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LG inherited a top 4 roster and left a top 150 roster. She had recruiting classes of 0, 1 and 2 players and those 3 players left so she basically had 3 recruiting classes with no players.

She had 4-14 conference record when the PAC-12 was mediocre and Mike Williams gave her an extension.

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Ha -- this one was pretty funny. No spin or anything....

Cal went 18-16/7-11 Pac12 and lost in 2d rd of the WNIT the year before, with much of the roster LG 'inherited.' The next year they went 25-10/15-6 and lost in 2d rd of the NCAA, but didn't finish ranked in the polls.

And if memory serves, didn't Charmin have some opportunity to keep some of the recruits/players that left, similar to Gottlieb keeping Boyd and Gray?

Lol, the conference was pretty mediocre that year -- except for the 3 Elite Eight teams (2 Final 4) and 2 other top-20 ranked teams.

The most difficult aspect of evaluating talent (and thus recruiting) is trying to determine when a player will stop improving.

Some players are as good as they will be 15 (Gabby Green), especially on the girls' side because usually the girl you see as a freshman is the woman you'll see at 21, in terms of height. Some players' main goal is to get a scholarship, and once that happens, they kick it into neutral (especially since they've been playing year-round since they were 11).

The prizes, though, are the players who do love to play, and work on their games and consistently improve all the way through college. And some players just get better and better as pros.

How do you determine which players fall into which categories? The successful college coaches do a better job of recruiting players who will continue to improve; the average coaches have a tougher time separating the players who have already peaked and/or lack the motivation from those who will be significantly better as seniors.

Always love a thread about a Cal coach who totally squished my expectations as a fan of Cal WHOOPS. Really Messed my head up. Twas a roller coaster ride from the apex of a F4 to literally ZERO players recruited in 3 years. It all came down to one thing and one thing only:

LINDSAY GOTTA LEAVE!!!

Seriously, it's been a treat to read some of the threads on Cal WHOOPS over the years, I know the lot of you had mucho problems processing the fact that a final four coach could s-#k so bad as a recruiter/coach.

Charmin Smith will never equal LGs overall record @ Cal in her career here, due to such a poor start, but I could see her with a .567 or so conference winning pct. When it's all said and done. How many more years/mulligans does she have left?

SFCALBear72 said:

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Well, she had 5 players transfer out after her first season there. I'm not worried.

(Sidebar: It's interesting that your very first post on BI is about the "recruiting success" of a former Cal WBB coach at another school. hmmmmm)

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Even money it's Yogi Bear.

Ccajon2 said:

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SFCALBear72 said:

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Well, she had 5 players transfer out after her first season there. I'm not worried.

(Sidebar: It's interesting that your very first post on BI is about the "recruiting success" of a former Cal WBB coach at another school. hmmmmm)

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Even money it's Yogi Bear.

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I don't think he or she was into women basketball.

ClayK said:

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I don't believe Cal was ever a favorite, or close to it, for Sabrina.
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Cal was the heavy favorite and almost signed early, but she had nothing in common with her would be teammates at Cal. Same reason why Plum didn't come and why several women transferred. I'd be more specific, but the moderators are too sensitive to the truth when you spell it out.

I believe you are wrong on Sabrina heavily favoring Cal early, but I believe you are right about the culture that kept Cal from being in the picture for her or Kelsey Plum.

The only reason I mention this is to counter the belief that somehow Lindsay blew it with Sabrina. She was on level ground, so I don't think she was directly to blame, and it's unclear how much the nature of the team at the time was due to Gottlieb.

ClayK said:

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I believe you are wrong on Sabrina heavily favoring Cal early, but I believe you are right about the culture that kept Cal from being in the picture for her or Kelsey Plum.

The only reason I mention this is to counter the belief that somehow Lindsay blew it with Sabrina. She was on level ground, so I don't think she was directly to blame, and it's unclear how much the nature of the team at the time was due to Gottlieb.

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..but you posted you didn't think much of coach G as a coach. Curious so when Sabrina asked you what you thought did you give her an answer, since you did work for her club team?

I never talked to Sabrina about her college choice nor did I ever coach her directly. But as a reporter who began writing about her as a sophomore in high school, I was close to the situation.

ClayK said:

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I never talked to Sabrina about her college choice nor did I ever coach her directly. But as a reporter who began writing about her as a sophomore in high school, I was close to the situation.

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But does she ask for your opinion being that you are the high school guru in this area and you are associated with her high school and the aau team she played on?

Why is this still being debated? Waste of time. She opted for Oregon. Good for her.

Moving on.

I will never forget one aspect of Sabrina's recruitment. After being offered by Cal, and with the Cal coaching staff attending many of her games and inviting her to numerous functions at Cal, Sabrina never publicly thanked LG and others, but merely announced that Cal "has been dismissed from my list". Sabrina is long gone now, but I root against her to this day in the WNBA.

annarborbear said:

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I will never forget one aspect of Sabrina's recruitment. After being offered by Cal, and with the Cal coaching staff attending many of her games and inviting her to numerous functions at Cal, Sabrina never publicly thanked LG and others, but merely announced that Cal "has been dismissed from my list". Sabrina is long gone now, but I root against her to this day in the WNBA.

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Amen!

3Cats4CAL said:

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annarborbear said:

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I will never forget one aspect of Sabrina's recruitment. After being offered by Cal, and with the Cal coaching staff attending many of her games and inviting her to numerous functions at Cal, Sabrina never publicly thanked LG and others, but merely announced that Cal "has been dismissed from my list". Sabrina is long gone now, but I root against her to this day in the WNBA.

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Amen!

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I second this!

She never asked my opinion about anything. I did suggest to her and her father that she try out for the USA Basketball U-16 team. That's about all the input I had on her career.

Teenage girls generally don't reach out to old guys for advice.

Arizona State's new HC has an impressive haul of transfers already headlined by Treasure Hunt from Kentucky. Should immediately at least make them competitive.

annarborbear said:

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I will never forget one aspect of Sabrina's recruitment. After being offered by Cal, and with the Cal coaching staff attending many of her games and inviting her to numerous functions at Cal, Sabrina never publicly thanked LG and others, but merely announced that Cal "has been dismissed from my list". Sabrina is long gone now, but I root against her to this day in the WNBA.

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Sabrina became a celebrity in highschool. Since she was a young girl she was a tough competitor. Maybe arrogance developed in her personality. It has been said in Orinda, her father was warmer to at least one of her teammates then she displayed. During one of her last games at Oregon, the woman coach said something to Sabrina as she came off the floor during a timeout. She did not appear confrontational, but Sabrina snapped back at her both in voice and body language. Kelly Graves can be a real jerk, but they flourished together. She got away with certain moves which could have been called fouls in college games. She plays with a fierce look of determination on her face. Off court, Sabrina has a pleasing demeanor. She has endured an injury, and a losing team in the WNBA. These experiences can build character.

ClayK said:

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She never asked my opinion about anything. I did suggest to her and her father that she try out for the USA Basketball U-16 team. That's about all the input I had on her career.

Teenage girls generally don't reach out to old guys for advice.

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I'd say you get a lot of credit for that because that was her big breakthrough!

Gottlieb is getting some good pickups in the transfer market and now she has added Beth Burns to the coaching staff.

his team is going to be good. All the NBA execs and other basketball insiders say Gottlieb is good with the X's & O's so I think her having a roster of older transfer players who can probably adjust to a system better than a freshman will help.

Also, Gottlieb is a very likable person and good recruiter so I see her having good transfer pickups every year. If she adjusts her recruiting and goes for more transfers and limits her high school recruits she'll have better luck.

Treasure Hunt? That's a great name