How big of a MORON is Donald Trump?

Claims that the fires have decimated areas around Beverly Hills.

Claims that the water that could have gone to fight these fires comes from NorCal and Newsum is to blame for simply allowing the water to flow out to the Pacific Ocean, all because of a "tiny little fish, by the way, called a smelt."

Never mind that Los Angeles gets its water from the Colorado River via the Metropolitan Water District and a 112-year aqueduct that runs from the Owens Valley east of the Sierra Nevada (not the Delta) as well as ground water.

Never mind that the MWD currently has more water in storage in its system in the HISTORY of the agency.

Fact check: Donald Trump's claims about LA fires and water - CalMatters

DiabloWags said:

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How big of a MORON is Donald Trump?

Claims that the fires have decimated areas abound Beverly Hills.

Claims that the water that could have gone to fight these fires comes from NorCal and Newsum is to blame for simply allowing the water to flow out to the Pacific Ocean, all because of a "tiny little fish, by the way, called a smelt."

Never mind that Los Angeles gets its water from the Colorado River via the Metropolitan Water District and a 112-year aqueduct that runs from the Owens Valley east of the Sierra Nevada (not the Delta) as well as ground water.

Never mind that the MWD currently has more water in storage in its system in the HISTORY of the agency.

Fact check: Donald Trump's claims about LA fires and water - CalMatters

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Who cares? Why do you choose to highlight this, right now? It says a lot about you…that you are a biased and politics loving.

Chapman_is_Gone said:

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DiabloWags said:

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How big of a MORON is Donald Trump?

Claims that the fires have decimated areas abound Beverly Hills.

Claims that the water that could have gone to fight these fires comes from NorCal and Newsum is to blame for simply allowing the water to flow out to the Pacific Ocean, all because of a "tiny little fish, by the way, called a smelt."

Never mind that Los Angeles gets its water from the Colorado River via the Metropolitan Water District and a 112-year aqueduct that runs from the Owens Valley east of the Sierra Nevada (not the Delta) as well as ground water.

Never mind that the MWD currently has more water in storage in its system in the HISTORY of the agency.

Fact check: Donald Trump's claims about LA fires and water - CalMatters

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Who cares? Why do you choose to highlight this, right now? It says a lot about you…that you are a biased, politics loving- DB.

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Biased?
Sorry but your boy Donald is an idiot and has no idea what he's talking about.

DiabloWags said:

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wifeisafurd said:

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This thread may set a record for misinformation and lack of understanding.

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I bet there are a lot of Trumpers here that think that LA gets its water from NorCal, fed by Northern California rivers and snowmelt.

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Owens Valley?

BearGoggles said:

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sycasey said:

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What I have learned about this from Twitter:

1. It's conservatives' fault because of climate change.

2. It's liberals' fault because of bad California government.

I see the latter position has already been spammed to death here by the usual suspects.

---

If you assume arguendo that #1 is correct (that the fires are exacerbated by climate change), then I think it makes it clear #2 is also true.

Whatever the cause, the wild fire risks are known. As others have pointed out, we have Santa Ana winds every year. We have homes in high fire risk areas. The state and local government have indisputably failed us. And that is in large part because they have given priority to other less important initiatives over fire, police, and water/fire fighting infrastructure.

They need to pass laws (state and federal) that allow fire clearing in accordance with standard practices that are proven effective (i.e., fire clearing) and construction of water infrastructure. There should be full and unequivocal exemptions from CEQA, Endangered Species and other similar laws.

There will always be fires. But our state is not even doing the bare minimum to mitigate the harm.

And they need to fix the insurance system by removing the insurance commissioner regime that prevents insurance companies from raising rates commensurate with expected losses. After this episode, I can't imagine any insurers will issue casualty policies in the state (and the California program is now effectively insolvent). Insurance companies will not write policies where they are guaranteed to lose money. Rather than calling a special session to oppose Trump, our fine governor should call a special session to fix the insurance problem - which predates the current situation.

And as an aside, the people in the palisades are going to go through coastal commission hell when trying to rebuild. I cannot even imagine the time and pain they will endure. CA should pass an exemption allowing all homeowners to rebuild w/o a coastal commission permit as long as what is being built is consistent with the prior improvements and permitted zoning.

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If people want to acknowledge both realities and propose solutions, that is fine. What I see is a reflexive, unthinking rush to preexisting partisan camps in an attempt to score points, and that is manifestly unhelpful.

Chapman_is_Gone said:

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DiabloWags said:

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How big of a MORON is Donald Trump?

Claims that the fires have decimated areas abound Beverly Hills.

Claims that the water that could have gone to fight these fires comes from NorCal and Newsum is to blame for simply allowing the water to flow out to the Pacific Ocean, all because of a "tiny little fish, by the way, called a smelt."

Never mind that Los Angeles gets its water from the Colorado River via the Metropolitan Water District and a 112-year aqueduct that runs from the Owens Valley east of the Sierra Nevada (not the Delta) as well as ground water.

Never mind that the MWD currently has more water in storage in its system in the HISTORY of the agency.

Fact check: Donald Trump's claims about LA fires and water - CalMatters

---

Who cares? Why do you choose to highlight this, right now? It says a lot about you…that you are a biased, politics loving- DB.

---

This thread got politicized long before Diablo posted that, yet you only choose to respond here. Interesting.

There is non reason gays can't fight fires as effectively as straights

Zippergate said:

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If people want to acknowledge both realities and propose solutions, that is fine. What I see is a reflexive, unthinking rush to preexisting partisan camps in an attempt to score points, and that is manifestly unhelpful.

That's awfully diplomatic of you but here's the problem. There is only one camp involved here, the radical progressive left. They're in charge. They run everything. And they do a remarkable job of running everything straight into the ground. Shellenberger, the conscience of California, provides some good detail here.

Over the next few weeks you’re going to hear Governor Gavin Newsom, Mayor Karen Bass, and the Democratic Party tell you that there’s nothing that could have been done to prevent the fires from destroying Los Angeles.

Those will be lies. They could have prevented them. Governor… pic.twitter.com/zmVuZXAl3W

— Michael Shellenberger (@shellenberger) January 9, 2025

Have a look at the team. Look at their backgrounds and announced priorities. See fire preparedness anywhere?

The LAFD is very diverse. It's run by lesbians named Kristin

(not that there's anything wrong with it)

Meet the team

1. Kristin Crowley - First LGBTQ Fire Chief - $439,772 - Harvard Business School

Mission - "the creation of systemic equity and inclusion across the LAFD" pic.twitter.com/nov8lbpSJ7

— Daniel Greenfield - "Hang Together or Separately" (@Sultanknish) January 9, 2025

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Michael Schellenberger? Criticizing LGBTQ and wokeness? Thanks for rushing to your preexisting partisan camp.

sycasey said:

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Chapman_is_Gone said:

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DiabloWags said:

---

How big of a MORON is Donald Trump?

Claims that the fires have decimated areas abound Beverly Hills.

Claims that the water that could have gone to fight these fires comes from NorCal and Newsum is to blame for simply allowing the water to flow out to the Pacific Ocean, all because of a "tiny little fish, by the way, called a smelt."

Never mind that Los Angeles gets its water from the Colorado River via the Metropolitan Water District and a 112-year aqueduct that runs from the Owens Valley east of the Sierra Nevada (not the Delta) as well as ground water.

Never mind that the MWD currently has more water in storage in its system in the HISTORY of the agency.

Fact check: Donald Trump's claims about LA fires and water - CalMatters

---

Who cares? Why do you choose to highlight this, right now? It says a lot about you…that you are a biased, politics loving- DB.

---

This thread got politicized long before Diablo posted that, yet you only choose to respond here. Interesting.

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Precisely. It is also noteworthy that, in spite of constantly complaining about the existence of this forum, CiG always ends up posting here with his MAGA energy.

Zippergate said:

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If people want to acknowledge both realities and propose solutions, that is fine. What I see is a reflexive, unthinking rush to preexisting partisan camps in an attempt to score points, and that is manifestly unhelpful.

That's awfully diplomatic of you but here's the problem. There is only one camp involved here, the radical progressive left.

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Unhelpful.

Eastern Oregon Bear said:

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Zippergate said:

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If people want to acknowledge both realities and propose solutions, that is fine. What I see is a reflexive, unthinking rush to preexisting partisan camps in an attempt to score points, and that is manifestly unhelpful.

That's awfully diplomatic of you but here's the problem. There is only one camp involved here, the radical progressive left. They're in charge. They run everything. And they do a remarkable job of running everything straight into the ground. Shellenberger, the conscience of California, provides some good detail here.

Over the next few weeks you’re going to hear Governor Gavin Newsom, Mayor Karen Bass, and the Democratic Party tell you that there’s nothing that could have been done to prevent the fires from destroying Los Angeles.

Those will be lies. They could have prevented them. Governor… pic.twitter.com/zmVuZXAl3W

— Michael Shellenberger (@shellenberger) January 9, 2025

Have a look at the team. Look at their backgrounds and announced priorities. See fire preparedness anywhere?

The LAFD is very diverse. It's run by lesbians named Kristin

(not that there's anything wrong with it)

Meet the team

1. Kristin Crowley - First LGBTQ Fire Chief - $439,772 - Harvard Business School

Mission - "the creation of systemic equity and inclusion across the LAFD" pic.twitter.com/nov8lbpSJ7

— Daniel Greenfield - "Hang Together or Separately" (@Sultanknish) January 9, 2025

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Michael Schellenberger? Criticizing LGBTQ and wokeness? Thanks for rushing to your preexisting partisan camp.

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Schellenberger tried to run against Newsom in the last recall attempt. He has every reason to continue grinding a political axe.

chazzed said:

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sycasey said:

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Chapman_is_Gone said:

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DiabloWags said:

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How big of a MORON is Donald Trump?

Claims that the fires have decimated areas abound Beverly Hills.

Claims that the water that could have gone to fight these fires comes from NorCal and Newsum is to blame for simply allowing the water to flow out to the Pacific Ocean, all because of a "tiny little fish, by the way, called a smelt."

Never mind that Los Angeles gets its water from the Colorado River via the Metropolitan Water District and a 112-year aqueduct that runs from the Owens Valley east of the Sierra Nevada (not the Delta) as well as ground water.

Never mind that the MWD currently has more water in storage in its system in the HISTORY of the agency.

Fact check: Donald Trump's claims about LA fires and water - CalMatters

---

Who cares? Why do you choose to highlight this, right now? It says a lot about you…that you are a biased, politics loving- DB.

---

This thread got politicized long before Diablo posted that, yet you only choose to respond here. Interesting.

---

Precisely. It is also noteworthy that, in spite of constantly complaining about the existence of this forum, CiG always ends up posting here with his MAGA energy.

---

Gone Chapman seems like a very angry man.
It's not healthy being so angry so early in the morning and constantly lashing out at strangers.

Gavin Newsom Demands Answers From Whoever's In Charge Of Californiahttps://t.co/yZcheY5OmS pic.twitter.com/CNX7FvJqyf

— The Babylon Bee (@TheBabylonBee) January 9, 2025

.@kdrum on Elon: "In addition to having an audience about a thousand times the size of mine, it took him only five seconds to repost that comment. It took me two hours to write this one. It's not possible to keep up with his firehose of lies and misinformation."…

— Jesse Singal (@jessesingal) January 9, 2025

https://jabberwocking.com/elon-musk-is-the-new-emperor-of-misinformation/

Quote:

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1. Reservoirs and emergency water tanks were all full before the fires started.

2. The fire budget was increased by $50 million.

3. The donations to Ukraine were in 2022 and included only small amounts of unused surplus equipment such as boots, hoses, nozzles, body armor and medication. None of this had any impact on current fire fighting.

4. A grand total of 12 LAFD workers were fired for neither getting a COVID vaccine nor requesting an exemption. They have long since been replaced.

5. Brush clearing is problematic for sure, but I'm not sure who "they" is in this sentence.

6. California has a poor record of doing prescribed burns. That said, only the US Forest Service -- not California -- halted prescribed burns temporarily in October. Everyone else, including Cal Fire, the US Park Service, BLM, native tribes, and private property owners, kept on burning. Overall, California burns about 125,000 acres per year and increased that to 250,000 acres in 2023 with plans to burn 400,000 acres in 2025.

7. Storm water has always drained primarily to the sea in order to prevent flooding, especially in rainy years that produce too much water to be captured. However, a significant amount is captured to recharge groundwater aquifers, and that amount has been growing ever since LA voters approved a tax levy in 2018 that goes toward storm water capture projects.

---

They stopped writing in Palisades before the fire

Trump is just making noise, and as much as it would be fun to poke fun at candidate Newsom, it isn' on the State either. The problems are local, and well known:

Rick Caruso is appearing on TV all over the place down here discussing mismanagement by the City, and unfortunately, there is something to that, and it doesn;t really have anything to do with lesbians.
(In fact the Fire Chief has been publicly predicting this disaster after the latest round of budget cuts).

Problem 1: A large potion of fire hydrants did not have sufficient water pressure.LADWP's explanation for the shortage comes down to only having three nearby water tanks, each with a storage capacity of about a million gallons, which sounds like a lot, but is minuscule to the demand for a wild fire in the Palisades, which is in foothills primarily. These tanks help maintain enough pressure for water to travel uphill through pipes to homes and fire hydrants but the pressure had decreased due to heavy water use, and officials knew the tanks couldn't keep up. In fact, the system couldn't handle the demand for more that a few hours. The infrastructure had not gown over the years to handle growth in the area. That LA City has chosen to ignore its capital needs in many areas is well known to those of us who represented governmental or private water purveyors and other governmental entities who are in the business of making capital improvements. LA is perceived as a joke truly only focused on short term social spending, made worse by an incredibly awkward governmental structure which leaves the Mayor little power, and was made incredibly worse by Dean Chemerinsky's well intended city charter amendments which focused on empowering local councilmen to move money to pet causes at the expense of needed regional projects, which have all been ignored. And it also means that LA County and other state agencies will not work with LA City (it is a bigger issue than just fire suppression).

Problem 2: a large number of hydrants simple did not work. The news of dry fire hydrants may be a shock to local residents (at least my friends and relatives who lost their homes), but it's a known concern to LA firefighters. As homes burn and water lines begin to leak, overall water pressure drops, meaning that hydrants can run dry before long. In order to have a system that could have handled the demands of continuous firefighting through fire hydrants, experts have said LA would have needed to keep much larger reserves of water physically on hand near the locations of possible wildfires. The problem is LA refused to build a reservoir in the area.

Problem 3: woefully inadequate supply of ground resources. This is purely a manpower budget issue which occurred overtime. No expansion of non-administrative personnel while the City grew. I was literally watching the attempts to save houses on TV while working out. This was spellbinding (a bunch of us were whatching for over 3 hours) and what the cameras showed was a 2 man crew would show-up and try to save a bunch of houses. One guy manning the front of the hose, the other guy moving to the back of the hose to water supplies (treir truck, hydrants, a pool, etc.). Sometimes it worked other time it didn't. My personal contrast was watching the Mandeville fire in 1978 where the was a fireman on the roof of every house in the canyon, armed with hose, as the fire crept down both side of the canyon. They waited until the fire got close enough to the houses, and then blasted the fire until it was defeated and could not advance. No water issues, no manpower issues, etc. But if you read the articles LA fire officials are saying they didn't have "even close" to sufficient ground resources to stop the fire (assuming the had water), despite as fire chief noted she "requested mutual aid from nearby counties, as well as additional crews and trucks from California's Office of Emergency Services and from out of state, all of which have responded and are on the way, but too late."

Problem 4: bad management. The basic plan behind not making the infrastructure improvements and adding staff as the City grew was the mantra that the wildfire instead can be fought from the air. And admittedly, LA City has invested in some air resources (you can debate if that is sufficient, but that debate is irrelevant to what happened to Pacific Palisades). The obvious retort to this mantra is that firestorms occur in windy, smokey conditions where air resources are grounded. That is exactly what happened in the Palisades and as a result, LA City basically stood by while its arguably wealthest enclave burned down. And I don't mean just some houses, but massive areas including shopping districts, schools, houses of worship, etc. no longer exit. Look at the picture in the linked Jon Turteltaub artricle.


https://abcnews.go.com/US/live-updates/la-fires-live-updates-2nd-fire-escalates-quickly?id=117448186&entryId=117518699

One other aspect to this is a state issue (though not exactly on Newsom). Many homeowers were not insured or underinsured (Cal Fair Plan without a wrap) due to cancellation or non-renewals of fire insurance and inability to place the new polices as major insurers and reinsurers have left the California market (there is an insurance crises going on, which is another discussion issue). The impacted houses for the most part, are not coming back. Another set of houses which will not be back soon absent legislation exemptions, while be houses that are in the CA Coastal Commission jurisdiction. This area will have some real issues recovering.

Firefighting aircraft 'increasingly ineffective' amid worsening wildfires

Fire officials insist that fixed-wing air tankers are too vulnerable to the blinding smoke and high winds of extreme fire conditions.

A very informative interview with an airtanker pilot who has over 20 years of experience.
Dave Kelly

Firefighting aircraft 'increasingly ineffective' amid worsening wildfires

Because Cal Fire pilots are scheduled to begin flying no earlier than 10 a.m., or in certain cases 8 a.m., and are also barred from flying in darkness, there are many fires they are unable to reach during the critical early moments. Of the state's 10 most destructive wildfires, half were ignited in darkness, or more than an hour before pilots were scheduled to begin operations, according to state fire data.

DiabloWags said:

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Zippergate said:

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If people want to acknowledge both realities and propose solutions, that is fine. What I see is a reflexive, unthinking rush to preexisting partisan camps in an attempt to score points, and that is manifestly unhelpful.

That's awfully diplomatic of you but here's the problem. There is only one camp involved here, the radical progressive left. They're in charge. They run everything. And they do a remarkable job of running everything straight into the ground.

---

Do they also run CAL FIRE?

Is the head of CAL FIRE also gay?

Why would that even matter to you?

Executive Staff | CAL FIRE

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I'm not understanding your post and link to Cal fire leadership.

Are you suggesting that the Cal Fire executive staff, many of whom are political appointees and all of whom have risen in the ranks of California bureaucracy, are not overwhelming liberal/progressive?

And even if CalFire isn't staffed by liberals, it is the left in California that brings lawsuits and enacts bills/regulations that have been awful for both forest fire prevention, water poilcy, and insurance. Any attempt to clear fuel is met with a lawsuit from the left or push back from a state agency.

And just to be clear, I don't care who is gay and I think that any gay person can/should be a fire fighter and/or part of Cal Fire (assuming they meet the normal skill/strength qualifications applicable to the job, if any). I don't see the post you responded to as suggesting otherwise, but perhaps I'm not tracking.

BearGoggles said:

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DiabloWags said:

---

Zippergate said:

---

If people want to acknowledge both realities and propose solutions, that is fine. What I see is a reflexive, unthinking rush to preexisting partisan camps in an attempt to score points, and that is manifestly unhelpful.

That's awfully diplomatic of you but here's the problem. There is only one camp involved here, the radical progressive left. They're in charge. They run everything. And they do a remarkable job of running everything straight into the ground.

---

Do they also run CAL FIRE?

Is the head of CAL FIRE also gay?

Why would that even matter to you?

Executive Staff | CAL FIRE

---

I'm not understanding your post and link to Cal fire leadership.

Are you suggesting that the Cal Fire executive staff, many of whom are political appointees and all of whom have risen in the ranks of California bureaucracy, are not overwhelming liberal/progressive?

---

Fire fighting, like any other "first responder" profession is entrenched in POLICY. that has been on the books for decades and gets fine-tuned and updated as changing conditions demand.

For some reason, your political bias and "goggles" don't allow you to comprehend that.
For you, everything is political.

wifeisafurd said:

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Trump is just making noise, and as much as it would be fun to poke fun at candidate Newsom, it isn' on the State either. The problems are local, and well known:

Rick Caruso is appearing on TV all over the place down here discussing mismanagement by the City, and unfortunately, there is something to that, and it doesn;t really have anything to do with lesbians.
(In fact the Fire Chief has been publicly predicting this disaster after the latest round of budget cuts).

Problem 1: A large potion of fire hydrants did not have sufficient water pressure.LADWP's explanation for the shortage comes down to only having three nearby water tanks, each with a storage capacity of about a million gallons, which sounds like a lot, but is minuscule to the demand for a wild fire in the Palisades, which is in foothills primarily. These tanks help maintain enough pressure for water to travel uphill through pipes to homes and fire hydrants but the pressure had decreased due to heavy water use, and officials knew the tanks couldn't keep up. In fact, the system couldn't handle the demand for more that a few hours. The infrastructure had not gown over the years to handle growth in the area. That LA City has chosen to ignore its capital needs in many areas is well known to those of us who represented governmental or private water purveyors and other governmental entities who are in the business of making capital improvements. LA is perceived as a joke truly only focused on short term social spending, made worse by an incredibly awkward governmental structure which leaves the Mayor little power, and was made incredibly worse by Dean Chemerinsky's well intended city charter amendments which focused on empowering local councilmen to move money to pet causes at the expense of needed regional projects, which have all been ignored. And it also means that LA County and other state agencies will not work with LA City (it is a bigger issue than just fire suppression).

Problem 2: a large number of hydrants simple did not work. The news of dry fire hydrants may be a shock to local residents (at least my friends and relatives who lost their homes), but it's a known concern to LA firefighters. As homes burn and water lines begin to leak, overall water pressure drops, meaning that hydrants can run dry before long. In order to have a system that could have handled the demands of continuous firefighting through fire hydrants, experts have said LA would have needed to keep much larger reserves of water physically on hand near the locations of possible wildfires. The problem is LA refused to build a reservoir in the area.

Problem 3: woefully inadequate supply of ground resources. This is purely a manpower budget issue which occurred overtime. No expansion of non-administrative personnel while the City grew. I was literally watching the attempts to save houses on TV while working out. This was spellbinding (a bunch of us were whatching for over 3 hours) and what the cameras showed was a 2 man crew would show-up and try to save a bunch of houses. One guy manning the front of the hose, the other guy moving to the back of the hose to water supplies (treir truck, hydrants, a pool, etc.). Sometimes it worked other time it didn't. My personal contrast was watching the Mandeville fire in 1978 where the was a fireman on the roof of every house in the canyon, armed with hose, as the fire crept down both side of the canyon. They waited until the fire got close enough to the houses, and then blasted the fire until it was defeated and could not advance. No water issues, no manpower issues, etc. But if you read the articles LA fire officials are saying they didn't have "even close" to sufficient ground resources to stop the fire (assuming the had water), despite as fire chief noted she "requested mutual aid from nearby counties, as well as additional crews and trucks from California's Office of Emergency Services and from out of state, all of which have responded and are on the way, but too late."

Problem 4: bad management. The basic plan behind not making the infrastructure improvements and adding staff as the City grew was the mantra that the wildfire instead can be fought from the air. And admittedly, LA City has invested in some air resources (you can debate if that is sufficient, but that debate is irrelevant to what happened to Pacific Palisades). The obvious retort to this mantra is that firestorms occur in windy, smokey conditions where air resources are grounded. That is exactly what happened in the Palisades and as a result, LA City basically stood by while its arguably wealthest enclave burned down. And I don't mean just some houses, but massive areas including shopping districts, schools, houses of worship, etc. no longer exit. Look at the picture in the linked Jon Turteltaub artricle.


https://abcnews.go.com/US/live-updates/la-fires-live-updates-2nd-fire-escalates-quickly?id=117448186&entryId=117518699

One other aspect to this is a state issue (though not exactly on Newsom). Many homeowers were not insured or underinsured (Cal Fair Plan without a wrap) due to cancellation or non-renewals of fire insurance and inability to place the new polices as major insurers and reinsurers have left the California market (there is an insurance crises going on, which is another discussion issue). The impacted houses for the most part, are not coming back. Another set of houses which will not be back soon absent legislation exemptions, while be houses that are in the CA Coastal Commission jurisdiction. This area will have some real issues recovering.

---

You said: "Trump is just making noise, and as much as it would be fun to poke fun at candidate Newsom, it isn' on the State either"

Why do you find it necessary to poke fun of the governor? Did Biden do it when Florida had the hurricanes? Poking fun of someone during a disaster is not normal. Time to grow up republicans!

unfortunately, there is something to that, and it doesn;t really have anything to do with lesbians.

What a bizarre take. THEY are the ones who have made their sexuality such a public issue. No one cared until houses burned. Now they care. Maybe Madam DEI did all she could but when she says that the mission is DEI across the LAFD, what does that tell you about priorities? It looks like she was very successful in achieving her those DEI metrics. I'm sure the Hollywood crowd who lost their homes are very grateful for that. A competent person taking over that job would have done a readiness assessment and prioritized fixing the issues. If she needed resources, she should've been in front of the public demanding better. Do we have any evidence that this occurred? I doubt it.