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Tosh is building a program

9,760 Views | 70 Replies | Last: 7 days ago by Bobodeluxe
Grrrrah76
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UCLA chose to bring in a program, as did Indiana.

Tosh is building a program. Several of our portal players have a lot of eligibility left and a lot of talented high school recruits. This doesn't equate to immediate success. Give him some time, like more than one game.
westcoastdude
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Yes, it is too soon to jump to any conclusions about what type of coach Tosh will become. It was the buildup of heightened expectations and getting vengeance on UCLA that created extremely high emotions with the Cal fanbase. I am most interested to see how the team responds and plays at Syracuse.
oasisbear
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Spot on. This still can be a positive season and the years to come will only get better. Anyone comparing this to past Cal coaches and leadership needs to stop. It's not even close to being the same.

I hope everyone will continue to go to the home games to support this team. This goes beyond the football program. Lets be like other football fan bases that show up every week.

Hope to see you all at the next home game.
01Bear
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Because Cal didn't have the option to plug and play a program?

Well, I guess it didn't since the whale donors blackmailed Cal into hiring their anointed football savior, Tosh. Tosh failed to live up to the expectations that were, in part, created by the lack of even considering any other candidate to replace Wilcox. Instead, we were all told that Tosh was the answer and he would immediately restore Cal to football glory by bringing in the best recruits and implementing his superior defensive knowledge that he displayed as Nick Saban's DC.

Instead, we saw Cal surrender 45 points in Game 1 to a better coached and more talented team. A team that managed to plug and play ten members of a winning football program along with most of its coaching staff.

If Cal had lost close and played well, it would've been painful but acceptable. But Cal played poorly for most of the night and got blown out in the 4th quarter. There's just no excuse for that. Especially, not when Cal finally got who the whale donors wanted as HC.
Oakbear
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oasisbear said:

Spot on. This still can be a positive season and the years to come will only get better. Anyone comparing this to past Cal coaches and leadership needs to stop. It's not even close to being the same.

I hope everyone will continue to go to the home games to support this team. This goes beyond the football program. Lets be like other football fan bases that show up every week.

Hope to see you all at the next home game.


i have felt this way since pete elliot left
calumnus
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01Bear said:

Because Cal didn't have the option to plug and play a program?

Well, I guess it didn't since the whale donors blackmailed Cal into hiring their anointed football savior, Tosh. Tosh failed to live up to the expectations that were, in part, created by the lack of even considering any other candidate to replace Wilcox. Instead, we were all told that Tosh was the answer and he would immediately restore Cal to football glory by bringing in the best recruits and implementing his superior defensive knowledge that he displayed as Nick Saban's DC.

Instead, we saw Cal surrender 45 points in Game 1 to a better coached and more talented team. A team that managed to plug and play ten members of a winning football program along with most of its coaching staff.

If Cal had lost close and played well, it would've been painful but acceptable. But Cal played poorly for most of the night and got blown out in the 4th quarter. There's just no excuse for that. Especially, not when Cal finally got who the whale donors wanted as HC.

It is too soon to tell. UCLA had a huge advantage in Game 1 but you don't hire a staff to win a single non-conference game. I think given how much was new we really needed to start with Wagner, if we are going to play them at all, and play UCLA in Game 3 (or later) instead.

I think (maybe "hope" is more accurate) losing our pre-season All-ACC tight end the week before the game may have changed some of our offensive strategy which will hopefully involve a lot of two tight-end sets and a good mixture of running and play action passing.

There is a lot more football to be played before we can draw any conclusions.
01Bear
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calumnus said:

01Bear said:

Because Cal didn't have the option to plug and play a program?

Well, I guess it didn't since the whale donors blackmailed Cal into hiring their anointed football savior, Tosh. Tosh failed to live up to the expectations that were, in part, created by the lack of even considering any other candidate to replace Wilcox. Instead, we were all told that Tosh was the answer and he would immediately restore Cal to football glory by bringing in the best recruits and implementing his superior defensive knowledge that he displayed as Nick Saban's DC.

Instead, we saw Cal surrender 45 points in Game 1 to a better coached and more talented team. A team that managed to plug and play ten members of a winning football program along with most of its coaching staff.

If Cal had lost close and played well, it would've been painful but acceptable. But Cal played poorly for most of the night and got blown out in the 4th quarter. There's just no excuse for that. Especially, not when Cal finally got who the whale donors wanted as HC.

It is too soon to tell. UCLA had a huge advantage in Game 1 but you don't hire a staff to win a single non-conference game. I think given how much was new we really needed to start with Wagner, if we are going to play them at all, and play UCLA in Game 3 (or later) instead.

I think (maybe "hope" is more accurate) losing our pre-season All-ACC tight end the week before the game may have changed some of our offensive strategy which will hopefully involve a lot of two tight-end sets and a good mixture of running and play action passing.

There is a lot more football to be played before we can draw any conclusions.

I'm less sanguine. The OC couldn't figure out that his 5 OL were going to be unable to block 6 defensive players on the line. That's just basic math. UCLA pulled that out repeatedly on Saturday and Somerville wasn't able to spot it, let alone scheme to prevent it. It led to JKS running for his life unnecessarily when the offense could've just added thrown in a TE or FB to block the unblocked defensive player.

Also, there were way too many missed tackles on defense due to inability to wrap up. That's a coaching issue. That's not a talent issue. The coaches needed to instill the discipline to wrap up on tackles from Day 1. They didn't do it.

Of all the teams in the P4, Cal is among the most likely to get relegated during the realignment. Heck, were it not for ND and the Furd, Cal would've been in the Pac-3+ with WSU and OSU. Cal needs to become relevant in college football in order to remain in the P4, period. Unfortunately, Cal has to do it before the next realignment, which is likely to be in 2027, when the negotiations for the ACC's grant of rights is next going to be negotiated. That means Cal absolutely needs to win now. It doesn't have time to mess around and let its coaching staff figure out how to do their jobs. That means Cal should've hired an experienced HC, preferably one from a lower level who has a history of winning and sustained success at all of his previous HC stops.

Instead, Cal went all in on an inexperienced HC whose one strength is sales. Cal got sold a bill of goods with Tosh and his cadre of rookie OCs, all because some whale donors had fond memories of Tosh and were willing to roll the dice on him being able to overcome his inexperience. They just knew, apropos of nothing, that he was the guy to lead Cal football back to relevance. Their hubris, thus far, has led to coordinators and a head coach who are lost and in over their heads.
GoCal80
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I wonder if Bob Chesney was ever on Cal's radar.

Tosh seemed like a super risky hire to me. He'd been embedded in highly successful programs, with tons of resources and top talent in the coaching staffs and players. Beyond his recruiting reputation, were there any indications that he could rebuild a program that was down and get less than super star players to rise up and play to or exceed their potential, and that he could effectively lead something as complex as an entire football program? We previously hired a more well known Cal alum as head coach based on the hope his connection to Cal and enthusiasm and charisma would lead to success. Joe Kapp's record as a head coach at Cal was 20-34-1. Maybe with the resources Tosh has Kapp would have done better, but the football arms race is a tricky thing.
Bobodeluxe
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We're talking unrestricted free agency, limited funding, poor history, in a professional , second level, minor league.

Not an easy prospect.
BigDaddy
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GoCal80 said:

I wonder if Bob Chesney was ever on Cal's radar.

Tosh seemed like a super risky hire to me. He'd been embedded in highly successful programs, with tons of resources and top talent in the coaching staffs and players. Beyond his recruiting reputation, were there any indications that he could rebuild a program that was down and get less than super star players to rise up and play to or exceed their potential, and that he could effectively lead something as complex as an entire football program? We previously hired a more well known Cal alum as head coach based on the hope his connection to Cal and enthusiasm and charisma would lead to success. Joe Kapp's record as a head coach at Cal was 20-34-1. Maybe with the resources Tosh has Kapp would have done better, but the football arms race is a tricky thing.

I don't think the coaching search led by RR and the $$$ guys ever got past Tosh. He was the only candidate imo, and I cannot recall Cal interviewing anyone else for the job. I don't think they ever considered Bob Chesney, but honestly don't think that Chesney would have come to Cal. He just had better job options and was one of the hotter candidates on the Coaching Carousel last season.

UCLA actually got lucky that Penn State passed on Chesney to hire Matt Campbell, Virginia Tech landed James Franklin and Maryland chose to give Mike Locksley another year. All of those places would have been natural landing spots for Chesney coming out of James Madison.
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Bjorn91
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Isn't UCLA recruiting at a very high level currently? That would suggest they are building a program as well.
01Bear
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BigDaddy said:

GoCal80 said:

I wonder if Bob Chesney was ever on Cal's radar.

Tosh seemed like a super risky hire to me. He'd been embedded in highly successful programs, with tons of resources and top talent in the coaching staffs and players. Beyond his recruiting reputation, were there any indications that he could rebuild a program that was down and get less than super star players to rise up and play to or exceed their potential, and that he could effectively lead something as complex as an entire football program? We previously hired a more well known Cal alum as head coach based on the hope his connection to Cal and enthusiasm and charisma would lead to success. Joe Kapp's record as a head coach at Cal was 20-34-1. Maybe with the resources Tosh has Kapp would have done better, but the football arms race is a tricky thing.

I think the coaching search led by RR and the $$$ guys ever got past Tosh. He was the only candidate imo, and I cannot recall Cal interviewing anyone else for the job. I don't think they ever considered Bob Chesney, but honestly don't think that Chesney would have come to Cal. He had better options and was one of the hotter candidates on the Coaching Carousel last season.

UCLA actually got lucky that Penn State passed to hire Matt Campbell, Virginia Tech landed James Franklin and Maryland chose to give Mike Locksley another year. All of those places would have been natural landing spots for Chesney coming out of James Madison.

Based on your analysis, Cal could've gotten lucky with Chesney, had it opted to have an open coaching search for a coach who could hit the ground running and plug and play his coaching staff along with many of his previous team's players. In other words, if Cal's whale donors hadn't been so unreasonably wedded to the idea of Tosh as Cal Football's savior and instead were neutrally/unbiasedly looking for the best candidate, Cal could've had a chance (however minimal) to land Chesney.
Rushinbear
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01Bear said:

Because Cal didn't have the option to plug and play a program?

Well, I guess it didn't since the whale donors blackmailed Cal into hiring their anointed football savior, Tosh. Tosh failed to live up to the expectations that were, in part, created by the lack of even considering any other candidate to replace Wilcox. Instead, we were all told that Tosh was the answer and he would immediately restore Cal to football glory by bringing in the best recruits and implementing his superior defensive knowledge that he displayed as Nick Saban's DC.

Instead, we saw Cal surrender 45 points in Game 1 to a better coached and more talented team. A team that managed to plug and play ten members of a winning football program along with most of its coaching staff.

If Cal had lost close and played well, it would've been painful but acceptable. But Cal played poorly for most of the night and got blown out in the 4th quarter. There's just no excuse for that. Especially, not when Cal finally got who the whale donors wanted as HC.

you must have been watching a different game. It was tied going into the 4th. then the miscue, then the roof fell in. let's see how it goes sat.
01Bear
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Rushinbear said:

01Bear said:

Because Cal didn't have the option to plug and play a program?

Well, I guess it didn't since the whale donors blackmailed Cal into hiring their anointed football savior, Tosh. Tosh failed to live up to the expectations that were, in part, created by the lack of even considering any other candidate to replace Wilcox. Instead, we were all told that Tosh was the answer and he would immediately restore Cal to football glory by bringing in the best recruits and implementing his superior defensive knowledge that he displayed as Nick Saban's DC.

Instead, we saw Cal surrender 45 points in Game 1 to a better coached and more talented team. A team that managed to plug and play ten members of a winning football program along with most of its coaching staff.

If Cal had lost close and played well, it would've been painful but acceptable. But Cal played poorly for most of the night and got blown out in the 4th quarter. There's just no excuse for that. Especially, not when Cal finally got who the whale donors wanted as HC.

you must have been watching a different game. It was tied going into the 4th. then the miscue, then the roof fell in. let's see how it goes sat.

I was watching more than just the box score. Sure the game was tied going into the 4th. Cal was rolling at that time. After it got pushed around for most of the game on defense and having an offense that struggled to gain yards (especially on the ground) in the first half. What's worse is that Cal made numerous strategic errors, including pooch kicking after its final score of the first half, which only served to give UCLA great field position and a scoring drive before the end of the first half.

I'm happy to admit that the final score was less indicative of how the game was played for most of the game. However, ceding 21 points to none in one quarter is also not something that should be handwaved away. Cal quit when the going got tough. Yet, Tosh claimed to be building a new culture at Cal that will play all 60 minutes. Either he's not been good at getting his message across (in which case, he's proven to be a poor communicator and motivator) or he's behind schedule. Either way, that's a Tosh problem.

If Cal loses to Syracuse on Saturday, I fully expect the Tosh apologists to come back on to the forums and blame the loss on circumstances instead of laying the blame where it belongs: at Tosh's feet. He's the HC, now. Win or lose, the buck stops with Tosh.
BearSD
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BigDaddy said:

GoCal80 said:

I wonder if Bob Chesney was ever on Cal's radar.

Tosh seemed like a super risky hire to me. He'd been embedded in highly successful programs, with tons of resources and top talent in the coaching staffs and players. Beyond his recruiting reputation, were there any indications that he could rebuild a program that was down and get less than super star players to rise up and play to or exceed their potential, and that he could effectively lead something as complex as an entire football program? We previously hired a more well known Cal alum as head coach based on the hope his connection to Cal and enthusiasm and charisma would lead to success. Joe Kapp's record as a head coach at Cal was 20-34-1. Maybe with the resources Tosh has Kapp would have done better, but the football arms race is a tricky thing.

I don't think the coaching search led by RR and the $$$ guys ever got past Tosh. He was the only candidate imo, and I cannot recall Cal interviewing anyone else for the job. I don't think they ever considered Bob Chesney, but honestly don't think that Chesney would have come to Cal. He just had better job options and was one of the hotter candidates on the Coaching Carousel last season.

UCLA actually got lucky that Penn State passed on Chesney to hire Matt Campbell, Virginia Tech landed James Franklin and Maryland chose to give Mike Locksley another year. All of those places would have been natural landing spots for Chesney coming out of James Madison.

UCLA had an early start on their search because they fired Foster after their third game last season, and after that unhappy experience they were not going to hire another first-time head coach. Their search reportedly focused on Chesney pretty quickly. I think they had at least made an offer to Chesney even before Cal fired Wilcox.
Rushinbear
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01Bear said:

Rushinbear said:

01Bear said:

Because Cal didn't have the option to plug and play a program?

Well, I guess it didn't since the whale donors blackmailed Cal into hiring their anointed football savior, Tosh. Tosh failed to live up to the expectations that were, in part, created by the lack of even considering any other candidate to replace Wilcox. Instead, we were all told that Tosh was the answer and he would immediately restore Cal to football glory by bringing in the best recruits and implementing his superior defensive knowledge that he displayed as Nick Saban's DC.

Instead, we saw Cal surrender 45 points in Game 1 to a better coached and more talented team. A team that managed to plug and play ten members of a winning football program along with most of its coaching staff.

If Cal had lost close and played well, it would've been painful but acceptable. But Cal played poorly for most of the night and got blown out in the 4th quarter. There's just no excuse for that. Especially, not when Cal finally got who the whale donors wanted as HC.

you must have been watching a different game. It was tied going into the 4th. then the miscue, then the roof fell in. let's see how it goes sat.

I was watching more than just the box score. Sure the game was tied going into the 4th. Cal was rolling at that time. After it got pushed around for most of the game on defense and having an offense that struggled to gain yards (especially on the ground) in the first half. What's worse is that Cal made numerous strategic errors, including pooch kicking after its final score of the first half, which only served to give UCLA great field position and a scoring drive before the end of the first half.

I'm happy to admit that the final score was less indicative of how the game was played for most of the game. However, ceding 21 points to none in one quarter is also not something that should be handwaved away. Cal quit when the going got tough. Yet, Tosh claimed to be building a new culture at Cal that will play all 60 minutes. Either he's not been good at getting his message across (in which case, he's proven to be a poor communicator and motivator) or he's behind schedule. Either way, that's a Tosh problem.

If Cal loses to Syracuse on Saturday, I fully expect the Tosh apologists to come back on to the forums and blame the loss on circumstances instead of laying the blame where it belongs: at Tosh's feet. He's the HC, now. Win or lose, the buck stops with Tosh.

and, if they win?
Bobodeluxe
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Rushinbear said:

01Bear said:

Rushinbear said:

01Bear said:

Because Cal didn't have the option to plug and play a program?

Well, I guess it didn't since the whale donors blackmailed Cal into hiring their anointed football savior, Tosh. Tosh failed to live up to the expectations that were, in part, created by the lack of even considering any other candidate to replace Wilcox. Instead, we were all told that Tosh was the answer and he would immediately restore Cal to football glory by bringing in the best recruits and implementing his superior defensive knowledge that he displayed as Nick Saban's DC.

Instead, we saw Cal surrender 45 points in Game 1 to a better coached and more talented team. A team that managed to plug and play ten members of a winning football program along with most of its coaching staff.

If Cal had lost close and played well, it would've been painful but acceptable. But Cal played poorly for most of the night and got blown out in the 4th quarter. There's just no excuse for that. Especially, not when Cal finally got who the whale donors wanted as HC.

you must have been watching a different game. It was tied going into the 4th. then the miscue, then the roof fell in. let's see how it goes sat.

I was watching more than just the box score. Sure the game was tied going into the 4th. Cal was rolling at that time. After it got pushed around for most of the game on defense and having an offense that struggled to gain yards (especially on the ground) in the first half. What's worse is that Cal made numerous strategic errors, including pooch kicking after its final score of the first half, which only served to give UCLA great field position and a scoring drive before the end of the first half.

I'm happy to admit that the final score was less indicative of how the game was played for most of the game. However, ceding 21 points to none in one quarter is also not something that should be handwaved away. Cal quit when the going got tough. Yet, Tosh claimed to be building a new culture at Cal that will play all 60 minutes. Either he's not been good at getting his message across (in which case, he's proven to be a poor communicator and motivator) or he's behind schedule. Either way, that's a Tosh problem.

If Cal loses to Syracuse on Saturday, I fully expect the Tosh apologists to come back on to the forums and blame the loss on circumstances instead of laying the blame where it belongs: at Tosh's feet. He's the HC, now. Win or lose, the buck stops with Tosh.

and, if they win?

Parades on Telegraph!
72CalBear
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Also didn't like the hire since it seemed so obvious - needed a fire breathing coach to replace a coach who many in here felt was a wimp. So disregard the inexperience and trust his judgement with the coordinators. On the other hand, who wanted to come to Cal? Who would have stepped into a transfer portal and NIL exit door?? Without any recent football history or winning pedigree we got who you deserved. No one else wanted to come. You got him along with his post game babble.
Bring back bottled beer and cigars at CMS. Should get us back in the Rose Bowl!
01Bear
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Rushinbear said:

01Bear said:

Rushinbear said:

01Bear said:

Because Cal didn't have the option to plug and play a program?

Well, I guess it didn't since the whale donors blackmailed Cal into hiring their anointed football savior, Tosh. Tosh failed to live up to the expectations that were, in part, created by the lack of even considering any other candidate to replace Wilcox. Instead, we were all told that Tosh was the answer and he would immediately restore Cal to football glory by bringing in the best recruits and implementing his superior defensive knowledge that he displayed as Nick Saban's DC.

Instead, we saw Cal surrender 45 points in Game 1 to a better coached and more talented team. A team that managed to plug and play ten members of a winning football program along with most of its coaching staff.

If Cal had lost close and played well, it would've been painful but acceptable. But Cal played poorly for most of the night and got blown out in the 4th quarter. There's just no excuse for that. Especially, not when Cal finally got who the whale donors wanted as HC.

you must have been watching a different game. It was tied going into the 4th. then the miscue, then the roof fell in. let's see how it goes sat.

I was watching more than just the box score. Sure the game was tied going into the 4th. Cal was rolling at that time. After it got pushed around for most of the game on defense and having an offense that struggled to gain yards (especially on the ground) in the first half. What's worse is that Cal made numerous strategic errors, including pooch kicking after its final score of the first half, which only served to give UCLA great field position and a scoring drive before the end of the first half.

I'm happy to admit that the final score was less indicative of how the game was played for most of the game. However, ceding 21 points to none in one quarter is also not something that should be handwaved away. Cal quit when the going got tough. Yet, Tosh claimed to be building a new culture at Cal that will play all 60 minutes. Either he's not been good at getting his message across (in which case, he's proven to be a poor communicator and motivator) or he's behind schedule. Either way, that's a Tosh problem.

If Cal loses to Syracuse on Saturday, I fully expect the Tosh apologists to come back on to the forums and blame the loss on circumstances instead of laying the blame where it belongs: at Tosh's feet. He's the HC, now. Win or lose, the buck stops with Tosh.

and, if they win?

If Cal wins, I'll be happy. However, that doesn't mean that Tosh and company are absolved. Tosh's pulling a double-Buh was just inexcusable hubris. A rookie HC really needs to surround himself with experience and wisdom, not be the most experienced guy in the room. (Heck, some of the wisest decision makers in history have tended to surround themselves with people smarter than they. They wanted to know what they didn't know and be challenged in their decisionmaking--not have yesmen who parrot them and stroke their egos.)

At a minimum, he needs to replace his coordinators with others (maybe those already on his staff) who have experience as coordinators. Let his current coordinators do what they do best: recruit. Along the way, they can learn what they need to do in order to be ready for the jobs for which they were hired. Maybe someday, they'll be ready to return to the posts for which they were originally hired.
SFHorn
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Grrrrah76 said:

UCLA chose to bring in a program, as did Indiana.

Tosh is building a program. Several of our portal players have a lot of eligibility left and a lot of talented high school recruits. This doesn't equate to immediate success. Give him some time, like more than one game.



A little outside perspective. Texas's first season under Sarkisian was terrible - fan base was unhappy (especially after the Charlie Strong and Tom Herman disasters). But he started to turn it around and while there certainly have been some questionable moments in the last few years, we are much improved.

Sometimes you just have to have some patience and just because Coach A turns a program around more quickly doesn't necessarily mean Tosh sucks because he stumbled out of the gates.

It's 1 game into his first season so drawing sweeping conclusions is more than a bit rash. I think any coach needs 3 years to be judged properly.
01Bear
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SFHorn said:

Grrrrah76 said:

UCLA chose to bring in a program, as did Indiana.

Tosh is building a program. Several of our portal players have a lot of eligibility left and a lot of talented high school recruits. This doesn't equate to immediate success. Give him some time, like more than one game.



A little outside perspective. Texas's first season under Sarkisian was terrible - fan base was unhappy (especially after the Charlie Strong and Tom Herman disasters). But he started to turn it around and while there certainly have been some questionable moments in the last few years, we are much improved.

Sometimes you just have to have some patience and just because Coach A turns a program around more quickly doesn't necessarily mean Tosh sucks because he stumbled out of the gates.

It's 1 game into his first season so drawing sweeping conclusions is more than a bit rash. I think any coach needs 3 years to be judged properly.

I'm not saying Tosh is going to be another Wilcox. Heck, for all I know, Tosh could end up in the hall of fame for his coaching prowess. The problem is that Cal doesn't have unlimited time for that to play out. Cal needs to win and win now. The next round of realignment is going to happen shortly. Cal needs to become a relevant player in collegiate football by that time, otherwise it'll be on the outside looking in at the P2.
calumnus
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GoCal80 said:

I wonder if Bob Chesney was ever on Cal's radar.

Tosh seemed like a super risky hire to me. He'd been embedded in highly successful programs, with tons of resources and top talent in the coaching staffs and players. Beyond his recruiting reputation, were there any indications that he could rebuild a program that was down and get less than super star players to rise up and play to or exceed their potential, and that he could effectively lead something as complex as an entire football program? We previously hired a more well known Cal alum as head coach based on the hope his connection to Cal and enthusiasm and charisma would lead to success. Joe Kapp's record as a head coach at Cal was 20-34-1. Maybe with the resources Tosh has Kapp would have done better, but the football arms race is a tricky thing.

If he was, I doubt we outbid UCLA for his services. LA and the B1G is not something we can match, Moreover, UCLA fired Foster early and identified Chesney early, so at the time UCLA was talking with him Ron was saying to the press that a letter asking him to fire Wilcox "was distasteful."
calumnus
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SFHorn said:

Grrrrah76 said:

UCLA chose to bring in a program, as did Indiana.

Tosh is building a program. Several of our portal players have a lot of eligibility left and a lot of talented high school recruits. This doesn't equate to immediate success. Give him some time, like more than one game.



A little outside perspective. Texas's first season under Sarkisian was terrible - fan base was unhappy (especially after the Charlie Strong and Tom Herman disasters). But he started to turn it around and while there certainly have been some questionable moments in the last few years, we are much improved.

Sometimes you just have to have some patience and just because Coach A turns a program around more quickly doesn't necessarily mean Tosh sucks because he stumbled out of the gates.

It's 1 game into his first season so drawing sweeping conclusions is more than a bit rash. I think any coach needs 3 years to be judged properly.

Similarly, from a Cal perspective: Bruce Snyder, was an experienced coach (with a mediocre record at Utah State). First year, 1987, we beat Pacific at home, then proceeded to lose to San Jose State at home as the beginning of a 0-5-1 streak, including 42-18 loss to UCLA, beat Oregon and ASU, lose badly to Stanford in Big Game 31-7 and finally tie WSU to finish 3-6-2.

Sometimes, even experienced guys need time to figure it out. Now, we don't have the 4 years it took Snyder to get to 7-4-1, or 5 years to get to 10-2, but we can at least give Tosh and his staff a game or two.
HateRed
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Well, he better build it this year!
Strykur
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01Bear said:

SFHorn said:

Grrrrah76 said:

UCLA chose to bring in a program, as did Indiana.

Tosh is building a program. Several of our portal players have a lot of eligibility left and a lot of talented high school recruits. This doesn't equate to immediate success. Give him some time, like more than one game.



A little outside perspective. Texas's first season under Sarkisian was terrible - fan base was unhappy (especially after the Charlie Strong and Tom Herman disasters). But he started to turn it around and while there certainly have been some questionable moments in the last few years, we are much improved.

Sometimes you just have to have some patience and just because Coach A turns a program around more quickly doesn't necessarily mean Tosh sucks because he stumbled out of the gates.

It's 1 game into his first season so drawing sweeping conclusions is more than a bit rash. I think any coach needs 3 years to be judged properly.

I'm not saying Tosh is going to be another Wilcox.

Tosh will have far superior talent but can he get other aspects of the program up to par with his recruiting capacities
GoCal80
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I think what we are seeing now with all the negative comments about Lupoi is that a lot of loyal Cal fans who did not approve of hiring him as the coach are now venting and displaying their disapproval. It's not different from loyal fans of a team like the (former) Oakland A's expressing their disapproval about decisions made by the team's owner or management.
HearstMining
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calumnus said:

SFHorn said:

Grrrrah76 said:

UCLA chose to bring in a program, as did Indiana.

Tosh is building a program. Several of our portal players have a lot of eligibility left and a lot of talented high school recruits. This doesn't equate to immediate success. Give him some time, like more than one game.



A little outside perspective. Texas's first season under Sarkisian was terrible - fan base was unhappy (especially after the Charlie Strong and Tom Herman disasters). But he started to turn it around and while there certainly have been some questionable moments in the last few years, we are much improved.

Sometimes you just have to have some patience and just because Coach A turns a program around more quickly doesn't necessarily mean Tosh sucks because he stumbled out of the gates.

It's 1 game into his first season so drawing sweeping conclusions is more than a bit rash. I think any coach needs 3 years to be judged properly.

Similarly, from a Cal perspective: Bruce Snyder, was an experienced coach (with a mediocre record at Utah State). First year, 1987, we beat Pacific at home, then proceeded to lose to San Jose State at home as the beginning of a 0-5-1 streak, including 42-18 loss to UCLA, beat Oregon and ASU, lose badly to Stanford in Big Game 31-7 and finally tie WSU to finish 3-6-2.

Sometimes, even experienced guys need time to figure it out. Now, we don't have the 4 years it took Snyder to get to 7-4-1, or 5 years to get to 10-2, but we can at least give Tosh and his staff a game or two.

Going a little further back in Cal history, Mike White was a Cal alum who arrived in 1972 having previously been the OC for Stanfurd and he also followed a career 500 Cal coach. The turnaround wasn't quick - the 1972 and 1973 seasons were grim including a 66-0 shellacking by Alabama, but things turned around in 1974 and the 1975 team led the country in total offense and tied for the PAC 8 championship. As Calumnus says, the timetable is different now, but Tosh is the guy we invited to the party, so we have to hope he learns to dance.
Boot
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Seriously? You must be a great coach.
oskithepimp
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JFC people, chill the **** out. It's one game. We played like **** and were tied halfway through the fourth. Step back from the ledge.
juarezbear
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oskithepimp said:

JFC people, chill the **** out. It's one game. We played like **** and were tied halfway through the fourth. Step back from the ledge.

I would vote for this being the best handle on BI.
BearlyBear
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A lot of people clearly had an axe to grind and just kept quiet. It really is just one game and people are calling to burn it all down.

I however do agree the timeline is short and the expectations, if unfair, on Tosh need to be extremely high, to win very fast. What we saw Saturday was massively disappointing. But there was also so much clear confusion it's obvious it's still too early to overreact. If not 3 years give it 3 games. I'm only going to panic and even expecting this team needs to win now, if we keep losing, and more importantly not making adjustments which are so obvious even lay people can see them and want to tear at their eyes.

Cuse, Wagner, and Clemson then the pitchforks will be felt for real or we've turned it around. Much more will be known by week 4. And for that matter, we don't even know if Chesney is good yet. Not every team is going to let them run 300 yards and average a first down on first down, and give up 3 turnovers plus 3 more turnovers on downs.
Bearspot
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Grrrrah76 said:

Tosh is building a program. Several of our portal players have a lot of eligibility left and a lot of talented high school recruits. This doesn't equate to immediate success. Give him some time, like more than one game.


Agreed.

My personal copium is that I'm looking at this game and the next 23 games of this current year and next as a macrocosm, like a single game consisting of 4 quarters. 2026 is Q1 & Q2. 2027 is Q3 & Q4.

We are presently 2:30 seconds into the first quarter. We got the ball first but then turned it over and the opposition has scored a pick six and a two-point conversion to boot. Punched in the mouth. Not a great start, right? I'm not yet worried though because there is still 47:30 to play. But I'm very concerned about what the score at the half (this season) will be.
HateRed
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Chesney has already built a team at UCLA.
BearlyBear
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Iamaleava looked middling besides an outstanding run game. Their backs destroyed us. It was hard to tell if their defense or our confused playcalling was doing more work when we were on offense. And now it's in vogue to say Chesney is already the next Cignetti after one game we were tied in to 9 minutes left and driving, down 2 turnovers, apparently. I will willingly eat crow if UCLA becomes elite. But I'm not sold on UCLA either. We gave up 6 turnovers including downs and basically gave a first down run on every attempt. Not buying the Chesney kool-aid just like I won't bail on Tosh, at least until seeing week 4 through. Or week 5 for UCLA, when they play Oregon.
BearSD
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HearstMining said:

calumnus said:

SFHorn said:

Grrrrah76 said:








As Calumnus says, the timetable is different now, but Tosh is the guy we invited to the party, so we have to hope he learns to dance.

Another analogy: Tosh is the general contractor we hired to do some major repairs on our house. The first batch of work wasn't great, but we really want this "contractor" and his "subcontractors" to get better fast, before the roof caves in.
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