With Oregon and Colorado winning today at least one, maybe both, will get in NCAA Tournament. I'm not sure if I care how far any of the 3 or 4 Pac-12 teams advance.

Same, but I am actively rooting against 'Zona just so I don't have to hear any more "U of A" chants.
I would like to see Cal play all its Pac12 rivals in nonconference play. I know it won't happen because coaches want a bunch of patsies and sacrificial lambs to boost the W column, but I think it would be nice to relive the Pac12 through at least a USC-UCLA and Washingtons annual rivalry.

Bottom line to both posts: Moving forward it's cool to still play all pac 12 teams - except Arizona.

oskidunker said:

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RedlessWardrobe said:

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Bottom line to both posts: Moving forward it's cool to still play all pac 12 teams - except Arizona.

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I am done with the Pac12.

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I'm still OK with the Pac-2, OSU and WSU.

stu said:

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oskidunker said:

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RedlessWardrobe said:

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Bottom line to both posts: Moving forward it's cool to still play all pac 12 teams - except Arizona.

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I am done with the Pac12.

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I'm still OK with the Pac-2, OSU and WSU.

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Going out with a whimper:

Two pretty good teams nobody cares about vied for the final Pac 12 Tournament title today, in a game that was just popular enough to where the Pac 12 Television Network didn't get to televise it. Sad.

calumnus said:

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The fact Oregon won it shows that we could have.

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Very good take. I would have never expected Oregon to win this thing. Funny though, when it came to this last game I got the feeling with Colorado now off the bubble that somehow Oregon would get them, and they did.

It's bizarre that in our final game, even though we basically gave the game away, it was aided by some of the legendary poor pac 12 officiating that we will always remember as a constant issue over the years. Hopefully that won't leak into the ACC. Okay Mr. Madsen, time to get back to work,

calumnus said:

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The fact Oregon won it shows that we could have.

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We would not htave beat Otegon.

6-11 Dante scored 25 points on 12-12, grabbed 9 rebounds and had a volleyball block on a 3 point shooter

That will win you a lot of games

HoopDreams said:

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6-11 Dante scored 25 points on 12-12, grabbed 9 rebounds and had a volleyball block on a 3 point shooter

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Then he chased it down and tipped it to a teammate - play of the game.

Good night

Pac-12 Network delivered… @AdamsonAshley crushed this: pic.twitter.com/9N55ZMlALg

— John Canzano (@johncanzanobft) March 17, 2024

oskidunker said:

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calumnus said:

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The fact Oregon won it shows that we could have.

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We would not htave beat Otegon.

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The last four teams left were the four that got a first-round bye, correct? When the games are on consecutive days, that makes a huge difference. It would've been almost impossible for the Bears to win four straifght, especially with our lack of depth.

Bottom line: We couldn't even win one game. Let's retool and get stronger.

RedlessWardrobe said:

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calumnus said:

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The fact Oregon won it shows that we could have.

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Very good take. I would have never expected Oregon to win this thing. Funny though, when it came to this last game I got the feeling with Colorado now off the bubble that somehow Oregon would get them, and they did.

It's bizarre that in our final game, even though we basically gave the game away, it was aided by some of the legendary poor pac 12 officiating that we will always remember as a constant issue over the years. Hopefully that won't leak into the ACC. Okay Mr. Madsen, time to get back to work,

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The item in bold made me think....

I'm guessing that the same refs will work ACC games at Cal and Furd. The only difference will be the conference patch on the zebra shirt. It will be interesting to see how that changes the calls and tone of their officiating.

I mean, when those same refs do March Madness and other western conferences, there wasn't the same P12 issues, right?

4 Pac-12 teams in the NCAA Tournament. Oregon at #11 and Colorado at #10 (play-in) seems weird to me.

PAC-2 will be swimming in $!

Big C said:

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oskidunker said:

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calumnus said:

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The last four teams left were the four that got a first-round bye, correct? When the games are on consecutive days, that makes a huge difference. It would've been almost impossible for the Bears to win four straifght, especially with our lack of depth.

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NC State just won the ACC tournament by winning five games in five days. AFAIK, it's the first time that's been done in any conference.

Big C said:

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oskidunker said:

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calumnus said:

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The fact Oregon won it shows that we could have.

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We would not htave beat Otegon.

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The last four teams left were the four that got a first-round bye, correct? When the games are on consecutive days, that makes a huge difference. It would've been almost impossible for the Bears to win four straifght, especially with our lack of depth.

Bottom line: We couldn't even win one game. Let's retool and get stronger.

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And making it to the Finals were the two teams that needed to win to get in versus the two teams that were already in and didn't want to risk injury and could use the rest before attempting a run.

That said, the 4 in the final four were clearly our 4 best teams, which is why they were the 4 with a first round bye. So it is a bit chicken and egg. Did they get there because the were better or because they were better rested? Maybe Oregon's 2 point win over UCLA was because they had the bye and Cronin plays a short rotation, but then Oregon went on to run the table.

BearSD said:

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Big C said:

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The last four teams left were the four that got a first-round bye, correct? When the games are on consecutive days, that makes a huge difference. It would've been almost impossible for the Bears to win four straifght, especially with our lack of depth.

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NC State just won the ACC tournament by winning five games in five days. AFAIK, it's the first time that's been done in any conference.

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Haven't been paying attention to the ACC tourney... yet. Realy, five games in 5 days?!? How is their tournament structured? What is NC State's roster like, in terms of depth?

Bobodeluxe said:

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PAC-2 will be swimming in $!

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does OSU and WSU get to keep the NCAA tournament share for the entire Pac12 this season?

Big C said:

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BearSD said:

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Big C said:

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The last four teams left were the four that got a first-round bye, correct? When the games are on consecutive days, that makes a huge difference. It would've been almost impossible for the Bears to win four straifght, especially with our lack of depth.

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NC State just won the ACC tournament by winning five games in five days. AFAIK, it's the first time that's been done in any conference.

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Haven't been paying attention to the ACC tourney... yet. Realy, five games in 5 days?!? How is their tournament structured? What is NC State's roster like, in terms of depth?

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During the conference NC State played an 8 man rotation with two guys averaging over 30, just like Cal this year. They also lost their last 4 conference games finishing one game under .500 in conference heading into the conference tournament, again just like Cal.

In their win over North Carolina in the Finals they played tge starters max and went only 7 deep.
O'Connell 36 min
Morsell 34 min
Horne 32 min (fouled out)
Diarra 31 min
Burns 28 min
Taylor 22 min
Middlebrooks 12 min

Same 7 the previous night in the OT win over Virginia and the same 7 the night before in the win over Duke and the night before that when they beat Syracuse. They did go 8 deep in the first game vs Louisville.

Horne and Diarra are their two plus players. Cal compares favorably. Actually, NC State did not go as deep.

Beating Louisville, Syracuse, Duke, Virginia in OT and North Carolina in 5 nights with 7 guys proves that depth is not the limiting factor. It is your starters getting hot and staying hot.

Big C said:

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BearSD said:

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Big C said:

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The last four teams left were the four that got a first-round bye, correct? When the games are on consecutive days, that makes a huge difference. It would've been almost impossible for the Bears to win four straifght, especially with our lack of depth.

---

NC State just won the ACC tournament by winning five games in five days. AFAIK, it's the first time that's been done in any conference.

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Haven't been paying attention to the ACC tourney... yet. Realy, five games in 5 days?!? How is their tournament structured? What is NC State's roster like, in terms of depth?

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As for the ACC tournament format: Here's the 2024 bracket. It will be the same format next year, because this year all 15 teams are in the ACC tournament, and the ACC members voted to have only the top 15 (of 18) teams participate next year. Any team that is 10th through 15th in the standings (NC State was 10th) would play five straight days if they make the final.

Calumnus is correct that NC State's key was its core players staying hot for five straight days, plus a bit of luck in the semifinal, which they tied and sent to OT with a bank shot 3 at the buzzer.

BearSD said:

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Big C said:

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BearSD said:

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Big C said:

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The last four teams left were the four that got a first-round bye, correct? When the games are on consecutive days, that makes a huge difference. It would've been almost impossible for the Bears to win four straifght, especially with our lack of depth.

---

NC State just won the ACC tournament by winning five games in five days. AFAIK, it's the first time that's been done in any conference.

---

Haven't been paying attention to the ACC tourney... yet. Realy, five games in 5 days?!? How is their tournament structured? What is NC State's roster like, in terms of depth?

---

As for the ACC tournament format: Here's the 2024 bracket. It will be the same format next year, because this year all 15 teams are in the ACC tournament, and the ACC members voted to have only the top 15 (of 18) teams participate next year. Any team that is 10th through 15th in the standings (NC State was 10th) would play five straight days if they make the final.

Calumnus is correct that NC State's key was its core players staying hot for five straight days, plus a bit of luck in the semifinal, which they tied and sent to OT with a bank shot 3 at the buzzer.

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Agreed, 40min of basketball is not that taxing for a 20yo.

Not sure I agree

Consider how beat up players get in a game, and how every player has injuries at this time of season (and I'm not just referring to Celestine)

Cal88 said:

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BearSD said:

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Big C said:

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BearSD said:

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Big C said:

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The last four teams left were the four that got a first-round bye, correct? When the games are on consecutive days, that makes a huge difference. It would've been almost impossible for the Bears to win four straifght, especially with our lack of depth.

---

NC State just won the ACC tournament by winning five games in five days. AFAIK, it's the first time that's been done in any conference.

---

Haven't been paying attention to the ACC tourney... yet. Realy, five games in 5 days?!? How is their tournament structured? What is NC State's roster like, in terms of depth?

---

As for the ACC tournament format: Here's the 2024 bracket. It will be the same format next year, because this year all 15 teams are in the ACC tournament, and the ACC members voted to have only the top 15 (of 18) teams participate next year. Any team that is 10th through 15th in the standings (NC State was 10th) would play five straight days if they make the final.

Calumnus is correct that NC State's key was its core players staying hot for five straight days, plus a bit of luck in the semifinal, which they tied and sent to OT with a bank shot 3 at the buzzer.

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Agreed, 40min of basketball is not that taxing for a 20yo.

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HoopDreams said:

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Not sure I agree

Consider how beat up players get in a game, and how every player has injuries at this time of season (and I'm not just referring to Celestine)

Cal88 said:

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BearSD said:

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Big C said:

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BearSD said:

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Big C said:

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The last four teams left were the four that got a first-round bye, correct? When the games are on consecutive days, that makes a huge difference. It would've been almost impossible for the Bears to win four straifght, especially with our lack of depth.

---

NC State just won the ACC tournament by winning five games in five days. AFAIK, it's the first time that's been done in any conference.

---

Haven't been paying attention to the ACC tourney... yet. Realy, five games in 5 days?!? How is their tournament structured? What is NC State's roster like, in terms of depth?

---

As for the ACC tournament format: Here's the 2024 bracket. It will be the same format next year, because this year all 15 teams are in the ACC tournament, and the ACC members voted to have only the top 15 (of 18) teams participate next year. Any team that is 10th through 15th in the standings (NC State was 10th) would play five straight days if they make the final.

Calumnus is correct that NC State's key was its core players staying hot for five straight days, plus a bit of luck in the semifinal, which they tied and sent to OT with a bank shot 3 at the buzzer.

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Agreed, 40min of basketball is not that taxing for a 20yo.

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In 5 nights,NC State just beat Louisville, Syracuse, Duke, Virginia and North Carolina to win the ACC Tournament using a 7 man rotation after playing only an 8 man rotation all during the conference.

Of course, depth is great to have in case of injuries, that goes without saying, but the most successful coaches (K, Few) shorten their rotations in the post season and maximize minutes for their 5 best players.

NBA teams play nearly every night for much longer seasons and generally play very short rotations. Teams don't really win or lose based on the quality of their 8th player. It is their starting 5. Sure, if they don't have anyone who can just go ten minutes playing defense without commiting turnovers to give the starters a breather, that is a huge problem, but that is a really low bar.

calumnus said:

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HoopDreams said:

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Not sure I agree

Consider how beat up players get in a game, and how every player has injuries at this time of season (and I'm not just referring to Celestine)

Cal88 said:

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BearSD said:

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Big C said:

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BearSD said:

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Big C said:

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The last four teams left were the four that got a first-round bye, correct? When the games are on consecutive days, that makes a huge difference. It would've been almost impossible for the Bears to win four straifght, especially with our lack of depth.

---

NC State just won the ACC tournament by winning five games in five days. AFAIK, it's the first time that's been done in any conference.

---

Haven't been paying attention to the ACC tourney... yet. Realy, five games in 5 days?!? How is their tournament structured? What is NC State's roster like, in terms of depth?

---

As for the ACC tournament format: Here's the 2024 bracket. It will be the same format next year, because this year all 15 teams are in the ACC tournament, and the ACC members voted to have only the top 15 (of 18) teams participate next year. Any team that is 10th through 15th in the standings (NC State was 10th) would play five straight days if they make the final.

Calumnus is correct that NC State's key was its core players staying hot for five straight days, plus a bit of luck in the semifinal, which they tied and sent to OT with a bank shot 3 at the buzzer.

---

Agreed, 40min of basketball is not that taxing for a 20yo.

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In 5 nights,NC State just beat Louisville, Syracuse, Duke, Virginia and North Carolina to win the ACC Tournament using a 7 man rotation after playing only an 8 man rotation all during the conference.

Of course, depth is great to have in case of injuries, that goes without saying, but the most successful coaches (K, Few) shorten their rotations in the post season and maximize minutes for their 5 best players.

NBA teams play nearly every night for much longer seasons and generally play very short rotations. Teams don't really win or lose based on the quality of their 8th player. It is their starting 5. Sure, if they don't have anyone who can just go ten minutes playing defense without commiting turnovers to give the starters a breather, that is a huge problem, but that is a really low bar.

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Agree with you that a 7-8 deep rotation works and is the approach the top coaches mostly use. Issue for Cal (vs Stanford) was that they had just "6" (Brown had a hurt toe and was very limited, Curtis is just not ready for even 10 minute play and Newell fine as a extended sub). But the 6 players quickly became 5, since Fardaws was clearly gassed (I was on the court and He was clearly playing without consistent energy which led to lazy fouls) due to his Ramadan fasting. A couple of players later noticed it as well.

calumnus said:

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HoopDreams said:

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Cal88 said:

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BearSD said:

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Big C said:

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BearSD said:

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Big C said:

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NBA teams play nearly every night for much longer seasons and generally play very short rotations.

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The conditioning level of NBA players is far higher. With very few exceptions, an NBA player whose conditioning isn't good enough for the NBA regular season grind isn't going to be in the league for very long.

I seem to remember Larry Bird saying that anybody in the NBA should be able to go 48 minutes. (That was before he hurt his back.)

In the ACC tournament the top 4 schools get two rounds of byes. That seems incredible, that really protects your top four and cuts down of possible injuries.

Colorado won their play-in game.

Arizona won by 20.

#11 seed Oregon beat #6 seed South Carolina 87 to 73.

WSU also beat Drake.

I don't like how a conference is considered weak or strong based on their OOC games which are early in the season

I think the Pac12 is stronger than it's giving credit for, just like Cal was better in second half of season

It's called improvement

stu said:

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Colorado won their play-in game.

Arizona won by 20.

#11 seed Oregon beat #6 seed South Carolina 87 to 73.

WSU also beat Drake.

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I think it's going to be a feature with many teams due to the portal transfers and roster turnover going forward, a lot of teams are going to gel mid-season as they learn to play together.

Pac12 4-0
SEC 0-3

Colorado wins today 102-100, shooting 63% and making 28 free throws.