wifeisafurd;842232622 said:

---

Neuheisal (who I thought was a weasel until I met him and talked with him for some time, turns out to be a great guy), was at UCLA from the 2008 to 2011 season. Assuming for the moment that Neuhiesal influenced Mora first 2012 class, then you get the following ratings (ESP, Rivals, Scout):

2012: 19, 18, 12 (realizing Mora picked-up a lot of late talent like McCarthy)
2011 45, 45, 56
2010 10, 8, 8 (his only top 10 class)
2009 17, 14, 15
2008 14, 13, 13 (realizing Neuhiesal helped a mediocre class late)

Sorta like Tedford during this period, who had one really good class, and and some classes in the teens or twenties depending on the rating service (though nothing as bad as 2011). So I guess you just looked at the USC line, rather than the UCLA line when looking at rankings.

So let's talk about the loaded team. This year UCLA started 3 freshmen on the oline, and a center who started last year as a frosh. One WR who started as a frosh last year, and depending on how you view Jack, a frosh who starts at RB or LB. One frosh starts as a DE, and the DT McCarthy started some times as a true frosh last year. When Marsh is missing games for suspensions, etc. the substitute is a frosh, when Kendricks has been injured this year, the starter has been a frosh, Adams and Priest at cornerback our RS frosh and frosh, and the back-up safeties who have played a lot our both frosh. So yea, just flippen loaded with veteran players.

---

Hey now!!! I am normally on board with your posts, but the hyperbole has to stop here. You did a good refuting the "4 top ten classes in 5 years" exaggeration for fUCLA. but then you laid an immense egg with your own exaggeration.

Fact: Tedford NEVER had four top 15 classes in a five year period. And no, he NEVER had "similar" results either.

I am not defending Dykes here, but the cold hard TRUTH is that Sonny didn't inherit a talent pool anywhere near the level that Mora did. Let's be fair and honest here. This is the internet after all ...

The Duke!;842235286 said:

---

And that's great. I think Goff has a bright future and I don't mean to ignore our QB improvement from last year.

But I don't root for individual players or individual stats. I root for the entire Cal football team to defeat our opponents. And Sonny coached the absolute worst team in our 128 year history this year. He also suffered the most embarrassing loss in Big Game history. These things are absolutely inexcusable, despite the impressive numbers that our QB put up.

---

And I agree. I simply refuse to say there is not one positive thing that came out of Cal Football this year. That is the topic I am addressing.

JSML;842235293 said:

---

And I agree. I simply refuse to say there is not one positive thing that came out of Cal Football this year. That is the topic I am addressing.

---

Rock on. We're on the same page.

There's a great, albeit tongue in cheek thread over on the Bball board that I think adds perspective to this discussion: "This is not acceptable" http://bearinsider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=79786

Senior starter goes down (Solo). Does Montgomery send in the Freshman with potential (Rooks)? Hell, no. We are better off playing without him (one big) than playing a guy who just isn't ready. And we lost both games. You don't think Dykes wishes he had options that would have allowed him to avoid playing guys who aren't ready? But he didn't and we suffered the consequences. BTW, not being ready as a Frosh is just normal and does not mean they won't be ready next year, or even better the year after. There is a day coming when Rooks will light things up, it just will not be this year. If you play him this year you will lose. That's what happened to Dykes.

In 2012, if Maynard has even fewer attempts than what Goff had this year, the most disliked QB in recent Cal history, he owns the most passing yards record. Similarly, Isi Sofele, last year, with 400 carries, rushes for 2,000+ yards, breaks Cal's all-time season rushing record...

These are simply by virtue of passing or running more often. BFD. This kind of stuff is just a by-product of many wasted plays.

And as said just above, how has QB play improved from last year, the offense in general? We don't score more points than last year; and certainly much fewer points per play. Maynard's completion %, QBR and Y/A, all better, while under a lot more pressure. We had more sacks last year, with a lot fewer attempted passes...

If the only positive thing we have to hold onto is raw passing yards as an "improvement", we are not being honest with ourselves.

What Mac did on CO is ideally you want to see in a first year hire. We all agreed that he inherited a mess, a worse situation than what we have here. Sure it got worse with our injuries, but lordy, the worst of all time, 100+ years of Cal football. Mac is getting more wins, and peaking under the hood, it's clear why. Both the O and D, marked improvement in PPG (see earlier post). They are making positive strides, and doing so with a true freshman QB. They are protecting him not just much better than last year, but he has the best protection in the conference (sack rate). Averages, rates, percentages are much more telling than raw numbers.

Although CO is the worst team in the South, they improved their win total from last year, and the aforementioned impressive metric gains. History shows that the hire is likely to be a good one for them. What do we have to hold on to? If it's this BS passing yards, might as well hold on to our f'ing ankles!

Cal89;842235418 said:

---

In 2012, if Maynard has even fewer attempts than what Goff had this year, the most disliked QB in recent Cal history, he owns the most passing yards record. Similarly, Isi Sofele, last year, with 400 carries, rushes for 2,000+ yards, breaks Cal's all-time season rushing record...

These are simply by virtue of passing or running more often. BFD. This kind of stuff is just a by-product of many wasted plays.

And as said just above, how has QB play improved from last year, the offense in general? We don't score more points than last year; and certainly much fewer points per play. Maynard's completion %, QBR and Y/A, all better, while under a lot more pressure. We had more sacks last year, with a lot fewer attempted passes...

If the only positive thing we have to hold onto is raw passing yards as an "improvement", we are not being honest with ourselves.

What Mac did on CO is ideally you want to see in a first year hire. We all agreed that he inherited a mess, a worse situation than what we have here. Sure it got worse with our injuries, but lordy, the worst of all time, 100+ years of Cal football. Mac is getting more wins, and peaking under the hood, it's clear why. Both the O and D, marked improvement in PPG (see earlier post). They are making positive strides, and doing so with a true freshman QB. They are protecting him not just much better than last year, but he has the best protection in the conference (sack rate). Averages, rates, percentages are much more telling than raw numbers.

Although CO is the worst team in the South, they improved their win total from last year, and the aforementioned impressive metric gains. History shows that the hire is likely to be a good one for them. What do we have to hold on to? If it's this BS passing yards, might as well hold on to our f'ing ankles!

---

Solid commentary, bro! Your post made my day while goofing off surfing the net this holiday (I'm actually watching Soccer on the side, weird huh?).

Great 'big picture' retrospective on your part. Thanks for posting it because I think it's spot on IMO.....

Our Domicile;842235428 said:

---

Solid commentary, bro! Your post made my day while goofing off surfing the net this holiday (I'm actually watching Soccer on the side, weird huh?).

Great 'big picture' retrospective on your part. Thanks for posting it because I think it's spot on IMO.....

---

Man, I wish this could make my day. I'm so f'ing depressed and angry about the state of Cal football. Through it all, I / we must maintain objectivity, keep it real, and that's where the knife cuts so deep. Unless some major changes are made, and not just on D, possibly beyond the team and above, the reason for hope is not all that much...

Cal89;842235418 said:

---

In 2012, if Maynard has even fewer attempts than what Goff had this year, the most disliked QB in recent Cal history, he owns the most passing yards record. Similarly, Isi Sofele, last year, with 400 carries, rushes for 2,000+ yards, breaks Cal's all-time season rushing record...

These are simply by virtue of passing or running more often. BFD. This kind of stuff is just a by-product of many wasted plays.

And as said just above, how has QB play improved from last year, the offense in general? We don't score more points than last year; and certainly much fewer points per play. Maynard's completion %, QBR and Y/A, all better, while under a lot more pressure. We had more sacks last year, with a lot fewer attempted passes...

If the only positive thing we have to hold onto is raw passing yards as an "improvement", we are not being honest with ourselves.

What Mac did on CO is ideally you want to see in a first year hire. We all agreed that he inherited a mess, a worse situation than what we have here. Sure it got worse with our injuries, but lordy, the worst of all time, 100+ years of Cal football. Mac is getting more wins, and peaking under the hood, it's clear why. Both the O and D, marked improvement in PPG (see earlier post). They are making positive strides, and doing so with a true freshman QB. They are protecting him not just much better than last year, but he has the best protection in the conference (sack rate). Averages, rates, percentages are much more telling than raw numbers.

Although CO is the worst team in the South, they improved their win total from last year, and the aforementioned impressive metric gains. History shows that the hire is likely to be a good one for them. What do we have to hold on to? If it's this BS passing yards, might as well hold on to our f'ing ankles!

---

And Bigelow would have broken an all time record and racked up 7000 yards except he did not. Neither did Isi or Maynard. They did not do it and it is a far cry from 'simply'. Stats aren't linear. Stats are Stats. I studied Stat at Cal fwiw. You cannot use stats to extrapolate like this.

JSML;842235486 said:

---

And Bigelow would have broken an all time record and racked up 7000 yards except he did not. Neither did Isi or Maynard. They did not do it and it is a far cry from 'simply'. Stats aren't linear. Stats are Stats. I studied Stat at Cal fwiw. You cannot use stats to extrapolate like this.

---

I do agree Goff did not have a great season and improvements over a 3-9 team by a 1-11 team are impossible to find. I simply choose to view Goff and his record as a positive for Cal.

And seasons are not comprable enough to take as controlled data.

And no doubt Goff's numbers are inflated by the system.

And on the average an NFL sack occurs in 2.8 seconds. Goff and Kline always look like they had no time to throw. I believe they got rid of the ball quicker or else they would have much more sacks.

ok. deep breath.

I do enjoy ur posts! Great insight. Cheers.

Cal89;842235418 said:

---

In 2012, if Maynard has even fewer attempts than what Goff had this year, the most disliked QB in recent Cal history, he owns the most passing yards record. Similarly, Isi Sofele, last year, with 400 carries, rushes for 2,000+ yards, breaks Cal's all-time season rushing record...

These are simply by virtue of passing or running more often. BFD. This kind of stuff is just a by-product of many wasted plays.

And as said just above, how has QB play improved from last year, the offense in general? We don't score more points than last year; and certainly much fewer points per play. Maynard's completion %, QBR and Y/A, all better, while under a lot more pressure. We had more sacks last year, with a lot fewer attempted passes...

If the only positive thing we have to hold onto is raw passing yards as an "improvement", we are not being honest with ourselves.

What Mac did on CO is ideally you want to see in a first year hire. We all agreed that he inherited a mess, a worse situation than what we have here. Sure it got worse with our injuries, but lordy, the worst of all time, 100+ years of Cal football. Mac is getting more wins, and peaking under the hood, it's clear why. Both the O and D, marked improvement in PPG (see earlier post). They are making positive strides, and doing so with a true freshman QB. They are protecting him not just much better than last year, but he has the best protection in the conference (sack rate). Averages, rates, percentages are much more telling than raw numbers.

Although CO is the worst team in the South, they improved their win total from last year, and the aforementioned impressive metric gains. History shows that the hire is likely to be a good one for them. What do we have to hold on to? If it's this BS passing yards, might as well hold on to our f'ing ankles!

---

Totally skewed stats. A few long plays and the luxury of Keenan Allen on the end of those plays, not only making the great catch but the yards after carry as well. Maynard as a senior was nowhere near as good as goff was this year. And up until the last three games, the oline protection was equally bad. Goff did have the luxury of snaps that were catchable, however. At least we fixed that.

JSML;842235486 said:

---

And Bigelow would have broken an all time record and racked up 7000 yards except he did not. Neither did Isi or Maynard. They did not do it and it is a far cry from 'simply'. Stats aren't linear. Stats are Stats. I studied Stat at Cal fwiw. You cannot use stats to extrapolate like this.

---

I studied stats too at Cal, and elsewhere, BTW. BFD. It's damn common sense what we're talking here...

If our starting QB would have thrown the ball the normal 30 or so times a game like the average QB, we are not having this discussion, because no record would have been broken.

JSML;842235494 said:

---

I do agree Goff did not have a great season and improvements over a 3-9 team by a 1-11 team are impossible to find. I simply choose to view Goff and his record as a positive for Cal.

And seasons are not comprable enough to take as controlled data.

And no doubt Goff's numbers are inflated by the system.

And on the average an NFL sack occurs in 2.8 seconds. Goff and Kline always look like they had no time to throw. I believe they got rid of the ball quicker or else they would have much more sacks.

ok. deep breath.

I do enjoy ur posts! Great insight. Cheers.

---

Ok, you are replying to your own post above, but seemingly to me. Maybe one too many after a big Thanksgiving meal, lol.

I seem to recall the goal in this TFS is to get rid of the ball within 3 seconds.

bearsandgiants;842235504 said:

---

Totally skewed stats. A few long plays and the luxury of Keenan Allen on the end of those plays, not only making the great catch but the yards after carry as well. Maynard as a senior was nowhere near as good as goff was this year. And up until the last three games, the oline protection was equally bad. Goff did have the luxury of snaps that were catchable, however. At least we fixed that.

---

Ok, let's start with "a few long plays"... Do you have those stats, or was that just a hunch, or possibly some hope because it sounded good. Goff had more big yardage plays than Maynard. Maynard had only 3 games with 50+ yard pass completions, with the longest connections being: 50, 51 and 69 yards. Goff had 5 such games, with the longest being: 52, 75, 61, 89 and 62 yards. For games where the longest pass was in the 40's, Maynard had one such game: 44 yards. Goff had two: 45 and 49 yards.

I almost feel like stopping there, but I can't stand misinformation...

Ah, the luxury of KA again...

What did KA afford Maynard last year?

61 catches
737 yards (that includes YAC)
12.1 yards / reception

That's what KA21 provided the despised Maynard, the most ridiculed Cal QB in recent history...

Here's what Goff got from Harper:

70 catches
852 yards
12.2 yards / reception

Here's what Goff got from Treggs:

77 catches
751 yards
9.8 yards / reception

Each Harper and Treggs had more yards than KA21 last year. Harper even a better yards per catch. On top of that, as a QB, I'd much rather prefer having two go-to guys compared to one. Goff got the ball to 10+ receivers a game on average, in addition to having 2 front-runners... Everyone in the house knew Maynard was looking for his bro, especially the D.

The argument that having KA is why Maynard's numbers are better does not hold water. Oh, the great catches by KA. I almost forgot that one... Damn straight he made some some nice grabs to help-out Maynard. I guess we had none this year to similarly aid Mr. Goff? Not sure I remember a season with so many great, acrobatic snags! Harris and Lawler for sure come-to-mind...

As I go through the misinformation above, now I get to this sentence:

"Maynard as a senior was nowhere near as good as goff was this year."

Based upon the crap I just refuted? Here it is AGAIN:

Completion %
QBR
Y/A

All better for Maynard. These are the most popularly used metrics to ascertain QB performance. What data might you be referencing to make such a bold statement? If you don't come back with some supporting data, I can only conclude it's more misinformation. If you have something say, give us compelling reasons to believe...

Whining about the offensive line's pass protection has gotten so old. Sure it's not good. Is it bad? Well, in relation to the rest of conference, we allow an average number of sacks per pass play. Average. Compared to last year, a hell of a lot better. In 2013, we got sacked about every 18 to 19 pass attempts. In 2012, about every 9 pass plays got a sack. We had double the frequency of sacks last year. Maynard had some ridiculous pressure last year. So, when bitchin' about the pass protection this year, keep that in perspective - it's far better this year, and average within the conference.

A nice long weekend everyone...

Cal89;842235559 said:

---

I studied stats too at Cal, and elsewhere, BTW. BFD. It's damn common sense what we're talking here...

If our starting QB would have thrown the ball the normal 30 or so times a game like the average QB, we are not having this discussion, because no record would have been broken.



Ok, you are replying to your own post above, but seemingly to me. Maybe one too many after a big Thanksgiving meal, lol.

I seem to recall the goal in this TFS is to get rid of the ball within 3 seconds.



Ok, let's start with "a few long plays"... Do you have those stats, or was that just a hunch, or possibly some hope because it sounded good. Goff had more big yardage plays than Maynard. Maynard had only 3 games with 50+ yard pass completions, with the longest connections being: 50, 51 and 69 yards. Goff had 5 such games, with the longest being: 52, 75, 61, 89 and 62 yards. For games where the longest pass was in the 40's, Maynard had one such game: 44 yards. Goff had two: 45 and 49 yards.

I almost feel like stopping there, but I can't stand misinformation...

Ah, the luxury of KA again...

What did KA afford Maynard last year?

61 catches
737 yards (that includes YAC)
12.1 yards / reception

That's what KA21 provided the despised Maynard, the most ridiculed Cal QB in recent history...

Here's what Goff got from Harper:

70 catches
852 yards
12.2 yards / reception

Here's what Goff got from Treggs:

77 catches
751 yards
9.8 yards / reception

Each Harper and Treggs had more yards than KA21 last year. Harper even a better yards per catch. On top of that, as a QB, I'd much rather prefer having two go-to guys compared to one. Goff got the ball to 10+ receivers a game on average, in addition to having 2 front-runners... Everyone in the house knew Maynard was looking for his bro, especially the D.

The argument that having KA is why Maynard's numbers are better does not hold water. Oh, the great catches by KA. I almost forgot that one... Damn straight he made some some nice grabs to help-out Maynard. I guess we had none this year to similarly aid Mr. Goff? Not sure I remember a season with so many great, acrobatic snags! Harris and Lawler for sure come-to-mind...

As I go through the misinformation above, now I get to this sentence:

"Maynard as a senior was nowhere near as good as goff was this year."

Based upon the crap I just refuted? Here it is AGAIN:

Completion %
QBR
Y/A

All better for Maynard. These are the most popularly used metrics to ascertain QB performance. What data might you be referencing to make such a bold statement? If you don't come back with some supporting data, I can only conclude it's more misinformation. If you have something say, give us compelling reasons to believe...

Whining about the offensive line's pass protection has gotten so old. Sure it's not good. Is it bad? Well, in relation to the rest of conference, we allow an average number of sacks per pass play. Average. Compared to last year, a hell of a lot better. In 2013, we got sacked about every 18 to 19 pass attempts. In 2012, about every 9 pass plays got a sack. We had double the frequency of sacks last year. Maynard had some ridiculous pressure last year. So, when bitchin' about the pass protection this year, keep that in perspective - it's far better this year, and average within the conference.

A nice long weekend everyone...

---

Great stuff! +1