Quote:
On third-and-goal from the Bears' 6, Kareem Kelly made a diving
catch in the back of the end zone, but the ball appeared to
immediately slip from his grasp and bounce back into his arms. It
was ruled a touchdown rather than an incompletion, however.
"I'm still sticking with it was a good catch. Other than that,
I have no comment,'' Palmer said.
Kelly explained: "I had the ball. The ground helped me secure
the ball. I rolled over and the ref had his hands up.''
That is too kind to the Pac12.HighlandDutch said:
Here's Canzano's article on the screw-up:
https://www.oregonlive.com/sports/2019/11/canzano-pac-12-officiating-blunder-is-a-symptom-conference-needs-a-total-reboot.html
I was thinking the same thing when I read the article. Anyone who has watched P12 football for any length of time knows that the refs are not biased. Their level of incompetence spans all teams all the time.UrsaMajor said:
Unfortunately, this damages the theory that P12 refs are biased against Cal (a common belief on the forum). As I have learned--never attribute to conspiracy what can be explained by incompetence.
What drives me crazy is all the times where the is simply no excuse for the level of incompetence. Saturday's gaffe was just another example. I can understand a brief miscommunication, but that should be fixed fairly quickly, and certainly there was ample time to fix it before the ball was snapped for the next play.71Bear said:I was thinking the same thing when I read the article. Anyone who has watched P12 football for any length of time knows that the refs are not biased. Their level of incompetence spans all teams all the time.UrsaMajor said:
Unfortunately, this damages the theory that P12 refs are biased against Cal (a common belief on the forum). As I have learned--never attribute to conspiracy what can be explained by incompetence.
IMO, this incident should be resurrected every time a Cal fan raises the foolish notion that the refs are conspiring against the Bears.
I'm sure you'll disagree but I think there was an obvious bias against us when Dykes was here. Some of that stuff was inexplicable. By contrast, I haven't seen it really at all since Wilcox took over. If anything, some of the weirder calls on balance seem to be going our way. Why? I subscribe to the theory that refs are humans and Dykes flipping out continuously rubbed some folks the wrong way. By contrast I think they respect Wilcox and view his demeanor as more becoming and lining up with their theory on what a coach "should be".UrsaMajor said:
Unfortunately, this damages the theory that P12 refs are biased against Cal (a common belief on the forum). As I have learned--never attribute to conspiracy what can be explained by incompetence.
In order to be a valid critic of his performance, I don't need to be able to do a better job than he does. I only need to know about his responsibilities and whether he demonstrates competence while exercising those duties.burritos said:
Is refereeing an easy job to master? Does it pay well? Do most critics think they can do a better job?
Since there are five games this week, the conference needs one fewer ref than if there were a full slate of games.burritos said:
Is there a huge supply of qualified non working refs that need work? Go ahead and bench that ref and see if things improve.
Yes but you can control how you feel about it. Most people can't.71Bear said:In order to be a valid critic of his performance, I don't need to be able to do a better job than he does. I only need to know about his responsibilities and whether he demonstrates competence while exercising those duties.burritos said:
Is refereeing an easy job to master? Does it pay well? Do most critics think they can do a better job?
To suggest otherwise, would invalidate all critics from doing their job, whether it be those who review motion pictures, stage, television, books, etc., etc., etc.
In other words, I don't need to be Laurence Olivier to know when I am seeing a terrible actor on stage.
I do think that ref that looked like Jeffrey Tambor of Arrested Development hated us though. For real. He's the guy that kicked out Michael Lowe out of the Big Game first play from scrimmage. I knew we were doomed. I think he was also in the booth during the sequence when Rubenzer got into the end zone like 3 times only for it to be reversed every time in the Big Game. This is when cheatin for Furd to get optimal bowl game was at its height.71Bear said:I was thinking the same thing when I read the article. Anyone who has watched P12 football for any length of time knows that the refs are not biased. Their level of incompetence spans all teams all the time.UrsaMajor said:
Unfortunately, this damages the theory that P12 refs are biased against Cal (a common belief on the forum). As I have learned--never attribute to conspiracy what can be explained by incompetence.
IMO, this incident should be resurrected every time a Cal fan raises the foolish notion that the refs are conspiring against the Bears.
KoreAmBear said:I do think that ref that looked like Jeffrey Tambor of Arrested Development hated us though. For real. He's the guy that kicked out Michael Lowe out of the Big Game first play from scrimmage. I knew we were doomed. I think he was also in the booth during the sequence when Rubenzer got into the end zone like 3 times only for it to be reversed every time in the Big Game. This is when cheatin for Furd to get optimal bowl game was at its height.71Bear said:I was thinking the same thing when I read the article. Anyone who has watched P12 football for any length of time knows that the refs are not biased. Their level of incompetence spans all teams all the time.UrsaMajor said:
Unfortunately, this damages the theory that P12 refs are biased against Cal (a common belief on the forum). As I have learned--never attribute to conspiracy what can be explained by incompetence.
IMO, this incident should be resurrected every time a Cal fan raises the foolish notion that the refs are conspiring against the Bears.
If the conference *really* wanted to improve reffing quickly, they could dangle big money to lure in better refs from other parts of the country. If there really is a dearth of qualified, competent referees in the Pac12's geographic footprint, then throw money at the problem. Top refs will travel if they make it worth their while.burritos said:
Is there a huge supply of qualified non working refs that need work? Go ahead and bench that ref and see if things improve.
No... An exception isn't evidence.UrsaMajor said:
Unfortunately, this damages the theory that P12 refs are biased against Cal (a common belief on the forum). As I have learned--never attribute to conspiracy what can be explained by incompetence.
Weaver was guilty as charged. You cannot body slam guys in the modern game. Everyone knows that. Later in the game, he smartly released a guy out of bounds rather than take him down. It appears that he learned his lesson.LunchTime said:No... An exception isn't evidence.UrsaMajor said:
Unfortunately, this damages the theory that P12 refs are biased against Cal (a common belief on the forum). As I have learned--never attribute to conspiracy what can be explained by incompetence.
The Pac12 needs to give Cal about 20 more to balance the scales. This makes up for the PF against Weaver. That only balances the scales for one game.
71Bear said:Weaver was guilty as charged. You cannot body slam guys in the modern game. Everyone knows that. Later in the game, he smartly released a guy out of bounds rather than take him down. It appears that he learned his lesson.LunchTime said:No... An exception isn't evidence.UrsaMajor said:
Unfortunately, this damages the theory that P12 refs are biased against Cal (a common belief on the forum). As I have learned--never attribute to conspiracy what can be explained by incompetence.
The Pac12 needs to give Cal about 20 more to balance the scales. This makes up for the PF against Weaver. That only balances the scales for one game.
Personal fouls (unless for targeting) do not result in ejection. Unsportsmanlike conduct (2 or more) do result in ejection. Since he committed a non-targeting personal foul, he was not "sent off the field".LunchTime said:71Bear said:Weaver was guilty as charged. You cannot body slam guys in the modern game. Everyone knows that. Later in the game, he smartly released a guy out of bounds rather than take him down. It appears that he learned his lesson.LunchTime said:No... An exception isn't evidence.UrsaMajor said:
Unfortunately, this damages the theory that P12 refs are biased against Cal (a common belief on the forum). As I have learned--never attribute to conspiracy what can be explained by incompetence.
The Pac12 needs to give Cal about 20 more to balance the scales. This makes up for the PF against Weaver. That only balances the scales for one game.
I was mildly joking about the roughing, but it was a BS penalty, but sometimes gets called - I think if Weaver had a PF before that call, he doesn't get one on that call. I think if they don't call it there, they would on the late hit. Pulling up doesn't negate the hit on a tickytack penalty.
But no ref in the pac12 sends the best linebacker off the field on either of those plays.
He didn't body slam the qb. He did take him to the ground in the course of what was otherwise a legal hit - which can be called a penalty if you forcefully drive the qb into the ground. But it was borderline, as the announcers suggested - in fact the announcers both suggested it was a soft call.71Bear said:Weaver was guilty as charged. You cannot body slam guys in the modern game. Everyone knows that. Later in the game, he smartly released a guy out of bounds rather than take him down. It appears that he learned his lesson.LunchTime said:No... An exception isn't evidence.UrsaMajor said:
Unfortunately, this damages the theory that P12 refs are biased against Cal (a common belief on the forum). As I have learned--never attribute to conspiracy what can be explained by incompetence.
The Pac12 needs to give Cal about 20 more to balance the scales. This makes up for the PF against Weaver. That only balances the scales for one game.
Are there large pots of accessible unused money for this?BGGB2 said:If the conference *really* wanted to improve reffing quickly, they could dangle big money to lure in better refs from other parts of the country. If there really is a dearth of qualified, competent referees in the Pac12's geographic footprint, then throw money at the problem. Top refs will travel if they make it worth their while.burritos said:
Is there a huge supply of qualified non working refs that need work? Go ahead and bench that ref and see if things improve.
Yeah, I got PF vs Unsportsmanlike conflated. Either way the endzone hit on the WSU was BS. It easily was the same call as the late hit where he pulled up. Both could have easily been called. Neither should have been called.71Bear said:Personal fouls (unless for targeting) do not result in ejection. Unsportsmanlike conduct (2 or more) do result in ejection. Since he committed a non-targeting personal foul, he was not "sent off the field".LunchTime said:71Bear said:Weaver was guilty as charged. You cannot body slam guys in the modern game. Everyone knows that. Later in the game, he smartly released a guy out of bounds rather than take him down. It appears that he learned his lesson.LunchTime said:No... An exception isn't evidence.UrsaMajor said:
Unfortunately, this damages the theory that P12 refs are biased against Cal (a common belief on the forum). As I have learned--never attribute to conspiracy what can be explained by incompetence.
The Pac12 needs to give Cal about 20 more to balance the scales. This makes up for the PF against Weaver. That only balances the scales for one game.
I was mildly joking about the roughing, but it was a BS penalty, but sometimes gets called - I think if Weaver had a PF before that call, he doesn't get one on that call. I think if they don't call it there, they would on the late hit. Pulling up doesn't negate the hit on a tickytack penalty.
But no ref in the pac12 sends the best linebacker off the field on either of those plays.
Are we talking about the same play? I was referencing the late hit on the QB followed later by a play out of bounds that did not result in a penalty.
According to the 'inference' that the better field position for WSU would have 'probably' given them a TD instead of a field goal - well OKHungryCalBear said:
I just rewatched the game. Better ref would not change the outcome but yeah that entire staff needs to be fired.