How do we bring the energy back

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HearstMining
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In reply to BearSD • 7:44a, 2/3/25
BearSD said:
Big C said:
Chabbear said:
Officially Haas only holds 11,858 (2015present) minus the new TV platform so we could never get higher than 6th if we filled it given others capacities.



Was just gonna mention that. Middle of the pack is reasonable, once we start playing .500+ conference ball.


There will always be the issue of being in a pro sports market - note that all the teams in NBA markets are nearer to the bottom in attendance - but winning more would help a lot.
Out of curiosity, I looked up UW attendance stats before and after the Sonics left in 2008. They won the PAC the next season so got a nice bump and hard to say how much of that was attributed to Sonics leaving. But that only lasted for 3-4 seasons, and in the later Romar years, it fell off quite a bit, even below what it was when the Sonics were there. I guess my point is that, at least based on this one location, an NBA team may not hugely impact the local college team. IT REALLY IS ABOUT WINNING.

Even as UW basketball has sagged the last few seasons, their attendance hasn't fallen off nearly as much as Cal's. Of course, they didn't experience the WyFox tsunami. Cal really should have applied for a FEMA grant to aid in recovery.
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BeachedBear
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In reply to HearstMining • 9:51a, 2/3/25
HearstMining said:
BearSD said:
Big C said:
Chabbear said:
Officially Haas only holds 11,858 (2015present) minus the new TV platform so we could never get higher than 6th if we filled it given others capacities.



Was just gonna mention that. Middle of the pack is reasonable, once we start playing .500+ conference ball.


There will always be the issue of being in a pro sports market - note that all the teams in NBA markets are nearer to the bottom in attendance - but winning more would help a lot.
Out of curiosity, I looked up UW attendance stats before and after the Sonics left in 2008. They won the PAC the next season so got a nice bump and hard to say how much of that was attributed to Sonics leaving. But that only lasted for 3-4 seasons, and in the later Romar years, it fell off quite a bit, even below what it was when the Sonics were there. I guess my point is that, at least based on this one location, an NBA team may not hugely impact the local college team. IT REALLY IS ABOUT WINNING.

Even as UW basketball has sagged the last few seasons, their attendance hasn't fallen off nearly as much as Cal's. Of course, they didn't experience the WyFox tsunami. Cal really should have applied for a FEMA grant to aid in recovery.
Good post (and I've never really bought into the Bay Area is a 'pro-market' excuse). Winning is the big issue here, but I think there is still some room on the margins, even if the program is NOT winning as much as we like...

1. Students: Sometimes they DO show up (during the last 8 years). And they bring energy! Someone should really figure out the key factors that correlate to when they DO show up. If its pizzas or tshirts or whatever, then repeat those things. And if someone thinks that any single student is going to hear the non stop MUZAK... please don't...

2. Alumni: These are also the people that bring energy (the run of the mill ex dubs fans than don't want to cross the bay are NOT the energizer bunnies. nor are the people doing some 'value' shopping with their entertainment budget). There has been a concerted effort by Knowlton, Williams and the entire Ath Dept to dissuade ageing alumni from returning and there has been NO effort to bring young alumni (Do they still offer discounted season tickets to recent grads like they did in the 80s and 90s?). Bring these people back! Each one is as good as 5 or 10 bodies off the street for excitement.

Winning is paramount! But getting an athletic department that cares and has a plan about the two items above will help as well.
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Shocky1
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6:30p, 2/3/25
FREE tixs for all students to all basketball & football games is so ******* obvious but general knowlton & markeisha everett are 100% non innovative & apathetic
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ManBearLion123
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2:27p, 2/4/25
During the Monty/Cuonzo years, Cal averaged between ~8k-10k/game every year.

Winning will bring us back to that level. The Cal fanbase shows up when the product is a winning one.
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HearstMining
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5:15p, 2/4/25
You know, an exciting (and winning) Cal football team wouldn't hurt basketball attendance. Many students never attended HS sports - not uncommon to see more parents in the stands than students. So, football season of their first year at Cal is their first intro to rooting in person for a team. If they go to a couple of games and have a good time with friends, well, going to a basketball game is the next thing to try. And yeah, free tickets can only help.
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Bobodeluxe
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8:03p, 2/4/25
And more loud music!

(Over the sound system, of course.)
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ManBearLion123
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In reply to HearstMining • 10:57a, 2/5/25
HearstMining said:
You know, an exciting (and winning) Cal football team wouldn't hurt basketball attendance. Many students never attended HS sports - not uncommon to see more parents in the stands than students. So, football season of their first year at Cal is their first intro to rooting in person for a team. If they go to a couple of games and have a good time with friends, well, going to a basketball game is the next thing to try. And yeah, free tickets can only help.
This is very true. I didn't attend a single game in HS.

My freshman year at Cal was '09/'10. Even though that football season went downhill as the season progressed, the hype around the football team really got me hooked early and I attended every home game (and Big Game).

As the football season wound down, I wanted something to fill that void -- and our basketball team had (deserved) preseason hype, so I decided to give it a shot. I was immediately hooked and attended every home bball game that season.

I still love Cal football, but Cal basketball became my #1 interest. And I probably never would've started going to bball games if Cal football didn't act as a gateway drug of sorts.
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Cal8285
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3:09p, 2/6/25
Aside from the Jones and Fox years killing enthusiasm, the conference switch hasn't helped.

We're now 7 home conference games into our first season in the ACC, and I just don't have the passion for conference games that I did in the Pac-8/10/12.

While it is, in some respects, interesting to play new teams, I have no feelings of passion about our conference opponents, Stanford excepted. It was always easy to feel a strong desire to beat UCLA, USC, and Stanford at basketball, Arizona became easy after the Lute era started, and Oregon managed to become really dislikeable over the years. For Washington, WSU, OSU, ASU, Colorado, and Utah, there would be players who lasted 4 years or coaches who lasted who knows how long who we could build up some desire to see lose. Familiarity breeds contempt, and we just don't know these guys. For those of us living in the Pac-12 footprint, we also knew a lot of fans/alums of our conference foes, which also helped build up the desire to win and excitement for games.

When we aren't familiar with our opponents and/or their fans, we mostly get energy and excitement for really good teams, but that won't last to the next game unless we beat them.

I'm just not sure when I will care about beating Syracuse, Virginia, Virginia Tech, Pitt, Miami, Florida St., NC St., Wake Forest, SMU, or BC, this year's home conference slate outside of Stanford. Next year we'll get Duke at home so that could be exciting, but we'll probably lose.

My feelings are reflected in the crowds. I've been to 5 conference games, outside of Stanford the crowds were all small and fairly lacking in energy, which mirrors how much I cared about Va Tech, Miami, Syracuse, and N.C. St.

I don't know how many years it will take to have a strong desire to see ACC basketball teams lose, maybe it will never happen, and we'll never get to the point where those of us in the Pac-12 footprint, especially the Bay Area, know as many opposing fans as we did in the Pac-12. I think having new conference opponents we haven't built up a dislike for accounts for a lot of the lack of energy from fans in the conference season. Winning would certainly help in part to make up for not caring too much about the opposition, and create more energy from the fans, but yes, the lack of energy from fans may be in part to blame for not winning so much.

I've got no answers, just observations.
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stu
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In reply to Cal8285 • 10:08p, 2/6/25
It will be years before I can even name all of the teams in the ACC, let alone build up any feelings about them.
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Big C
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In reply to stu • 11:24p, 2/6/25
stu said:
It will be years before I can even name all of the teams in the ACC, let alone build up any feelings about them.

Same here, stu. And I have some unfortunate news for you: "Years" from now, your growing familiarity with the teams needs to exceed your cognitive decline. For example, I remember my first ten Big Games better than my most recent ten (and that's with 25 years between the two tens).
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RedlessWardrobe
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In reply to Big C • 7:12a, 2/7/25
Big C said:
stu said:
It will be years before I can even name all of the teams in the ACC, let alone build up any feelings about them.

Same here, stu. And I have some unfortunate news for you: "Years" from now, your growing familiarity with the teams needs to exceed your cognitive decline. For example, I remember my first ten Big Games better than my most recent ten (and that's with 25 years between the two tens).
Come on guys. Check out the standings twice a week and you'll have it in no time. It's really not all that difficult.
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BeachedBear
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In reply to Cal8285 • 8:05a, 2/7/25
Cal8285 said:
.....

I don't know how many years it will take to have a strong desire to see ACC basketball teams lose, maybe it will never happen, and we'll never get to the point where those of us in the Pac-12 footprint, especially the Bay Area, know as many opposing fans as we did in the Pac-12. I think having new conference opponents we haven't built up a dislike for accounts for a lot of the lack of energy from fans in the conference season. Winning would certainly help in part to make up for not caring too much about the opposition, and create more energy from the fans, but yes, the lack of energy from fans may be in part to blame for not winning so much.

I've got no answers, just observations.
tossing in a couple more observations.

1. Because of geography, I don't expect Haas to have a significant number of opposing fans at games. To be honest, having obnoxious UCLA/USC/UA fans at Haas, really did make the atmosphere more ENERGETIC. That is probably a thing of the past.

2. Based on your moniker, I sense we are of a similar vintage. For me, the sense of rivalry, was VERY geocentric (and history based). Stanfurd at a different level. Then came UCLA (our kid sister) closely followed by our other CA school - USC. Then for me, it was UW, OSU, UO, WSU in the next group. UA and ASU were 'huh?' until Olsen came to UA as you said. And maybe ASU much later. CU and Utah were always 'huh?' for me.

3. Lots of good discussion around entertainment and crowds and energy. I see 3 different target groups:

X: People just looking for entertainment. Seems like too much effort is spent on why they don't attend.

Y: Basketball fans looking for entertainment. We can get some of these. Stealing W's fans? Come on.

Z: Alumni and Students: And their friend and relatives. This is where 95% of our effort should be,

I really want people to focus on that last one. Should be 95%. But probably less than 5%. The 'winning' argument helps to bring in the 'Y' group, but most of the 'Z' group would show up anyway (barring 8 years of horrible coaching and an Athletic Director, who is hostile to MBB alums).
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stu
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In reply to RedlessWardrobe • 10:37a, 2/7/25
RedlessWardrobe said:
Big C said:
stu said:
It will be years before I can even name all of the teams in the ACC, let alone build up any feelings about them.

Same here, stu. And I have some unfortunate news for you: "Years" from now, your growing familiarity with the teams needs to exceed your cognitive decline. For example, I remember my first ten Big Games better than my most recent ten (and that's with 25 years between the two tens).
Come on guys. Check out the standings twice a week and you'll have it in no time. It's really not all that difficult.
Probably easier than learning to program in Haskell or play oboe but I'm more motivated to work on those.
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HearstMining
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11:18a, 2/7/25
I think the Washington Huskies are an interesting parallel:
  • Big state universities in urban setting
  • Identical Pac12 records last season
  • Both currently towards the bottom of their new conferences (UW dead last)
  • UW actually has a higher % of out-of-state students than Cal (15% vs 23%)

Just eyeballing attendance, it looks like UW averaging ~7,000 per game this season and ~7,500 last season. This is at least twice Cal's attendance, right? Worth mentioning that UW drew ~5,300 for UC Davis this season, that's just a few hundred less than Cal drew for Stanford. I think this underscores the challenges Cal faces digging themselves out of the six season WyFox hole. Sure, let current students in for free, but how do you attract all the young alumni from that era who never had a good reason to attended a game during their student years?
EDIT - So far, it appears that neither team has gotten a bounce in attendance from their new conference affiliations, but there are still additional conference games to go, so the jury is still out.
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HoopDreams
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12:46p, 2/7/25
Anything less than 6000 for a conference game or OOC big name opponent is terrible

Some small adjustment for holidays, and weekday rainy days

One improvement last couple seasons are the MBB and WBB double headers
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Big C
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In reply to HoopDreams • 1:26p, 2/7/25

The different start times don't help (talkin' about alums here): Some find 8:00 to be a little late if they have a decent drive to get home and/or if they are bringing kids. Anything before 7:00 can be hard to get to on time. I know that makes people sound like wusses, but the fact of the matter is, the way our teams have been recently, it doesn't take much for casual fans to find a reason not to go.
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HoopDreams
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In reply to Big C • 1:30p, 2/7/25
Lots of reasons not to go. Lots of reasons not to get a dog…. Lots of reasons not to …

But going to a LIVE game, concert, walk on the beach is always amazing compared to watching TV and I never regret going on campus and attending a game, or regret getting a dog

Big C said:

The different start times don't help (talkin' about alums here): Some find 8:00 to be a little late if they have a decent drive to get home and/or if they are bringing kids. Anything before 7:00 can be hard to get to on time. I know that makes people sound like wusses, but the fact of the matter is, the way our teams have been recently, it doesn't take much for casual fans to find a reason not to go.
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barsad
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In reply to RedlessWardrobe • 2:36p, 2/7/25
RedlessWardrobe said:
Big C said:
stu said:
It will be years before I can even name all of the teams in the ACC, let alone build up any feelings about them.

Same here, stu. And I have some unfortunate news for you: "Years" from now, your growing familiarity with the teams needs to exceed your cognitive decline. For example, I remember my first ten Big Games better than my most recent ten (and that's with 25 years between the two tens).
Come on guys. Check out the standings twice a week and you'll have it in no time. It's really not all that difficult.

Redless, you're forgetting about the time it takes Big C and stu to get a working scissors, go out to the curb, get the rolled up newspaper, find the very skinny sports section, then clip the ACC standings section (dang, did they not print it again!), then post it on a cork board with tacks, get their reading glasses, THEN they can read the team names. Not worth it, I'd say
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RedlessWardrobe
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In reply to barsad • 2:47p, 2/7/25
barsad said:
RedlessWardrobe said:
Big C said:
stu said:
It will be years before I can even name all of the teams in the ACC, let alone build up any feelings about them.

Same here, stu. And I have some unfortunate news for you: "Years" from now, your growing familiarity with the teams needs to exceed your cognitive decline. For example, I remember my first ten Big Games better than my most recent ten (and that's with 25 years between the two tens).
Come on guys. Check out the standings twice a week and you'll have it in no time. It's really not all that difficult.

Redless, you're forgetting about the time it takes Big C and stu to get a working scissors, go out to the curb, get the rolled up newspaper, find the very skinny sports section, then clip the ACC standings section (dang, did they not print it again!), then post it on a cork board with tacks, get their reading glasses, THEN they can read the team names. Not worth it, I'd say
Barsad, you might be right, but SILLY ME, I figured that if they're tech savvy enough to post stuff here, they might be able to figure out that ESPN (maybe they never heard of it), has this thing called a website where you click "NCAAM", "Standings", and "Atlantic Coast Conference." I guess I shouldn't make assumptions like that.
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Big C
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In reply to RedlessWardrobe • 5:00p, 2/7/25
RedlessWardrobe said:
barsad said:
RedlessWardrobe said:
Big C said:
stu said:
It will be years before I can even name all of the teams in the ACC, let alone build up any feelings about them.

Same here, stu. And I have some unfortunate news for you: "Years" from now, your growing familiarity with the teams needs to exceed your cognitive decline. For example, I remember my first ten Big Games better than my most recent ten (and that's with 25 years between the two tens).
Come on guys. Check out the standings twice a week and you'll have it in no time. It's really not all that difficult.

Redless, you're forgetting about the time it takes Big C and stu to get a working scissors, go out to the curb, get the rolled up newspaper, find the very skinny sports section, then clip the ACC standings section (dang, did they not print it again!), then post it on a cork board with tacks, get their reading glasses, THEN they can read the team names. Not worth it, I'd say
Barsad, you might be right, but SILLY ME, I figured that if they're tech savvy enough to post stuff here, they might be able to figure out that ESPN (maybe they never heard of it), has this thing called a website where you click "NCAAM", "Standings", and "Atlantic Coast Conference." I guess I shouldn't make assumptions like that.

So you're saying that that ESPN thing (yes I've heard of it, you wise guys) is more than just a TV channel?

Wow, good to know!
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HongKong_Bear
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6:34p, 2/7/25
This is a bit off topic, but is Mark Madsen or anyone running a basketball camp at Cal during the summer for teens? Is this still a popular thing in this era of NIL? When I was a teacher in Japan in the early 90's I also coached basketball at the high school level. I organized a summer trip for 5 or 6 of my players one year to attend a basketball camp. As Cal had nothing, I ended up enrolling them in Mike Montgomery's camp over at Stanford. Most of the heavy lifting was done by his staff the time I was there.
I agree getting current Cal students is the low hanging fruit to raising attendance and boosting energy, but how about reaching out to local high schools with deeply discounted tickets. Also working with local retailers (restaurants, pubs) to offer discounts to customers bringing in ticket stubs/e-tickets on game nights.
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Cal8285
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In reply to BeachedBear • 6:49p, 2/7/25
I don't expect a ton of opposing conference fans, but I was shocked at how many Syracuse fans there were at Haas. More of them showed up than Stanford fans were there on December 7. It was annoying seeing all those fans hyped up about their crappy team beating a team playing really poorly. I might be able to build up a dislike for the Orange if I'm around some of those fans enough.
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RedlessWardrobe
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In reply to Big C • 7:44p, 2/7/25
Big C said:
RedlessWardrobe said:
barsad said:
RedlessWardrobe said:
Big C said:
stu said:
It will be years before I can even name all of the teams in the ACC, let alone build up any feelings about them.

Same here, stu. And I have some unfortunate news for you: "Years" from now, your growing familiarity with the teams needs to exceed your cognitive decline. For example, I remember my first ten Big Games better than my most recent ten (and that's with 25 years between the two tens).
Come on guys. Check out the standings twice a week and you'll have it in no time. It's really not all that difficult.

Redless, you're forgetting about the time it takes Big C and stu to get a working scissors, go out to the curb, get the rolled up newspaper, find the very skinny sports section, then clip the ACC standings section (dang, did they not print it again!), then post it on a cork board with tacks, get their reading glasses, THEN they can read the team names. Not worth it, I'd say
Barsad, you might be right, but SILLY ME, I figured that if they're tech savvy enough to post stuff here, they might be able to figure out that ESPN (maybe they never heard of it), has this thing called a website where you click "NCAAM", "Standings", and "Atlantic Coast Conference." I guess I shouldn't make assumptions like that.

So you're saying that that ESPN thing (yes I've heard of it, you wise guys) is more than just a TV channel?

Wow, good to know!
Big C, when it comes right down to it, it really doesn't matter that much who we're playing, it's way more about if we're WINNING. If we could get more of that, it becomes way easier to stay interested.
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oskidunker
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8:25p, 2/7/25
Exactly
Bring back It’s It’s to Haas Pavillion!
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Big C
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In reply to RedlessWardrobe • 8:32p, 2/7/25
RedlessWardrobe said:
Big C said:
RedlessWardrobe said:
barsad said:
RedlessWardrobe said:
Big C said:
stu said:
It will be years before I can even name all of the teams in the ACC, let alone build up any feelings about them.

Same here, stu. And I have some unfortunate news for you: "Years" from now, your growing familiarity with the teams needs to exceed your cognitive decline. For example, I remember my first ten Big Games better than my most recent ten (and that's with 25 years between the two tens).
Come on guys. Check out the standings twice a week and you'll have it in no time. It's really not all that difficult.

Redless, you're forgetting about the time it takes Big C and stu to get a working scissors, go out to the curb, get the rolled up newspaper, find the very skinny sports section, then clip the ACC standings section (dang, did they not print it again!), then post it on a cork board with tacks, get their reading glasses, THEN they can read the team names. Not worth it, I'd say
Barsad, you might be right, but SILLY ME, I figured that if they're tech savvy enough to post stuff here, they might be able to figure out that ESPN (maybe they never heard of it), has this thing called a website where you click "NCAAM", "Standings", and "Atlantic Coast Conference." I guess I shouldn't make assumptions like that.

So you're saying that that ESPN thing (yes I've heard of it, you wise guys) is more than just a TV channel?

Wow, good to know!
Big C, when it comes right down to it, it really doesn't matter that much who we're playing, it's way more about if we're WINNING. If we could get more of that, it becomes way easier to stay interested.

Of course. Did I say or imply otherwise?
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stu
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12:10a, 2/8/25
After all the discussion I still have the same question. Why should I care?

Why should I care if North Carolina beats Duke? I live nearly 3 time zones from either of them. I don't know anybody who attended either of them.

Why should I care if Florida State moves to a better football conference? I live 3 time zones from them. I don't watch college football unless Cal is playing. I don't know anyone who went to school there.

I feel the same about the others, except of course for Stanford, even if I live only 2 time zones from a few of them.

Why should I care?
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oskidunker
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In reply to stu • 12:59a, 2/8/25
stu said:
After all the discussion I still have the same question. Why should I care?

Why should I care if North Carolina beats Duke? I live nearly 3 time zones from either of them. I don't know anybody who attended either of them.

Why should I care if Florida State moves to a better football conference? I live 3 time zones from them. I don't watch college football unless Cal is playing. I don't know anyone who went to school there.

I feel the same about the others, except of course for Stanford, even if I live only 2 time zones from a few of them.

Why should I care?


I feel the same way .
Bring back It’s It’s to Haas Pavillion!
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RedlessWardrobe
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In reply to stu • 7:11a, 2/8/25
stu said:
After all the discussion I still have the same question. Why should I care?

Why should I care if North Carolina beats Duke? I live nearly 3 time zones from either of them. I don't know anybody who attended either of them.

Why should I care if Florida State moves to a better football conference? I live 3 time zones from them. I don't watch college football unless Cal is playing. I don't know anyone who went to school there.

I feel the same about the others, except of course for Stanford, even if I live only 2 time zones from a few of them.

Why should I care?
You're right. But as a Cal fan the only thing that really matters is when Cal plays. Even in the Pac12 after a while, the other games didn't really matter to me. I used to despise Arizona so much that even if UCLA beat them, my "anti-socal" roots stopped coming into play. Today Cal's playing Wake Forest. If we were playing Arizona State would it really make that much of a difference? Bottom line: Go Bears!
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HoopDreams
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7:54a, 2/8/25
Good for today. Go after men's game!

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