I've seen nothing but reasonable outlooks/perspectives from South Bend over an extended time

perhaps some are reading his posts without that longer perspective, so may misunderstand him

I have a similar view about Braun and Monty's run, especially given we aren't playing on a level field (that's not an excuse, but a reality....we have some natural advantages over some teams, and some teams have natural advantages over us).

We are just not ready to proclaim that the new coaches will push Cal up to the basketball elite until we've seen more tangle results in terms of signing of top recruits and/or on court results.

SB is far from a negabear or a sunshine pumper, as those are two extremes that people just label others to discredit their arguments or devalue their commentary

But so far (speaking for myself only) I like the new coaches background and I like what they are doing and saying since they've come to Cal.

SB, forgive me if I'm misrepresenting you in any way

south bender;842329516 said:

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I cannot say that Ben's tenure toward the end particularly was exhilarating, but let me down? I would not put it that way. I wish he had been a better coach and had done better at Cal.

Monty I love. Last year was strange, but certainly in no way did I feel "let down" by Monty.

Look, I am glad that we got Martin. It is just the mood swings of many on this site, that now we are primed to contend for national titles, that is a bit much for me. I am not "waiting to be disappointed." I am hoping to be elated by the success of Martin as coach. I would be jazzed as anyone if we suddenly became a nationally powerful, relevant program.

To point out that there are not yet any achievements in games won or recruits signed to confirm the Cuonzo is leading our Bears to the promised land is not to be down on him.

In the end, of course, this is just college basketball. I love the game, enjoy rooting for the Bears, but that is as far as it goes. I certainly don't feel better or worse about life in general, depending on the outcome of games of any sort.

And to answer your question about pumping sunshine versus being a nega-Bear, in mentioning these labels, I was just playing around. I put no stock in either.

Go Bears!

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HoopDreams;842329539 said:

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I've seen nothing but reasonable outlooks/perspectives from South Bend over an extended time

perhaps some are reading his posts without that longer perspective, so may misunderstand him

I have a similar view about Braun and Monty's run, especially given we aren't playing on a level field (that's not an excuse, but a reality....we have some natural advantages over some teams, and some teams have natural advantages over us).

We are just not ready to proclaim that the new coaches will push Cal up to the basketball elite until we've seen more tangle results in terms of signing of top recruits and/or on court results.

SB is far from a negabear or a sunshine pumper, as those are two extremes that people just label others to discredit their arguments or devalue their commentary

But so far (speaking for myself only) I like the new coaches background and I like what they are doing and saying since they've come to Cal.

SB, forgive me if I'm misrepresenting you in any way

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We are one on this matter. Everything that we can observe about the new staff looks super.

As you are, I am pleased with our new coaches, and impatiently await the new season!

As well as I am anxious to see our new coaching staff's first year, I am excited to see the development of the now sophomore class (all five, and great to hear that Rooks is looking healthy), the junior class (Tyrone and Behrens), the senior (and probably once again improved) Kravish, and am hoping to be loving the two new recruits, the big guy and the little guy (talk about Mutt and Jeff!).

Go Bears!

Bobodeluxe;842329366 said:

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I just hope that people start going to the games in respectable numbers. Several have posted here that Cal was something like number three in the PAC in attendance. If that is true, the game is in crisis.

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The game has suffered attendance declines overall, but it would be nice if Haas was crowded and maybe even with people who stand up and yell a bit. (too much to ask?) All those empty chairbacks are depressing enough, but at least they're paid for but there were too many games with half-empty student areas.

Until the ball gets thrown up at center court, we're only dealing with perceptions. Right now the perception is that Martin is more interested in recruiting than Monty, and will be better at it. That would, for now, put him in with Padgett and Braun as good recruiters of talent. As yet unknown is whether he can get the talent to produce. Again, the perception is that Monty, Campanelli and Coach Newell were the best at getting performance out of the talent they had.

What we need is a coach that can do both. Hopefully, Martin is the man, but we won't know until the ball goes up in November.

Jeff82;842329697 said:

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Until the ball gets thrown up at center court, we're only dealing with perceptions. Right now the perception is that Martin is more interested in recruiting than Monty, and will be better at it. That would, for now, put him in with Padgett and Braun as good recruiters of talent. As yet unknown is whether he can get the talent to produce. Again, the perception is that Monty, Campanelli and Coach Newell were the best at getting performance out of the talent they had.

What we need is a coach that can do both. Hopefully, Martin is the man, but we won't know until the ball goes up in November.

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As with most things the answer lies somewhere in the middle. I think the staff will be marginally better on the recruiting front and probably a less adept on the Xs and Os. However, I think getting a few more blue chip recruits coupled with slightly better than average coaching might actually take us further than any coach we have had in the last 20 years.

Bobodeluxe;842329366 said:

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I just hope that people start going to the games in respectable numbers. Several have posted here that Cal was something like number three in the PAC in attendance. If that is true, the game is in crisis.

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I would have to guess that attendance in that case means tickets sold. Let's face it, we have a lot of chairbackers who buy the tickets as a donation and go to relatively few games. I doubt we are third in butts in seats.

MoragaBear;842329170 said:

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Have to keep much of this stuff on the Insider board for obvious reasons but here's a post from the other week to give you guys a general sense of what's going on with the 2015 class:

Here's a little rundown on where things stand right now with hoops recruiting.

No offers yet at PG for 2015. Recruiting Justin Robinson (MD), Paris Austin (Bishop O'Dowd), Terrence Phillips (visited last week).

SG: Brandon Sampson, Malik Beasley, Jimmy Whitt, Stevie Thompson all have offers and interest and Hanif Cheatham was offered last week. Trey Low and Serigne Athj are being recruited but don't have offers. Whitt's a combo guard but probably better at the 2.

SF: Ray Smith, Cameron Walker both offered. Walker: 2 team race with Stanford it seems but Cal has great relationship with Walker and his family. He just came off a great visit to Cal, too. Smith will be tough to pull. Tres Tinkle (no offer, probably OSU), Kaiser Gates (GA, Beasley's teammate, no offer) are others in the mix.

PF: Rabb, Boatwright both offered. Alex Illikaenen (no offer), Ed Morrow (Chicago, no offer), Elijah Thomas. Some of the guys without offers had offers from the previous staff and could get them with the current staff but Rabb's the clear priority and Boatright's #2.

C: Caleb Swanigan (recent offeree from Indiana -projected at 4 by most but Cal likes him at 5) and Chance Comanche (big priority). Josh Sharmin is being evaluated but no offer yet.

Here's the database: http://bearinsider.com/basketball/re...015&filter=all

Very good shots at officials from at least Walker, Rabb, Beasley, Sampson, Thompson, Comanche, Tinkle, Austin, Cheatham. Ray Smith might be tough to get here. Sampson, Beasley, Whitt, Thompson, Cheatham, Sharmin, Smith all were offered first at Vandy but there's good carryover at Cal.

Martin and staff feel like the previous staff did a great job coaching and with who they inherited. They especially like the frosh class.

A positive surprise is that they're happy with Rooks' mobility since recently coming back. They feel like he's going to flourish in the new S&C program with Nicodemas Christopher. Supposedly the returners, especially Bird, have a real fire and passion in their eyes and they said they'll be pushed like they've never been pushed before.

Bottom line: The new staff feels good with the situation right now, even with the thin roster. But they'll be guns blazing for this next class and are committed to working relentlessly to pump up the talent and the depth.

They said -look, we're not just here to win games and make the tourney. We want to win it all.

I get the feeling they mean it.

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Thoughts on 2015...

There is a lot recruiting and visiting yet to be done in the next couple months so names and school lists will continue to evolve.

The most important piece of the 2015 class is an immediate impact big to replace Kravish's production, most likely a 4 to play alongside Rooks or Okoroh. Obviously the priority is Rabb, and right now it appears there aren't many other realistic top-100ish targets being heavily pursued who are true interior players. Boatwright seems like more of a stretch 4 -- great prospect and somebody who could play alongside Rabb, but not sure how well he'd hold up having to play a lot in the paint.

Rabb is reportedly making his decision in Spring 2015. The only positive I can see for Martin there is that it gives him more time to build a relationship.

With three open spots, would they take a PF in November as insurance in case they don't get Rabb? Or if they elect to wait for Rabb, they'll have to have some contingency plans keeping in mind that Spring seems to elevate competition for available players, especially top-100 bigs.

SF and SG (or combo guard) are the other positions of need for 2015. Can't see taking a PG in 2015 with the current state of three available spots.

MoragaBear;842329176 said:

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Of course everyone wants to win it all. The point is, they think they legitimately have a chance to make some serious waves here. Not just to be a good program but a great one.

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Excellent news. Tedford thought the same thing and early on he was able to back it up.

If we can land Rabb and Comanche then they may have their ammo.

OaktownBear;842329766 said:

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I would have to guess that attendance in that case means tickets sold. Let's face it, we have a lot of chairbackers who buy the tickets as a donation and go to relatively few games. I doubt we are third in butts in seats.

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I have an irrational hatred for those people. LOL. I just hate the empty seats showing up on every tv broadcast and when I'm there I want to sit in them.

OaktownBear;842329766 said:

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I would have to guess that attendance in that case means tickets sold. Let's face it, we have a lot of chairbackers who buy the tickets as a donation and go to relatively few games. I doubt we are third in butts in seats.

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Would not be surprised if we were 3rd in seats. Crowds everywhere else in the Pac save AZ,CU, Utah are pretty bleak.

bluesaxe;842330355 said:

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I have an irrational hatred for those people. LOL. I just hate the empty seats showing up on every tv broadcast and when I'm there I want to sit in them.

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They should pm me. I'll take the seats.

http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_basketball_RB/Reports/attend/2014.pdf

Cal was 6th in 2014 after Arizona, Utah, Colorado, UCLA, and Oregon. I'd guess UCLA and Oregon won't stay above us as they are still experiencing a bump from the newness of their respective arenas. Utah surprisingly averaged 2nd best.

ColoradoBear1;842330423 said:

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http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_basketball_RB/Reports/attend/2014.pdf

Cal was 6th in 2014 after Arizona, Utah, Colorado, UCLA, and Oregon. I'd guess UCLA and Oregon won't stay above us as they are still experiencing a bump from the newness of their respective arenas. Utah surprisingly averaged 2nd best.

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Orygun avg 29 more/game with new arena. Ucla 400 more w/ new arena, historic legacy and 22 million in the greater LA area-just sayin:rant

ColoradoBear1;842330423 said:

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http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_basketball_RB/Reports/attend/2014.pdf

Cal was 6th in 2014 after Arizona, Utah, Colorado, UCLA, and Oregon. I'd guess UCLA and Oregon won't stay above us as they are still experiencing a bump from the newness of their respective arenas. Utah surprisingly averaged 2nd best.

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Take away the two NIT home games, and we would have been ahead of both UCLA and Oregon.

MoragaBear;842329203 said:

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I highly doubt Monty thought he could bring in the type of talent this staff thinks they can get.

We'll see how many of the strong relationships being built bear fruit but I'm expecting pretty big things.

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I know he made noise about recruiting one and dones like Gordon and Rabb, but that was lip service. He really didn't like the one year rule and that type of players, and it undoubtedly came through to the recruits. Nor did he like the AAU types. The fact that a player like Rabb made a serious about face when Martin and his staff came on board is telling.

BerkeleyBAT;842330507 said:

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Take away the two NIT home games, and we would have been ahead of both UCLA and Oregon.

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Interesting that the NCAA does indeed use those games in the average. Minus those two games, with 2518 and 1862 fans, Cal averaged 8408 per game.

That moves us up past Oregon, UCLA and Notre Dame to #54 best (from #61) in the NCAA.

(Not at all being completely facetious here)

And it's freaking sad that UCLA and Oregon each spent well over a hundred million on a remodel or new arena and draw so little. however, UCLA got a free remodel of the Rose Bowl from the city of pasadena, and oregon gets everything free from Uncle Phil.

Mike Montgomery was a great coach with very good recruiting. IMO, teams were very interesting to watch. And Cuonzo can do better. attendance might never average 11.5k because Haas is not comfortable at all, but it can still be really fun and loud at 10k. I think they should have made the seats a bit more comfortable in the first place at the expense of the extra seats.

ColoradoBear1;842330567 said:

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Interesting that the NCAA does indeed use those games in the average. Minus those two games, with 2518 and 1862 fans, Cal averaged 8408 per game.

That moves us up past Oregon, UCLA and Notre Dame to #54 best (from #61) in the NCAA.

(Not at all being completely facetious here)

And it's freaking sad that UCLA and Oregon each spent well over a hundred million on a remodel or new arena and draw so little. however, UCLA got a free remodel of the Rose Bowl from the city of pasadena, and oregon gets everything free from Uncle Phil.

Mike Montgomery was a great coach with very good recruiting. IMO, teams were very interesting to watch. And Cuonzo can do better. attendance might never average 11.5k because Haas is not comfortable at all, but it can still be really fun and loud at 10k. I think they should have made the seats a bit more comfortable in the first place at the expense of the extra seats.

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UCLA signed a new lease at higher rates after the RB remodel. No free lunch.

Any word on 2016 recruiting? Specifically with respect to Vancouver guard Jermaine Haley? His stock has really risen the last few months and Cal is now apparently in the mix (better late than never).

https://twitter.com/HoopsHypeCA/stat...84485237702656

Monty has a relationship with Haley's AAU coach, Pasha Bains, from when he was trying to recruit him to Stanford. Not sure to what extent the new staff does.

Quote, "So (as others on this Board have said), especially since it looks like Travis, Greg, John and Theo will land on their feet and do very well, thank you despite the disappointment all around (as was probably well predictable), it looks from here like whatever forces that were necessary gathered to produce the administrative boldness and vision to produce an even more promising prospect going forward than the previously most optimistic of us had hoped for.

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Wow! A sentence with 77 words on this blog must be some kind of record!

Cal, along with UCLA and Illinois, "monitoring" 2016 Nolan Narain. He's a 6'9" C out of Hamilton, ON, playing prep at La Lumiere in Indiana.

He played sparingly for Canada at the FIBA Americas U16s last summer, but may have a bigger role at the U17 worlds next month.

bluesaxe;842329680 said:

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The game has suffered attendance declines overall, but it would be nice if Haas was crowded and maybe even with people who stand up and yell a bit. (too much to ask?) All those empty chairbacks are depressing enough, but at least they're paid for but there were too many games with half-empty student areas.

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On this point, I have a message for the new AD: fire the gatekeeper ushers who police seating (unless problems arise) and allow fans to get close to the game. By forcing people like me into their seats higher up, you chase us from the game and onto our tv sets.
SDSU has turned their program around by creating a fun, lively, crowded arena that recruits want to play in front of. You might want to understand the importance of having an active fan base! Active = financial + loud.

bluesaxe;842330355 said:

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I have an irrational hatred for those people. LOL. I just hate the empty seats showing up on every tv broadcast and when I'm there I want to sit in them.

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You are not alone, but rather than be angry with the folks who direct $ to Cal regardless of the schedule they keep, direct it at the AD who hasn't figured out a way to get more butts into the Haas, let alone allow unused seats close to the action to be filled.

concordtom;842332861 said:

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You are not alone, but rather than be angry with the folks who direct $ to Cal regardless of the schedule they keep, direct it at the AD who hasn't figured out a way to get more butts into the Haas, let alone allow unused seats close to the action to be filled.

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We have a world class CS department. Seems like an iPhone/Android app should be able to fix things.

New policy: if your seat's ticket isn't scanned by tip off (or 10 minutes after, or whatever), someone can claim it with their smartphone and move to it. Allow season ticket holders to opt out if they don't like the policy.

CalAlumnus13;842332959 said:

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We have a world class CS department. Seems like an iPhone/Android app should be able to fix things.

New policy: if your seat's ticket isn't scanned by tip off (or 10 minutes after, or whatever), someone can claim it with their smartphone and move to it. Allow season ticket holders to opt out if they don't like the policy.

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I've heard a suggestion like this before. Sounds good and all, but it won't happen. The people in charge of stuff like this have different optics, issues of importance. I would say, by halftime. That way, there is no disturbance to seating while play is going on. Maybe you set up ticket machines in the lobby and people spend $2 to get a new ticket printed out, which gives them the right to sit there. There would be an interesting rush between those heading to the bar and those getting their new seats.
It could work!

MoragaBear;842332356 said:

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He's kind of on the fringe of interest right now.

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Narain now with offers from Gonzaga and Illinois after his strong showing last weekend.

Already I get the sense that this staff is much more committed to, and effective at, recruiting than the prior admin. He's not going to match Monty on x's and o's, but there's something to be said for the youth, energy and drive Cuonzo brings that's been lacking in this program for many years.

BeachyBear;842335413 said:

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Already I get the sense that this staff is much more committed to, and effective at, recruiting than the prior admin.

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Well, not until we actually land somebody worth getting excited about

BeachyBear;842335413 said:

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Already I get the sense that this staff is much more committed to, and effective at, recruiting than the prior admin.

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I have been waiting for some news on commitment of a few four or five star recruits since April when Coach Martin was hired. I am still waiting ... and hoping.

Moraga, can you at least give us a prediction of average stars for our next class?

smokeyrover;842329790 said:

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Thoughts on 2015...

There is a lot recruiting and visiting yet to be done in the next couple months so names and school lists will continue to evolve.

The most important piece of the 2015 class is an immediate impact big to replace Kravish's production, most likely a 4 to play alongside Rooks or Okoroh. Obviously the priority is Rabb, and right now it appears there aren't many other realistic top-100ish targets being heavily pursued who are true interior players. Boatwright seems like more of a stretch 4 -- great prospect and somebody who could play alongside Rabb, but not sure how well he'd hold up having to play a lot in the paint.

Rabb is reportedly making his decision in Spring 2015. The only positive I can see for Martin there is that it gives him more time to build a relationship.

With three open spots, would they take a PF in November as insurance in case they don't get Rabb? Or if they elect to wait for Rabb, they'll have to have some contingency plans keeping in mind that Spring seems to elevate competition for available players, especially top-100 bigs.

SF and SG (or combo guard) are the other positions of need for 2015. Can't see taking a PG in 2015 with the current state of three available spots.

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I don't see taking another PF as just insurance in case Rabb goes elsewhere; Cal needs more than one big for 2015 and even if they get Rabb he is a 1 year player. Plus Cal needs an impact center. Missing on Welsh, Poeltl, etc was very costly.

powripp;842335642 said:

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Well, not until we actually land somebody worth getting excited about

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You no ?

Bobodeluxe;842335769 said:

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You no ?

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Let's just say that how the 2013 class closed out was pretty disappointing to me. I understand that transition to a new coach is never easy and there has to be a fit between coach and players, but I'm hoping for something that's more of a sure thing type of recruit to commit to us in the next 3 months.

powripp;842335908 said:

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Let's just say that how the 2013 class closed out was pretty disappointing to me. I understand that transition to a new coach is never easy and there has to be a fit between coach and players, but I'm hoping for something that's more of a sure thing type of recruit to commit to us in the next 3 months.

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MB kinda beat me to this, but are you the powripp from back in the day? Those were fun times...