https://es.pn/2WyGT2e

Will Kuany make it 3-0? In terms of trajectory, it wouldn't surprise me.

Where's everyone who told us Kyle Smith was a bad hire?

Kuany will come here.

If Pullman is viewed as more desirable than Berkeley, as Don meredith used to say, " turn out the lights----the party's over"!!!!!!

I think WSU's 3rd leading scorer put his name in the transfer Portal this week and Elleby getting some love from the NBA

HoopDreams said:

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I think WSU's 3rd leading scorer put his name in the transfer Portal this week and Elleby getting some love from the NBA

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Wasn't among the 66 invited to the combine, so he'll be coming back. That was probably his plan all along but with the way the rules are, there's no downside to throwing your name out there and getting some feedback.

BearSD said:

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Where's everyone who told us Kyle Smith was a bad hire?

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I don't have any basis here to know whether I'm sorry we didn't get these guys or not.

HoopDreams said:

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I think WSU's 3rd leading scorer put his name in the transfer Portal this week and Elleby getting some love from the NBA

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https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/wsu-cougar-basketball/washington-states-robert-franks-cj-elleby-and-gonzagas-josh-perkins-to-participate-in-g-league-camp/

Elleby is my favorite player in the league just like Klay was. Elleby has hops, handles, speed, offense, motor stuck in high gear and hyper aggressive to the point of crossing the line. He also has a Michael Bloomfield vibe.

BearSD said:

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Where's everyone who told us Kyle Smith was a bad hire?

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Don't know that I said he was a bad hire for wasu, but he most def would have been a worse hire for Cal than Fox.

BearSD said:

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Where's everyone who told us Kyle Smith was a bad hire?

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People who do not pay attention to the personality, their coaching or philosophy and only compare his recent 3 year W/L at USF with Fox's W/L at Nevada a decade ago.

Hey, but Fox is our guy now, so hoping for the best.

calumnus said:

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BearSD said:

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Where's everyone who told us Kyle Smith was a bad hire?

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People who do not pay attention to the personality, their coaching or philosophy and only compare his recent 3 year W/L at USF with Fox's W/L at Nevada a decade ago.

Hey, but Fox is our guy now, so hoping for the best.

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Right, it has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that Smith hasn't even made it to the NIT in his 9 year HC career.

Civil Bear said:

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BearSD said:

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Where's everyone who told us Kyle Smith was a bad hire?

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Don't know that I said he was a bad hire for wasu, but he most def would have been a worse hire for Cal than Fox.

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"Most definitely"? Why?

If put in identical situations, I would put my money on Smith every time. Smart guy, open minded and flexible, uses the data, good positive motivator. A guy kids want to play for, which is critical these days. I was really impressed with his coaching Columbia over Turner and Irvine in the CBI championship game.

Civil Bear said:

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calumnus said:

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BearSD said:

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Where's everyone who told us Kyle Smith was a bad hire?

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People who do not pay attention to the personality, their coaching or philosophy and only compare his recent 3 year W/L at USF with Fox's W/L at Nevada a decade ago.

Hey, but Fox is our guy now, so hoping for the best.

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Right, it has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that Smith hasn't even made it to the NIT in his 9 year HC career.

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I went to Columbia for grad school. They used to be last in the Ivy League. Zero attendance. Zero. 33 straight years of losing records before Smith. His first year is their first winning record in 34 years. Getting them to 25 wins was a great accomplishment, but I get it, it is the Ivy League. Unless you win the Ivy, you aren't going to the NCAA or NIT.

oskidunker said:

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https://es.pn/2WyGT2e

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I've maxed out my windows so can't click without losing one.
What's it say?

bearister said:

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He also has a Michael Bloomfield vibe.

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Doesn't get any better than this, and the lyrics work for a Cal fan:
I Got A Mind To Give Up Living

concordtom said:

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oskidunker said:

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https://es.pn/2WyGT2e

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I've maxed out my windows so can't click without losing one.
What's it say?

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Cougs signed a decent freshman and a so-so grad transfer. Big whoop.

Fox was never going to be Mr. Big Turnaround Guy. We hired him (not on my recommendation). Now we gotta give him a few years, see what he can do and hope for the best.

Big C said:

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concordtom said:

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oskidunker said:

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https://es.pn/2WyGT2e

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I've maxed out my windows so can't click without losing one.
What's it say?

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Cougs signed a decent freshman and a so-so grad transfer. Big whoop.

Fox was never going to be Mr. Big Turnaround Guy. We hired him (not on my recommendation). Now we gotta give him a few years, see what he can do and hope for the best.

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"Gotta" is the key word there.

Regarding recruiting, Fox has brought one back from the portal and lost one recruit. So he is at 0 right now. Alford at Nevada is at +8 right now. Brought back 4 from the portal and signed 4. BTW Fox had a really good record when he coached Nevada. Hope he can duplicate that at Cal.

Yogi Bear said:

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BearSD said:

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Where's everyone who told us Kyle Smith was a bad hire?

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I don't have any basis here to know whether I'm sorry we didn't get these guys or not.

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Or that Cal was even that involved with them? Head to head recruiting with Washington St. isn't going to determine in the long or short run how the program is doing...

calumnus said:

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Civil Bear said:

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calumnus said:

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BearSD said:

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Where's everyone who told us Kyle Smith was a bad hire?

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People who do not pay attention to the personality, their coaching or philosophy and only compare his recent 3 year W/L at USF with Fox's W/L at Nevada a decade ago.

Hey, but Fox is our guy now, so hoping for the best.

---

Right, it has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that Smith hasn't even made it to the NIT in his 9 year HC career.

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I went to Columbia for grad school. They used to be last in the Ivy League. Zero attendance. Zero. 33 straight years of losing records before Smith. His first year is their first winning record in 34 years. Getting them to 25 wins was a great accomplishment, but I get it, it is the Ivy League. Unless you win the Ivy, you aren't going to the NCAA or NIT.

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Ivy league teams can make the NIT if they are good enough. Harvard went just last year.

calumnus said:

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Civil Bear said:

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BearSD said:

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Where's everyone who told us Kyle Smith was a bad hire?

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Don't know that I said he was a bad hire for wasu, but he most def would have been a worse hire for Cal than Fox.

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"Most definitely"? Why?

If put in identical situations, I would put my money on Smith every time. Smart guy, open minded and flexible, uses the data, good positive motivator. A guy kids want to play for, which is critical these days. I was really impressed with his coaching Columbia over Turner and Irvine in the CBI championship game.

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What matters to me is results, and Fox has produced better at higher levels.

caltagjohnson said:

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Regarding recruiting, Fox has brought one back from the portal and lost one recruit. So he is at 0 right now. Alford at Nevada is at +8 right now. Brought back 4 from the portal and signed 4. BTW Fox had a really good record when he coached Nevada. Hope he can duplicate that at Cal.

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Why is Nevada and/or Alford a point of reference for anything Cal?

caltagjohnson said:

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Regarding recruiting, Fox has brought one back from the portal and lost one recruit. So he is at 0 right now.

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The way I see it Fox has lost McNeill and Smith (LOI) and gained nobody. I consider retaining a player who entered the portal after the coach was hired to be a zero, not a plus. So far no new recruits, so my score is -2, maybe a bit worse because the losses leave us short at a critical position.

AFAIK we still have 3 players in the portal, though for a lot of reasons I wouldn't call Davis a big loss. However IMHO the 2 players remaining in the portal were among our better players and will be hard to replace immediately if they go.

mbBear said:

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caltagjohnson said:

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Regarding recruiting, Fox has brought one back from the portal and lost one recruit. So he is at 0 right now. Alford at Nevada is at +8 right now. Brought back 4 from the portal and signed 4. BTW Fox had a really good record when he coached Nevada. Hope he can duplicate that at Cal.

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Why is Nevada and/or Alford a point of reference for anything Cal?

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Nevada had as much, if not more uncertainty than Cal in regards to players this coming year.They had more players enter the portal than Cal, and Alford has gotten them back in the fold. Granted, UNR wasn't the **** show that Cal has been, so there really is nothing that can compare to us right now, but Nevada is the closest thing.

stu said:

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caltagjohnson said:

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Regarding recruiting, Fox has brought one back from the portal and lost one recruit. So he is at 0 right now.

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The way I see it Fox has lost McNeill and Smith (LOI) and gained nobody. I consider retaining a player who entered the portal after the coach was hired to be a zero, not a plus. So far no new recruits, so my score is -2, maybe a bit worse because the losses leave us short at a critical position.

AFAIK we still have 3 players in the portal, though for a lot of reasons I wouldn't call Davis a big loss. However IMHO the 2 players remaining in the portal were among our better players and will be hard to replace immediately if they go.

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Getting either of the two back would be huge moving forward, but I don't expect that it will happen. Davis is a complete non factor here, just like he was the entire time he was at Cal.

caltagjohnson said:

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Regarding recruiting, Fox has brought one back from the portal and lost one recruit. So he is at 0 right now. Alford at Nevada is at +8 right now. Brought back 4 from the portal and signed 4. BTW Fox had a really good record when he coached Nevada. Hope he can duplicate that at Cal.

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Yeah, and Jordan Caroline is what the Warriors need even though he couldn't even get invited to the G-League combine.

Alford is scum. Enjoy him.

helltopay1 said:

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If Pullman is viewed as more desirable than Berkeley, as Don meredith used to say, " turn out the lights----the party's over"!!!!!!

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Pullman has one thing going for it, the best homecourt advantage in the PAC, in football or basketball.

The Palouse is beautiful country.
And WSu is best at ice cream.

stu said:

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caltagjohnson said:

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Regarding recruiting, Fox has brought one back from the portal and lost one recruit. So he is at 0 right now.

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The way I see it Fox has lost McNeill and Smith (LOI) and gained nobody. I consider retaining a player who entered the portal after the coach was hired to be a zero, not a plus. So far no new recruits, so my score is -2, maybe a bit worse because the losses leave us short at a critical position.

AFAIK we still have 3 players in the portal, though for a lot of reasons I wouldn't call Davis a big loss. However IMHO the 2 players remaining in the portal were among our better players and will be hard to replace immediately if they go.

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Wait!! So he "lost" Smith and gets no credit for re-recruiting Thorpe and Brown??? Yeah, that makes sense.

89Bear said:

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Wait!! So he "lost" Smith and gets no credit for re-recruiting Thorpe and Brown??? Yeah, that makes sense.

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Since all three had signed LOIs I consider leaving a minus and staying a zero. To me a plus would be bringing in a useful player not previously committed to Cal (e.g. Jones bringing in McNeill).

But that's just my opinion. I'm actually pleased that Fox managed to retain or re-recruit two players. Good on him.

Anyway I'm more concerned about filling gaps than keeping score. If Vanover leaves we'll have no center, I doubt any of our 3 power forwards will be soon become an effective PAC-12 center. But I'm more worried about small forward and shooting guard. I see only Bradley as a sure contributor. Harris-Dyson hasn't been a good shooter, Gordon hasn't been healthy or ready, and I don't know if Brown could help there. With neither a center nor much perimeter scoring and defense we could look pretty bad.

I just read that Kuany is coming. In my scoring that's a plus. So now we'll have 4 power forwards - I hope 1 or 2 of them will be able to shoot or defend away from the basket a little.

Civil Bear said:

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calumnus said:

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Civil Bear said:

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BearSD said:

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Where's everyone who told us Kyle Smith was a bad hire?

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Don't know that I said he was a bad hire for wasu, but he most def would have been a worse hire for Cal than Fox.

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"Most definitely"? Why?

If put in identical situations, I would put my money on Smith every time. Smart guy, open minded and flexible, uses the data, good positive motivator. A guy kids want to play for, which is critical these days. I was really impressed with his coaching Columbia over Turner and Irvine in the CBI championship game.

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What matters to me is results, and Fox has produced better at higher levels.

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Results matter to me too. It is why Cuonzo getting a 4 seed is better than any result at Cal basketball in a long time.

Context is important. I look for results relative to the situation. I look to see if the coach makes a difference, if he is getting the most from the school's potential. I look at recruiting, I look at offensive and defensive strategy. And results, where was the school at when he took over? What did he achieve within that school's context? He thinks out of the box. He developed the Aussie pipeline at St. Mary's. He was originally known for being a good recruiter. Now he is known for "nerd ball" and using analytics, being "the smartest man in basketball." His teams play good defense and have efficient offense, minimal turnovers.

Smith is achieving success at schools that were not successful before he took over, places that were considered impossible, turning them around and is getting promoted. There is a reason why Klay Thompson recommended him for his alma matter.

Cal is a much better situation than WSU. I think he will do well there, but I think he would have done good things at Cal.

Hope you are right about Fox. I don't see it, but I hope you are right.

calumnus said:

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Context is important. I look for results relative to the situation. I look to see if the coach makes a difference, if he is getting the most from the school's potential.

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Good point!

If I were interviewing coaching candidates I'd look for someone really bright, knowledgeable, good with organization, and good with people. I think those qualities would attract and develop the kind of players I want at Cal. Then results would come.

calumnus said:

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Context is important. I look for results relative to the situation.

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9 years provides more than enough context.

Civil Bear said:

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calumnus said:

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Context is important. I look for results relative to the situation.

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9 years provides more than enough context.

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Exactly, that is why he was fired and no one hired him for a year. An SEC school with zero admission standards located in one of the states that produces the most NBA talent should have at least one year out of nine with some tournament success. Even success in the NIT or CBI.

But enough. Say what you want I'll say no more. It is what it is.

Go Bears! Go Fox!