picked to finish 12th, win pac 12 tournament and go to the dance

Colorado, best FT shooting team in last 25 years, shoot 68% from the line and lose by 1

Congratulations to the Beavers! They played with a lot of heart to win the Pac-12 tourney.

OSU is 17-12 and now #29 in Sagarin's Recent.

calumnus said:

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OSU is 17-12 and now #29 in Sagarin's Recent.

---

and coach tinkle's seat was getting warm after they didn't make the tournament last year

HoopDreams said:

---

calumnus said:

---

OSU is 17-12 and now #29 in Sagarin's Recent.

---

and coach tinkle's seat was getting warm after they didn't make the tournament last year

---

Grew up in Wisconsin and Washington. Played under Monty at Montana, successful head coach at Montana. Middle of conference at OSU. Team plays efficiently like a Monty team, issue is recruiting.

HoopDreams said:

---

picked to finish 12th, win pac 12 tournament and go to the dance

Colorado, best FT shooting team in last 25 years, shoot 68% from the line and lose by 1

---

The Beavers were fun to watch in this tournament. I remember the eye-opening game Alatushe had against us way back in the first (non-conference) game we played against the Beavers. I thought he was a budding star. But then I didn't hear much about him, including in the subsequent games against us. But he was fantastic again in this tournament.

Happy for OSU that their patience with Tinkle paid off. They are a fun team to watch. That free throw shooting for Colorado was tough. Is it possible that the Beavers just took UCLA's spot from them?

drizzlybear said:

---

HoopDreams said:

---

picked to finish 12th, win pac 12 tournament and go to the dance

Colorado, best FT shooting team in last 25 years, shoot 68% from the line and lose by 1

---

The Beavers were fun to watch in this tournament. I remember the eye-opening game Alatushe had against us way back in the first (non-conference) game we played against the Beavers. I thought he was a budding star. But then I didn't hear much about him, including in the subsequent games against us. But he was fantastic again in this tournament.

Happy for OSU that their patience with Tinkle paid off. They are a fun team to watch. That free throw shooting for Colorado was tough. Is it possible that the Beavers just took UCLA's spot from them?

---

UCLA is on the bubble, but I don't think there is a quota by conference. To the extent teams that wouldn't be in otherwise get auto bids it takes away slots for teams like them. They should be in based on Ken Pom and Sagarin, but we will see. He

drizzlybear said:

---

HoopDreams said:

---

picked to finish 12th, win pac 12 tournament and go to the dance

Colorado, best FT shooting team in last 25 years, shoot 68% from the line and lose by 1

---

The Beavers were fun to watch in this tournament. I remember the eye-opening game Alatushe had against us way back in the first (non-conference) game we played against the Beavers. I thought he was a budding star. But then I didn't hear much about him, including in the subsequent games against us. But he was fantastic again in this tournament.

Happy for OSU that their patience with Tinkle paid off. They are a fun team to watch. That free throw shooting for Colorado was tough. Is it possible that the Beavers just took UCLA's spot from them?

---

Tinkle and OSU made the tourney in his second year after finishing 6th in conference, much like this season. Unless there's a run in the tourney, this isn't really some major pay off IMO.

The Buffs are dirty players and whiners and quitters from the top down. Congrats Beavers!

I would lime to see Cal win the tournament when ranked 12th.

Don't ruin my bitter narrative with the facts!

sluggo said:

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calumnus said:

---

HoopDreams said:

---

calumnus said:

---

OSU is 17-12 and now #29 in Sagarin's Recent.

---

and coach tinkle's seat was getting warm after they didn't make the tournament last year

---

Grew up in Wisconsin and Washington. Played under Monty at Montana, successful head coach at Montana. Middle of conference at OSU. Team plays efficiently like a Monty team, issue is recruiting.

---

Tinkle is the type of competent coach I want at Cal. They maximize their talent.

---

Edited: I had Boyle in my mind.

I'm pretty sure that until late this season there was a sizable portion of the OSU fan base (not a particularly demanding fan base) that had become convinced Tinkle could not be that kind of coach after recently failing to reach success with some decent personnel (and he had run out of sons to recruit).

I like Boyle, and hopefully Fox can be that kind of coach. Or, if he's not, hopefully Fox can be the kind of coach that resurrects the program from total morbidity to a level where Cal is better positioned to attract a coach like Boyle.

NathanAllen said:

---

sluggo said:

---

drizzlybear said:

---

sluggo said:

---

calumnus said:

---

HoopDreams said:

---

calumnus said:

---

OSU is 17-12 and now #29 in Sagarin's Recent.

---

and coach tinkle's seat was getting warm after they didn't make the tournament last year

---

Grew up in Wisconsin and Washington. Played under Monty at Montana, successful head coach at Montana. Middle of conference at OSU. Team plays efficiently like a Monty team, issue is recruiting.

---

Tinkle is the type of competent coach I want at Cal. They maximize their talent.

---

Edited: I had Boyle in my mind.

I'm pretty sure that until late this season there was a sizable portion of the OSU fan base (not a particularly demanding fan base) that had become convinced Tinkle could not be that kind of coach after failing to reach success with some decent personnel (and he had run out of sons to recruit).

I like Boyle, and hopefully Fox can be that kind of coach. Or, if he's not, hopefully Fox can be the kind of coach that resurrects the program from total morbidity to a level where Cal is better positioned to attract a coach like Boyle.

---

Boyle is good too. My standards are not so high. If Fox could be like Tinkle or Boyle we would have already seen it. To attract a coach like Boyle or Tinkle you write a check, it is not complicated. But you need someone running the hiring process who knows what they are doing.

---

I really don't want this thread to devolve into another fire Fox/Knowlton thread because that's not happening in the near future. But I do want to point out Boyle makes about $100K more than Fox. So technically Cal has already written a check pretty similar to what Boyle is making (Tinkle makes about $600K more than Fox).

---

I was addressing whether Cal had to be somehow good enough to attract a coach like Boyle or Tinkle. Either could have been had when they were looking for a break, as could plenty of up and coming coaches today. They would be more expensive now that they are more established. Overall, I think Cal pays competitively, you could even say generously. They just give the money to the wrong people.

sluggo said:

---

drizzlybear said:

---

sluggo said:

---

calumnus said:

---

HoopDreams said:

---

calumnus said:

---

OSU is 17-12 and now #29 in Sagarin's Recent.

---

and coach tinkle's seat was getting warm after they didn't make the tournament last year

---

Grew up in Wisconsin and Washington. Played under Monty at Montana, successful head coach at Montana. Middle of conference at OSU. Team plays efficiently like a Monty team, issue is recruiting.

---

Tinkle is the type of competent coach I want at Cal. They maximize their talent.

---

Edited: I had Boyle in my mind.

I'm pretty sure that until late this season there was a sizable portion of the OSU fan base (not a particularly demanding fan base) that had become convinced Tinkle could not be that kind of coach after failing to reach success with some decent personnel (and he had run out of sons to recruit).

I like Boyle, and hopefully Fox can be that kind of coach. Or, if he's not, hopefully Fox can be the kind of coach that resurrects the program from total morbidity to a level where Cal is better positioned to attract a coach like Boyle.

---

Boyle is good too. My standards are not so high. If Fox could be like Tinkle or Boyle we would have already seen it. To attract a coach like Boyle or Tinkle you write a check, it is not complicated. But you need someone running the hiring process who knows what they are doing.

---

I think those who have already decided "we would have seen it by now" wrt Fox at this point, would have gotten rid of Tinkle at OSU a long time ago.

Just going off basic W-L info, Tinkle has had only one winning conference season (10-8) in his seven years at OSU. Yes, they went to the ncaa tournament in his second year, but did so with a 9-9 conference record and had a 19-13 record overall (Fox nearly achieved that same conference record right away in his first year at Cal). In year 3 Tinkle's Beavers plummeted to 1-17; that's Wyking Jones territory, and it was Tinkle's THIRD season. And Tinkle still hasn't had a winning conference record since then.

Meanwhile, you might disagree with me that Fox showed real promise his first year at Cal, but i am certainly not alone. Jon Wilner (not known for effusive praise of Cal athletics) voted Fox as Pac12 Coach of the Year last year. Yes, Year 2 was a tough year for Fox and Cal, but even for those of you not inclined to see the impact of Covid (and injury) on the development of this year's Cal team, as bad as this rough year was for Cal, Fox's Year 2 wasn't nearly as bad as Tinkle's third year at OSU.

One reason I'm particularly happy for Tinkle and OSU's success this season is because in this era of instant-gratification, what-have-you-done-for-me-lately fan bases, OSU's story is one of reasonable patience and commitment bearing fruit.

drizzlybear said:

---

sluggo said:

---

drizzlybear said:

---

sluggo said:

---

calumnus said:

---

HoopDreams said:

---

calumnus said:

---

OSU is 17-12 and now #29 in Sagarin's Recent.

---

and coach tinkle's seat was getting warm after they didn't make the tournament last year

---

Grew up in Wisconsin and Washington. Played under Monty at Montana, successful head coach at Montana. Middle of conference at OSU. Team plays efficiently like a Monty team, issue is recruiting.

---

Tinkle is the type of competent coach I want at Cal. They maximize their talent.

---

Edited: I had Boyle in my mind.

I'm pretty sure that until late this season there was a sizable portion of the OSU fan base (not a particularly demanding fan base) that had become convinced Tinkle could not be that kind of coach after failing to reach success with some decent personnel (and he had run out of sons to recruit).

I like Boyle, and hopefully Fox can be that kind of coach. Or, if he's not, hopefully Fox can be the kind of coach that resurrects the program from total morbidity to a level where Cal is better positioned to attract a coach like Boyle.

---

Boyle is good too. My standards are not so high. If Fox could be like Tinkle or Boyle we would have already seen it. To attract a coach like Boyle or Tinkle you write a check, it is not complicated. But you need someone running the hiring process who knows what they are doing.

---

I think those who have already decided "we would have seen it by now" wrt Fox at this point, would have gotten rid of Tinkle at OSU a long time ago.

Just going off basic W-L info, Tinkle has had only one winning conference season (10-8) in his seven years at OSU. Yes, they went to the ncaa tournament in his second year, but did so with a 9-9 conference record and had a 19-13 record overall (Fox nearly achieved that same conference record right away in his first year at Cal). In year 3 Tinkle's Beavers plummeted to 1-17; that's Wyking Jones territory, and it was Tinkle's THIRD season. And Tinkle still hasn't had a winning conference record since then.

Meanwhile, Mark Fox was voted Pac12 coach of the year by Jon Wilner (not known for effusive praise of Cal athletics) after Fox's Year 1. Year 2 was a tough year for Fox and Cal, but even for those not inclined to see the impact of Covid (and injury) on the development of this year's Cal team, as bad as this rough year was for Cal, it wasn't nearly as bad as Tinkle's third year at OSU.

---

Not me. Always thought they played well given their talent. I realize that some can't see past W-L, which is NOT my complaint with Fox.

Cal has the best weather in the world, is the best public university in the world and is in an interesting urban environment. OSU is in Corvallis. I judge the two places and their coaches differently.

sluggo said:

---

drizzlybear said:

---

sluggo said:

---

drizzlybear said:

---

sluggo said:

---

calumnus said:

---

HoopDreams said:

---

calumnus said:

---

OSU is 17-12 and now #29 in Sagarin's Recent.

---

and coach tinkle's seat was getting warm after they didn't make the tournament last year

---

Grew up in Wisconsin and Washington. Played under Monty at Montana, successful head coach at Montana. Middle of conference at OSU. Team plays efficiently like a Monty team, issue is recruiting.

---

Tinkle is the type of competent coach I want at Cal. They maximize their talent.

---

Edited: I had Boyle in my mind.

I'm pretty sure that until late this season there was a sizable portion of the OSU fan base (not a particularly demanding fan base) that had become convinced Tinkle could not be that kind of coach after failing to reach success with some decent personnel (and he had run out of sons to recruit).

I like Boyle, and hopefully Fox can be that kind of coach. Or, if he's not, hopefully Fox can be the kind of coach that resurrects the program from total morbidity to a level where Cal is better positioned to attract a coach like Boyle.

---

Boyle is good too. My standards are not so high. If Fox could be like Tinkle or Boyle we would have already seen it. To attract a coach like Boyle or Tinkle you write a check, it is not complicated. But you need someone running the hiring process who knows what they are doing.

---

I think those who have already decided "we would have seen it by now" wrt Fox at this point, would have gotten rid of Tinkle at OSU a long time ago.

Just going off basic W-L info, Tinkle has had only one winning conference season (10-8) in his seven years at OSU. Yes, they went to the ncaa tournament in his second year, but did so with a 9-9 conference record and had a 19-13 record overall (Fox nearly achieved that same conference record right away in his first year at Cal). In year 3 Tinkle's Beavers plummeted to 1-17; that's Wyking Jones territory, and it was Tinkle's THIRD season. And Tinkle still hasn't had a winning conference record since then.

Meanwhile, Mark Fox was voted Pac12 coach of the year by Jon Wilner (not known for effusive praise of Cal athletics) after Fox's Year 1. Year 2 was a tough year for Fox and Cal, but even for those not inclined to see the impact of Covid (and injury) on the development of this year's Cal team, as bad as this rough year was for Cal, it wasn't nearly as bad as Tinkle's third year at OSU.

---

Not me. Always thought they played well given their talent. I realize that some can't see past W-L, which is NOT my complaint with Fox.

Cal has the best weather in the world, is the best public university in the world and is in an interesting urban environment. OSU is in Corvallis. I judge the two places and their coaches differently.

---

Yeah, obviously WAY differently.

Patrick Ewing became the first person to win the Big East championship as both a player and a coach in Georgetown's 73-48 win over Creighton" Sports Illustrated

NathanAllen said:

---

sluggo said:

---

NathanAllen said:

---

sluggo said:

---

drizzlybear said:

---

sluggo said:

---

calumnus said:

---

HoopDreams said:

---

calumnus said:

---

OSU is 17-12 and now #29 in Sagarin's Recent.

---

and coach tinkle's seat was getting warm after they didn't make the tournament last year

---

Grew up in Wisconsin and Washington. Played under Monty at Montana, successful head coach at Montana. Middle of conference at OSU. Team plays efficiently like a Monty team, issue is recruiting.

---

Tinkle is the type of competent coach I want at Cal. They maximize their talent.

---

Edited: I had Boyle in my mind.

I'm pretty sure that until late this season there was a sizable portion of the OSU fan base (not a particularly demanding fan base) that had become convinced Tinkle could not be that kind of coach after failing to reach success with some decent personnel (and he had run out of sons to recruit).

I like Boyle, and hopefully Fox can be that kind of coach. Or, if he's not, hopefully Fox can be the kind of coach that resurrects the program from total morbidity to a level where Cal is better positioned to attract a coach like Boyle.

---

Boyle is good too. My standards are not so high. If Fox could be like Tinkle or Boyle we would have already seen it. To attract a coach like Boyle or Tinkle you write a check, it is not complicated. But you need someone running the hiring process who knows what they are doing.

---

I really don't want this thread to devolve into another fire Fox/Knowlton thread because that's not happening in the near future. But I do want to point out Boyle makes about $100K more than Fox. So technically Cal has already written a check pretty similar to what Boyle is making (Tinkle makes about $600K more than Fox).

---

I was addressing whether Cal had to be somehow good enough to attract a coach like Boyle or Tinkle. Either could have been had when they were looking for a break, as could plenty of up and coming coaches today. They would be more expensive now that they are more established. Overall, I think Cal pays competitively, you could even say generously. They just give the money to the wrong people.

---

Not really. Fox's salary is ranked 66th in the nation and 10th in the conference (ahead of Kyle Smith at Wazzu, but probably actually 11th because we don't know Haase's actual salary). I'm not saying Cal should pay more or less, just saying, according to what other power conference coaches make, Cal is not paying competitively. Only Smith and Travis Steele at Xavier make less than Fox while coaching in a hoops power conference.

Here's the database, that was updated five days ago: https://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/salaries/mens-basketball/coach/

---

I mean for who they are getting. 1 million for WJ and 1.5 million for Fox is generous.

I found this story on Cuonzo Martin. Said he was in the middle of Pac12 coaches. https://www.mercurynews.com/2016/10/25/cal-basketball-coach-cuonzo-martin-receives-contract-extension/#:~:text=Cal%20basketball%20coach%20Cuonzo%20Martin%20has%20received%20a%20two%2Dyear,season%2C%20his%20second%20in%20Berkeley.

bearister said:

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Patrick Ewing became the first person to win the Big East championship as both a player and a coach in Georgetown's 73-48 win over Creighton" Sports Illustrated

---

interesting, and he did this after his two best players transferred out, and I think one or two other players

NathanAllen said:

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sluggo said:

---

drizzlybear said:

---

sluggo said:

---

calumnus said:

---

HoopDreams said:

---

calumnus said:

---

OSU is 17-12 and now #29 in Sagarin's Recent.

---

and coach tinkle's seat was getting warm after they didn't make the tournament last year

---

Grew up in Wisconsin and Washington. Played under Monty at Montana, successful head coach at Montana. Middle of conference at OSU. Team plays efficiently like a Monty team, issue is recruiting.

---

Tinkle is the type of competent coach I want at Cal. They maximize their talent.

---

Edited: I had Boyle in my mind.

I'm pretty sure that until late this season there was a sizable portion of the OSU fan base (not a particularly demanding fan base) that had become convinced Tinkle could not be that kind of coach after failing to reach success with some decent personnel (and he had run out of sons to recruit).

I like Boyle, and hopefully Fox can be that kind of coach. Or, if he's not, hopefully Fox can be the kind of coach that resurrects the program from total morbidity to a level where Cal is better positioned to attract a coach like Boyle.

---

Boyle is good too. My standards are not so high. If Fox could be like Tinkle or Boyle we would have already seen it. To attract a coach like Boyle or Tinkle you write a check, it is not complicated. But you need someone running the hiring process who knows what they are doing.

---

I really don't want this thread to devolve into another fire Fox/Knowlton thread because that's not happening in the near future. But I do want to point out Boyle makes about $100K more than Fox. So technically Cal has already written a check pretty similar to what Boyle is making (Tinkle makes about $600K more than Fox).

---

... too late, every thread on this board devolves into another fire Fox/Knowlen thread ...

NathanAllen said:

---

sluggo said:

---

NathanAllen said:

---

sluggo said:

---

NathanAllen said:

---

sluggo said:

---

drizzlybear said:

---

sluggo said:

---

calumnus said:

---

HoopDreams said:

---

calumnus said:

---

OSU is 17-12 and now #29 in Sagarin's Recent.

---

and coach tinkle's seat was getting warm after they didn't make the tournament last year

---

Grew up in Wisconsin and Washington. Played under Monty at Montana, successful head coach at Montana. Middle of conference at OSU. Team plays efficiently like a Monty team, issue is recruiting.

---

Tinkle is the type of competent coach I want at Cal. They maximize their talent.

---

Edited: I had Boyle in my mind.

I'm pretty sure that until late this season there was a sizable portion of the OSU fan base (not a particularly demanding fan base) that had become convinced Tinkle could not be that kind of coach after failing to reach success with some decent personnel (and he had run out of sons to recruit).

I like Boyle, and hopefully Fox can be that kind of coach. Or, if he's not, hopefully Fox can be the kind of coach that resurrects the program from total morbidity to a level where Cal is better positioned to attract a coach like Boyle.

---

Boyle is good too. My standards are not so high. If Fox could be like Tinkle or Boyle we would have already seen it. To attract a coach like Boyle or Tinkle you write a check, it is not complicated. But you need someone running the hiring process who knows what they are doing.

---

I really don't want this thread to devolve into another fire Fox/Knowlton thread because that's not happening in the near future. But I do want to point out Boyle makes about $100K more than Fox. So technically Cal has already written a check pretty similar to what Boyle is making (Tinkle makes about $600K more than Fox).

---

I was addressing whether Cal had to be somehow good enough to attract a coach like Boyle or Tinkle. Either could have been had when they were looking for a break, as could plenty of up and coming coaches today. They would be more expensive now that they are more established. Overall, I think Cal pays competitively, you could even say generously. They just give the money to the wrong people.

---

Not really. Fox's salary is ranked 66th in the nation and 10th in the conference (ahead of Kyle Smith at Wazzu, but probably actually 11th because we don't know Haase's actual salary). I'm not saying Cal should pay more or less, just saying, according to what other power conference coaches make, Cal is not paying competitively. Only Smith and Travis Steele at Xavier make less than Fox while coaching in a hoops power conference.

Here's the database, that was updated five days ago: https://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/salaries/mens-basketball/coach/

---

I mean for who they are getting. 1 million for WJ and 1.5 million for Fox is generous.

I found this story on Cuonzo Martin. Said he was in the middle of Pac12 coaches. https://www.mercurynews.com/2016/10/25/cal-basketball-coach-cuonzo-martin-receives-contract-extension/#:~:text=Cal%20basketball%20coach%20Cuonzo%20Martin%20has%20received%20a%20two%2Dyear,season%2C%20his%20second%20in%20Berkeley.

---

Yeah, got it. I think we're talking about different things. As the USA Today database shows, Cal is definitely on the lowest end of the spectrum when it comes to paying coaches compared to its peers. Of course, compared to the 350+ D1 basketball coaches, Cal is very competitive in pay.

As for $1.5M for Fox being generous, yeah, I'm sure many arguments could be made that is too much based on his two-year record at Cal or whatever. I find it interesting the coach directly ahead of him in that salary database is Mike Boynton at Oklahoma State, who I'm sure will get a new contract after what he's done this season.. There's kind of two extremes in terms of on-court success this year right next to each other in salaries (although $1.3+M goes a lot further in Stillwater than Berkeley.

Thanks for sharing that article about Martin. It's a good barometer to see how coaching salaries have changed in a short amount of time in the conference. So, in 2016, $1.84M gets you middle of the pack in the conference. In 2021, that puts you ninth (or 10th depending on what Stanford is paying Haase), just ahead of Boyle.

Interesting to see Coach K at Utah is now the highest-paid coach in the league.

---

At least we can agree on what you wrote here. According to the database 2-3 million is the standard range for power conference coaches. If you add Fox + WJ's buyout ... just Cal being Cal.

NathanAllen said:

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drizzlybear said:

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HoopDreams said:

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picked to finish 12th, win pac 12 tournament and go to the dance

Colorado, best FT shooting team in last 25 years, shoot 68% from the line and lose by 1

---

The Beavers were fun to watch in this tournament. I remember the eye-opening game Alatushe had against us way back in the first (non-conference) game we played against the Beavers. I thought he was a budding star. But then I didn't hear much about him, including in the subsequent games against us. But he was fantastic again in this tournament.

Happy for OSU that their patience with Tinkle paid off. They are a fun team to watch. That free throw shooting for Colorado was tough. Is it possible that the Beavers just took UCLA's spot from them?

---

OSU and Georgetown knocked two teams off the bubble yesterday. I still think UCLA gets in, but it wasn't a good conference tournament season for bubble teams.

---

OSU helped the conference by winning. Now 5 teams in the field instead of 4.

NathanAllen said:

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sycasey said:

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NathanAllen said:

---

drizzlybear said:

---

HoopDreams said:

---

picked to finish 12th, win pac 12 tournament and go to the dance

Colorado, best FT shooting team in last 25 years, shoot 68% from the line and lose by 1

---

The Beavers were fun to watch in this tournament. I remember the eye-opening game Alatushe had against us way back in the first (non-conference) game we played against the Beavers. I thought he was a budding star. But then I didn't hear much about him, including in the subsequent games against us. But he was fantastic again in this tournament.

Happy for OSU that their patience with Tinkle paid off. They are a fun team to watch. That free throw shooting for Colorado was tough. Is it possible that the Beavers just took UCLA's spot from them?

---

OSU and Georgetown knocked two teams off the bubble yesterday. I still think UCLA gets in, but it wasn't a good conference tournament season for bubble teams.

---

OSU helped the conference by winning. Now 5 teams in the field instead of 4.

---

Yes and no. On one hand, having five teams looks better than four (although, UCLA almost got knocked out and is in one of the play-in games). But what looks better than having more teams in is the teams that are in winning. If OSU gets blown out by Tennessee in the first round, I'm not sure it helps the conference. But if OSU gets by Tennessee, then, yeah, it looks good for the Pac-12, which is widely considered the worst of the power conferences right now.

---

More teams in means more chances to advance. All you can ask for at this stage.

sycasey said:

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NathanAllen said:

---

sycasey said:

---

NathanAllen said:

---

drizzlybear said:

---

HoopDreams said:

---

picked to finish 12th, win pac 12 tournament and go to the dance

Colorado, best FT shooting team in last 25 years, shoot 68% from the line and lose by 1

---

The Beavers were fun to watch in this tournament. I remember the eye-opening game Alatushe had against us way back in the first (non-conference) game we played against the Beavers. I thought he was a budding star. But then I didn't hear much about him, including in the subsequent games against us. But he was fantastic again in this tournament.

Happy for OSU that their patience with Tinkle paid off. They are a fun team to watch. That free throw shooting for Colorado was tough. Is it possible that the Beavers just took UCLA's spot from them?

---

OSU and Georgetown knocked two teams off the bubble yesterday. I still think UCLA gets in, but it wasn't a good conference tournament season for bubble teams.

---

OSU helped the conference by winning. Now 5 teams in the field instead of 4.

---

Yes and no. On one hand, having five teams looks better than four (although, UCLA almost got knocked out and is in one of the play-in games). But what looks better than having more teams in is the teams that are in winning. If OSU gets blown out by Tennessee in the first round, I'm not sure it helps the conference. But if OSU gets by Tennessee, then, yeah, it looks good for the Pac-12, which is widely considered the worst of the power conferences right now.

---

More teams in means more chances to advance. All you can ask for at this stage.

---

I feel like this post aged well.

drizzlybear said:

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sluggo said:

---

drizzlybear said:

---

sluggo said:

---

calumnus said:

---

HoopDreams said:

---

calumnus said:

---

OSU is 17-12 and now #29 in Sagarin's Recent.

---

and coach tinkle's seat was getting warm after they didn't make the tournament last year

---

Grew up in Wisconsin and Washington. Played under Monty at Montana, successful head coach at Montana. Middle of conference at OSU. Team plays efficiently like a Monty team, issue is recruiting.

---

Tinkle is the type of competent coach I want at Cal. They maximize their talent.

---

Edited: I had Boyle in my mind.

I'm pretty sure that until late this season there was a sizable portion of the OSU fan base (not a particularly demanding fan base) that had become convinced Tinkle could not be that kind of coach after failing to reach success with some decent personnel (and he had run out of sons to recruit).

I like Boyle, and hopefully Fox can be that kind of coach. Or, if he's not, hopefully Fox can be the kind of coach that resurrects the program from total morbidity to a level where Cal is better positioned to attract a coach like Boyle.

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Boyle is good too. My standards are not so high. If Fox could be like Tinkle or Boyle we would have already seen it. To attract a coach like Boyle or Tinkle you write a check, it is not complicated. But you need someone running the hiring process who knows what they are doing.

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I think those who have already decided "we would have seen it by now" wrt Fox at this point, would have gotten rid of Tinkle at OSU a long time ago.

Just going off basic W-L info, Tinkle has had only one winning conference season (10-8) in his seven years at OSU. Yes, they went to the ncaa tournament in his second year, but did so with a 9-9 conference record and had a 19-13 record overall (Fox nearly achieved that same conference record right away in his first year at Cal). In year 3 Tinkle's Beavers plummeted to 1-17; that's Wyking Jones territory, and it was Tinkle's THIRD season. And Tinkle still hasn't had a winning conference record since then.

Meanwhile, you might disagree with me that Fox showed real promise his first year at Cal, but i am certainly not alone. Jon Wilner (not known for effusive praise of Cal athletics) voted Fox as Pac12 Coach of the Year last year. Yes, Year 2 was a tough year for Fox and Cal, but even for those of you not inclined to see the impact of Covid (and injury) on the development of this year's Cal team, as bad as this rough year was for Cal, Fox's Year 2 wasn't nearly as bad as Tinkle's third year at OSU.

One reason I'm particularly happy for Tinkle and OSU's success this season is because in this era of instant-gratification, what-have-you-done-for-me-lately fan bases, OSU's story is one of reasonable patience and commitment bearing fruit.

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No. OSU hadn't been to the tournament in 26 Y E A R S before Tinkle did it in his 2nd season. This is all the counter argument you need. At OSU Tinkle did show what he could do right away. For a team who hadn't gone to the tourney in nearly three decades, making it in year 2 is about as close as you can get to instant gratification in any era. If anything, he has now shown he was able to build on his [very early] historic success at OSU.

dang, osu playing in the elite 8.

I like their chance of beating houston.