I always had hope Goff would have enough time to lead us to one more TD. But watching this year's team was painful and mentally draining. This year was definitely a highlight film for our D, thank you guys for trying to keep us in the games and sometimes even scoring! But our offense was just awful, when you are hoping that we don't turnover the ball, there is something wrong. What was so wrong with running the ball or setting up screen passes? I'm ok with taking a deep pass now and then but it all needs to be setup with the run. That freshman (Brown) I thought looked pretty good and will only get better. I thought Garber came out with some confidence but that soon left after the pics....

Troll said:

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I always had hope Goff would have enough time to lead us to one more TD. But watching this year's team was painful and mentally draining. This year was definitely a highlight film for our D, thank you guys for trying to keep us in the games and sometimes even scoring! But our offense was just awful, when you are hoping that we don't turnover the ball, there is something wrong. What was so wrong with running the ball or setting up screen passes? I'm ok with taking a deep pass now and then but it all needs to be setup with the run. That freshman (Brown) I thought looked pretty good and will only get better. I thought Garber came out with some confidence but that soon left after the pics....

---

Like Cal89 says, our O under Dykes was a mirage. Dropping 50 on weak or flawed teams. But against good teams we couldn't score and our D was just as bad against all comers. Under Wilcox, our D kept us in the game and even provided the leadership to beat elite teams. I count the victory of the Rose Bowl bound UW a nice victory over an elite team. The D also did everything it could to slow down the Wazzu offensive juggernaut and they deserved the win but for the offense. We fire the OC, fix the offense to be merely efficient, we could be really good next season.

I'd rather watch Cal's current defense (with the flawed offense) over the Dykes' Bear Raid all offense/no D. Why? a) the W/L record. b) offense can be fixed even if it appears clueless/hopeless now

I'm not saying fixing the offense will be easy or a sure thing but the W/L record and the ability to stay in games and even beat good teams is a better position to be in.

Agree (with the OP). The HORRIBLE defenses of the previous regime were unbelievably frustrating, but yesterday's offense (reaching a new low for the season) was equally frustrating, maybe even more so. We're down by three -- heck, even when we were TIED -- and it felt so hopeless. Going into overtime, my only reason for hope was that our defense was strong and that TCU's offense looked equally inept. Otherwise, forget it.

Bottom line, whichever situation a team is in at that given moment (only defense, or only offense), that is the one that seems most frustrating.

Edit: Ah, I will say, some people are just more "defense guys", while others are more "offense guys" and that colors the way folks see this issue. And, obviously, it would be nice to have a little balance, for goodness sake!

10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

StarsDoMatter said:

---

10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

---

See? You are an "offense guy". The "defense guys" are never going to agree with you, though I certainly do (at least today).

Can't we at least be "decent" on both sides of the ball?!?

To win you have to play both offense and defense. The good Tedford teams did both, at a high level and that's what it's going to take to win consistently. Can't only do one but it doens't have to be a 50/50 split on strength, just complimentary enough to work.

That said, defense will keep you in games longer and let you win some big games by denying the opposition.

My take is playing good defense is playing good fundamental football and that's never bad. The thing is, have to also play good fundamental offense too. Any way, I have no answers now. Just have to wait and hope fixes occur and the staff is adjusted.

StarsDoMatter said:

---

10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

---

I would take yesterday 's loss over any of the pinball losses in the Dykes era. The reason is simple - Cal had no chance in those Dykes era losses. Whereas, yesterday, the idea was get it to OT and you have got a shot. If you think this was rock bottom, I suggest that you weren't around in '01 or '13. Those were both rock bottom years. Yesterday was a competitive game (for a variety of reasons). That is a far cry from the recent past.

Dykes completely folding the first season was inexcusable. He just packed it in. Agree, while it was ugly last night, at least Cal was in the game and Cal beat good teams this season. That never happened under Dykes.

that was agonizing. at least the video game scores were entertaining.

it is tragic that this defense is stuck with hands-down the worst offense i've seen in 15 years following Cal football. with even an average offense... this is a really good team.

71Bear said:

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StarsDoMatter said:

---

10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

---

I would take yesterday 's loss over any of the pinball losses in the Dykes era. The reason is simple - Cal had no chance in those Dykes era losses. Whereas, yesterday, the idea was get it to OT and you have got a shot. If you think this was rock bottom, I suggest that you weren't around in '01 or '13. Those were both rock bottom years. Yesterday was a competitive game (for a variety of reasons). That is a far cry from the recent past.

---

Alright... I was 10 in '01 so don't quite remember everything. '13 was terrible. A lost year.

This was just so embarrassing, because TCU was giving us the game. We could have just kicked 2 FG's in the red zone and won. Instead, our JV offense couldn't even muster that.

Beyond frustrating.

71Bear said:

---

StarsDoMatter said:

---

10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

---

I would take yesterday 's loss over any of the pinball losses in the Dykes era. The reason is simple - Cal had no chance in those Dykes era losses. Whereas, yesterday, the idea was get it to OT and you have got a shot. If you think this was rock bottom, I suggest that you weren't around in '01 or '13. Those were both rock bottom years. Yesterday was a competitive game (for a variety of reasons). That is a far cry from the recent past.

---

See? You're a "defense guy". I thought, in 2014-15, we ALWAYS had a shot if we were within three TDs and had at least ten minutes left in the game. Yesterday, we were THREE POINTS DOWN and it felt nearly hopeless. My hope in OT was that we'd get a turnover and then be able to kick a field goal. That was about our only chance.

TLR. The dykes program was chicken***** We consistently had no offense. We almost never showed a defense. If Dykes could score against marginal or better opponents, then sure. But he couldnt. Blow out garbage, then get blown out was Dykes football. Let me show you how Dykes football existed in its "prime" under Goff... Blow out wins with Blow out losses.


Bolding games that could be decided by a 4th quarter score

The games Goff lost in his best season he lost by
6 (Close game, Cal down 3 in the 4th)
16 (Cal was losing 40-16 in the 4th before garbage time)
6 (Cal was losing 27-14 in the 4th before garbage time)
16 (Only 34-21 going into the 4th)
13 (Cal was losing 35-16 before garbage time)

His 2nd year he lost by
4 (Cal Led in the 4th 45-30),
24 (Cal didnt score until the end of the 3rd)
2 (Cal led in the 4th 34-33),
18 (Cal was losing 59-35 before Goff handed off for the last score)
8 (Cal was losing 38-16 in the 4th before garbage time)
21 (Cal was losing 38-10 in the 4th before garbage time)
7 (Tied in the 4th)


In the wins in 2015,
Won by 60
Won by 28
Winning 45-24 in the 4th
Cal led from the second quarter on
Cal came back in the 4th down 8
Cal led 44-24 going into the 4th
Cal came back on a FG down 1

In 2014
Cal was winning 31-7 in the 3rd before they stopped scoring
Cal was winning 45-0 in the 2nd
Cal was tied at the end of regulation
Cal came back on a 51 yard pass from goff down 5
Cal scored the last 3 times to come back


Out of 9 chances to win or lose in the 4th quarter and lost 4, won 5. Pretty good.

OTOH, Cal lost 8 games that were over before the half, and won 6 that were over before the second half.


I get that this team might be more frustrating to watch, but that is because this team has close games. Dykes' games were generally over at the half either way. A half of meaningless football isnt exciting in any way to me. Out of 23 games 14 were settled decisively before the half time show, and we lost 4 of the interesting games.

If your criteria is honestly the ability to win late, Dykes was not your guy. We either blew teams apart to win, or went 5050 late.


What games did you feel Cal was out of it or locked up before the half this year? What games did you stop watching because it was clearly a done deal?

W- UNC (17-0 at the half, 24-3 in the 4th)
W- BYU (14-10 in the 4th)
W- Idaho St (31-9 in the 4th)
L- Oregon (28-10 at the half)
L- Arizona (14-17 in the 4th)
L- UCLA (20-7 in the 4th)
W- OSU (21-0 at the half)
W- Washington (7-12 in the 4th)
L- WSU (13-13 in the 4th)
W- USC (15-14 in the 4th)
W- Colorado (21-27 in the 4th)
L- Stanford (13-6 in the 4th)
L- TCU (7-7 at the end of regulation)

With Wilcox the outcome was not certain in 8 of the 12 games. Of the games that were close in the 4th we won 4, and lost 4. Of the games that were not close at the half, we won all but Oregon.

In other words, Wilcox is at LEAST as capable of winning the close game as Dykes and Goff were. Probably more able, considering the quality of teams we competed with late, vs the epic overtime win vs Colorado when Colorado was attempting to win their second game of the season.

StarsDoMatter said:

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71Bear said:

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StarsDoMatter said:

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10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

---

I would take yesterday 's loss over any of the pinball losses in the Dykes era. The reason is simple - Cal had no chance in those Dykes era losses. Whereas, yesterday, the idea was get it to OT and you have got a shot. If you think this was rock bottom, I suggest that you weren't around in '01 or '13. Those were both rock bottom years. Yesterday was a competitive game (for a variety of reasons). That is a far cry from the recent past.

---

Alright... I was 10 in '01 so don't quite remember everything. '13 was terrible. A lost year.

This was just so embarrassing, because TCU was giving us the game. We could have just kicked 2 FG's in the red zone and won. Instead, our JV offense couldn't even muster that.

Beyond frustrating.

---

This explains a lot

BearsWiin said:

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StarsDoMatter said:

---

71Bear said:

---

StarsDoMatter said:

---

10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

---

I would take yesterday 's loss over any of the pinball losses in the Dykes era. The reason is simple - Cal had no chance in those Dykes era losses. Whereas, yesterday, the idea was get it to OT and you have got a shot. If you think this was rock bottom, I suggest that you weren't around in '01 or '13. Those were both rock bottom years. Yesterday was a competitive game (for a variety of reasons). That is a far cry from the recent past.

---

Alright... I was 10 in '01 so don't quite remember everything. '13 was terrible. A lost year.

This was just so embarrassing, because TCU was giving us the game. We could have just kicked 2 FG's in the red zone and won. Instead, our JV offense couldn't even muster that.

Beyond frustrating.

---

This explains a lot

---

So you have to old to understand football? All those billionaires in silicon valley sure are old.. Sean Mcvay is 32 bro! He must not know a thing.

We've hardly been completely out of games in the Wilcox era, the same can't be said for the Dykes era when in some games, it was over before halftime. C'mon, it wasn't that long ago.

StarsDoMatter said:

---

10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

---

Anyone who thinks a 7 win season is rock bottom for Cal is suspect.

Anyone who thinks a 7 win season is rock bottom while comparing it to a coach who won 0 FBS games, AND set several all-time worst records is too emotionally unstable to be taken seriously.

Dykes lost to Stanfurd by 50 ******* points. Dykes fielded units that hold the record, ALL TIME, ALL LEVELS, of worst ever.

oskirules said:

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We've hardly been completely out of games in the Wilcox era, the same can't be said for the Dykes era when in some games, it was over before halftime. C'mon, it wasn't that long ago.

---

Yeah we are in games according to the scoreboard (like last night) but then our offense does nothing and we lose, we are just losing by the skin of our teeth versus getting blown out in shootouts, but either way it's an L!

StarsDoMatter said:

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BearsWiin said:

---

StarsDoMatter said:

---

71Bear said:

---

StarsDoMatter said:

---

10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

---

I would take yesterday 's loss over any of the pinball losses in the Dykes era. The reason is simple - Cal had no chance in those Dykes era losses. Whereas, yesterday, the idea was get it to OT and you have got a shot. If you think this was rock bottom, I suggest that you weren't around in '01 or '13. Those were both rock bottom years. Yesterday was a competitive game (for a variety of reasons). That is a far cry from the recent past.

---

Alright... I was 10 in '01 so don't quite remember everything. '13 was terrible. A lost year.

This was just so embarrassing, because TCU was giving us the game. We could have just kicked 2 FG's in the red zone and won. Instead, our JV offense couldn't even muster that.

Beyond frustrating.

---

This explains a lot

---

So you have to old to understand football? All those billionaires in silicon valley sure are old.. Sean Mcvay is 32 bro! He must not know a thing.

---

I'm not your bro and you're not Sean McVay. A sense of history and perspective helps temper the hyperbole. But by all means keep going, it's a free country


for now

Big C said:

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71Bear said:

---

StarsDoMatter said:

---

10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

---

I would take yesterday 's loss over any of the pinball losses in the Dykes era. The reason is simple - Cal had no chance in those Dykes era losses. Whereas, yesterday, the idea was get it to OT and you have got a shot. If you think this was rock bottom, I suggest that you weren't around in '01 or '13. Those were both rock bottom years. Yesterday was a competitive game (for a variety of reasons). That is a far cry from the recent past.

---

See? You're a "defense guy". I thought, in 2014-15, we ALWAYS had a shot if we were within three TDs and had at least ten minutes left in the game. Yesterday, we were THREE POINTS DOWN and it felt nearly hopeless. My hope in OT was that we'd get a turnover and then be able to kick a field goal. That was about our only chance.

---

We weren't three points down until the game was over. At no time during the game were we three points down.

StarsDoMatter said:

---

BearsWiin said:

---

StarsDoMatter said:

---

71Bear said:

---

StarsDoMatter said:

---

10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

---

I would take yesterday 's loss over any of the pinball losses in the Dykes era. The reason is simple - Cal had no chance in those Dykes era losses. Whereas, yesterday, the idea was get it to OT and you have got a shot. If you think this was rock bottom, I suggest that you weren't around in '01 or '13. Those were both rock bottom years. Yesterday was a competitive game (for a variety of reasons). That is a far cry from the recent past.

---

Alright... I was 10 in '01 so don't quite remember everything. '13 was terrible. A lost year.

This was just so embarrassing, because TCU was giving us the game. We could have just kicked 2 FG's in the red zone and won. Instead, our JV offense couldn't even muster that.

Beyond frustrating.

---

This explains a lot

---

So you have to old to understand football? All those billionaires in silicon valley sure are old.. Sean Mcvay is 32 bro! He must not know a thing.

---

It is either your age, or you. Either way you dont know what you are talking about.

I'll let you pick.

Big C said:

---

71Bear said:

---

StarsDoMatter said:

---

10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

---

I would take yesterday 's loss over any of the pinball losses in the Dykes era. The reason is simple - Cal had no chance in those Dykes era losses. Whereas, yesterday, the idea was get it to OT and you have got a shot. If you think this was rock bottom, I suggest that you weren't around in '01 or '13. Those were both rock bottom years. Yesterday was a competitive game (for a variety of reasons). That is a far cry from the recent past.

---

See? You're a "defense guy". I thought, in 2014-15, we ALWAYS had a shot if we were within three TDs and had at least ten minutes left in the game. Yesterday, we were THREE POINTS DOWN and it felt nearly hopeless. My hope in OT was that we'd get a turnover and then be able to kick a field goal. That was about our only chance.

---

LMFAO...

You felt it was hopeless because the game was over when we were "THREE POINTS DOWN"

Its hard to come back from a deficit when the game is over.

LunchTime said:

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TLR. The dykes program was chicken***** We consistently had no offense. We almost never showed a defense. If Dykes could score against marginal or better opponents, then sure. But he couldnt. Blow out garbage, then get blown out was Dykes football. Let me show you how Dykes football existed in its "prime" under Goff... Blow out wins with Blow out losses.


Bolding games that could be decided by a 4th quarter score

The games Goff lost in his best season he lost by
6 (Close game, Cal down 3 in the 4th)
16 (Cal was losing 40-16 in the 4th before garbage time)
6 (Cal was losing 27-14 in the 4th before garbage time)
16 (Only 34-21 going into the 4th)
13 (Cal was losing 35-16 before garbage time)

His 2nd year he lost by
4 (Cal Led in the 4th 45-30),
24 (Cal didnt score until the end of the 3rd)
2 (Cal led in the 4th 34-33),
18 (Cal was losing 59-35 before Goff handed off for the last score)
8 (Cal was losing 38-16 in the 4th before garbage time)
21 (Cal was losing 38-10 in the 4th before garbage time)
7 (Tied in the 4th)


In the wins in 2015,
Won by 60
Won by 28
Winning 45-24 in the 4th
Cal led from the second quarter on
Cal came back in the 4th down 8
Cal led 44-24 going into the 4th
Cal came back on a FG down 1

In 2014
Cal was winning 31-7 in the 3rd before they stopped scoring
Cal was winning 45-0 in the 2nd
Cal was tied at the end of regulation
Cal came back on a 51 yard pass from goff down 5
Cal scored the last 3 times to come back


Out of 9 chances to win or lose in the 4th quarter and lost 4, won 5. Pretty good.

OTOH, Cal lost 8 games that were over before the half, and won 6 that were over before the second half.


I get that this team might be more frustrating to watch, but that is because this team has close games. Dykes' games were generally over at the half either way. A half of meaningless football isnt exciting in any way to me. Out of 23 games 14 were settled decisively before the half time show, and we lost 4 of the interesting games.

If your criteria is honestly the ability to win late, Dykes was not your guy. We either blew teams apart to win, or went 5050 late.


What games did you feel Cal was out of it or locked up before the half this year? What games did you stop watching because it was clearly a done deal?

W- UNC (17-0 at the half, 24-3 in the 4th)
W- BYU (14-10 in the 4th)
W- Idaho St (31-9 in the 4th)
L- Oregon (28-10 at the half)
L- Arizona (14-17 in the 4th)
L- UCLA (20-7 in the 4th)
W- OSU (21-0 at the half)
W- Washington (7-12 in the 4th)
L- WSU (13-13 in the 4th)
W- USC (15-14 in the 4th)
W- Colorado (21-27 in the 4th)
L- Stanford (13-6 in the 4th)
L- TCU (7-7 at the end of regulation)

With Wilcox the outcome was not certain in 8 of the 12 games. Of the games that were close in the 4th we won 4, and lost 4. Of the games that were not close at the half, we won all but Oregon.

In other words, Wilcox is at LEAST as capable of winning the close game as Dykes and Goff were. Probably more able, considering the quality of teams we competed with late, vs the epic overtime win vs Colorado when Colorado was attempting to win their second game of the season.

---

Straw man: Overall, it's almost impossible to defend the job Sonny Dykes did here. He was unsuccessful and he was let go. I don't think anybody here is defending Dykes' performance, in general, just saying that "all D / no O" can be as frustrating as "all O / no D". Depending on one's perspective, maybe even more frustrating.

And let's not kid ourselves, we have now sunk to the "no O" level.

Big C said:

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71Bear said:

---

StarsDoMatter said:

---

10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

---

I would take yesterday 's loss over any of the pinball losses in the Dykes era. The reason is simple - Cal had no chance in those Dykes era losses. Whereas, yesterday, the idea was get it to OT and you have got a shot. If you think this was rock bottom, I suggest that you weren't around in '01 or '13. Those were both rock bottom years. Yesterday was a competitive game (for a variety of reasons). That is a far cry from the recent past.

---

See? You're a "defense guy". I thought, in 2014-15, we ALWAYS had a shot if we were within three TDs and had at least ten minutes left in the game. Yesterday, we were THREE POINTS DOWN and it felt nearly hopeless. My hope in OT was that we'd get a turnover and then be able to kick a field goal. That was about our only chance.

---

Actually, as soon as Cal was down by two scores in the Dykes era, it was very promblematic for the Bears because every time they scored, the opposition would march right back down the field. Those games were hopeless before kickoff.

Strykur said:

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oskirules said:

---

We've hardly been completely out of games in the Wilcox era, the same can't be said for the Dykes era when in some games, it was over before halftime. C'mon, it wasn't that long ago.

---

Yeah we are in games according to the scoreboard (like last night) but then our offense does nothing and we lose, we are just losing by the skin of our teeth versus getting blown out in shootouts, but either way it's an L!

---

Your assessment is objectively false. At least comparing Wilcox and Dykes.

Subjectively you can argue that Dykes football felt better, but objectively, Cal is not at a larger disadvantage with Wilcox, and may be at an advantage (given the plotting of teams we beat now vs who we beat under dykes).

Objectively we have a MUCH better chance of beating good teams (500+) with Wilcox. Objectively, we have a better chance of losing to teams that are worse.

Subjectively, I never thought Dykes would be able to compete with good teams consistently. I think Wilcox does now, and has a chance of competing with bad teams better in the future.

I just want to know why the hell we didn't go for it on 4th and 2? Weren't we inside the 40? We were pounding the rock well in 2nd half...Punt gets you 25 yds of field position...??

Big C said:

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LunchTime said:

---

TLR. The dykes program was chicken***** We consistently had no offense. We almost never showed a defense. If Dykes could score against marginal or better opponents, then sure. But he couldnt. Blow out garbage, then get blown out was Dykes football. Let me show you how Dykes football existed in its "prime" under Goff... Blow out wins with Blow out losses.


Bolding games that could be decided by a 4th quarter score

The games Goff lost in his best season he lost by
6 (Close game, Cal down 3 in the 4th)
16 (Cal was losing 40-16 in the 4th before garbage time)
6 (Cal was losing 27-14 in the 4th before garbage time)
16 (Only 34-21 going into the 4th)
13 (Cal was losing 35-16 before garbage time)

His 2nd year he lost by
4 (Cal Led in the 4th 45-30),
24 (Cal didnt score until the end of the 3rd)
2 (Cal led in the 4th 34-33),
18 (Cal was losing 59-35 before Goff handed off for the last score)
8 (Cal was losing 38-16 in the 4th before garbage time)
21 (Cal was losing 38-10 in the 4th before garbage time)
7 (Tied in the 4th)


In the wins in 2015,
Won by 60
Won by 28
Winning 45-24 in the 4th
Cal led from the second quarter on
Cal came back in the 4th down 8
Cal led 44-24 going into the 4th
Cal came back on a FG down 1

In 2014
Cal was winning 31-7 in the 3rd before they stopped scoring
Cal was winning 45-0 in the 2nd
Cal was tied at the end of regulation
Cal came back on a 51 yard pass from goff down 5
Cal scored the last 3 times to come back


Out of 9 chances to win or lose in the 4th quarter and lost 4, won 5. Pretty good.

OTOH, Cal lost 8 games that were over before the half, and won 6 that were over before the second half.


I get that this team might be more frustrating to watch, but that is because this team has close games. Dykes' games were generally over at the half either way. A half of meaningless football isnt exciting in any way to me. Out of 23 games 14 were settled decisively before the half time show, and we lost 4 of the interesting games.

If your criteria is honestly the ability to win late, Dykes was not your guy. We either blew teams apart to win, or went 5050 late.


What games did you feel Cal was out of it or locked up before the half this year? What games did you stop watching because it was clearly a done deal?

W- UNC (17-0 at the half, 24-3 in the 4th)
W- BYU (14-10 in the 4th)
W- Idaho St (31-9 in the 4th)
L- Oregon (28-10 at the half)
L- Arizona (14-17 in the 4th)
L- UCLA (20-7 in the 4th)
W- OSU (21-0 at the half)
W- Washington (7-12 in the 4th)
L- WSU (13-13 in the 4th)
W- USC (15-14 in the 4th)
W- Colorado (21-27 in the 4th)
L- Stanford (13-6 in the 4th)
L- TCU (7-7 at the end of regulation)

With Wilcox the outcome was not certain in 8 of the 12 games. Of the games that were close in the 4th we won 4, and lost 4. Of the games that were not close at the half, we won all but Oregon.

In other words, Wilcox is at LEAST as capable of winning the close game as Dykes and Goff were. Probably more able, considering the quality of teams we competed with late, vs the epic overtime win vs Colorado when Colorado was attempting to win their second game of the season.

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Straw man: Overall, it's almost impossible to defend the job Sonny Dykes did here. He was unsuccessful and he was let go. I don't think anybody here is defending Dykes' performance, in general, just saying that "all D / no O" can be as frustrating as "all O / no D". Depending on one's perspective, maybe even more frustrating.

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That isnt a straw man. The argument was literally that Dykes would give a better shot at winning close games.

This is evidence that it is objectively not true. At worst Wilcox is equal. His opinion is subjective. The reality is that we have an equal shot with no D as we do with no O.

I dont think you know what straw man means.

StarsDoMatter said:

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71Bear said:

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StarsDoMatter said:

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10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

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I would take yesterday 's loss over any of the pinball losses in the Dykes era. The reason is simple - Cal had no chance in those Dykes era losses. Whereas, yesterday, the idea was get it to OT and you have got a shot. If you think this was rock bottom, I suggest that you weren't around in '01 or '13. Those were both rock bottom years. Yesterday was a competitive game (for a variety of reasons). That is a far cry from the recent past.

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Alright... I was 10 in '01 so don't quite remember everything. '13 was terrible. A lost year.

This was just so embarrassing, because TCU was giving us the game. We could have just kicked 2 FG's in the red zone and won. Instead, our JV offense couldn't even muster that.

Beyond frustrating.

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Thanks for the clarification re: your age. I suspected that you were a young guy. Keep in mind that many of us having been watching Cal football since the Pappy era. We know the difference between losing a bowl game and rock bottom.....

71Bear said:

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Big C said:

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71Bear said:

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StarsDoMatter said:

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10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

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I would take yesterday 's loss over any of the pinball losses in the Dykes era. The reason is simple - Cal had no chance in those Dykes era losses. Whereas, yesterday, the idea was get it to OT and you have got a shot. If you think this was rock bottom, I suggest that you weren't around in '01 or '13. Those were both rock bottom years. Yesterday was a competitive game (for a variety of reasons). That is a far cry from the recent past.

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See? You're a "defense guy". I thought, in 2014-15, we ALWAYS had a shot if we were within three TDs and had at least ten minutes left in the game. Yesterday, we were THREE POINTS DOWN and it felt nearly hopeless. My hope in OT was that we'd get a turnover and then be able to kick a field goal. That was about our only chance.

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Actually, as soon as Cal was down by two scores in the Dykes era, it was very promblematic for the Bears because every time they scored, the opposition would march right back down the field. Those games were hopeless before kickoff.

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Note that I am not defending the indefensible here (Dykes overall performance), but there were plenty of times back then where we were down by more than two scores and came back to make a game of it. (Yes, those games were often against mediocre opponents... like a 2018 TCU.)

This thread contains some good laughs.

To those that don't mind losing 10-7 like we did last night , what is your best assessment of what is wrong and do you have ideas on how to fix things?

going4roses said:

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This thread contains some good laughs.

To those that don't mind losing 10-7 like we did last night , what is your best assessment of what is wrong and do you have ideas on how to fix things?

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TCU cheerleaders.....

LunchTime said:

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StarsDoMatter said:

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BearsWiin said:

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StarsDoMatter said:

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71Bear said:

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StarsDoMatter said:

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10-7 is much worse.

Losing like we did yesterday, reminded me of my sisters 5th grade CYO B team who lost 4-2 in basketball. Sure the game was close, but they made 3 baskets in 24 mins...

What I witnessed last night was truly a god awful football game. We lost a lot more than a game yesterday. We lost to a team whose QB threw 8 yards and 4 INTs. A QB who was 4th string. The 5th string QB was injured and played a few snaps because they LITERALLY had nobody else. We had a month to prepare.

This was rock bottom.

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I would take yesterday 's loss over any of the pinball losses in the Dykes era. The reason is simple - Cal had no chance in those Dykes era losses. Whereas, yesterday, the idea was get it to OT and you have got a shot. If you think this was rock bottom, I suggest that you weren't around in '01 or '13. Those were both rock bottom years. Yesterday was a competitive game (for a variety of reasons). That is a far cry from the recent past.

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Alright... I was 10 in '01 so don't quite remember everything. '13 was terrible. A lost year.

This was just so embarrassing, because TCU was giving us the game. We could have just kicked 2 FG's in the red zone and won. Instead, our JV offense couldn't even muster that.

Beyond frustrating.

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This explains a lot

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So you have to old to understand football? All those billionaires in silicon valley sure are old.. Sean Mcvay is 32 bro! He must not know a thing.

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It is either your age, or you. Either way you dont know what you are talking about.

I'll let you pick.

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I do know what I'm talking about. I'm 27, but have played football, coached football, .. have you?

My clients, a lot of them OLD BLUES seem to agree with me. Trying to explain to them what they witnessed last night was challenging to say the least.

going4roses said:

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This thread contains some good laughs.

To those that don't mind losing 10-7 like we did last night , what is your best assessment of what is wrong and do you have ideas on how to fix things?

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Give me a staff position and pay me $300k/year and I'll tell you. Otherwise, not my job and frankly I don't have enough information to know what's really going on, let along fix things.

Like I said before...I like being 7-6 this season and near .500 after two years over a 1-11 season and just folding and crapping the bed like Dykes and being 6-18 after 2 seasons. Besides the W/L record, it's also about the attitude toward competing and winning that I like now, versus pragmatically sitting on your dick while others punch you in the face.

For god sake, man the EF up and show some fight.

Some people are conflating multiple issues and failing to acknowledge that there are several issues occurring on offense.

1. Talent - Redshirt Frosh at QB walk-on at RB. Love Laird but look at the RBs Cal has had over the last 15-20 years a majority were NFL caliber. Plus you could rotate the backs. In 2004 Cal had JJ Arrington Terrell Williams, Marcus O'Keith, Marshawn Lynch, Justin Forster and Chris Manderino. 4 of those guys played in the NFL.

Right now maybe Chris Brown has that type of potential.

Has there been a weaker WR corps in the last 15-20 years?

2. The offensive game plan was garbage. You know TCU has a nasty D so why have your inexperienced QB making choices?

There was success with TE plays in the game? Why didn't the plan continue to exploit the TCU D with TE sit down routes?

Are screens illegal for this Cal O? Shovel passes?
Clearly it was a bad idea to have Chase reading the field and looking for 2nd or 3rd options or reading the defensive alignment. So why not simplify things in the passing game by running crossing patterns, or running the TE and/or RB run checkdown routes 4-5 yards past the line of scrimmage.

Why not to 2 back T sets and not just offset I formations with Malik.

I attended every Goff home game. He was worth the price of admission. This lifetime Raider fan is now a Rams fan for as long as Goff plays for them. The End