Who will be Basketball's JKS this season?

2,296 Views | 32 Replies | Last: 5 days ago by SFCityBear
barsad
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I like what I'm seeing on the football side, though I never set hopes too high. But no doubt JKS' success is a pleasant surprise so far.
Who is going to be the surprise freshman or sophomore on the Cal squad this year? Ruff? I don't have a lot to go on, so I'm looking for a young guy like Wilkinson last year who will make an impact.
calumnus
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barsad said:

I like what I'm seeing on the football side, though I never set hopes too high. But no doubt JKS' success is a pleasant surprise so far.
Who is going to be the surprise freshman or sophomore on the Cal squad this year? Ruff? I don't have a lot to go on, so I'm looking for a young guy like Wilkinson last year who will make an impact.


I think Ruff and Carr are the only two true (scholarship) freshmen right? Ruff emerging as a high scoring star would be fantastic for the program. Carr as a solid PG would be huge too.
barsad
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Yes, but I was counting sophomores as having potential to be "young guy" surprises. So not counting walk-ons we have Pippen, Kocanas and Yeanay as 2nd years.
calumnus
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barsad said:

Yes, but I was counting sophomores as having potential to be "young guy" surprises. So not counting walk-ons we have Pippen, Kocanas and Yeanay as 2nd years.

In that case add the 7' Dut, maybe even Stephon Marbury II?
Even expanding the field, I still go with Ruff.
barsad
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barsad
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I see not a lot of interest in this topic, which is telling. Most of the young guys except Ruff will probably not see a lot of minutes (maybe Dut?) But I really believe if we keep up this pattern of only retaining 3 guys from the year before the program is doomed in the long term. That means making sure all the freshmen and sophomores want to stick around and know they have a future at Cal instead of being drawn by some fat check from the next team over. Invest in youth.
Big C
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The topic is interesting, it's just that I'm not seeing a young guy on the roster with anything like JKS impact.

I do like the way Carr used to be described as not super athletic (according to what I read anyway), but now it's sounding like he definitely has his share of athleticism.
sluggo
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No one.
oskidunker
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Football can bring in a bunch of new guys and be successful. Basketball can not, for whatever reason.
sluggo
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oskidunker said:

Football can bring in a bunch of new guys and be successful. Basketball can not, for whatever reason.

In most cases basketball players are what they are when they are 16, and everyone wants the same ones. These days Cal is not competitive for top players. Football players develop at all different times, which makes scouting much less reliable and players who were second choice when they were 16 may be first choice when they are 20.
sluggo
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calumnus said:

barsad said:

I like what I'm seeing on the football side, though I never set hopes too high. But no doubt JKS' success is a pleasant surprise so far.
Who is going to be the surprise freshman or sophomore on the Cal squad this year? Ruff? I don't have a lot to go on, so I'm looking for a young guy like Wilkinson last year who will make an impact.


I think Ruff and Carr are the only two true (scholarship) freshmen right? Ruff emerging as a high scoring star would be fantastic for the program. Carr as a solid PG would be huge too.

Pippen is only a sophomore, and I think he will be the best fresh/soph. He better be if the team wants to win more than a few games. But I think JKS will win the Heisman as a junior, he is that good, and there is certainly no one on the roster like that.
BeachedBear
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sluggo said:

calumnus said:

barsad said:

I like what I'm seeing on the football side, though I never set hopes too high. But no doubt JKS' success is a pleasant surprise so far.
Who is going to be the surprise freshman or sophomore on the Cal squad this year? Ruff? I don't have a lot to go on, so I'm looking for a young guy like Wilkinson last year who will make an impact.


I think Ruff and Carr are the only two true (scholarship) freshmen right? Ruff emerging as a high scoring star would be fantastic for the program. Carr as a solid PG would be huge too.

Pippen is only a sophomore, and I think he will be the best fresh/soph. He better be if the team wants to win more than a few games. But I think JKS will win the Heisman as a junior, he is that good, and there is certainly no one on the roster like that.


They don't give the Heisman to NFL players. LOL
Civil Bear
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BeachedBear said:

sluggo said:

calumnus said:

barsad said:

I like what I'm seeing on the football side, though I never set hopes too high. But no doubt JKS' success is a pleasant surprise so far.
Who is going to be the surprise freshman or sophomore on the Cal squad this year? Ruff? I don't have a lot to go on, so I'm looking for a young guy like Wilkinson last year who will make an impact.


I think Ruff and Carr are the only two true (scholarship) freshmen right? Ruff emerging as a high scoring star would be fantastic for the program. Carr as a solid PG would be huge too.

Pippen is only a sophomore, and I think he will be the best fresh/soph. He better be if the team wants to win more than a few games. But I think JKS will win the Heisman as a junior, he is that good, and there is certainly no one on the roster like that.


They don't give the Heisman to NFL players. LOL

As a true frosh, I believe JKS won't be eligible for the NFL until he is a senior.
sluggo
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Civil Bear said:

BeachedBear said:

sluggo said:

calumnus said:

barsad said:

I like what I'm seeing on the football side, though I never set hopes too high. But no doubt JKS' success is a pleasant surprise so far.
Who is going to be the surprise freshman or sophomore on the Cal squad this year? Ruff? I don't have a lot to go on, so I'm looking for a young guy like Wilkinson last year who will make an impact.


I think Ruff and Carr are the only two true (scholarship) freshmen right? Ruff emerging as a high scoring star would be fantastic for the program. Carr as a solid PG would be huge too.

Pippen is only a sophomore, and I think he will be the best fresh/soph. He better be if the team wants to win more than a few games. But I think JKS will win the Heisman as a junior, he is that good, and there is certainly no one on the roster like that.


They don't give the Heisman to NFL players. LOL

As a true frosh, I believe JKS won't be eligible for the NFL until he is a senior.

I consciously mentioned when he was a junior. NFL players need to be three years out of high school.
stu
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sluggo said:

In most cases basketball players are what they are when they are 16, and everyone wants the same ones.

Some of the bigs enter the sport or mature late and get much better with time. But it's hard to predict how much or how quickly one will improve.
sluggo
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stu said:

sluggo said:

In most cases basketball players are what they are when they are 16, and everyone wants the same ones.

Some of the bigs enter the sport or mature late and get much better with time. But it's hard to predict how much or how quickly one will improve.


Every once in a while. The vast majority of project bigs fail.
HearstMining
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stu said:

sluggo said:

In most cases basketball players are what they are when they are 16, and everyone wants the same ones.

Some of the bigs enter the sport or mature late and get much better with time. But it's hard to predict how much or how quickly one will improve.


Francisco Elson, anyone? I'd completely forgotten about him when, four years after leaving Cal (degree or not? I don't know) he suddenly popped up on the Nugget's roster and had a nice little eight-year run in the NBA.
stu
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Big C said:

The topic is interesting, it's just that I'm not seeing a young guy on the roster with anything like JKS impact.

From what I've seen, JKS is not just a legit 5-star but has been ready to play from day one
and plays a crucial position. IMHO the closest comparable Cal basketball player would be Jason Kidd.

The best I can hope is Justin Pippen will make a huge jump and remind people of Keith Smith.
oskidunker
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stu said:

Big C said:

The topic is interesting, it's just that I'm not seeing a young guy on the roster with anything like JKS impact.

From what I've seen, JKS is not just a legit 5-star but has been ready to play from day one
and plays a crucial position. IMHO the closest comparable Cal basketball player would be Jason Kidd.

The best I can hope is Justin Pippen will make a huge jump and remind people of Keith Smith.


It was sweet when Keith Smith beat Indiana.
Bring back It’s It’s to Haas Pavillion!
sluggo
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stu said:

Big C said:

The topic is interesting, it's just that I'm not seeing a young guy on the roster with anything like JKS impact.

From what I've seen, JKS is not just a legit 5-star but has been ready to play from day one
and plays a crucial position. IMHO the closest comparable Cal basketball player would be Jason Kidd.

The best I can hope is Justin Pippen will make a huge jump and remind people of Keith Smith.

Agreed on the first part. Maybe Kidd was even better for his sport than JKS and Jaylen Brown would be a good comparison.

I hope Justin Pippen is more like Justin Cobbs. Smith took a couple years to become as good as he did. Still Cobbs had nothing like the JKS impact.
stu
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sluggo said:

stu said:

Big C said:

The topic is interesting, it's just that I'm not seeing a young guy on the roster with anything like JKS impact.

From what I've seen, JKS is not just a legit 5-star but has been ready to play from day one
and plays a crucial position. IMHO the closest comparable Cal basketball player would be Jason Kidd.

The best I can hope is Justin Pippen will make a huge jump and remind people of Keith Smith.

Agreed on the first part. Maybe Kidd was even better for his sport than JKS and Jaylen Brown would be a good comparison.

I hope Justin Pippen is more like Justin Cobbs. Smith took a couple years to become as good as he did. Still Cobbs had nothing like the JKS impact.

I thought of Jaylen Brown. Awesome talent but he came in pretty raw and didn't make the players around him better.
sluggo
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stu said:

sluggo said:

stu said:

Big C said:

The topic is interesting, it's just that I'm not seeing a young guy on the roster with anything like JKS impact.

From what I've seen, JKS is not just a legit 5-star but has been ready to play from day one
and plays a crucial position. IMHO the closest comparable Cal basketball player would be Jason Kidd.

The best I can hope is Justin Pippen will make a huge jump and remind people of Keith Smith.

Agreed on the first part. Maybe Kidd was even better for his sport than JKS and Jaylen Brown would be a good comparison.

I hope Justin Pippen is more like Justin Cobbs. Smith took a couple years to become as good as he did. Still Cobbs had nothing like the JKS impact.

I thought of Jaylen Brown. Awesome talent but he came in pretty raw and didn't make the players around him better.

Even if he was not a great passer it is impossible that having a player that good does not help the team out.
stu
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sluggo said:

stu said:

sluggo said:

stu said:

Big C said:

The topic is interesting, it's just that I'm not seeing a young guy on the roster with anything like JKS impact.

From what I've seen, JKS is not just a legit 5-star but has been ready to play from day one
and plays a crucial position. IMHO the closest comparable Cal basketball player would be Jason Kidd.

The best I can hope is Justin Pippen will make a huge jump and remind people of Keith Smith.

Agreed on the first part. Maybe Kidd was even better for his sport than JKS and Jaylen Brown would be a good comparison.

I hope Justin Pippen is more like Justin Cobbs. Smith took a couple years to become as good as he did. Still Cobbs had nothing like the JKS impact.

I thought of Jaylen Brown. Awesome talent but he came in pretty raw and didn't make the players around him better.

Even if he was not a great passer it is impossible that having a player that good does not help the team out.

I totally agree, I'd love to get another Jaylen Brown. But I don't think he is closely comparable to JKS.
sonofabear51
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Didn't Keith Smith hit a late shot to beat Villanova in Harmon back in the '80's?
SFCityBear
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stu said:

sluggo said:

stu said:

Big C said:

The topic is interesting, it's just that I'm not seeing a young guy on the roster with anything like JKS impact.

From what I've seen, JKS is not just a legit 5-star but has been ready to play from day one
and plays a crucial position. IMHO the closest comparable Cal basketball player would be Jason Kidd.

The best I can hope is Justin Pippen will make a huge jump and remind people of Keith Smith.

Agreed on the first part. Maybe Kidd was even better for his sport than JKS and Jaylen Brown would be a good comparison.

I hope Justin Pippen is more like Justin Cobbs. Smith took a couple years to become as good as he did. Still Cobbs had nothing like the JKS impact.

I thought of Jaylen Brown. Awesome talent but he came in pretty raw and didn't make the players around him better.

JKS so far has done a terrific job of making many of his teammates look better. He makes his receivers look good by putting the ball where defenders can't touch it, and throws it where it is highly possible his receivers can catch it. He makes it look easy. He helps his blockers look good by using their blocks efficiently to buy enough time to allow him to complete passes. He hasn't been tackled that often.

While he looks good doing this, we have to remember that Cal has not played any ranked teams, or any team close to that, have we? I'm very high on him, but we need to see how he does against better teams to judge him fairly. If he continues to play like this, the sky is the limit for him, and hopefully for Cal, if we can have enough key players, like JKS, along with our offensive linemen, running backs, and receivers staying healthy. A lot of things have to happen for our good play to continue.

As for Jaylen Brown, he can score almost at will, usually by himself. He is quite capable of making other players look good on offense, but I sense that most coaches may have given him the freedom to go ahead and take the shot himself, instead of looking for a teammate who might be open for a better shot. Basketball in general has become less of a team sport on offense, while at the same time, become more of a team sport on defense, with the introduction of "help" defense, and the improvement of that help defense over the last few years. And Brown excels in any form of defense, including help defense, where he is good at helping out.

JKS, of course, does not play on defense, so JKS and Brown can't be compared on that, only on offense.




calumnus
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sluggo said:

stu said:

Big C said:

The topic is interesting, it's just that I'm not seeing a young guy on the roster with anything like JKS impact.

From what I've seen, JKS is not just a legit 5-star but has been ready to play from day one
and plays a crucial position. IMHO the closest comparable Cal basketball player would be Jason Kidd.

The best I can hope is Justin Pippen will make a huge jump and remind people of Keith Smith.

Agreed on the first part. Maybe Kidd was even better for his sport than JKS and Jaylen Brown would be a good comparison.

I hope Justin Pippen is more like Justin Cobbs. Smith took a couple years to become as good as he did. Still Cobbs had nothing like the JKS impact.

Yes, Cobbs was a third year red-shirt sophomore after transferring from Minnesota and having to sit out a year (remember that?). Hope Pippen is like Cobbs.
Civil Bear
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SFCityBear said:



While he looks good doing this, we have to remember that Cal has not played any ranked teams, or any team close to that, have we? I'm very high on him, but we need to see how he does against better teams to judge him fairly. If he continues to play like this, the sky is the limit for him, and hopefully for Cal, if we can have enough key players, like JKS, along with our offensive linemen, running backs, and receivers staying healthy. A lot of things have to happen for our good play to continue.

Minnesota is not ranked, but they do have (arguably) a top-25 defense, and will likely be the top defense he sees in the regular season, or at least close to it.
SFCityBear
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Civil Bear said:

SFCityBear said:



While he looks good doing this, we have to remember that Cal has not played any ranked teams, or any team close to that, have we? I'm very high on him, but we need to see how he does against better teams to judge him fairly. If he continues to play like this, the sky is the limit for him, and hopefully for Cal, if we can have enough key players, like JKS, along with our offensive linemen, running backs, and receivers staying healthy. A lot of things have to happen for our good play to continue.

Minnesota is not ranked, but they do have (arguably) a top-25 defense, and will likely be the top defense he sees in the regular season, or at least close to it.

Thanks Civil Bear
SFCityBear
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Well, I sure hope and pray whatever Cal basketball player emerges to be the most like JKS has been in football, that he will be more like the JKS who showed up tho play in Cal's first few games, rather than the JKS who showed up to play against San Diego State. It was a deer looking in the headlights all night long.
HearstMining
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stu said:

sluggo said:

stu said:

Big C said:

The topic is interesting, it's just that I'm not seeing a young guy on the roster with anything like JKS impact.

From what I've seen, JKS is not just a legit 5-star but has been ready to play from day one
and plays a crucial position. IMHO the closest comparable Cal basketball player would be Jason Kidd.

The best I can hope is Justin Pippen will make a huge jump and remind people of Keith Smith.

Agreed on the first part. Maybe Kidd was even better for his sport than JKS and Jaylen Brown would be a good comparison.

I hope Justin Pippen is more like Justin Cobbs. Smith took a couple years to become as good as he did. Still Cobbs had nothing like the JKS impact.

I thought of Jaylen Brown. Awesome talent but he came in pretty raw and didn't make the players around him better.

It's not the point of the topic, but if you're talking strictly about time at Cal, Shareef had way more impact (and polish) than Brown.
SFCityBear
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HearstMining said:

stu said:

sluggo said:

stu said:

Big C said:

The topic is interesting, it's just that I'm not seeing a young guy on the roster with anything like JKS impact.

From what I've seen, JKS is not just a legit 5-star but has been ready to play from day one
and plays a crucial position. IMHO the closest comparable Cal basketball player would be Jason Kidd.

The best I can hope is Justin Pippen will make a huge jump and remind people of Keith Smith.

Agreed on the first part. Maybe Kidd was even better for his sport than JKS and Jaylen Brown would be a good comparison.

I hope Justin Pippen is more like Justin Cobbs. Smith took a couple years to become as good as he did. Still Cobbs had nothing like the JKS impact.

I thought of Jaylen Brown. Awesome talent but he came in pretty raw and didn't make the players around him better.

It's not the point of the topic, but if you're talking strictly about time at Cal, Shareef had way more impact (and polish) than Brown.

I long for another Jason Kidd to arrive at Cal.
stu
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HearstMining said:

stu said:

sluggo said:

stu said:

Big C said:

The topic is interesting, it's just that I'm not seeing a young guy on the roster with anything like JKS impact.

From what I've seen, JKS is not just a legit 5-star but has been ready to play from day one
and plays a crucial position. IMHO the closest comparable Cal basketball player would be Jason Kidd.

The best I can hope is Justin Pippen will make a huge jump and remind people of Keith Smith.

Agreed on the first part. Maybe Kidd was even better for his sport than JKS and Jaylen Brown would be a good comparison.

I hope Justin Pippen is more like Justin Cobbs. Smith took a couple years to become as good as he did. Still Cobbs had nothing like the JKS impact.

I thought of Jaylen Brown. Awesome talent but he came in pretty raw and didn't make the players around him better.

It's not the point of the topic, but if you're talking strictly about time at Cal, Shareef had way more impact (and polish) than Brown.

I agree about Shareef compared to Brown. But I think both, especially Jaylen, played more like running backs in football while Jason played more like a quarterback.
SFCityBear
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stu said:

HearstMining said:

stu said:

sluggo said:

stu said:

Big C said:

The topic is interesting, it's just that I'm not seeing a young guy on the roster with anything like JKS impact.

From what I've seen, JKS is not just a legit 5-star but has been ready to play from day one
and plays a crucial position. IMHO the closest comparable Cal basketball player would be Jason Kidd.

The best I can hope is Justin Pippen will make a huge jump and remind people of Keith Smith.

Agreed on the first part. Maybe Kidd was even better for his sport than JKS and Jaylen Brown would be a good comparison.

I hope Justin Pippen is more like Justin Cobbs. Smith took a couple years to become as good as he did. Still Cobbs had nothing like the JKS impact.

I thought of Jaylen Brown. Awesome talent but he came in pretty raw and didn't make the players around him better.

It's not the point of the topic, but if you're talking strictly about time at Cal, Shareef had way more impact (and polish) than Brown.

I agree about Shareef compared to Brown. But I think both, especially Jaylen, played more like running backs in football while Jason played more like a quarterback.

On defense, Jason Kidd played like a middle linebacker, while Brown played like a defensive back. I don't remember anything remarkable about Shareef's defense.
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