBear
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GMP looking out for the emotional health of BI - Thanks.

Agree. There is a lot of difference between the recruiting expectations of 8-20 years ago versus the last 7. I think there is a enough room to have a little hope, a little caution and a little dread.
oskidunker
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I bet we win a lot of non conference games by just playing smart instead of stupid.
Go Bears!
dimitrig
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I will be happy if the team finishes .500 next year and is playing better at the end of the year than at the beginning.

We were a 3 win team. We aren't going to win 20 all of a sudden unless Madsen pulls some major recruiting coups.

calumnus
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socaltownie said:

Oh absolutely. Just have on your computer a short cut to "Go back and root for the picket fence".

There is a contingent of posters here who are not happy with the general direction the sport has taken over the past 50 years and take it out on the players. Ignore is your friend. I believe most of these people also think Steph is too much of a ball hog and isn't good for the game since he doesn't shot a push jump shot.


It is strange but there is a contingent of Cal fans that focus their criticism on the more highly rated and successful (ie our best) players in football and basketball.
KoreAmBear
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So far I sense a wait and see sentiment from our hard core basketball fans (which number only a few at this point), but good looking out as that can change rather quickly. I have my doubts that we can get to the level of early Cuonzo recruiting that quickly from the abyss, and even if we do land a couple of blue chippers, the excitement will still tempered ... because we are coming out of the abyss.
Big C
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Where is the Final Four being played next season? I hear it's smart to book early...
KoreAmBear
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Big C said:


Where is the Final Four being played next season? I hear it's smart to book early...
I dunno but Mark Fox will be lurking and passing out resumes.
BeachedBear
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KoreAmBear said:

Big C said:


Where is the Final Four being played next season? I hear it's smart to book early...
I dunno but Mark Fox will be lurking and passing out resumes 'off the road' (every year for a long, long time).
FIFY


Hey Mods: Please move this to the Mark Fox Venting(mocking) Tent thread!
PtownBear1
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I've never bashed any Cal players, but I'm not seeing how the inconsistencies of 18 and 19-year-old frosh should lead to tempered expectations for 23 and 24-year old grad transfers.
GMP
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PtownBear1 said:

I've never bashed any Cal players, but I'm not seeing how the inconsistencies of 18 and 19-year-old frosh should lead to tempered expectations for 23 and 24-year old grad transfers.

Jaylen Brown was the #4 ranked player in the country and a future All NBA First Teamer. Rabb was the #7 ranked player in the country and had some time in the NBA.

Aimak and Cone are older but don't have the same pedigree. But your post kinda proves my point. You're suggesting that they should be even better than Brown and Rabb were.
bearister
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Big C said:


Where is the Final Four being played next season? I hear it's smart to book early...


Big C, I, on the other hand, reside in the Jerry Brown "Era of Limits and Lowered Expectations Zone." If Madsen and the team don't lose 16 in a row to tie the Foxorama and Wyking's co school record….



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Cal_79
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GMP said:

PtownBear1 said:

I've never bashed any Cal players, but I'm not seeing how the inconsistencies of 18 and 19-year-old frosh should lead to tempered expectations for 23 and 24-year old grad transfers.

Jaylen Brown was the #4 ranked player in the country and a future All NBA First Teamer. Rabb was the #7 ranked player in the country and had some time in the NBA.

Aimak and Cone are older but don't have the same pedigree. But your post kinda proves my point. You're suggesting that they should be even better than Brown and Rabb were.

How so? I'm likely more mature now than Jaylen Brown was as a frosh; in what way would this suggest I should be a better player now than he was then?
bearister
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Rabb cost himself millions hanging around an extra year in a rudderless program. He was overvalued in the NBA Draft after his 1st Cal season. I hope Cuonzo Martin played no role in convincing him to stay. If he did, he f'd him bad.

For Ivan Rabb, returning to Cal for another season was as simple choice | Sports Illustrated


https://www.si.com/college/2016/06/09/ivan-rabb-california-golden-bears-nba-draft

* He went from a potential top 10 pick to # 35 overall, 2nd Round. Great advisors.
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graguna
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GMP said:

PtownBear1 said:

I've never bashed any Cal players, but I'm not seeing how the inconsistencies of 18 and 19-year-old frosh should lead to tempered expectations for 23 and 24-year old grad transfers.

Jaylen Brown was the #4 ranked player in the country and a future All NBA First Teamer. Rabb was the #7 ranked player in the country and had some time in the NBA.

Aimak and Cone are older but don't have the same pedigree. But your post kinda proves my point. You're suggesting that they should be even better than Brown and Rabb were.
I completely understand your original point and agree that expectation should be tempered. However, I do expect Aimak and Cone to be better at this point in their careers than Brown and Rabb were as freshmen. Not better than Brown is today just better than he was when he was 18.
bluesaxe
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bearister said:

Big C said:


Where is the Final Four being played next season? I hear it's smart to book early...


Big C, I, on the other hand, reside in the Jerry Brown "Era of Limits and Lowered Expectations Zone." If Madsen and the team don't lose 16 in a row to tie the Foxorama and Wyking's co school record….




Don't forget the psychic benefits of being associated with the University.
bluesaxe
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Cal_79 said:

GMP said:

PtownBear1 said:

I've never bashed any Cal players, but I'm not seeing how the inconsistencies of 18 and 19-year-old frosh should lead to tempered expectations for 23 and 24-year old grad transfers.

Jaylen Brown was the #4 ranked player in the country and a future All NBA First Teamer. Rabb was the #7 ranked player in the country and had some time in the NBA.

Aimak and Cone are older but don't have the same pedigree. But your post kinda proves my point. You're suggesting that they should be even better than Brown and Rabb were.

How so? I'm likely more mature now than Jaylen Brown was as a frosh; in what way would this suggest I should be a better player now than he was then?
I think there's a tendency to underrate how good Brown was as a freshman.
annarborbear
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It is a new era. If you are asking for large amounts of NIL, and bargaining between schools for it, then the expectations are going to be just as high as for any professional.
HoopDreams
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do you mean the Jaylen Brown who the Pac 12 coaches voted for to win conference freshmen POY and first tram all conference?



bluesaxe said:

Cal_79 said:

GMP said:

PtownBear1 said:

I've never bashed any Cal players, but I'm not seeing how the inconsistencies of 18 and 19-year-old frosh should lead to tempered expectations for 23 and 24-year old grad transfers.

Jaylen Brown was the #4 ranked player in the country and a future All NBA First Teamer. Rabb was the #7 ranked player in the country and had some time in the NBA.

Aimak and Cone are older but don't have the same pedigree. But your post kinda proves my point. You're suggesting that they should be even better than Brown and Rabb were.

How so? I'm likely more mature now than Jaylen Brown was as a frosh; in what way would this suggest I should be a better player now than he was then?
I think there's a tendency to underrate how good Brown was as a freshman.
bearister
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bluesaxe said:

Cal_79 said:

GMP said:

PtownBear1 said:

I've never bashed any Cal players, but I'm not seeing how the inconsistencies of 18 and 19-year-old frosh should lead to tempered expectations for 23 and 24-year old grad transfers.

Jaylen Brown was the #4 ranked player in the country and a future All NBA First Teamer. Rabb was the #7 ranked player in the country and had some time in the NBA.

Aimak and Cone are older but don't have the same pedigree. But your post kinda proves my point. You're suggesting that they should be even better than Brown and Rabb were.

How so? I'm likely more mature now than Jaylen Brown was as a frosh; in what way would this suggest I should be a better player now than he was then?
I think there's a tendency to underrate how good Brown was as a freshman.

2016 NBA Draft: Jaylen Brown scouting report - NBC Sports RSN


https://www.nbcsports.com/boston/2016-nba-draft-jaylen-brown-california-forward-scouting-report

I focused on his negatives when he was at Cal. Someone in the Celtic organization focused on his strengths and believed his weaknesses could be fixed. That person (s) called it and drafted him # 3…..and the rest is history.

In other news…

Celtics Trade Rumors: Jaylen Brown to Trail Blazers, Team Up with Damian Lillard? - Blazer's Edge


https://www.blazersedge.com/2023/4/10/23677823/boston-celtics-trade-rumors-jaylen-brown-portland-trail-blazers-damian-lillard
*At 6'6 with inadequate handles and a substandard 3 ball, I didn't see those deficiencies as so quickly remedied. His lightening fast first step and explosiveness were apparent at Cal.
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calumnus
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HoopDreams said:

do you mean the Jaylen Brown who the Pac 12 coaches voted for to win conference freshmen POY and first tram all conference?



bluesaxe said:

Cal_79 said:

GMP said:

PtownBear1 said:

I've never bashed any Cal players, but I'm not seeing how the inconsistencies of 18 and 19-year-old frosh should lead to tempered expectations for 23 and 24-year old grad transfers.

Jaylen Brown was the #4 ranked player in the country and a future All NBA First Teamer. Rabb was the #7 ranked player in the country and had some time in the NBA.

Aimak and Cone are older but don't have the same pedigree. But your post kinda proves my point. You're suggesting that they should be even better than Brown and Rabb were.

How so? I'm likely more mature now than Jaylen Brown was as a frosh; in what way would this suggest I should be a better player now than he was then?
I think there's a tendency to underrate how good Brown was as a freshman.



Called "the most explosive player in college basketball."

BearHunter
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Big C said:


Where is the Final Four being played next season? I hear it's smart to book early...


Mad Dog said we're going to be hanging banners at Haas in the not too distant future. Why should l not believe him?

Go Bears.
ducky23
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The brown/rabb team was a 4 seed and had legit final 4 aspirations.

I don't think I've seen a single poster saying we're going to come close to making the tourney next year. The majority of us would be ecstatic just to make the NIT.

I appreciate you trying to temper expectations, but if there's one thing us cal fans do well is learning to live with disappointment.
HoopDreams
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don't limit the possibilities with negative thinking


BeachedBear
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BearHunter said:

Big C said:


Where is the Final Four being played next season? I hear it's smart to book early...


Mad Dog said we're going to be hanging banners at Haas in the not too distant future. Why should l not believe him?

Go Bears.
JK assumed that was another reminder from annoying boosters about the old banners and doing the 'simple things'. he asked the cheerleading coach to take care of that last season.
socaltownie
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ducky23 said:

The brown/rabb team was a 4 seed and had legit final 4 aspirations.

I don't think I've seen a single poster saying we're going to come close to making the tourney next year. The majority of us would be ecstatic just to make the NIT.

I appreciate you trying to temper expectations, but if there's one thing us cal fans do well is learning to live with disappointment.
This. And they might have been a bit higher if Tye hadn't missed that month with his first hand injury.

It was a SERIOUSLY loaded team and so much fun to watch. And at least 2 posters have independently said Jaylen was coached repeatedly not to put head down and go but it didn't stick. He was good for 2 player control fouls in the first half ;-)
OldenBear
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edwinbear
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Leave it to BI to remind us to hedge our emotions haha
RedlessWardrobe
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I'm in complete agreement with the sentiments of this issue.

Wait a minute...... Jalen Cone now on his way. Where is the site of next year's Final Four? Need to make my travel plans!
oskidunker
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RedlessWardrobe said:

I'm in complete agreement with the sentiments of this issue.

Wait a minute...... Jalen Cone now on his way. Where is the site of next year's Final Four? Need to make my travel plans!
Nau was not a great team. Cone was often the high scorer.. also did well against Michigan State and The Scum Devils .hoping he can be almost as good as Randle.
Go Bears!
Civil Bear
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graguna said:

GMP said:

PtownBear1 said:

I've never bashed any Cal players, but I'm not seeing how the inconsistencies of 18 and 19-year-old frosh should lead to tempered expectations for 23 and 24-year old grad transfers.

Jaylen Brown was the #4 ranked player in the country and a future All NBA First Teamer. Rabb was the #7 ranked player in the country and had some time in the NBA.

Aimak and Cone are older but don't have the same pedigree. But your post kinda proves my point. You're suggesting that they should be even better than Brown and Rabb were.
I completely understand your original point and agree that expectation should be tempered. However, I do expect Aimak and Cone to be better at this point in their careers than Brown and Rabb were as freshmen. Not better than Brown is today just better than he was when he was 18.

Cone was a non-starter in the ACC and 3rd team all-conference in the Big Sky. Stats and video look good, but I doubt he is at the level of a freshman Jalen Brown.
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