LethalFang;841964599 said:

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Our situation right now is light years ahead of where we were in 2001. 2001 was depressing, because we had little talent and crumbling facilities. Now we have both, largedly thanks to Tedford, but he's long worn out his welcome.

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We actually were loaded with talent (admittedly mostly young talent) in 2001. Consider the following individuals Tedford had to work with coming in:
- Lorenzo Alexander
- Ryan O'Callaghan
- Scott Fujita
- Wendell Hunter
- Terrell Williams
- Joe Igber
- Reggie Robertson
- That a**hole who will not be named who f'd over the bears during recruiting season last year (he was a good player during his playing days)
- Namdi Asamougha
- Geoff McArthur
- Kyle Boller
- Tyler Fredrickson
- James Bethea
- Tully Banta-Cain
- Chase Lyman
- Harrison Smith

That hardly constitutes "little talent".

Got this from the Tedford #2 on the hot-seat thread:

Quote:

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Uh, Oh.We have a pretty good idea of WHO that wealthy Cal-alum that Bruce Jenkins talked to about being the "last one off the bus when it comes to firing Tedford" and if HE is talking about California making a head coaching change then Jeff Tedford needs to start thinking about what he is going to be doing next football season because he will NOT be coaching the California Golden Bears.

We have always liked and had a lot of respect for Jeff Tedford here at Coaches Hot Seat and having seen Tedford behind the scenes at practice and other non-football events dozens of times over the past decade we can say that we have seen a very noticeable change in Jeff over the past few years and we would peg that change to be that very simply..

Jeff Tedford is just NOT as hungry as he used to be to win games as he used to be when he first arrived at Cal when Tedford was one of the most driven coaches we had ever run across.

Now, we are confident that Jeff would argue with us on this point BUT that is our honest and "with the bark-on" opinion of why the California football program has faltered in recent years as the fire in Tedford's gut has slowly been going out and now Jeff seems to be in a place where he seems resigned to his fate whatever may come.

One thing in Bruce Jenkins' column on Jeff Tedford's contract was the Complete ABSURDITY that Tedford if fired would be owed something like.

$8 Million Dollars through 2015

.because Cal like a lot of other schools that are run by people with NO Damn Business or Common Sense signed a contract with Jeff Tedford that has No Damn Buyout and what a surprise.NOTthat in our opinion Jeff Tedford's motivation to coach, win and lead the California football program is just NOT there anymore and we blame that partly on Tedford and other coaches being given contracts the basically take away the incentive to coach, win and lead a football program with Completely ABSURD contracts for football coaches that don't have reasonable and common sense buyouts for both the school and coach.

With the current state of the University of California system which has seen Billions of Dollars cut from its budget in recent years IF Cal is forced to fired Jeff Tedford for non-performance of his football team on the field then it will be very interesting to see what the reaction is on the Cal-Berkeley campus even IF the money comes from private and not school resources as it most certainly will because $8 Million Dollars is a Helluva lot of money to pay someone for doing.

NOTHING!

That would be $8 Million Dollars paid to a former head coach that would be doing

NOTHING

which is $8 Million Dollars that could be going to fund athletic scholarships at Cal or $8 Million Dollars that could be used to pay down the several Hundred Million Dollars in debt that Cal athletics has on the books right now for the renovation of Memorial Stadium!

As we said when it comes to guaranteed contracts with NO buyouts of college head football coaches you can cue Forrest Gump:

"As my Momma always said: Stupid Is As Stupid Does!"

Amen to that Forrest!

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http://coacheshotseat.com/coacheshotseatblog/

25To20;841965656 said:

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We actually were loaded with talent (admittedly mostly young talent) in 2001. Consider the following individuals Tedford had to work with coming in:
- Lorenzo Alexander
- Ryan O'Callaghan
- Scott Fujita
- Wendell Hunter
- Terrell Williams
- Joe Igber
- Reggie Robertson
- That a**hole who will not be named who f'd over the bears during recruiting season last year (he was a good player during his playing days)
- Namdi Asamougha
- Geoff McArthur
- Kyle Boller
- Tyler Fredrickson
- James Bethea
- Tully Banta-Cain
- Chase Lyman
- Harrison Smith

That hardly constitutes "little talent".

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Of course, that's not a bad list at all.
But the current roster has a number of potential game changers, among the best of the best in the country.

Tedford inherited good top end talent. The current roster may not have anyone as good as Namdi or a college QB with as much potential as Boller, but it is deeper.

Bear Balls;841965741 said:

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Tedford inherited good top end talent. The current roster may not have anyone as good as Namdi or a college QB with as much potential as Boller, but it is deeper.

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Right, that team had some good starters but no depth.

Also, I'd say we have some QBs who at least have the potential to be as good as Boller . . . they just aren't seeing the field.

Kline et al. definitely have the potential to surpass Boller's career (which was actually pretty disappointing until 2002). I'm just saying in retrospect we know we had a pretty talented guy in Boller... our current roster, who knows? Only one guy gets to see the field and I think we know what we have in him by now.

25To20;841965656 said:

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We actually were loaded with talent (admittedly mostly young talent) in 2001. Consider the following individuals Tedford had to work with coming in:
- Lorenzo Alexander
- Ryan O'Callaghan
- Scott Fujita
- Wendell Hunter
- Terrell Williams
- Joe Igber
- Reggie Robertson
- That a**hole who will not be named who f'd over the bears during recruiting season last year (he was a good player during his playing days)
- Namdi Asamougha
- Geoff McArthur
- Kyle Boller
- Tyler Fredrickson
- James Bethea
- Tully Banta-Cain
- Chase Lyman
- Harrison Smith

That hardly constitutes "little talent".

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Unless Tedford and his staff created (or seriously nudged along) that talent when he got here. Harbaugh's Stanford team was not at all talented when they started blowing out USC. You can't retroactively look at that roster and go "Oh! They really WERE talented all along!"

There's no such thing as an objective quantity of "talent" that guys have that's either wasted or realized. When Tedford got here, those guys weren't anywhere near as good as they were when they left. A million Alex Mack's play high school football, but Cal had at least a little something to do with him becoming the player he did. Same thing with Cameron Jordan, Tyson Alualu, Robert Jordan, Mychal Kendricks, Mike Mohamed, etc. Cal's staff had a lot to do with making those players good, just like Tedford had a lot to do with the players on your list being good.

freshfunk;841965460 said:

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Why should he leave? If you dislike positive sentiments perhaps YOU should be the one to leave. After all this is a forum FOR Cal football not AGAINST Cal football.

Anyway, spreading grief isn't going to haste JT's departure. All it does is bring everyone down. You're kidding yourself if you think you're making any positive difference.

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You just don't get it. Why single me out .Read what others are saying. If I was against Cal, I would not be on this board. If everything is ok with you, and 4thGenCal, and LocoOso, and BobbyGBear then have your little Sunshine party. We don't want to be laughing stock or settle for losing. You guys seem happy, and don't care if it continues. So, who is for Cal. ????

mvargus;841963729 said:

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UCLA - loss -
WSU - tossup -
Oregon - loss -
Utah - likely Cal win -
Stanford - loss -
UW - Loss -
Oregon State - loss -

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We're really not as bad as the consensus insists. This is football and any Pac-12 team can beat any other Pac-12 team if they get the breaks.

Besides the luck factor...
The Prairie Dog offense CAN work without causing delay of game penalties.
The players the coaches choose to put on the field are still BETTER than most of our remaining competition.
Our quarterback CAN get hot.
Our defensive line CAN get more aggressive and pressure the passer.

Most people look at past results and can only envision more negatives. But Saturday night I expect we'll see a much better performance out of our bears. 6-6 is definitely possible from here, though I'd put the odds at about 25% or less.

UCLA - tossup -
WSU - likely win -
Oregon - probable loss -
Utah - likely win -
Stanford - likely win -
UW - likely win -
Oregon State - probable loss -

SonOfCalVa;841965305 said:

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No need to "stir the pot" .. I just read the posting of the alleged contract language and it's pretty obvious that there's only a requirement that JT seek employment but no specification as to a particular position. Compensation from Cal to JT is only reduced for certain specified jobs.

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I'm not sure it even matters that much in the end. No job outside of an NFL job or college HC is going to net JT an amount even close to the $2.3 million. As for a positions not named, what would he make as a college OC? TV talking head? Maybe $300k-400k per year?

As others have said, we would expect a reduced buyout would be negotiated to free both sides from potential legal issues in the future as well as freeing JT from the burden of looking for work. But how far it swings towards either side is the important detail.

R90;841965806 said:

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UCLA - tossup -
WSU - likely win -
Oregon - probable loss -
Utah - likely win -
Stanford - likely win -
UW - likely win -
Oregon State - probable loss -

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I'm afraid you're in for a depressing reality check. This isn't about talent; the team has tuned out the coaches and the man in charge has lost it. How about:

UCLA - likely loss
WSU - likely loss
Oregon - loss
Utah - tossup, likely loss because on road
Stanford - likely loss
UW - likely loss
OSU - Loss

davetdds;841965795 said:

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You just don't get it. Why single me out .Read what others are saying. If I was against Cal, I would not be on this board. If everything is ok with you, and 4thGenCal, and LocoOso, and BobbyGBear then have your little Sunshine party. We don't want to be laughing stock or settle for losing. You guys seem happy, and don't care if it continues. So, who is for Cal. ????

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You don't get it.

You singled out LocoOso to leave. That's why I singled you out. Otherwise, various opinions are welcome of course.

I seem happy? Really? You must not be reading my posts then. Most of my recent posts express dissatisfaction and disbelief. I'm not going to waste time linking it for you despite your mischaracterization.

Just because I won't sh*t on JT's name doesn't mean I want him to continue to be HC and I'm happy where we are. I've outright said multiple times that we need a new HC and the ASU performance was downright pathetic.

At the same time, I don't believe in actively tearing down this program. Rooting for us to lose and yelling "Fire Tedford" during games is treasonous to me. You're sh*ting on our program and our players by doing so. That has nothing to do with caring for Cal football. That has to do with fans just wanting to win, at any cost, so that their personal pride and egos can be inflated.

No, they are not complete. Won't be complete until the end of December 2012 (possibly January 2013).

It's apparent that you and I have a different definition of personal attack on a head coach or former head coach.

I'm probably also holding folks to a higher standard of conduct and am more likely to recognize bitterness when I read it.

LethalFang;841965540 said:

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Bruce Synder was fired because Bockrath wanted him to continue his job on minimum wage.
Mike White was fired due to NCAA violations.
Neither has much similarity with Tedford's situation.

Pappy, maybe, I only have at best 3rd hand knowledge of his era.

Tedford's closest contemporary comparison is Ben Braun, in terms of his career trajectory after arriving at Cal.

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Snyder was allowed to leave by Bockrath; he wasn't fired. Facilities was the primary issue over which Snyder left. Money was secondary.

Pappy's situation deteriorated with the Ronny Knox recruiting scandal, even though Waldorf was never implicated personally. He coached another four seasons with declining records each of the last four seasons.

freshfunk;841965895 said:

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You don't get it.

You singled out LocoOso to leave. That's why I singled you out. Otherwise, various opinions are welcome of course.

I seem happy? Really? You must not be reading my posts then. Most of my recent posts express dissatisfaction and disbelief. I'm not going to waste time linking it for you despite your mischaracterization.

Just because I won't sh*t on JT's name doesn't mean I want him to continue to be HC and I'm happy where we are. I've outright said multiple times that we need a new HC and the ASU performance was downright pathetic.

At the same time, I don't believe in actively tearing down this program. Rooting for us to lose and yelling "Fire Tedford" during games is treasonous to me. You're sh*ting on our program and our players by doing so. That has nothing to do with caring for Cal football. That has to do with fans just wanting to win, at any cost, so that their personal pride and egos can be inflated.

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Dude. What's up with you. i never ever said that I root for us to lose. Nor do I root for the other team. You better go compare a lot of posts. I have not done a character assasination on JT. I know you are upset. I called out LocoOso because he and BobbyGBear have been calling us out and name calling. That is all. I have usually agreed with your posts and look to you as an old timer on this board. I don't mean age wise, just that you are a long time poster. So, call a truce. I want the same as you and I support the athletes, but I don't believe JT is supporting the athletes by some of the decisions he has made. There are many more posters saying downright, nasty crappy things. I am not one of them. Go Beasr!!!:gobears:

FiatSlug;841966365 said:

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Snyder was allowed to leave by Bockrath; he wasn't fired. Facilities was the primary issue over which Snyder left. Money was secondary.

Pappy's situation deteriorated with the Ronny Knox recruiting scandal, even though Waldorf was never implicated personally. He coached another four seasons with declining records each of the last four seasons.

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I don't have 1st hand memory of Snyder's era either. I remember reading a lot of posts about Snyder telling Bockrath that ASU was tripling his salary, to which Bockrath showed him the door.
The first season I paid attention to Cal football was Mooch.

GoldenYears;841966110 said:

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If you are in a car and the driver is driving the car towards a brick wall and you tell him to stop the car before he hits the wall and he refuses and you start berating him for his lack of sense, does that make you anti-driver? No. You're not telling the driver that he is worthless on all accounts, you're just trying to prevent the crash. In addition, you are not only not anti-driver, you are decidedly PRO-car because absent your bringing all of this to the attention of someone who can stop it (the driver), the car will definitely crash.

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Don't be silly. If all you do is berate the driver, you're dead. Pull the brake or grab the flippin' wheel before you get killed!