If this isn't enough to make Arizona move on, I don't know what will be enough.

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/26647372/miller-paid-10k-per-month-ayton

BearSD said:

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If this isn't enough to make Arizona move on, I don't know what will be enough.

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/26647372/miller-paid-10k-per-month-ayton

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They are desperate to keep their recruiting class. It's a short-sighted view, though. They likely know it will be hard to get a decent replacement for Miller, with their brand damaged.

Has anyone seen comments recently from Miller? Is he hiding until the start of the season???

89Bear said:

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Has anyone seen comments recently from Miller? Is he hiding until the start of the season???

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Not sure about Miller but the general consensus among Arizona people seems to be: 1). Miller already has said he's never paid a player and we believe him; and 2) it makes perfect sense that Book Richardson would make this kind of stuff up to Dawkins so that he can get more of a cut. Of course, Miller is the victim in all this.

Even if you defy reason and think Miller is above board (lol), he still has to deal with the ncaa rule that states "The head coach will be held accountable for violations in the program unless he or she can rebut the presumption of responsibility", meaning that the head coach is still responsible for violations committed by assistants.

I've been aghast for the last year - how has the University of Arizona not cut ties with Sean Miller yet??

All the stuff before today made clear what a scoundrel Miller is. Today's news is just the stem on the cherry on the ice cream on the sundae.

If U of A wants to be thought of as anything other than a joke University, they need to cut ties with Sean Miller right now.

75bear said:

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I've been aghast for the last year - how has the University of Arizona not cut ties with Sean Miller yet??

All the stuff before today made clear what a scoundrel Miller is. Today's news is just the stem on the cherry on the ice cream on the sundae.

If U of A wants to be thought of as anything other than a joke University, they need to cut ties with Sean Miller right now.

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They have their priorities and we have ours.

Is too early to label Coach Miller a "tzchithead"?

$10,000 in cash for player. That is bad.

The NCAA won't be able to ignore the situation. Oregon State will be hit with sanctions any day now (with apologies to Jerry Tarkanian).

UofA knew all this info last year yet continued to employ Miller after a closed door session between Miller and the regents. He has a whack contract with UofA. He gets paid whether he cheats or not. They've decided to save money and employ this cheater because they can't get their money back.

Whats bizarre in all this is that we sit here and fret and agaonize about our coaching and its so clear that it is NOT a level playing field at all. And the NCAA band plays on...

uA wins with Coach Miller.
Winning means big$$$.
Keep Miller.
Pay the fines.
Fight the penalties.
Extend Miller's contract and move on.

75bear said:

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If U of A wants to be thought of as anything other than a joke University, they need to cut ties with Sean Miller right now.

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Maybe they past the point of no return.

This was posted on a U of A fan site...

oskirules said:

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75bear said:

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If U of A wants to be thought of as anything other than a joke University, they need to cut ties with Sean Miller right now.

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Maybe they past the point of no return.

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Not too hasty. . . gotta charter the Honors College.

joe amos yaks said:

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uA wins with Coach Miller.
Winning means big$$$.
Keep Miller.
Pay the fines.
Fight the penalties.
Extend Miller's contract and move on.

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At this point, I'd rather have Mark Fox than Miller.

Listened to XM college sports talk radio this morning.

Chris (the hosts) basically said

• No-one cares
• Everyone cheats (Arizona, LSU, etc)
• Schools with serious athletic aspirations all cheat
• The rules are still the rules
• He feels bad - schools that try to play within the rules are at a competitive disadvantage

Welcome to life...

I love the cynicism.

I get that the NCAA and Arizona might not take action considering all the evidence and corruption, but all the recruits are sticking! NONE of them are scared off?

Any chance Hazzard can get out and come to us? Not that he didn't know about all this going in.

BC Calfan said:

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I get that the NCAA and Arizona might not take action considering all the evidence and corruption, but all the recruits are sticking! NONE of them are scared off?

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$ talks.

If you think the ncaa actually cares....

KoreAmBear said:

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Any chance Hazzard can get out and come to us? Not that he didn't know about all this going in.

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Unlikely. He has probably already spent the $$ that he'd have to return.

RJABear said:

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Listened to XM college sports talk radio this morning.

Chris (the hosts) basically said

• No-one cares
• Everyone cheats (Arizona, LSU, etc)
• Schools with serious athletic aspirations all cheat
• The rules are still the rules
• He feels bad - schools that try to play within the rules are at a competitive disadvantage

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INCLUDING DUKE!

In before someone starts fanboying about Krzyzewski.

Yogi Bear said:

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RJABear said:

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Listened to XM college sports talk radio this morning.

Chris (the hosts) basically said

• No-one cares
• Everyone cheats (Arizona, LSU, etc)
• Schools with serious athletic aspirations all cheat
• The rules are still the rules
• He feels bad - schools that try to play within the rules are at a competitive disadvantage

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INCLUDING DUKE!

In before someone starts fanboying about Krzyzewski.

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For sure.

Will Wade is still at LSU and he's on a wiretap bragging about the "strong azz offer" he made to get one of his players. Bill Self is in no danger whatsoever, and he's on a wiretap where his adidas handler promises to do anything for KU, Self tells him, "Just got to get a couple of real guys," and lo and behold a couple of one and done players sign with KU. The Zonies can argue, "Why does Sean Miller have to be the only one to go?"

Does anyone believe this is an outlier?

After all, UNC -- which cherishes its academic reputation -- set up bogus classes for athletes (and others who were clever enough to get in on the scam) and didn't even care. When caught, they fired the women's basketball coach, and of course the NCAA did nothing.

I will repeat that I believe most of this stems from not paying workers who generate a tremendous amount of income. If high school and college athletes were able to negotiate contracts and be paid whatever the market decided, then much of this corruption would disappear. (Note that I'm not saying all college athletes should be paid -- only those who generate enough interest on the open market to draw a salary.)

ClayK said:

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I will repeat that I believe most of this stems from not paying workers who generate a tremendous amount of income.

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Of course. Elite athletes like Zion Williamson or Tua Tagovailoa make millions for the schools whose uniforms they (briefly) wear and for their $10 million/year head coaches.

Let the market decide how much it's worth to have Tua at Alabama and Zion at Duke rather than someplace else. Either the open market decides it above the table, or the gray market decides it below the table. The hypocrites want to keep it below the table so they can keep pretending to believe in the Tooth Fairy and Santa Claus and college amateurism.

The open market already exists: in Europe, Asia, Australia, NBA, etc. What is suggested here is that the colleges go directly the into professional sports business. Professional sports is unlikely to be found in any college charter and also unlikely, as a matter of law, to be supportable by tax dollars. The real problem is the colleges trying to be "not quite" in the professional sports business. The answer is to get out of "professional sports" and return to academics. Also, athletes getting paid "above board" will not eliminate "under the table" payments. Finally, what does the college do when its "one and done" superstar who it is paying several million dollars per year turns out to be Ivan Rabb and not Zion Williamson?

RJABear said:

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Get rid of the one-and-done rule. Let the kids who are capable go pro as soon as possible.

I would watch the same amount of college basketball with or without John Wall, Zion Williamson, and Anthony Davis.

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I starred your third sentence.
But your first sentence won't fix the cheating.
You gotta pay the kids their market value. Otherwise the incentive to cheat is huge.
If you are a poor family, $100,000 is massive. But if you pay $100,000 on top of that, it's not as motivating to cheat and risk. Basic needs can be met with the initial pay amount.

Cheating will go on anyway. I have known college players on the "take" from as many as four agents at once; when the players did not "need" more money to live. In one case the player was wealthy. Getting paid is an ego stroke. Paying is an ego stroke for the boosters. Paying the players is not the answer.

bearchamp said:

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The open market already exists: in Europe, Asia, Australia, NBA, etc. What is suggested here is that the colleges go directly the into professional sports business. Professional sports is unlikely to be found in any college charter and also unlikely, as a matter of law, to be supportable by tax dollars. The real problem is the colleges trying to be "not quite" in the professional sports business. The answer is to get out of "professional sports" and return to academics. Also, athletes getting paid "above board" will not eliminate "under the table" payments. Finally, what does the college do when its "one and done" superstar who it is paying several million dollars per year turns out to be Ivan Rabb and not Zion Williamson?

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Good points.
But what then is the solution?

College athletics is a multi-billion dollar industry, especially when it's impact on donors and applications are included.

The employees who generate the bulk of this income -- primarily football players and men's basketball players -- are paid the same as those employees who generate zero income -- golf, tennis, etc.

Because there is so much money at stake, there is enormous pressure on those within the system to do whatever it takes to succeed, and obviously paying players is one of them. And regardless if the payments come under the table, over the table or at halftime, there is no good reason that they should not be made.

I'm not saying that golfers should be paid, or even football quarterbacks. But if a university/donor/sponsor feels it's in their best interests to do so, why prevent it? College athletics, to repeat, is a multi-billion dollar industry, and there's no reason the market should not dictate how its employees are paid. (Coaches and athletic directors take full advantage of the market; why are the other adults in the system denied the same privilege?)

Even Division III schools make financial deals with athletes, which leads to the question of why there should be this sham of amateurism at all, if not to deny athletes access to the income they really deserve?

bearchamp said:

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Finally, what does the college do when its "one and done" superstar who it is paying several million dollars per year turns out to be Ivan Rabb and not Zion Williamson?

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The college then regrets the purchase, just like when you pay big bucks to a coach and he turns out to be Wyking Jones and not Pete Newell.

Are you going to use that fact to argue that coaches should work for free?

Of course not. And that argument has just as little merit whether it's applied to athletes or coaches.