The top 25 shooting guards in college basketball since 2000

According to ChatGPT🏀 pic.twitter.com/46WkIYmcLQ

— College Basketball Report (@CBKReport) May 27, 2023

Big C said:

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^^^ Interesting AI list. I'm guessing the fact that the best shooting guards went to the NBA before making a huge impact in college influences this list. Love Allen Crabbe, but he seems a little high at #8.

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dimitrig said:

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Big C said:

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^^^ Interesting AI list. I'm guessing the fact that the best shooting guards went to the NBA before making a huge impact in college influences this list. Love Allen Crabbe, but he seems a little high at #8.

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Not even sure he was the best guard at Cal over that time period.

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Big C said:

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^^^ Interesting AI list. I'm guessing the fact that the best shooting guards went to the NBA before making a huge impact in college influences this list. Love Allen Crabbe, but he seems a little high at #8.

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BeachedBear said:

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Big C said:

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^^^ Interesting AI list. I'm guessing the fact that the best shooting guards went to the NBA before making a huge impact in college influences this list. Love Allen Crabbe, but he seems a little high at #8.

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And Adam Morrison seems a little low at #10. At least based on what he did at Gonzaga (not NBA).

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calumnus said:

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dimitrig said:

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Big C said:

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^^^ Interesting AI list. I'm guessing the fact that the best shooting guards went to the NBA before making a huge impact in college influences this list. Love Allen Crabbe, but he seems a little high at #8.

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Not even sure he was the best guard at Cal over that time period.

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Only because he was a small forward at Cal

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SFCityBear said:

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calumnus said:

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dimitrig said:

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Big C said:

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^^^ Interesting AI list. I'm guessing the fact that the best shooting guards went to the NBA before making a huge impact in college influences this list. Love Allen Crabbe, but he seems a little high at #8.

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Not even sure he was the best guard at Cal over that time period.

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Only because he was a small forward at Cal

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Crabbe may have looked like a forward because he was taller than the other guards on his Cal teams, but he was always listed as a guard in the starting lineups, as Montgomery went with a starting lineup of three guards and two forwards during all of Crabbe's three seasons at Cal. Sports-reference.com also lists Crabbe as a guard.

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Big C said:

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^^^ Interesting AI list. I'm guessing the fact that the best shooting guards went to the NBA before making a huge impact in college influences this list. Love Allen Crabbe, but he seems a little high at #8.

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Big C said:

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^^^ Agree 100% on Klay, who was a better college player than Jaylen Brown. Seems like there might be others left off as well, but I don't follow non-Cal college basketball closely enough anymore to be able to think of any. Haphazard list.

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oskidunker said:

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Improve the concessions. Open mre of them restore the fruit freezes. Bring back the bbq.

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calumnus said:

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Big C said:

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^^^ Agree 100% on Klay, who was a better college player than Jaylen Brown. Seems like there might be others left off as well, but I don't follow non-Cal college basketball closely enough anymore to be able to think of any. Haphazard list.

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Great example of ChatGPT. The information is "pretty good" and looks OK to a casual observer, but can be picked apart by humans who have pretty good knowledge on the subject.

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HearstMining said:

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calumnus said:

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Big C said:

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^^^ Agree 100% on Klay, who was a better college player than Jaylen Brown. Seems like there might be others left off as well, but I don't follow non-Cal college basketball closely enough anymore to be able to think of any. Haphazard list.

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Great example of ChatGPT. The information is "pretty good" and looks OK to a casual observer, but can be picked apart by humans who have pretty good knowledge on the subject.

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I'd think ChatGPT would heavily weigh where the player was drafted by the NBA but apparently not. In this analysis. Klay was drafted #11. Crabbe (and I'm not down on Crabbe - I liked watching the guy play) was a second round pick.

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Jeff82 said:

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SFCityBear said:

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MinotStateBeav said:

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Remove the air conditioners, Bring back the Harmon Gym sweats!!! My favorite game of all time in Harmon was Cal vs Illinois in a 3OT thriller. I think it was Ed Gray who hit the game winning free throws. 96-97 team was sooo good. Ed Gray, Shareef, Anwar McQueen, Tony Gonzalez and the Duck starting 5. Such a fun team.

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MinotStateBeav,

Thanks for the special memory of your favorite game at Harmon. You are absolutely right about the 1996-1997 Cal basketball team. They were very exciting, and one of Cal's very best teams.

With all due respect, I'd like to add couple of minor corrections. You seem to be writing about two different teams, or maybe conflating them into one team. To begin with, Shareef was not a member of the 1996-1997 team. He played at Cal just one season, 1995-1996, and then left Cal for the NBA. That team, while successful to a degree, was coached by Todd Bozeman, who was fired after the season due to recruiting violations.

The 1996-1997 team was coached by Ben Braun, and the usual starters were Randy Duck (32 games), Yogi Stewart (32), Prentice McGruder (30), Al Grigsby (17), Sean Marks (15), Tony Gonzalez (6) , and Anwar McQueen (3). That team did beat Illinois at Harmon in 2 OT periods, according to Sports-Reference.com. The team finished 23-9, 12-6 in the PAC10 (3rd place). UCLA was perhaps the best team during conference play, and Cal lost to UCLA at Harmon, but later beat UCLA in Pauley. The team suffered a major setback when Ed Gray broke a leg at the end of the regular season, and was not available for the NCAA Tournament. In spite of that, Cal had a great run. In the 1st round Cal beat Ivy League Champion Princeton, and then in the 2nd round Cal upset Big East Champion, #20 Villanova. In the Sweet 16 Round, Cal nearly knocked off #4 North Carolina, featuring Antawn Jamison and Vince Carter, and coached by the legendary Dean Smith. Cal grabbed a 9 point lead, but went cold in the 2nd half. You may remember 1997 was the year that Arizona (5th place in the PAC10), went on to win the NCAA Championship. And Cal had split with Arizona during the season, losing to them at McKale 81-80, and beating then #12 Arizona at Harmon 79-77.

The Cal team of 1995-1996, coached by Todd Bozeman, had a usual starting lineup of Shareef (28 games), Duck (27), Stewart (22), Gardner (17), Gray (12), McGruder (12), Gonzalez (7), Fowlkes (7), McQueen (7). Cal finished 17-11, and11-7, in conference, which would have been good for 4th place, but their conference wins were vacated due to the recruiting scandals, and Cal finished 10th.

With all the departures to the pros and other schools, Ben Braun inherited roster depleted of highly ranked talent, and it is to his great credit that he was able to cobble together a team which played even better than Bozeman's teams and most its star power, Shareef, Fowlkes, and Gardner. Especially with the injury to Gray before the tournament, leaving Cal without any one-on-one talent, he got the team to play together and achieve more than the year before under Bozeman. Maybe Ben Braun's finest hour as Cal coach.

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If Ed Gray doesn't get hurt, the 96-97 team probably goes to the Final Four. With Gray, who averaged 23 ppg, they would have beaten North Carolina.

That team was ultra-experienced, with the top eight players all juniors or seniors. And they were great athletes. Randy Duck, as a sophomore I believe, actually broke his arm against the backboard, leaping to block a shot. Marks and Yogi could run the floor, and they had Magruder as the defensive specialist against the other teams best shooter. That team had all the pieces, which is why they made it to weekend two, even after Ed's injury. When he got hurt, Tony G. had to play major minutes, and he basically ran out of gas in the second half against the Tar Heels. That is the best Cal team in the post-Newell era, without question.

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Big C said:

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Jeff82 said:

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SFCityBear said:

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MinotStateBeav said:

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Remove the air conditioners, Bring back the Harmon Gym sweats!!! My favorite game of all time in Harmon was Cal vs Illinois in a 3OT thriller. I think it was Ed Gray who hit the game winning free throws. 96-97 team was sooo good. Ed Gray, Shareef, Anwar McQueen, Tony Gonzalez and the Duck starting 5. Such a fun team.

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MinotStateBeav,

Thanks for the special memory of your favorite game at Harmon. You are absolutely right about the 1996-1997 Cal basketball team. They were very exciting, and one of Cal's very best teams.

With all due respect, I'd like to add couple of minor corrections. You seem to be writing about two different teams, or maybe conflating them into one team. To begin with, Shareef was not a member of the 1996-1997 team. He played at Cal just one season, 1995-1996, and then left Cal for the NBA. That team, while successful to a degree, was coached by Todd Bozeman, who was fired after the season due to recruiting violations.

The 1996-1997 team was coached by Ben Braun, and the usual starters were Randy Duck (32 games), Yogi Stewart (32), Prentice McGruder (30), Al Grigsby (17), Sean Marks (15), Tony Gonzalez (6) , and Anwar McQueen (3). That team did beat Illinois at Harmon in 2 OT periods, according to Sports-Reference.com. The team finished 23-9, 12-6 in the PAC10 (3rd place). UCLA was perhaps the best team during conference play, and Cal lost to UCLA at Harmon, but later beat UCLA in Pauley. The team suffered a major setback when Ed Gray broke a leg at the end of the regular season, and was not available for the NCAA Tournament. In spite of that, Cal had a great run. In the 1st round Cal beat Ivy League Champion Princeton, and then in the 2nd round Cal upset Big East Champion, #20 Villanova. In the Sweet 16 Round, Cal nearly knocked off #4 North Carolina, featuring Antawn Jamison and Vince Carter, and coached by the legendary Dean Smith. Cal grabbed a 9 point lead, but went cold in the 2nd half. You may remember 1997 was the year that Arizona (5th place in the PAC10), went on to win the NCAA Championship. And Cal had split with Arizona during the season, losing to them at McKale 81-80, and beating then #12 Arizona at Harmon 79-77.

The Cal team of 1995-1996, coached by Todd Bozeman, had a usual starting lineup of Shareef (28 games), Duck (27), Stewart (22), Gardner (17), Gray (12), McGruder (12), Gonzalez (7), Fowlkes (7), McQueen (7). Cal finished 17-11, and11-7, in conference, which would have been good for 4th place, but their conference wins were vacated due to the recruiting scandals, and Cal finished 10th.

With all the departures to the pros and other schools, Ben Braun inherited roster depleted of highly ranked talent, and it is to his great credit that he was able to cobble together a team which played even better than Bozeman's teams and most its star power, Shareef, Fowlkes, and Gardner. Especially with the injury to Gray before the tournament, leaving Cal without any one-on-one talent, he got the team to play together and achieve more than the year before under Bozeman. Maybe Ben Braun's finest hour as Cal coach.

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If Ed Gray doesn't get hurt, the 96-97 team probably goes to the Final Four. With Gray, who averaged 23 ppg, they would have beaten North Carolina.

That team was ultra-experienced, with the top eight players all juniors or seniors. And they were great athletes. Randy Duck, as a sophomore I believe, actually broke his arm against the backboard, leaping to block a shot. Marks and Yogi could run the floor, and they had Magruder as the defensive specialist against the other teams best shooter. That team had all the pieces, which is why they made it to weekend two, even after Ed's injury. When he got hurt, Tony G. had to play major minutes, and he basically ran out of gas in the second half against the Tar Heels. That is the best Cal team in the post-Newell era, without question.

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You like that team better than the Kidd/Murray team that upset Duke? True, they are deeper (especially with Gray), but J-Kidd was J-Kidd, you know? (Good God, how did we lose to Wisky Green Bay that next season?)

I'd love to see those teams play each other, except for I wouldn't know who to root for!

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Big C said:

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Jeff82 said:

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SFCityBear said:

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MinotStateBeav said:

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Remove the air conditioners, Bring back the Harmon Gym sweats!!! My favorite game of all time in Harmon was Cal vs Illinois in a 3OT thriller. I think it was Ed Gray who hit the game winning free throws. 96-97 team was sooo good. Ed Gray, Shareef, Anwar McQueen, Tony Gonzalez and the Duck starting 5. Such a fun team.

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MinotStateBeav,

Thanks for the special memory of your favorite game at Harmon. You are absolutely right about the 1996-1997 Cal basketball team. They were very exciting, and one of Cal's very best teams.

With all due respect, I'd like to add couple of minor corrections. You seem to be writing about two different teams, or maybe conflating them into one team. To begin with, Shareef was not a member of the 1996-1997 team. He played at Cal just one season, 1995-1996, and then left Cal for the NBA. That team, while successful to a degree, was coached by Todd Bozeman, who was fired after the season due to recruiting violations.

The 1996-1997 team was coached by Ben Braun, and the usual starters were Randy Duck (32 games), Yogi Stewart (32), Prentice McGruder (30), Al Grigsby (17), Sean Marks (15), Tony Gonzalez (6) , and Anwar McQueen (3). That team did beat Illinois at Harmon in 2 OT periods, according to Sports-Reference.com. The team finished 23-9, 12-6 in the PAC10 (3rd place). UCLA was perhaps the best team during conference play, and Cal lost to UCLA at Harmon, but later beat UCLA in Pauley. The team suffered a major setback when Ed Gray broke a leg at the end of the regular season, and was not available for the NCAA Tournament. In spite of that, Cal had a great run. In the 1st round Cal beat Ivy League Champion Princeton, and then in the 2nd round Cal upset Big East Champion, #20 Villanova. In the Sweet 16 Round, Cal nearly knocked off #4 North Carolina, featuring Antawn Jamison and Vince Carter, and coached by the legendary Dean Smith. Cal grabbed a 9 point lead, but went cold in the 2nd half. You may remember 1997 was the year that Arizona (5th place in the PAC10), went on to win the NCAA Championship. And Cal had split with Arizona during the season, losing to them at McKale 81-80, and beating then #12 Arizona at Harmon 79-77.

The Cal team of 1995-1996, coached by Todd Bozeman, had a usual starting lineup of Shareef (28 games), Duck (27), Stewart (22), Gardner (17), Gray (12), McGruder (12), Gonzalez (7), Fowlkes (7), McQueen (7). Cal finished 17-11, and11-7, in conference, which would have been good for 4th place, but their conference wins were vacated due to the recruiting scandals, and Cal finished 10th.

With all the departures to the pros and other schools, Ben Braun inherited roster depleted of highly ranked talent, and it is to his great credit that he was able to cobble together a team which played even better than Bozeman's teams and most its star power, Shareef, Fowlkes, and Gardner. Especially with the injury to Gray before the tournament, leaving Cal without any one-on-one talent, he got the team to play together and achieve more than the year before under Bozeman. Maybe Ben Braun's finest hour as Cal coach.

---

If Ed Gray doesn't get hurt, the 96-97 team probably goes to the Final Four. With Gray, who averaged 23 ppg, they would have beaten North Carolina.

That team was ultra-experienced, with the top eight players all juniors or seniors. And they were great athletes. Randy Duck, as a sophomore I believe, actually broke his arm against the backboard, leaping to block a shot. Marks and Yogi could run the floor, and they had Magruder as the defensive specialist against the other teams best shooter. That team had all the pieces, which is why they made it to weekend two, even after Ed's injury. When he got hurt, Tony G. had to play major minutes, and he basically ran out of gas in the second half against the Tar Heels. That is the best Cal team in the post-Newell era, without question.

---

You like that team better than the Kidd/Murray team that upset Duke? True, they are deeper (especially with Gray), but J-Kidd was J-Kidd, you know? (Good God, how did we lose to Wisky Green Bay that next season?)

I'd love to see those teams play each other, except for I wouldn't know who to root for!

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Jeff82 said:

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Big C said:

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Jeff82 said:

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SFCityBear said:

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MinotStateBeav said:

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Remove the air conditioners, Bring back the Harmon Gym sweats!!! My favorite game of all time in Harmon was Cal vs Illinois in a 3OT thriller. I think it was Ed Gray who hit the game winning free throws. 96-97 team was sooo good. Ed Gray, Shareef, Anwar McQueen, Tony Gonzalez and the Duck starting 5. Such a fun team.

---

MinotStateBeav,

Thanks for the special memory of your favorite game at Harmon. You are absolutely right about the 1996-1997 Cal basketball team. They were very exciting, and one of Cal's very best teams.

With all due respect, I'd like to add couple of minor corrections. You seem to be writing about two different teams, or maybe conflating them into one team. To begin with, Shareef was not a member of the 1996-1997 team. He played at Cal just one season, 1995-1996, and then left Cal for the NBA. That team, while successful to a degree, was coached by Todd Bozeman, who was fired after the season due to recruiting violations.

The 1996-1997 team was coached by Ben Braun, and the usual starters were Randy Duck (32 games), Yogi Stewart (32), Prentice McGruder (30), Al Grigsby (17), Sean Marks (15), Tony Gonzalez (6) , and Anwar McQueen (3). That team did beat Illinois at Harmon in 2 OT periods, according to Sports-Reference.com. The team finished 23-9, 12-6 in the PAC10 (3rd place). UCLA was perhaps the best team during conference play, and Cal lost to UCLA at Harmon, but later beat UCLA in Pauley. The team suffered a major setback when Ed Gray broke a leg at the end of the regular season, and was not available for the NCAA Tournament. In spite of that, Cal had a great run. In the 1st round Cal beat Ivy League Champion Princeton, and then in the 2nd round Cal upset Big East Champion, #20 Villanova. In the Sweet 16 Round, Cal nearly knocked off #4 North Carolina, featuring Antawn Jamison and Vince Carter, and coached by the legendary Dean Smith. Cal grabbed a 9 point lead, but went cold in the 2nd half. You may remember 1997 was the year that Arizona (5th place in the PAC10), went on to win the NCAA Championship. And Cal had split with Arizona during the season, losing to them at McKale 81-80, and beating then #12 Arizona at Harmon 79-77.

The Cal team of 1995-1996, coached by Todd Bozeman, had a usual starting lineup of Shareef (28 games), Duck (27), Stewart (22), Gardner (17), Gray (12), McGruder (12), Gonzalez (7), Fowlkes (7), McQueen (7). Cal finished 17-11, and11-7, in conference, which would have been good for 4th place, but their conference wins were vacated due to the recruiting scandals, and Cal finished 10th.

With all the departures to the pros and other schools, Ben Braun inherited roster depleted of highly ranked talent, and it is to his great credit that he was able to cobble together a team which played even better than Bozeman's teams and most its star power, Shareef, Fowlkes, and Gardner. Especially with the injury to Gray before the tournament, leaving Cal without any one-on-one talent, he got the team to play together and achieve more than the year before under Bozeman. Maybe Ben Braun's finest hour as Cal coach.

---

If Ed Gray doesn't get hurt, the 96-97 team probably goes to the Final Four. With Gray, who averaged 23 ppg, they would have beaten North Carolina.

That team was ultra-experienced, with the top eight players all juniors or seniors. And they were great athletes. Randy Duck, as a sophomore I believe, actually broke his arm against the backboard, leaping to block a shot. Marks and Yogi could run the floor, and they had Magruder as the defensive specialist against the other teams best shooter. That team had all the pieces, which is why they made it to weekend two, even after Ed's injury. When he got hurt, Tony G. had to play major minutes, and he basically ran out of gas in the second half against the Tar Heels. That is the best Cal team in the post-Newell era, without question.

---

You like that team better than the Kidd/Murray team that upset Duke? True, they are deeper (especially with Gray), but J-Kidd was J-Kidd, you know? (Good God, how did we lose to Wisky Green Bay that next season?)

I'd love to see those teams play each other, except for I wouldn't know who to root for!

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Yes. The 92-93 team only went seven deep, really, down to Monty Buckley. The 96-97 team was better balanced, and I think as a rim stopper, Yogi was slightly better than the oft-injured Grigsby, who still logged some minutes that year. I think the proof is in the results. Even without Gray, Cal was ahead of NC at the half, whereas the 92-93 game, after the wins against LSU and Duke, wasn't really in the game against Kansas.

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Jeff82 said:

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Big C said:

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Jeff82 said:

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SFCityBear said:

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MinotStateBeav said:

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Remove the air conditioners, Bring back the Harmon Gym sweats!!! My favorite game of all time in Harmon was Cal vs Illinois in a 3OT thriller. I think it was Ed Gray who hit the game winning free throws. 96-97 team was sooo good. Ed Gray, Shareef, Anwar McQueen, Tony Gonzalez and the Duck starting 5. Such a fun team.

---

MinotStateBeav,

Thanks for the special memory of your favorite game at Harmon. You are absolutely right about the 1996-1997 Cal basketball team. They were very exciting, and one of Cal's very best teams.

With all due respect, I'd like to add couple of minor corrections. You seem to be writing about two different teams, or maybe conflating them into one team. To begin with, Shareef was not a member of the 1996-1997 team. He played at Cal just one season, 1995-1996, and then left Cal for the NBA. That team, while successful to a degree, was coached by Todd Bozeman, who was fired after the season due to recruiting violations.

The 1996-1997 team was coached by Ben Braun, and the usual starters were Randy Duck (32 games), Yogi Stewart (32), Prentice McGruder (30), Al Grigsby (17), Sean Marks (15), Tony Gonzalez (6) , and Anwar McQueen (3). That team did beat Illinois at Harmon in 2 OT periods, according to Sports-Reference.com. The team finished 23-9, 12-6 in the PAC10 (3rd place). UCLA was perhaps the best team during conference play, and Cal lost to UCLA at Harmon, but later beat UCLA in Pauley. The team suffered a major setback when Ed Gray broke a leg at the end of the regular season, and was not available for the NCAA Tournament. In spite of that, Cal had a great run. In the 1st round Cal beat Ivy League Champion Princeton, and then in the 2nd round Cal upset Big East Champion, #20 Villanova. In the Sweet 16 Round, Cal nearly knocked off #4 North Carolina, featuring Antawn Jamison and Vince Carter, and coached by the legendary Dean Smith. Cal grabbed a 9 point lead, but went cold in the 2nd half. You may remember 1997 was the year that Arizona (5th place in the PAC10), went on to win the NCAA Championship. And Cal had split with Arizona during the season, losing to them at McKale 81-80, and beating then #12 Arizona at Harmon 79-77.

The Cal team of 1995-1996, coached by Todd Bozeman, had a usual starting lineup of Shareef (28 games), Duck (27), Stewart (22), Gardner (17), Gray (12), McGruder (12), Gonzalez (7), Fowlkes (7), McQueen (7). Cal finished 17-11, and11-7, in conference, which would have been good for 4th place, but their conference wins were vacated due to the recruiting scandals, and Cal finished 10th.

With all the departures to the pros and other schools, Ben Braun inherited roster depleted of highly ranked talent, and it is to his great credit that he was able to cobble together a team which played even better than Bozeman's teams and most its star power, Shareef, Fowlkes, and Gardner. Especially with the injury to Gray before the tournament, leaving Cal without any one-on-one talent, he got the team to play together and achieve more than the year before under Bozeman. Maybe Ben Braun's finest hour as Cal coach.

---

If Ed Gray doesn't get hurt, the 96-97 team probably goes to the Final Four. With Gray, who averaged 23 ppg, they would have beaten North Carolina.

That team was ultra-experienced, with the top eight players all juniors or seniors. And they were great athletes. Randy Duck, as a sophomore I believe, actually broke his arm against the backboard, leaping to block a shot. Marks and Yogi could run the floor, and they had Magruder as the defensive specialist against the other teams best shooter. That team had all the pieces, which is why they made it to weekend two, even after Ed's injury. When he got hurt, Tony G. had to play major minutes, and he basically ran out of gas in the second half against the Tar Heels. That is the best Cal team in the post-Newell era, without question.

---

You like that team better than the Kidd/Murray team that upset Duke? True, they are deeper (especially with Gray), but J-Kidd was J-Kidd, you know? (Good God, how did we lose to Wisky Green Bay that next season?)

I'd love to see those teams play each other, except for I wouldn't know who to root for!

---

Yes. The 92-93 team only went seven deep, really, down to Monty Buckley. The 96-97 team was better balanced, and I think as a rim stopper, Yogi was slightly better than the oft-injured Grigsby, who still logged some minutes that year. I think the proof is in the results. Even without Gray, Cal was ahead of NC at the half, whereas the 92-93 game, after the wins against LSU and Duke, wasn't really in the game against Kansas.

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calumnus said:

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Jeff82 said:

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Big C said:

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Jeff82 said:

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SFCityBear said:

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MinotStateBeav said:

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Remove the air conditioners, Bring back the Harmon Gym sweats!!! My favorite game of all time in Harmon was Cal vs Illinois in a 3OT thriller. I think it was Ed Gray who hit the game winning free throws. 96-97 team was sooo good. Ed Gray, Shareef, Anwar McQueen, Tony Gonzalez and the Duck starting 5. Such a fun team.

---

MinotStateBeav,

Thanks for the special memory of your favorite game at Harmon. You are absolutely right about the 1996-1997 Cal basketball team. They were very exciting, and one of Cal's very best teams.

With all due respect, I'd like to add couple of minor corrections. You seem to be writing about two different teams, or maybe conflating them into one team. To begin with, Shareef was not a member of the 1996-1997 team. He played at Cal just one season, 1995-1996, and then left Cal for the NBA. That team, while successful to a degree, was coached by Todd Bozeman, who was fired after the season due to recruiting violations.

The 1996-1997 team was coached by Ben Braun, and the usual starters were Randy Duck (32 games), Yogi Stewart (32), Prentice McGruder (30), Al Grigsby (17), Sean Marks (15), Tony Gonzalez (6) , and Anwar McQueen (3). That team did beat Illinois at Harmon in 2 OT periods, according to Sports-Reference.com. The team finished 23-9, 12-6 in the PAC10 (3rd place). UCLA was perhaps the best team during conference play, and Cal lost to UCLA at Harmon, but later beat UCLA in Pauley. The team suffered a major setback when Ed Gray broke a leg at the end of the regular season, and was not available for the NCAA Tournament. In spite of that, Cal had a great run. In the 1st round Cal beat Ivy League Champion Princeton, and then in the 2nd round Cal upset Big East Champion, #20 Villanova. In the Sweet 16 Round, Cal nearly knocked off #4 North Carolina, featuring Antawn Jamison and Vince Carter, and coached by the legendary Dean Smith. Cal grabbed a 9 point lead, but went cold in the 2nd half. You may remember 1997 was the year that Arizona (5th place in the PAC10), went on to win the NCAA Championship. And Cal had split with Arizona during the season, losing to them at McKale 81-80, and beating then #12 Arizona at Harmon 79-77.

The Cal team of 1995-1996, coached by Todd Bozeman, had a usual starting lineup of Shareef (28 games), Duck (27), Stewart (22), Gardner (17), Gray (12), McGruder (12), Gonzalez (7), Fowlkes (7), McQueen (7). Cal finished 17-11, and11-7, in conference, which would have been good for 4th place, but their conference wins were vacated due to the recruiting scandals, and Cal finished 10th.

With all the departures to the pros and other schools, Ben Braun inherited roster depleted of highly ranked talent, and it is to his great credit that he was able to cobble together a team which played even better than Bozeman's teams and most its star power, Shareef, Fowlkes, and Gardner. Especially with the injury to Gray before the tournament, leaving Cal without any one-on-one talent, he got the team to play together and achieve more than the year before under Bozeman. Maybe Ben Braun's finest hour as Cal coach.

---

If Ed Gray doesn't get hurt, the 96-97 team probably goes to the Final Four. With Gray, who averaged 23 ppg, they would have beaten North Carolina.

That team was ultra-experienced, with the top eight players all juniors or seniors. And they were great athletes. Randy Duck, as a sophomore I believe, actually broke his arm against the backboard, leaping to block a shot. Marks and Yogi could run the floor, and they had Magruder as the defensive specialist against the other teams best shooter. That team had all the pieces, which is why they made it to weekend two, even after Ed's injury. When he got hurt, Tony G. had to play major minutes, and he basically ran out of gas in the second half against the Tar Heels. That is the best Cal team in the post-Newell era, without question.

---

You like that team better than the Kidd/Murray team that upset Duke? True, they are deeper (especially with Gray), but J-Kidd was J-Kidd, you know? (Good God, how did we lose to Wisky Green Bay that next season?)

I'd love to see those teams play each other, except for I wouldn't know who to root for!

---

Yes. The 92-93 team only went seven deep, really, down to Monty Buckley. The 96-97 team was better balanced, and I think as a rim stopper, Yogi was slightly better than the oft-injured Grigsby, who still logged some minutes that year. I think the proof is in the results. Even without Gray, Cal was ahead of NC at the half, whereas the 92-93 game, after the wins against LSU and Duke, wasn't really in the game against Kansas.

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The 92-93 team added freshmen Yogi Stewart, Randy Duck and McQueen to the Kidd, Murray, Buckley, KJ Roberts, Jamison (a little Grigsby) core only losing Hendrick.

However, the 91-92 team is probably underrated due to all the losing before Campanelli was fired and Bozeman took over.

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MinotStateBeav said:

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calumnus said:

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Jeff82 said:

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Big C said:

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Jeff82 said:

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SFCityBear said:

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MinotStateBeav said:

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Remove the air conditioners, Bring back the Harmon Gym sweats!!! My favorite game of all time in Harmon was Cal vs Illinois in a 3OT thriller. I think it was Ed Gray who hit the game winning free throws. 96-97 team was sooo good. Ed Gray, Shareef, Anwar McQueen, Tony Gonzalez and the Duck starting 5. Such a fun team.

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MinotStateBeav,

Thanks for the special memory of your favorite game at Harmon. You are absolutely right about the 1996-1997 Cal basketball team. They were very exciting, and one of Cal's very best teams.

With all due respect, I'd like to add couple of minor corrections. You seem to be writing about two different teams, or maybe conflating them into one team. To begin with, Shareef was not a member of the 1996-1997 team. He played at Cal just one season, 1995-1996, and then left Cal for the NBA. That team, while successful to a degree, was coached by Todd Bozeman, who was fired after the season due to recruiting violations.

The 1996-1997 team was coached by Ben Braun, and the usual starters were Randy Duck (32 games), Yogi Stewart (32), Prentice McGruder (30), Al Grigsby (17), Sean Marks (15), Tony Gonzalez (6) , and Anwar McQueen (3). That team did beat Illinois at Harmon in 2 OT periods, according to Sports-Reference.com. The team finished 23-9, 12-6 in the PAC10 (3rd place). UCLA was perhaps the best team during conference play, and Cal lost to UCLA at Harmon, but later beat UCLA in Pauley. The team suffered a major setback when Ed Gray broke a leg at the end of the regular season, and was not available for the NCAA Tournament. In spite of that, Cal had a great run. In the 1st round Cal beat Ivy League Champion Princeton, and then in the 2nd round Cal upset Big East Champion, #20 Villanova. In the Sweet 16 Round, Cal nearly knocked off #4 North Carolina, featuring Antawn Jamison and Vince Carter, and coached by the legendary Dean Smith. Cal grabbed a 9 point lead, but went cold in the 2nd half. You may remember 1997 was the year that Arizona (5th place in the PAC10), went on to win the NCAA Championship. And Cal had split with Arizona during the season, losing to them at McKale 81-80, and beating then #12 Arizona at Harmon 79-77.

The Cal team of 1995-1996, coached by Todd Bozeman, had a usual starting lineup of Shareef (28 games), Duck (27), Stewart (22), Gardner (17), Gray (12), McGruder (12), Gonzalez (7), Fowlkes (7), McQueen (7). Cal finished 17-11, and11-7, in conference, which would have been good for 4th place, but their conference wins were vacated due to the recruiting scandals, and Cal finished 10th.

With all the departures to the pros and other schools, Ben Braun inherited roster depleted of highly ranked talent, and it is to his great credit that he was able to cobble together a team which played even better than Bozeman's teams and most its star power, Shareef, Fowlkes, and Gardner. Especially with the injury to Gray before the tournament, leaving Cal without any one-on-one talent, he got the team to play together and achieve more than the year before under Bozeman. Maybe Ben Braun's finest hour as Cal coach.

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If Ed Gray doesn't get hurt, the 96-97 team probably goes to the Final Four. With Gray, who averaged 23 ppg, they would have beaten North Carolina.

That team was ultra-experienced, with the top eight players all juniors or seniors. And they were great athletes. Randy Duck, as a sophomore I believe, actually broke his arm against the backboard, leaping to block a shot. Marks and Yogi could run the floor, and they had Magruder as the defensive specialist against the other teams best shooter. That team had all the pieces, which is why they made it to weekend two, even after Ed's injury. When he got hurt, Tony G. had to play major minutes, and he basically ran out of gas in the second half against the Tar Heels. That is the best Cal team in the post-Newell era, without question.

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You like that team better than the Kidd/Murray team that upset Duke? True, they are deeper (especially with Gray), but J-Kidd was J-Kidd, you know? (Good God, how did we lose to Wisky Green Bay that next season?)

I'd love to see those teams play each other, except for I wouldn't know who to root for!

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Yes. The 92-93 team only went seven deep, really, down to Monty Buckley. The 96-97 team was better balanced, and I think as a rim stopper, Yogi was slightly better than the oft-injured Grigsby, who still logged some minutes that year. I think the proof is in the results. Even without Gray, Cal was ahead of NC at the half, whereas the 92-93 game, after the wins against LSU and Duke, wasn't really in the game against Kansas.

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The 92-93 team added freshmen Yogi Stewart, Randy Duck and McQueen to the Kidd, Murray, Buckley, KJ Roberts, Jamison (a little Grigsby) core only losing Hendrick.

However, the 91-92 team is probably underrated due to all the losing before Campanelli was fired and Bozeman took over.

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Jamison always reminded me as 1 of the 3 Head Monsters from the Bulls Jordan Era lol. Remember the 3 stiffs they would just rotate in and out to give themselves 15 fouls to hack you hard per game haha. They were good enough to hit an open jumper to make you cover them, but were never taking their guy off the bounce or that successful in the post moves.

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