RFK jr considering Aaron Rogers as running mate
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Last: 1 yr ago by Strykur
Cal88 said:okaydo said:
Rodgers told reporters he was "immunized."
If he already has had covid, he would have indeed been immunized. The immunization from prior infection is more complete, effective and longer-lasting than that from the mRNA vaccine.
In any case, for his age group and fitness level, the mRNA vaccine does not present a very favorable risk-benefit profile. In that sense, his decision was rational and well-informed.
You conveniently left out that he answered the question "Yeah…" if he had said "No, I've been immunized" then you have an argument that he didn't lie. He lied. He answered the question in the affirmative. Everything else you are arguing about vaccines is irrelevant. He lied.
Cal88 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:calumnus said:So at least you agree that it would be really vile to believe and spread Sandy Hook conspiracy theories, right?bear2034 said:sycasey said:okaydo said:BREAKING from me & @PamelaBrownCNN:
— Jake Tapper (@jaketapper) March 13, 2024
RFK Jr.’s VP prospect Aaron Rodgers has shared false Sandy Hook conspiracy theories in private conversationshttps://t.co/W1eCJ8XnSD
This seems bad.
When okaydo posts Jake Tapper tweets about private conversations, maybe not.
Russia, Russia, Putin, Trump, Putin, Russia?
Trump just hosted his and Putin's buddy and fellow dictator at Mar a Lago this week:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna142774
Orban himself said Trump told him he would cut off all funding to Ukraine.
Orban is not a "dictator", he has decisively won every election in his country since 2010 and has arguably been the most popular leader in Europe.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
Hitler and Mussolini were elected too. Putin has won every election. Kim Jun Il wins every election unanimously. It is what you do once you are in power, consolidating power, eliminating opposition, changing the constitution, taking control of the judiciary… Orban has consolidated power and is now very much a dictator.
Orban is a proudly anti-democratic, antiAmerican, Putin ally promoting a racist, antisemitc, sexist anti LGBTQ ideology, who jokes about bringing back the gas chambers.
What happened to you Cal88? Are you now a follower of La Pen? Or has someone stolen the username of the liberal Cal alum from France whose posts I used to enjoy?
I'm sure you must have noticed that I never in any way suggested she lied or even reported inaccurately and in fact twice called her reporting believable. As for whether or not Rodgers really said he thinks Sandy Hook was a government inside job, it doesn't really matter to me in light of his other more recent statements. Rodgers is already a discreditable figure in my eyes and one more extreme conspiracy theory on the pile doesn't make much of a difference.Vandalus said:kal kommie said:
If Rodgers believes the things he reportedly said on the Eddie Bravo podcast then he's got a really warped world view and I wouldn't be surprised if he subscribed to some Sandy Hook conspiracy theory. I noted the wording Rodgers used in his disclaimer tweet can be construed in a way that is technically truthful if Rodgers believes, as he is reported to have said, that Sandy Hook was a government orchestrated massacre rather than a fabrication with crisis actors as others suggest.
But I find this reporting by CNN's Pamela Brown interesting for reasons other than Rodgers' personal character. Brown claims she was on the job for CNN at the Kentucky Derby in 2013 and Aaron Rodgers, one of the most famous athletes in America, told her Sandy Hook was a government inside job and she chose not to report this very newsworthy item at the intersection of sports and politics?
It only occurs to Brown to report this outrageous statement Rodgers made to her a decade later when Rodgers becomes associated with a third party political candidacy. And the only corroboration Tapper and Brown can offer is another hearsay episode from that most plastic of sources, one they keep anonymous because the supposed source wishes to condemn Rodgers while shielding themselves from any kind of accountability for their allegation.
I'm not saying Rodgers didn't make the statements to Pamela Brown in 2013 that she reported. At this point it's believable that he would hold such an extreme view just based on other extreme views he has expressed. But I think this reporting is bad journalism of an unfortunately common variety.
Put another way; though I have always been a huge Arod football fan, his views on other subjects concerning "conspiracy theories," in addition to his prior comments and subterfuge re being "immunized" make his current reported beliefs on Sandy Hook to be much more plausible, vis a vis my belief that a reporter would have this conversation but then never write an article about it until his newfound potential foray into politics.
Maybe if ARod took an oath under penalty of perjury, and he was asked direct probing questions under direct and cross examination, and if perhaps maybe Ms. Brown and the unnamed corroborating source were also called into to testify, and if perhaps Ms. Brown recalls that she told some other family, personal or professional acquaintance of this conversation contemporaneously, or if more people came out to say - yes, I have heard ARod make comments such as these, then maybe we can make a more informed decision.
You say it's bad journalism. I am not sure what makes is bad. That you think it was newsworthy for her to have reported it then, and that because she did not until now (when its more newsworthy) makes it bad journalism is crying for a revisionist history of the facts. The fact is, she did not report it until now, along with an anonymous source. We have her statement - with a lot of detail and quotes - and a corroborating account from a different time period that is similar; and we have Aaron saying, I have never had those beliefs or said those things. We can agree to disagree, but on the whole, and judging by a "more likely than not" standard, I am in the camp that I believe that he said those things to Ms. Brown. She has no reason to lie. Why would she randomly create a story from an interaction however many years ago? She knows coming forward with this will subject her to critique; what is her motivation to lie about the alleged conversation? And what is Aaron's motivation to lie, obfuscate or deny that he has said and espoused those views?
Seems pretty easy for me to decide if I were sitting in a jurors box, and we haven't even had either of them raise their right hand yet.
-- edit -- side note, and this is admittedly a pet peeve of mine: the anonymous quotes, or those from Brown, are not hearsay. If we ever get into a court or tribunal where the rules of evidence apply, then we can start talking about hearsay and whether any of the statements have an applicable exception to allow them to be admissible or not. Right now they are statements that are attributed to one person, and we can assess them for what they are without relying upon a legal and evidentiary principle that most non-lawyers have almost zero concept of, why we call these statements hearsay, nor why there are so many exceptions to them.
It's bad journalism because Rodgers statement was newsworthy at the time he allegedly made it. Why did Pamela Brown not report it in 2013? It would have been a huge story for the 15 minutes that most stories get and would have redefined the way many if not most people see Rodgers at a time long before he began to let the mask down. It causes me to suspect the motive behind Brown's decision to finally reveal Rodgers' views is political rather than a journalistic desire to inform the public about newsworthy items.
okaydo said:
Rodgers told reporters he was "immunized."As I’m on the record saying in the past, what happened in Sandy Hook was an absolute tragedy. I am not and have never been of the opinion that the events did not take place. Again, I hope that we learn from this and other tragedies to identify the signs that will allow us to…
— Aaron Rodgers (@AaronRodgers12) March 14, 2024
"I am not and have never been of the opinion" .. is not how a human answers such questions.
kal kommie said:I'm sure you must have noticed that I never in any way suggested she lied or even reported inaccurately and in fact twice called her reporting believable. As for whether or not Rodgers really said he thinks Sandy Hook was a government inside job, it doesn't really matter to me in light of his other more recent statements. Rodgers is already a discreditable figure in my eyes and one more extreme conspiracy theory on the pile doesn't make much of a difference.Vandalus said:kal kommie said:
If Rodgers believes the things he reportedly said on the Eddie Bravo podcast then he's got a really warped world view and I wouldn't be surprised if he subscribed to some Sandy Hook conspiracy theory. I noted the wording Rodgers used in his disclaimer tweet can be construed in a way that is technically truthful if Rodgers believes, as he is reported to have said, that Sandy Hook was a government orchestrated massacre rather than a fabrication with crisis actors as others suggest.
But I find this reporting by CNN's Pamela Brown interesting for reasons other than Rodgers' personal character. Brown claims she was on the job for CNN at the Kentucky Derby in 2013 and Aaron Rodgers, one of the most famous athletes in America, told her Sandy Hook was a government inside job and she chose not to report this very newsworthy item at the intersection of sports and politics?
It only occurs to Brown to report this outrageous statement Rodgers made to her a decade later when Rodgers becomes associated with a third party political candidacy. And the only corroboration Tapper and Brown can offer is another hearsay episode from that most plastic of sources, one they keep anonymous because the supposed source wishes to condemn Rodgers while shielding themselves from any kind of accountability for their allegation.
I'm not saying Rodgers didn't make the statements to Pamela Brown in 2013 that she reported. At this point it's believable that he would hold such an extreme view just based on other extreme views he has expressed. But I think this reporting is bad journalism of an unfortunately common variety.
Put another way; though I have always been a huge Arod football fan, his views on other subjects concerning "conspiracy theories," in addition to his prior comments and subterfuge re being "immunized" make his current reported beliefs on Sandy Hook to be much more plausible, vis a vis my belief that a reporter would have this conversation but then never write an article about it until his newfound potential foray into politics.
Maybe if ARod took an oath under penalty of perjury, and he was asked direct probing questions under direct and cross examination, and if perhaps maybe Ms. Brown and the unnamed corroborating source were also called into to testify, and if perhaps Ms. Brown recalls that she told some other family, personal or professional acquaintance of this conversation contemporaneously, or if more people came out to say - yes, I have heard ARod make comments such as these, then maybe we can make a more informed decision.
You say it's bad journalism. I am not sure what makes is bad. That you think it was newsworthy for her to have reported it then, and that because she did not until now (when its more newsworthy) makes it bad journalism is crying for a revisionist history of the facts. The fact is, she did not report it until now, along with an anonymous source. We have her statement - with a lot of detail and quotes - and a corroborating account from a different time period that is similar; and we have Aaron saying, I have never had those beliefs or said those things. We can agree to disagree, but on the whole, and judging by a "more likely than not" standard, I am in the camp that I believe that he said those things to Ms. Brown. She has no reason to lie. Why would she randomly create a story from an interaction however many years ago? She knows coming forward with this will subject her to critique; what is her motivation to lie about the alleged conversation? And what is Aaron's motivation to lie, obfuscate or deny that he has said and espoused those views?
Seems pretty easy for me to decide if I were sitting in a jurors box, and we haven't even had either of them raise their right hand yet.
-- edit -- side note, and this is admittedly a pet peeve of mine: the anonymous quotes, or those from Brown, are not hearsay. If we ever get into a court or tribunal where the rules of evidence apply, then we can start talking about hearsay and whether any of the statements have an applicable exception to allow them to be admissible or not. Right now they are statements that are attributed to one person, and we can assess them for what they are without relying upon a legal and evidentiary principle that most non-lawyers have almost zero concept of, why we call these statements hearsay, nor why there are so many exceptions to them.
It's bad journalism because Rodgers statement was newsworthy at the time he allegedly made it. Why did Pamela Brown not report it in 2013? It would have been a huge story for the 15 minutes that most stories get and would have redefined the way many if not most people see Rodgers at a time long before he began to let the mask down. It causes me to suspect the motive behind Brown's decision to finally reveal Rodgers' views is political rather than a journalistic desire to inform the public about newsworthy items.
People, a former teammate of Rodgers said the first thing Aaron asked him was whether "He believed in 9/11."
https://www.si.com/nfl/2022/11/29/packers-deshone-kizer-aaron-rodgers-once-asked-him-if-he-believes-in-9-11-conspiracy-theories
"Inner Earth, moon landing, reptile people,"
And you are doubting he ever said something similar about Sandy Hook? Alex Jones was pushing that one harder than most of the others.
calumnus said:bear2034 said:And the vaccine nazis lost their minds.okaydo said:
Rodgers told reporters he was "immunized."
Your use of that term is vile, but you probably know that. God have mercy on your soul.
1.2 million Americans died from the virus. More than in any other country, more than all the American deaths from all the wars in history combined. The vaccines ended the pandemic.
John Kelly has recently recounted how much your hero Trump admires Hitler. Yes, Trump pushed for the vaccines, but that is not why he and so many of his followers are Nazis.
Aaron Rodgers' vaccination status had nothing to do with other people who died from the virus, many who were experiencing multiple comorbidities. Professional athletes aren't in the same category but the anti-science, pro-vaccine mandate people don't care. It's best you save your faux outrage for those who experienced vaccine injury or death.
I love how people are twisting things around. Now its "anti-science, pro vaccine mandate" crowd. Another race to the bottom
Mr. Vice President
Anarchistbear said:okaydo said:
Rodgers told reporters he was "immunized."As I’m on the record saying in the past, what happened in Sandy Hook was an absolute tragedy. I am not and have never been of the opinion that the events did not take place. Again, I hope that we learn from this and other tragedies to identify the signs that will allow us to…
— Aaron Rodgers (@AaronRodgers12) March 14, 2024
"I am not and have never been of the opinion" .. is not how a human answers such questions.
bear2034 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:And the vaccine nazis lost their minds.okaydo said:
Rodgers told reporters he was "immunized."
Your use of that term is vile, but you probably know that. God have mercy on your soul.
1.2 million Americans died from the virus. More than in any other country, more than all the American deaths from all the wars in history combined. The vaccines ended the pandemic.
John Kelly has recently recounted how much your hero Trump admires Hitler. Yes, Trump pushed for the vaccines, but that is not why he and so many of his followers are Nazis.
Aaron Rodgers' vaccination status had nothing to do with other people who died from the virus, many who were experiencing multiple comorbidities. Professional athletes aren't in the same category but the anti-science, pro-vaccine mandate people don't care. It's best you save your faux outrage for those who experienced vaccine injury or death.
My contempt is not for Aaron, It is 100% for your repeated wilfull and vile use of the term "Nazi" for medical health professionals who were attempting to SAVE lives in the midst of a pandemic that killed millions that the death cult only encouraged by actively opposing even simple measures like mask wearing.
Your trying to justify the deaths of millions due to "co-morbidities" is similarly vile. My friends and family members who died were mostly in good health in their 50s, some former athletes. But even if they weren't their deaths are justified in your mind? Fortunately my parents in the 80s, one on dialysis, one on chemo, with FAR worse potential "co-morbidities" were vaccinated when they caught COVID in the hospital and are still with us. The vaccine saved their lives. Meanwhile my 25 year old nephew, their grandson, is an orphan due to COVID but wouldn't be if the vaccine were available sooner.
If you want to be a decent person and argue your point about vaccines being unsafe do so without calling health professionals like my sister, many who died trying to save lives, including yours, Nazis.
He's a moron. Sandy was an inside job with
child actors.
child actors.
You're wasting your time. Bear2034 is here to troll and provoke outrage. I've rarely seen him post anything with much thought behind it. Posting three sentences like he did above is an outlier for him.calumnus said:bear2034 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:And the vaccine nazis lost their minds.okaydo said:
Rodgers told reporters he was "immunized."
Your use of that term is vile, but you probably know that. God have mercy on your soul.
1.2 million Americans died from the virus. More than in any other country, more than all the American deaths from all the wars in history combined. The vaccines ended the pandemic.
John Kelly has recently recounted how much your hero Trump admires Hitler. Yes, Trump pushed for the vaccines, but that is not why he and so many of his followers are Nazis.
Aaron Rodgers' vaccination status had nothing to do with other people who died from the virus, many who were experiencing multiple comorbidities. Professional athletes aren't in the same category but the anti-science, pro-vaccine mandate people don't care. It's best you save your faux outrage for those who experienced vaccine injury or death.
My contempt is not for Aaron, It is 100% for your repeated wilfull and vile use of the term "Nazi" for medical health professionalse who were attempting to SAVE lives in the midst of a pandemic that killed millions that the death cult only encouraged by actively opposing even simple measures like mask wearing.
Your trying to justify the deaths of millions due to "co-morbidities" is similarly vile. My friends and family members who died were mostly in good health in their 50s, some former athletes. But even if they weren't their deaths are justified in your mind? Fortunately my parents in the 80s, one on dialysis, one on chemo, with FAR worse potential "co-morbidities" were vaccinated when they caught COVID in the hospital and are still with us. The vaccine saved their lives. Meanwhile my 25 year old nephew, their grandson, is an orphan due to COVID but wouldn't be if the vaccine were available sooner.
If you want to be a decent person and argue your point about vaccines being unsafe do so without calling health professionals like my sister, many who died trying to save lives, including yours, Nazis.
calumnus said:bear2034 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:And the vaccine nazis lost their minds.okaydo said:
Rodgers told reporters he was "immunized."
Your use of that term is vile, but you probably know that. God have mercy on your soul.
1.2 million Americans died from the virus. More than in any other country, more than all the American deaths from all the wars in history combined. The vaccines ended the pandemic.
John Kelly has recently recounted how much your hero Trump admires Hitler. Yes, Trump pushed for the vaccines, but that is not why he and so many of his followers are Nazis.
Aaron Rodgers' vaccination status had nothing to do with other people who died from the virus, many who were experiencing multiple comorbidities. Professional athletes aren't in the same category but the anti-science, pro-vaccine mandate people don't care. It's best you save your faux outrage for those who experienced vaccine injury or death.
My contempt is not for Aaron, It is 100% for your repeated wilfull and vile use of the term "Nazi" for medical health professionals who were attempting to SAVE lives in the midst of a pandemic that killed millions that the death cult only encouraged by actively opposing even simple measures like mask wearing.
Your trying to justify the deaths of millions due to "co-morbidities" is similarly vile. My friends and family members who died were mostly in good health in their 50s, some former athletes. But even if they weren't their deaths are justified in your mind? Fortunately my parents in the 80s, one on dialysis, one on chemo, with FAR worse potential "co-morbidities" were vaccinated when they caught COVID in the hospital and are still with us. The vaccine saved their lives. Meanwhile my 25 year old nephew, their grandson, is an orphan due to COVID but wouldn't be if the vaccine were available sooner.
If you want to be a decent person and argue your point about vaccines being unsafe do so without calling health professionals like my sister, many who died trying to save lives, including yours, Nazis.
Of course your contempt is for Aaron, why lie?
There are differences between being anti-vaccine, anti-mRNA vaccine, and anti-vaccine mandate. It's been over four years, you should sort this out first.
These days, the OT Covid thread is mostly 4 or 5 people posting every scrap of anti-vaccine social media they can find. The pro-vaccine people have mostly given up on having a rational discussion and left them to reinforce their armchair scientist beliefs.Anarchistbear said:bear2034 said:Anarchistbear said:
The last thing the American people care about in 2024 is Covid or vaccines. Trump and Biden are the two most unpopular candidates in US history. Running against them with vaccines as a major issue buys you nothing but the usual cranks. Let's hope Cornel West is smarter
Covid, vaccines, public health, and government overreach are still hot topics on people's minds. The Covid thread in the OT forum is still going strong. As far as candidate popularity goes, Biden received the most "votes" in history, 11 million more than his former boss, Obama. And Trump is so popular that 51 former intel agents went out of their way to lie and claim that Hunter Biden's laptop bore all the hallmarks of Russian disinformation.
Covid threat going strong in OT. Of course it is being whack job central.
Biden and Trump both have favorability ratings in the low 40's. Most people are indifferent to them because they don't have anything to do with their lives. OT is another exception where they actually think who wins is life or death
Cal88's positions can only be explained by the idea that he supports whatever Putin supports.calumnus said:Cal88 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:calumnus said:So at least you agree that it would be really vile to believe and spread Sandy Hook conspiracy theories, right?bear2034 said:sycasey said:okaydo said:BREAKING from me & @PamelaBrownCNN:
— Jake Tapper (@jaketapper) March 13, 2024
RFK Jr.’s VP prospect Aaron Rodgers has shared false Sandy Hook conspiracy theories in private conversationshttps://t.co/W1eCJ8XnSD
This seems bad.
When okaydo posts Jake Tapper tweets about private conversations, maybe not.
Russia, Russia, Putin, Trump, Putin, Russia?
Trump just hosted his and Putin's buddy and fellow dictator at Mar a Lago this week:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna142774
Orban himself said Trump told him he would cut off all funding to Ukraine.
Orban is not a "dictator", he has decisively won every election in his country since 2010 and has arguably been the most popular leader in Europe.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
Hitler and Mussolini were elected too. Putin has won every election. Kim Jun Il wins every election unanimously. It is what you do once you are in power, consolidating power, eliminating opposition, changing the constitution, taking control of the judiciary… Orban has consolidated power and is now very much a dictator.
Orban is a proudly anti-democratic, antiAmerican, Putin ally promoting a racist, antisemitc, sexist anti LGBTQ ideology, who jokes about bringing back the gas chambers.
What happened to you Cal88? Are you now a follower of La Pen? Or has someone stolen the username of the liberal Cal alum from France whose posts I used to enjoy?
bear2034 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:And the vaccine nazis lost their minds.okaydo said:
Rodgers told reporters he was "immunized."
Your use of that term is vile, but you probably know that. God have mercy on your soul.
1.2 million Americans died from the virus. More than in any other country, more than all the American deaths from all the wars in history combined. The vaccines ended the pandemic.
John Kelly has recently recounted how much your hero Trump admires Hitler. Yes, Trump pushed for the vaccines, but that is not why he and so many of his followers are Nazis.
Aaron Rodgers' vaccination status had nothing to do with other people who died from the virus, many who were experiencing multiple comorbidities. Professional athletes aren't in the same category but the anti-science, pro-vaccine mandate people don't care. It's best you save your faux outrage for those who experienced vaccine injury or death.
My contempt is not for Aaron, It is 100% for your repeated wilfull and vile use of the term "Nazi" for medical health professionals who were attempting to SAVE lives in the midst of a pandemic that killed millions that the death cult only encouraged by actively opposing even simple measures like mask wearing.
Your trying to justify the deaths of millions due to "co-morbidities" is similarly vile. My friends and family members who died were mostly in good health in their 50s, some former athletes. But even if they weren't their deaths are justified in your mind? Fortunately my parents in the 80s, one on dialysis, one on chemo, with FAR worse potential "co-morbidities" were vaccinated when they caught COVID in the hospital and are still with us. The vaccine saved their lives. Meanwhile my 25 year old nephew, their grandson, is an orphan due to COVID but wouldn't be if the vaccine were available sooner.
If you want to be a decent person and argue your point about vaccines being unsafe do so without calling health professionals like my sister, many who died trying to save lives, including yours, Nazis.
Of course your contempt is for Aaron, why lie?
There are differences between being anti-vaccine, anti-mRNA vaccine, and anti-vaccine mandate. It's been over four years, you should sort this out first.
My contempt is for you calling people who are trying to save lives Nazis. Got it?
As I have said, if you just gave your information for why you think these vaccines are harmful or dangerous without all the BS, I would respect that and you would be far more effective.
sycasey said:Cal88's positions can only be explained by the idea that he supports whatever Putin supports.calumnus said:Cal88 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:calumnus said:So at least you agree that it would be really vile to believe and spread Sandy Hook conspiracy theories, right?bear2034 said:sycasey said:okaydo said:BREAKING from me & @PamelaBrownCNN:
— Jake Tapper (@jaketapper) March 13, 2024
RFK Jr.’s VP prospect Aaron Rodgers has shared false Sandy Hook conspiracy theories in private conversationshttps://t.co/W1eCJ8XnSD
This seems bad.
When okaydo posts Jake Tapper tweets about private conversations, maybe not.
Russia, Russia, Putin, Trump, Putin, Russia?
Trump just hosted his and Putin's buddy and fellow dictator at Mar a Lago this week:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna142774
Orban himself said Trump told him he would cut off all funding to Ukraine.
Orban is not a "dictator", he has decisively won every election in his country since 2010 and has arguably been the most popular leader in Europe.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
Hitler and Mussolini were elected too. Putin has won every election. Kim Jun Il wins every election unanimously. It is what you do once you are in power, consolidating power, eliminating opposition, changing the constitution, taking control of the judiciary… Orban has consolidated power and is now very much a dictator.
Orban is a proudly anti-democratic, antiAmerican, Putin ally promoting a racist, antisemitc, sexist anti LGBTQ ideology, who jokes about bringing back the gas chambers.
What happened to you Cal88? Are you now a follower of La Pen? Or has someone stolen the username of the liberal Cal alum from France whose posts I used to enjoy?
When did that happen? Did a Russian troll farm steal his account?
For the third and final time: I find it completely believable that Rodgers voiced his support for Sandy Hook conspiracy theories. My issue is with the reporter's decision not to report this obviously newsworthy item until now, a decision which makes me suspect her motives, not the accuracy of her report.calumnus said:People, a former teammate of Rodgers said the first thing Aaron asked him was whether "He believed in 9/11."kal kommie said:I'm sure you must have noticed that I never in any way suggested she lied or even reported inaccurately and in fact twice called her reporting believable. As for whether or not Rodgers really said he thinks Sandy Hook was a government inside job, it doesn't really matter to me in light of his other more recent statements. Rodgers is already a discreditable figure in my eyes and one more extreme conspiracy theory on the pile doesn't make much of a difference.Vandalus said:kal kommie said:
If Rodgers believes the things he reportedly said on the Eddie Bravo podcast then he's got a really warped world view and I wouldn't be surprised if he subscribed to some Sandy Hook conspiracy theory. I noted the wording Rodgers used in his disclaimer tweet can be construed in a way that is technically truthful if Rodgers believes, as he is reported to have said, that Sandy Hook was a government orchestrated massacre rather than a fabrication with crisis actors as others suggest.
But I find this reporting by CNN's Pamela Brown interesting for reasons other than Rodgers' personal character. Brown claims she was on the job for CNN at the Kentucky Derby in 2013 and Aaron Rodgers, one of the most famous athletes in America, told her Sandy Hook was a government inside job and she chose not to report this very newsworthy item at the intersection of sports and politics?
It only occurs to Brown to report this outrageous statement Rodgers made to her a decade later when Rodgers becomes associated with a third party political candidacy. And the only corroboration Tapper and Brown can offer is another hearsay episode from that most plastic of sources, one they keep anonymous because the supposed source wishes to condemn Rodgers while shielding themselves from any kind of accountability for their allegation.
I'm not saying Rodgers didn't make the statements to Pamela Brown in 2013 that she reported. At this point it's believable that he would hold such an extreme view just based on other extreme views he has expressed. But I think this reporting is bad journalism of an unfortunately common variety.
Put another way; though I have always been a huge Arod football fan, his views on other subjects concerning "conspiracy theories," in addition to his prior comments and subterfuge re being "immunized" make his current reported beliefs on Sandy Hook to be much more plausible, vis a vis my belief that a reporter would have this conversation but then never write an article about it until his newfound potential foray into politics.
Maybe if ARod took an oath under penalty of perjury, and he was asked direct probing questions under direct and cross examination, and if perhaps maybe Ms. Brown and the unnamed corroborating source were also called into to testify, and if perhaps Ms. Brown recalls that she told some other family, personal or professional acquaintance of this conversation contemporaneously, or if more people came out to say - yes, I have heard ARod make comments such as these, then maybe we can make a more informed decision.
You say it's bad journalism. I am not sure what makes is bad. That you think it was newsworthy for her to have reported it then, and that because she did not until now (when its more newsworthy) makes it bad journalism is crying for a revisionist history of the facts. The fact is, she did not report it until now, along with an anonymous source. We have her statement - with a lot of detail and quotes - and a corroborating account from a different time period that is similar; and we have Aaron saying, I have never had those beliefs or said those things. We can agree to disagree, but on the whole, and judging by a "more likely than not" standard, I am in the camp that I believe that he said those things to Ms. Brown. She has no reason to lie. Why would she randomly create a story from an interaction however many years ago? She knows coming forward with this will subject her to critique; what is her motivation to lie about the alleged conversation? And what is Aaron's motivation to lie, obfuscate or deny that he has said and espoused those views?
Seems pretty easy for me to decide if I were sitting in a jurors box, and we haven't even had either of them raise their right hand yet.
-- edit -- side note, and this is admittedly a pet peeve of mine: the anonymous quotes, or those from Brown, are not hearsay. If we ever get into a court or tribunal where the rules of evidence apply, then we can start talking about hearsay and whether any of the statements have an applicable exception to allow them to be admissible or not. Right now they are statements that are attributed to one person, and we can assess them for what they are without relying upon a legal and evidentiary principle that most non-lawyers have almost zero concept of, why we call these statements hearsay, nor why there are so many exceptions to them.
It's bad journalism because Rodgers statement was newsworthy at the time he allegedly made it. Why did Pamela Brown not report it in 2013? It would have been a huge story for the 15 minutes that most stories get and would have redefined the way many if not most people see Rodgers at a time long before he began to let the mask down. It causes me to suspect the motive behind Brown's decision to finally reveal Rodgers' views is political rather than a journalistic desire to inform the public about newsworthy items.
https://www.si.com/nfl/2022/11/29/packers-deshone-kizer-aaron-rodgers-once-asked-him-if-he-believes-in-9-11-conspiracy-theories
"Inner Earth, moon landing, reptile people,"
And you are doubting he ever said something similar about Sandy Hook? Alex Jones was pushing that one harder than most of the others.
calumnus said:sycasey said:Cal88's positions can only be explained by the idea that he supports whatever Putin supports.calumnus said:Cal88 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:calumnus said:So at least you agree that it would be really vile to believe and spread Sandy Hook conspiracy theories, right?bear2034 said:sycasey said:okaydo said:BREAKING from me & @PamelaBrownCNN:
— Jake Tapper (@jaketapper) March 13, 2024
RFK Jr.’s VP prospect Aaron Rodgers has shared false Sandy Hook conspiracy theories in private conversationshttps://t.co/W1eCJ8XnSD
This seems bad.
When okaydo posts Jake Tapper tweets about private conversations, maybe not.
Russia, Russia, Putin, Trump, Putin, Russia?
Trump just hosted his and Putin's buddy and fellow dictator at Mar a Lago this week:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna142774
Orban himself said Trump told him he would cut off all funding to Ukraine.
Orban is not a "dictator", he has decisively won every election in his country since 2010 and has arguably been the most popular leader in Europe.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
Hitler and Mussolini were elected too. Putin has won every election. Kim Jun Il wins every election unanimously. It is what you do once you are in power, consolidating power, eliminating opposition, changing the constitution, taking control of the judiciary… Orban has consolidated power and is now very much a dictator.
Orban is a proudly anti-democratic, antiAmerican, Putin ally promoting a racist, antisemitc, sexist anti LGBTQ ideology, who jokes about bringing back the gas chambers.
What happened to you Cal88? Are you now a follower of La Pen? Or has someone stolen the username of the liberal Cal alum from France whose posts I used to enjoy?
When did that happen? Did a Russian troll farm steal his account?
It's been going on for a few years now. Not sure when exactly.
am i crazy or is RFK Jr.'s potential VP pick, Aaron Rodgers, saying HIV was a government created pandemic pic.twitter.com/zGilwIvgg5
— Keith Edwards (@keithedwards) March 14, 2024
So Rodgers falsely implies Jimmy Kimmel was on Epstein's plane but he backs and would run as VP with a guy who has admitted he was a friend of Epstein's (and his wife a friend of Gladwell) and admitted he flew on Epstein's plane twice?
okaydo said:am i crazy or is RFK Jr.'s potential VP pick, Aaron Rodgers, saying HIV was a government created pandemic pic.twitter.com/zGilwIvgg5
— Keith Edwards (@keithedwards) March 14, 2024
He is in deep
calumnus said:Cal88 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:calumnus said:So at least you agree that it would be really vile to believe and spread Sandy Hook conspiracy theories, right?bear2034 said:sycasey said:okaydo said:BREAKING from me & @PamelaBrownCNN:
— Jake Tapper (@jaketapper) March 13, 2024
RFK Jr.’s VP prospect Aaron Rodgers has shared false Sandy Hook conspiracy theories in private conversationshttps://t.co/W1eCJ8XnSD
This seems bad.
When okaydo posts Jake Tapper tweets about private conversations, maybe not.
Russia, Russia, Putin, Trump, Putin, Russia?
Trump just hosted his and Putin's buddy and fellow dictator at Mar a Lago this week:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna142774
Orban himself said Trump told him he would cut off all funding to Ukraine.
Orban is not a "dictator", he has decisively won every election in his country since 2010 and has arguably been the most popular leader in Europe.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
Hitler and Mussolini were elected too. Putin has won every election. Kim Jun Il wins every election unanimously. It is what you do once you are in power, consolidating power, eliminating opposition, changing the constitution, taking control of the judiciary… Orban has consolidated power and is now very much a dictator.
Orban is a proudly anti-democratic, antiAmerican, Putin ally promoting a racist, antisemitc, sexist anti LGBTQ ideology, who jokes about bringing back the gas chambers.
What happened to you Cal88? Are you now a follower of La Pen? Or has someone stolen the username of the liberal Cal alum from France whose posts I used to enjoy?
You're wrong about Orban Calumnus, Hungary is a functioning democracy, he was re-elected in '22 with 54% of the vote, with the 2nd place opposition liberal party getting only 34%, Orban got roughly the same results in 2010. Note that there is a Hungarian ultranationalist far right party that got 6% of the vote running to the right of Orban.
Hungary's immigration policy is not as exclusive as Japan's, yet people don't assail Japan for that. Hungary is a small country, with half the population of greater LA, located in the gateway to Europe from the Balkans, and could have easily been overrun by the kind of open border immigration practiced in many parts of the EU. Much like the Japanese, Hungarians are protective of their rich culture and heritage.
Hungary, like many of its EE neighbors, is today a more socially conservative society, in good part because they have been through a century of hardcore communism. You have to respect their choices and stances, which are rooted in their own unique cultural and historical experience. Trying to impose 2020s western values on societies like Hungary, or on most non-western countries for that matter, is a form of colonialism.
France under Macron has been far more anti-democratic and repressive than Hungary ever was under Orban. The Macron govt has used the dictatorial "nuclear option" law 49.3 eleven times to shove through highly unpopular laws against the will of the majority.
You have no idea how brutal the political repression has been this past decade in France, hundreds of unarmed protestors have been shot with rubber bullets, with the militarized riot police often aiming at their face and eyes - savage, disproportionate violence against the Gilets Jaunes, a mostly peaceful grassroot protest of the working poor, retirees and other people struggling economically under an increasingly difficult regulatory and tax environment.
Here is an example of that: the riot police in Paris walked up to the main Gilets Jaunes leader, and shot him in the eye from 20ft out:
PS: I am not a Marine le Pen fan, I support the center-right in France, which is the equivalent of the center in the US.
sycasey said:Cal88's positions can only be explained by the idea that he supports whatever Putin supports.calumnus said:Cal88 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:calumnus said:So at least you agree that it would be really vile to believe and spread Sandy Hook conspiracy theories, right?bear2034 said:sycasey said:okaydo said:BREAKING from me & @PamelaBrownCNN:
— Jake Tapper (@jaketapper) March 13, 2024
RFK Jr.’s VP prospect Aaron Rodgers has shared false Sandy Hook conspiracy theories in private conversationshttps://t.co/W1eCJ8XnSD
This seems bad.
When okaydo posts Jake Tapper tweets about private conversations, maybe not.
Russia, Russia, Putin, Trump, Putin, Russia?
Trump just hosted his and Putin's buddy and fellow dictator at Mar a Lago this week:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna142774
Orban himself said Trump told him he would cut off all funding to Ukraine.
Orban is not a "dictator", he has decisively won every election in his country since 2010 and has arguably been the most popular leader in Europe.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
Hitler and Mussolini were elected too. Putin has won every election. Kim Jun Il wins every election unanimously. It is what you do once you are in power, consolidating power, eliminating opposition, changing the constitution, taking control of the judiciary… Orban has consolidated power and is now very much a dictator.
Orban is a proudly anti-democratic, antiAmerican, Putin ally promoting a racist, antisemitc, sexist anti LGBTQ ideology, who jokes about bringing back the gas chambers.
What happened to you Cal88? Are you now a follower of La Pen? Or has someone stolen the username of the liberal Cal alum from France whose posts I used to enjoy?
Being against a very damaging war of choice in E. Europe provoked by NATO policies today will get you the same kinds of smears I got for being against the Iraq war.
You're a Putin lover if you are against the war in Ukraine the same way you're a Saddam lover if you were against the Iraq invasion, and a commie lover if you were against the war in Vietnam.
Cal88 said:calumnus said:Cal88 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:calumnus said:So at least you agree that it would be really vile to believe and spread Sandy Hook conspiracy theories, right?bear2034 said:sycasey said:okaydo said:BREAKING from me & @PamelaBrownCNN:
— Jake Tapper (@jaketapper) March 13, 2024
RFK Jr.’s VP prospect Aaron Rodgers has shared false Sandy Hook conspiracy theories in private conversationshttps://t.co/W1eCJ8XnSD
This seems bad.
When okaydo posts Jake Tapper tweets about private conversations, maybe not.
Russia, Russia, Putin, Trump, Putin, Russia?
Trump just hosted his and Putin's buddy and fellow dictator at Mar a Lago this week:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna142774
Orban himself said Trump told him he would cut off all funding to Ukraine.
Orban is not a "dictator", he has decisively won every election in his country since 2010 and has arguably been the most popular leader in Europe.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
Hitler and Mussolini were elected too. Putin has won every election. Kim Jun Il wins every election unanimously. It is what you do once you are in power, consolidating power, eliminating opposition, changing the constitution, taking control of the judiciary… Orban has consolidated power and is now very much a dictator.
Orban is a proudly anti-democratic, antiAmerican, Putin ally promoting a racist, antisemitc, sexist anti LGBTQ ideology, who jokes about bringing back the gas chambers.
What happened to you Cal88? Are you now a follower of La Pen? Or has someone stolen the username of the liberal Cal alum from France whose posts I used to enjoy?
You're wrong about Orban Calumnus, Hungary is a functioning democracy, he was re-elected in '22 with 54% of the vote, with the 2nd place opposition liberal party getting only 34%, Orban got roughly the same results in 2010. Note that there is a Hungarian ultranationalist far right party that got 6% of the vote running to the right of Orban.
Hungary's immigration policy is not as exclusive as Japan's, yet people don't assail Japan for that. Hungary is a small country, with half the population of greater LA, located in the gateway to Europe from the Balkans, and could have easily been overrun by the kind of open border immigration practiced in many parts of the EU. Much like the Japanese, Hungarians are protective of their rich culture and heritage.
Hungary, like many of its EE neighbors, is today a more socially conservative society, in good part because they have been through a century of hardcore communism. You have to respect their choices and stances, which are rooted in their own unique cultural and historical experience. Trying to impose 2020s western values on societies like Hungary, or on most non-western countries for that matter, is a form of colonialism.
France under Macron has been far more anti-democratic and repressive than Hungary ever was under Orban. The Macron govt has used the dictatorial "nuclear option" law 49.3 eleven times to shove through highly unpopular laws against the will of the majority.
You have no idea how brutal the political repression has been this past decade in France, hundreds of unarmed protestors have been shot with rubber bullets, with the militarized riot police often aiming at their face and eyes - savage, disproportionate violence against the Gilets Jaunes, a mostly peaceful grassroot protest of the working poor, retirees and other people struggling economically under an increasingly difficult regulatory and tax environment.
Here is an example of that: the riot police in Paris walked up to the main Gilets Jaunes leader, and shot him in the eye from 20ft out:
PS: I am not a Marine le Pen fan, I support the center-right in France, which is the equivalent of the center in the US.
Hungary has long been part of Europe and is a member of the EU. Don't make excuses for them. Communism ended in the 1980s. Orban is clearly a return to the antiliberalism and antisenitism that lead Hungary to ally with Hitler and then join the Axis in 1940 and cooperate with the Holocaust with Hungarian Jews sent to Auschwitz.
Here is an counterpoint to your argument from an exiled former member of the Hungarian Parliament.
https://theconversation.com/i-watched-hungarys-democracy-dissolve-into-authoritarianism-as-a-member-of-parliament-and-i-see-troubling-parallels-in-trumpism-and-its-appeal-to-workers-224930
It is how strongmen became Caesars in Ancient Rome and has been played out in democratic republics over and over again. You win an election and with the backing of your narrow majority in the senate, use your power to dismantle democracy to make sure you never lose an election again. Gaining that first majority by whipping up nationalism and fear and hatred of minorities, gays, immigrants within the majority group is standard issue authoritarian playbook.
sycasey said:calumnus said:sycasey said:Cal88's positions can only be explained by the idea that he supports whatever Putin supports.calumnus said:Cal88 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:calumnus said:So at least you agree that it would be really vile to believe and spread Sandy Hook conspiracy theories, right?bear2034 said:sycasey said:okaydo said:BREAKING from me & @PamelaBrownCNN:
— Jake Tapper (@jaketapper) March 13, 2024
RFK Jr.’s VP prospect Aaron Rodgers has shared false Sandy Hook conspiracy theories in private conversationshttps://t.co/W1eCJ8XnSD
This seems bad.
When okaydo posts Jake Tapper tweets about private conversations, maybe not.
Russia, Russia, Putin, Trump, Putin, Russia?
Trump just hosted his and Putin's buddy and fellow dictator at Mar a Lago this week:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna142774
Orban himself said Trump told him he would cut off all funding to Ukraine.
Orban is not a "dictator", he has decisively won every election in his country since 2010 and has arguably been the most popular leader in Europe.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
Hitler and Mussolini were elected too. Putin has won every election. Kim Jun Il wins every election unanimously. It is what you do once you are in power, consolidating power, eliminating opposition, changing the constitution, taking control of the judiciary… Orban has consolidated power and is now very much a dictator.
Orban is a proudly anti-democratic, antiAmerican, Putin ally promoting a racist, antisemitc, sexist anti LGBTQ ideology, who jokes about bringing back the gas chambers.
What happened to you Cal88? Are you now a follower of La Pen? Or has someone stolen the username of the liberal Cal alum from France whose posts I used to enjoy?
When did that happen? Did a Russian troll farm steal his account?
It's been going on for a few years now. Not sure when exactly.
The pandemic was a bad time, man.
oski003 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:Grrrrah76 said:
Off the field Aaron has been a constant embarrassment for Butte College.
Aaron Rodgers embarrassed a certain segment of the population that view themselves as enlightened elite but are actually closer to being effeminate cultists. Cults don't question, they obey.
Thanks to Putin,Trump and people like you who spread such nonsense (first anti-mask, anti-lockdown then anti-vaccine) more Americans died of COVID than in any other country, including third world countries with much larger populations. More Americans died of COVID than in all the wars in American history combined. 1.2 million Americans dead. For me, it was 10 friends and family members, including Cal grads, including former Cal football players. However, the vaccine saved my elderly parents' lives, because without the vaccine I am sure they would be dead too, my dad turns 90 this year, but the vaccine didn't get here in time to prevent my nephew from becoming an orphan at age 22. Everyone I know who died was unvaccinated. No one I know who was vaccinated has died. But carry on with your nonsense I will try to hold back my contempt for you.
There is a lot more than went into the US excess deaths than covid vaccine refusal and Trump and Putin. Obesity and actually reporting accurate statistics played a role. Rodgers isn't so much anti covid vax but anti-mandating the covid vax to young healthy athletes, such as himself. It was ridiculous that fit athletes, especially those who had already contracted covid, were prevented or hindered from playing their sports when covid was no longer a serious danger to them. Perhaps if the vaccine had a transparent safety record this wouldn't be an issue, as opposed to the CDC having to say VARS isn't accurate for the covid vaccine. Remember, there is a no control group for mRNA covid vaccines.
correct, there are a lot more things that contributed to the US deaths, science called them comorbidities.
death, however, is not the only danger. all these years and people still refuse to educate themselves, and that is astonishing. Aaron Rodgers is an embarrassment, his grasp on covid is as unhinged as his New Age cultural appropriation nonsense.
Rodgers is completely anti-vax. His being anti-mandate stems directly from him being antivax. and his being antivax stems directly from his New Age circles which are steaming piles of anti-intellectualism and unhinged conspiracy theories. Most of you aren't aware of any of this because you don't come in contact with those weird crystals and incense circle jerks.
as to the issue of young healthy athletes, you should have been paying closer attention. Covid has the capacity to cause organ damage. How much organ damage is out there due to covid is not known because most people do not have access to high end medical care. You know who does? Athletes at top tier schools. Ohio State football players who came down with mild covid infections started noticing what appeared to be minor drops in their performance. they went and got checked and MRI's showed that they had suffered organ damage. lungs, heart, etc.
average joe having minor organ damage won't be something they register until their mid-40s or as they approach their senior citizen years. but an elite athlete having minor organ damage is significant enough to be noticed, because they need that edge to compete. so, no, Rodgers is a moron that has no grip on medical science whatsoever. Athletes should be concerned over covid infections because it literally could mean significant drops in performance and that means drops in their ability to earn a living as athletes.
average joe should be concerned because organ damage can result from minor covid infections, and that damage will mean a significant drop off in their quality of life as they grow older.
as to mRNA vaccines...they aren't knew! The technology is literally over 20 years old. It works. the cost-benefit analysis still weighs heavily in favor of vaccines because of how dangerous covid is. Covid is one of the leading causes of death globally, and we won't know for another 20 years how bad the healthcare crisis will be with millions walking around with organ damage they know nothing about right now because they're young.
not going to ask where you conjured that claim out of, because its a tiresome antivaxx trope. more complete? lol covid has a high rate of mutation, so high that there were many strains going around, and immunity from another infection varied according to the strain, if you were lucky you could get a few weeks out of it, but if you kept informed you would have known that when he said that immunization claim you could literally get reinfected within days of fighting off one infection. right now, its around 24-48 hours before you get reinfected.Cal88 said:okaydo said:
Rodgers told reporters he was "immunized."As I’m on the record saying in the past, what happened in Sandy Hook was an absolute tragedy. I am not and have never been of the opinion that the events did not take place. Again, I hope that we learn from this and other tragedies to identify the signs that will allow us to…
— Aaron Rodgers (@AaronRodgers12) March 14, 2024
If he already has had covid, he would have indeed been immunized. The immunization from prior infection is more complete, effective and longer-lasting than that from the mRNA vaccine.
In any case, for his age group and fitness level, the mRNA vaccine does not present a very favorable risk-benefit profile. In that sense, his decision was rational and well-informed.
his decision was galactically irrational and completely misinformed.
neither you nor he has any knowledge of all the research and tracking of the strains.
its easily accessible data, btw. but lets be real, he doesn't spend his spare time reading peer reviewed published scientific research. he's too busy hiding in dark rooms for 4 days trying to magically push out toxins while getting high off of sacred indigenous plant medicines so he can pretend to be enlightened.
Yup.
Aaron Rodgers 'Denial' Over Despicable Sandy Hook Conspiracy Reads More Like a Confession | Opinion by @colbyhall https://t.co/6jiWD1eBd6
— Mediaite (@Mediaite) March 15, 2024
BarcaBear said:not going to ask where you conjured that claim out of, because its a tiresome antivaxx trope. more complete? lol covid has a high rate of mutation, so high that there were many strains going around, and immunity from another infection varied according to the strain, if you were lucky you could get a few weeks out of it, but if you kept informed you would have known that when he said that immunization claim you could literally get reinfected within days of fighting off one infection. right now, its around 24-48 hours before you get reinfected.Cal88 said:okaydo said:
Rodgers told reporters he was "immunized."As I’m on the record saying in the past, what happened in Sandy Hook was an absolute tragedy. I am not and have never been of the opinion that the events did not take place. Again, I hope that we learn from this and other tragedies to identify the signs that will allow us to…
— Aaron Rodgers (@AaronRodgers12) March 14, 2024
If he already has had covid, he would have indeed been immunized. The immunization from prior infection is more complete, effective and longer-lasting than that from the mRNA vaccine.
In any case, for his age group and fitness level, the mRNA vaccine does not present a very favorable risk-benefit profile. In that sense, his decision was rational and well-informed.
his decision was galactically irrational and completely misinformed.
neither you nor he has any knowledge of all the research and tracking of the strains.
its easily accessible data, btw. but lets be real, he doesn't spend his spare time reading peer reviewed published scientific research. he's too busy hiding in dark rooms for 4 days trying to magically push out toxins while getting high off of sacred indigenous plant medicines so he can pretend to be enlightened.
Here is a citation confirming this (in French, but English autotranslation/CC available). At the 4:00 mark, prof. Raoult states that natural infection is up to 10 times more protective than the vaccine, as observed among the thousands of patients he has seen as head of the foremost state-run hospital in southern France:
From what I understand, one main reason immunization from an infection is more complete is that the vaccine only acts on a narrow spectrum of the immune system.
As well there is a significant time lag between the formulation of the strains chosen for a given vaccine and its administration, which involves some guesswork. The success of a flu vaccine for instance depends on scientists guessing in summertime which flu strains are going to be most widely spread several months later during the winter flu season. This random element accounts for a lot of the variability in the effectiveness of the flu vaccine from season to season.
calumnus said:Cal88 said:calumnus said:Cal88 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:calumnus said:So at least you agree that it would be really vile to believe and spread Sandy Hook conspiracy theories, right?bear2034 said:sycasey said:okaydo said:BREAKING from me & @PamelaBrownCNN:
— Jake Tapper (@jaketapper) March 13, 2024
RFK Jr.’s VP prospect Aaron Rodgers has shared false Sandy Hook conspiracy theories in private conversationshttps://t.co/W1eCJ8XnSD
This seems bad.
When okaydo posts Jake Tapper tweets about private conversations, maybe not.
Russia, Russia, Putin, Trump, Putin, Russia?
Trump just hosted his and Putin's buddy and fellow dictator at Mar a Lago this week:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna142774
Orban himself said Trump told him he would cut off all funding to Ukraine.
Orban is not a "dictator", he has decisively won every election in his country since 2010 and has arguably been the most popular leader in Europe.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Hungarian_parliamentary_election
Hitler and Mussolini were elected too. Putin has won every election. Kim Jun Il wins every election unanimously. It is what you do once you are in power, consolidating power, eliminating opposition, changing the constitution, taking control of the judiciary… Orban has consolidated power and is now very much a dictator.
Orban is a proudly anti-democratic, antiAmerican, Putin ally promoting a racist, antisemitc, sexist anti LGBTQ ideology, who jokes about bringing back the gas chambers.
What happened to you Cal88? Are you now a follower of La Pen? Or has someone stolen the username of the liberal Cal alum from France whose posts I used to enjoy?
You're wrong about Orban Calumnus, Hungary is a functioning democracy, he was re-elected in '22 with 54% of the vote, with the 2nd place opposition liberal party getting only 34%, Orban got roughly the same results in 2010. Note that there is a Hungarian ultranationalist far right party that got 6% of the vote running to the right of Orban.
Hungary's immigration policy is not as exclusive as Japan's, yet people don't assail Japan for that. Hungary is a small country, with half the population of greater LA, located in the gateway to Europe from the Balkans, and could have easily been overrun by the kind of open border immigration practiced in many parts of the EU. Much like the Japanese, Hungarians are protective of their rich culture and heritage.
Hungary, like many of its EE neighbors, is today a more socially conservative society, in good part because they have been through a century of hardcore communism. You have to respect their choices and stances, which are rooted in their own unique cultural and historical experience. Trying to impose 2020s western values on societies like Hungary, or on most non-western countries for that matter, is a form of colonialism.
France under Macron has been far more anti-democratic and repressive than Hungary ever was under Orban. The Macron govt has used the dictatorial "nuclear option" law 49.3 eleven times to shove through highly unpopular laws against the will of the majority.
You have no idea how brutal the political repression has been this past decade in France, hundreds of unarmed protestors have been shot with rubber bullets, with the militarized riot police often aiming at their face and eyes - savage, disproportionate violence against the Gilets Jaunes, a mostly peaceful grassroot protest of the working poor, retirees and other people struggling economically under an increasingly difficult regulatory and tax environment.
Here is an example of that: the riot police in Paris walked up to the main Gilets Jaunes leader, and shot him in the eye from 20ft out:
PS: I am not a Marine le Pen fan, I support the center-right in France, which is the equivalent of the center in the US.
Hungary has long been part of Europe and is a member of the EU. Don't make excuses for them. Communism ended in the 1980s. Orban is clearly a return to the antiliberalism and antisenitism that lead Hungary to ally with Hitler and then join the Axis in 1940 and cooperate with the Holocaust with Hungarian Jews sent to Auschwitz.
Here is an counterpoint to your argument from an exiled former member of the Hungarian Parliament.
https://theconversation.com/i-watched-hungarys-democracy-dissolve-into-authoritarianism-as-a-member-of-parliament-and-i-see-troubling-parallels-in-trumpism-and-its-appeal-to-workers-224930
It is how strongmen became Caesars in Ancient Rome and has been played out in democratic republics over and over again. You win an election and with the backing of your narrow majority in the senate, use your power to dismantle democracy to make sure you never lose an election again. Gaining that first majority by whipping up nationalism and fear and hatred of minorities, gays, immigrants within the majority group is standard issue authoritarian playbook.
Orban did not just gain a first majority, he is still drawing 54% of the vote 12 years after his first landslide win. This indicates a very clear and solid democratic mandate. I don't know of any other European country where the leading party has had such a clear majority of the popular vote over such a long period. In the UK for instance the Conservatives earning 43% of the popular vote in 2019 was considered a massive blowout win.
I doubt the media landscape in Hungary is less diverse than that of say, France or Canada, where all the state and private media conglomerates are completely aligned with the government. Also anti-liberalism does not equate with antisemitism.
The counterpoint you have provided is from a Green Party millennial politician who is outside of the Hungarian mainstream. I would also note that the Green parties across Europe have been the most ardent pro-war advocates, especially in Germany, while the general public in Hungary is staunchly anti-war.
BarcaBear said:oski003 said:calumnus said:bear2034 said:Grrrrah76 said:
Off the field Aaron has been a constant embarrassment for Butte College.
Aaron Rodgers embarrassed a certain segment of the population that view themselves as enlightened elite but are actually closer to being effeminate cultists. Cults don't question, they obey.
Thanks to Putin,Trump and people like you who spread such nonsense (first anti-mask, anti-lockdown then anti-vaccine) more Americans died of COVID than in any other country, including third world countries with much larger populations. More Americans died of COVID than in all the wars in American history combined. 1.2 million Americans dead. For me, it was 10 friends and family members, including Cal grads, including former Cal football players. However, the vaccine saved my elderly parents' lives, because without the vaccine I am sure they would be dead too, my dad turns 90 this year, but the vaccine didn't get here in time to prevent my nephew from becoming an orphan at age 22. Everyone I know who died was unvaccinated. No one I know who was vaccinated has died. But carry on with your nonsense I will try to hold back my contempt for you.
There is a lot more than went into the US excess deaths than covid vaccine refusal and Trump and Putin. Obesity and actually reporting accurate statistics played a role. Rodgers isn't so much anti covid vax but anti-mandating the covid vax to young healthy athletes, such as himself. It was ridiculous that fit athletes, especially those who had already contracted covid, were prevented or hindered from playing their sports when covid was no longer a serious danger to them. Perhaps if the vaccine had a transparent safety record this wouldn't be an issue, as opposed to the CDC having to say VARS isn't accurate for the covid vaccine. Remember, there is a no control group for mRNA covid vaccines.
correct, there are a lot more things that contributed to the US deaths, science called them comorbidities.
death, however, is not the only danger. all these years and people still refuse to educate themselves, and that is astonishing. Aaron Rodgers is an embarrassment, his grasp on covid is as unhinged as his New Age cultural appropriation nonsense.
Rodgers is completely anti-vax. His being anti-mandate stems directly from him being antivax. and his being antivax stems directly from his New Age circles which are steaming piles of anti-intellectualism and unhinged conspiracy theories. Most of you aren't aware of any of this because you don't come in contact with those weird crystals and incense circle jerks.
as to the issue of young healthy athletes, you should have been paying closer attention. Covid has the capacity to cause organ damage. How much organ damage is out there due to covid is not known because most people do not have access to high end medical care. You know who does? Athletes at top tier schools. Ohio State football players who came down with mild covid infections started noticing what appeared to be minor drops in their performance. they went and got checked and MRI's showed that they had suffered organ damage. lungs, heart, etc.
average joe having minor organ damage won't be something they register until their mid-40s or as they approach their senior citizen years. but an elite athlete having minor organ damage is significant enough to be noticed, because they need that edge to compete. so, no, Rodgers is a moron that has no grip on medical science whatsoever. Athletes should be concerned over covid infections because it literally could mean significant drops in performance and that means drops in their ability to earn a living as athletes.
average joe should be concerned because organ damage can result from minor covid infections, and that damage will mean a significant drop off in their quality of life as they grow older.
as to mRNA vaccines...they aren't knew! The technology is literally over 20 years old. It works. the cost-benefit analysis still weighs heavily in favor of vaccines because of how dangerous covid is. Covid is one of the leading causes of death globally, and we won't know for another 20 years how bad the healthcare crisis will be with millions walking around with organ damage they know nothing about right now because they're young.
1) the heart issues result from the toxicity of the spike protein. The vaccine prevents the lung issues though, but so does actually previously having the virus as most active folks had already gotten it in the first two waves.
2) the vaccine is the spike protein
3) mRNA had been around but had never been approved due to a poor safety profile. Moderna pivoted from cancer treatments to vaccines because mRNA had worse safety profiles with repetitive treatments and vaccines are supposed to only require one or two administrations. mRNA is especially unsafe, relative to other vaccines techs, because the mRNA doesn't always transfect at the point of injection.
5) the FDA head who approved mRNA then got hired at the venture capital bio seed company that funded Moderna's IPO and made $$$$$.
6) Dr. Marion Gruber, head of vaccines at the FDA, retired 9/11/21 instead of rubber stamp expanding approvals past emergency use for adults.
7) Dr. Paul Offit, VRBPAC and leading expert on vaccines for children, was appalled at the information withheld by Pfizer and Moderna and later discovered that booster recommendations did not prevent more infections than previous. He was against mRNA booster mandates and approvals for children. He is definitely pro child vaccination, just not booster recommendations.
....
The vaccine saved lives. However, effectively mandating that healthy pro athletes get vaccinated, regardless of whether or not they had previously contract covid, is ridiculous. mRNA covid vaccines have their dangers, although they are mostly safe. Same for mandating boosters at universities. Demonizing folks like Aaron Rodgers who indeed was immunized but not vaccinated is wrong.
This column really nails it.
— mike freeman (@mikefreemanNFL) March 15, 2024
RFK Jr. and Aaron Rodgers: How con artists exploit male insecurity for political gain | https://t.co/Wzxu9TZvkN https://t.co/8e94YwebBZ
Its interesting that many of your views about NATO, Hungary and France dismiss or overlook much of what has happened over the past 10-15 years - particularly with respect to Hungary. Yes, Orban seems "broadly popular". But since 2010, he was determined to change the landscape of Hungary so that his party, Fidesz, and himself would never lose power again. And it has proven so through his motto of holding power through: money, votes and ideology.Quote:
Orban did not just gain a first majority, he is still drawing 54% of the vote 12 years after his first landslide win. This indicates a very clear and solid democratic mandate. I don't know of any other European country where the leading party has had such a clear majority of the popular vote over such a long period. In the UK for instance the Conservatives earning 43% of the popular vote in 2019 was considered a massive blowout win.
I doubt the media landscape in Hungary is less diverse than that of say, France or Canada, where all the state and private media conglomerates are completely aligned with the government. Also anti-liberalism does not equate with antisemitism.
The counterpoint you have provided is from a Green Party millennial politician who is outside of the Hungarian mainstream. I would also note that the Green parties across Europe have been the most ardent pro-war advocates, especially in Germany, while the general public in Hungary is staunchly anti-war.
Orban has held on to power and consolidated his power through massive gerrymandering. As an example, in the 2014 election, Fidesz needed only 45 percent of popular votes to win 67 percent of parliamentary seats, while other parties gaining 55 percent of votes got only 33 percent of the seats. There is no way that the will of Hungarians can possibly be represented with this level of redrawing maps to the benefit of one party.
As a result of this supermajority in parliament, he then placed all of his friends and political allies to six-to-12-year terms in the Constitutional Court, the National Media Authority, the Competition Authority, the State Audit Office, and the Public Prosecutor's Office. By doing this he effectively controlled all elements of civil, political and legal societies in Hungary.
With all these majorities and with nothing standing in his way, he passed what is called the Fundamental Law - which is basically the foundation of laws in Hungary. This new law robbed the Constitutional Court (yes, even with his cronies on it) of the power to express an opinion in budgetary matters; another stipulated that the National Assembly alone can recognize a religious community eligible for state funding; a third laid down that, during election campaign periods, political parties could advertise only in public-service media, not in commercial media.
Lastly, you mentioned concentration of media in France. There is no similarity between France and Hungary. In 2010, Orban wanted greater control of not just state financed media but commercial media. In 2018, over 450 Fidesz-friendly private media outlets (purchased with generous state funded bank loans) merged into one giant media holding company in a single day. The Orban government issued a decree that classified these transactions as being of "national strategic importance," thus ruling out any inquiry as to whether this was legal or even competitive. When he did this, all meaningful political discourse that opposition parties would enjoy, vanished.
Most people on the right point to Hungary and say, "look at how great and orderly things are in Hungary. They kicked all the immigrants out. Orban is winning elections in landslides. They love him". But that' doesn't even tell half the story as to how that all happened. How democracy and free market principles have been eroded there since 2010. How Orban has worked to dismantle civil, political and legal societies to the benefit of himself and his party. This is not something to be lauded. So when a guy like Donald Trump hosts him at Mar a Lago, you have to wonder if this is what Trump wants. What he wants to emulate. Not for me.
Do you even science, bro? This is so utterly false, it suggests you have an IQ of a turnip.Cal88 said:okaydo said:
Rodgers told reporters he was "immunized."As I’m on the record saying in the past, what happened in Sandy Hook was an absolute tragedy. I am not and have never been of the opinion that the events did not take place. Again, I hope that we learn from this and other tragedies to identify the signs that will allow us to…
— Aaron Rodgers (@AaronRodgers12) March 14, 2024
If he already has had covid, he would have indeed been immunized. The immunization from prior infection is more complete, effective and longer-lasting than that from the mRNA vaccine.
In any case, for his age group and fitness level, the mRNA vaccine does not present a very favorable risk-benefit profile. In that sense, his decision was rational and well-informed.
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