J Kidd Back in the Saddle Again

7,189 Views | 58 Replies | Last: 2 yr ago by calumnus
calumnus
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KoreAmBear said:

mbBear said:

BearForce2 said:

calumnus said:

BearForce2 said:


Congratulations to Jason Kidd for taking the Mavericks to the 2022 Western Conference Finals by beating the number one seed Phoenix Suns in seven games.


And to think, in 2019 when we fired Wyking Jones, Jason Kidd expressed interest in coaching at Cal ("the only college job I am interested in") and Knowlton hired Mark Fox.


It could have been beautiful.
He didn't hire Fox over Kidd. There wasn't that option. Happy for Jason, seeing he has had ups and downs in the NBA...
I'm pretty sure he didn't even try. We wrapped up this coaching search in like a couple of weeks. Who knew how lucky we were to have such a high caliber coach who took a year off? Actually with Monty we really were lucky. With our currently guy, not so much.


Less than a week between reversing course and announcing Jones fired, then announcing Fox hired. Knowlton said he only interviewed two candidates (Travis and Fox). Let the search firm do the heavy lifting. Said he chose Fox over Travis because he "felt more comfortable around him" the could "relate" (affinity hire). He interviewed Travis the Monday after his return from the NCAA Tournament and said the unemployed Fox had been "better prepared" for the interview.

Kidd was between jobs and in an interview said he wanted to return to being a head coach and "Cal was the only college job (he) was interested in." There was some excitement and debate about it on this board. Fox was announced soon after to the excitement of no one. It was clear, Knowlton never followed up on the Kidd overture. Kidd became an assistant coach for the Lakers.

Knowlton/Fox apologists have since said Fox is the only coach that would take our $millions.
Dgoldnbaer
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Am elated for Jason & his success coaching the Mavs! We've never had a better basketball player. Imagine the athletes we'd be watching at Haas if Knowlton pursued him 3 years ago! I would certainly still have my season tix.
stu
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Jason Kidd singing to the Cal Athletic Department:
BearSD
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calumnus said:




Less than a week between reversing course and announcing Jones fired, then announcing Fox hired. Knowlton said he only interviewed two candidates (Travis and Fox). Let the search firm do the heavy lifting. Said he chose Fox over Travis because he "felt more comfortable around him" the could "relate" (affinity hire). He interviewed Travis the Monday after his return from the NCAA Tournament and said the unemployed Fox had been "better prepared" for the interview.
Lemme guess.... Knowlton was about as prepared for his interview with Travis DeCuire as John Elway was for the Broncos' interview with Brian Flores.
calumnus
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BearSD said:

calumnus said:




Less than a week between reversing course and announcing Jones fired, then announcing Fox hired. Knowlton said he only interviewed two candidates (Travis and Fox). Let the search firm do the heavy lifting. Said he chose Fox over Travis because he "felt more comfortable around him" the could "relate" (affinity hire). He interviewed Travis the Monday after his return from the NCAA Tournament and said the unemployed Fox had been "better prepared" for the interview.
Lemme guess.... Knowlton was about as prepared for his interview with Travis DeCuire as John Elway was for the Broncos' interview with Brian Flores.


Knowlton said that Fox (who had plenty of time to prepare) was "better prepared" for the interview than DeCuire (who had just returned that morning from taking his team the NCAA Tournament and had no time to prepare).
upsetof86
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HoopDreams said:

bearister said:

OneTopOneChickenApple said:

Oh man, the old Harmon looked so good and with character. I wished I attended a game there.


I got to play intramural games there as an undergrad (and take exams and see Tower of Power). In '74 broke my foot landing on a guy's foot when coming down with a rebound. The next day I got an x ray at Cowell and the doc told me it was a bad sprain. A week later I got a postcard from Cowell stating that they misread the x ray and that my foot was broken. Oops!


Pickup game rebounds are overrated

Almost every basketball injury I've had is during rebounding, either by landing on someone's foot or getting an elbow in the face by some big dude

Now if the ball bounces twice on the court I'll get a rebound as I no longer go hard after a rebound




Blown right achilles coming down with a rebound. Worst injury Ive experienced recovery time wise.
concordtom
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AunBear89 said:

bearister said:

OneTopOneChickenApple said:

Oh man, the old Harmon looked so good and with character. I wished I attended a game there.


I got to play intramural games there as an undergrad (and take exams and see Tower of Power). In '74 broke my foot landing on a guy's foot when coming down with a rebound. The next day I got an x ray at Cowell and the doc told me it was a bad sprain. A week later I got a postcard from Cowell stating that they misread the x ray and that my foot was broken. Oops!


And a personal injury lawyer was born

"Hurt in an accident? And it wasn't your fault? Call 1-800- BEARISTER to get the relief you deserve!"


Back to Harmon…. Here's the capacity of Harmon/Haas. We'd be better off having a full house of 6500 today, rather than a sporadic 4k, no?

Capacity
11,858 (2015present)
11,877 (20032015)
11,892 (20022003)
12,300 (19992002)
6,578 (19881997)
6,660 (19811988)
7,200 (19331981)

….missing both Harmon AND Bearister.
concordtom
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BI article on mens basketball attendance

Had dropped precipitously below 5k

https://bearinsider.com/s/2172/mens-hoops-attendance-slides-for-fourth-straight-season

And Calbears.com reports this past season as 4700:

ATTENDANCE - home - away
TOT 85430 66453
AVG 18-4,746 11-6,041
concordtom
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Jason Kidd vs Chris Paul…. Who would YOU take?

Answer before looking up the stats:
https://www.landofbasketball.com/player_comparison/jason_kidd_vs_chris_paul.htm

And you might like this article about shade between the two:

https://www.yardbarker.com/nba/articles/amp/jason_kidd_mocked_chris_paul_after_game_7_for_the_10_oclock_curfew_he_gave_his_suns_teammates_curfew_10_oclock/s1_16751_37504460

mbBear
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KoreAmBear said:

mbBear said:

BearForce2 said:

calumnus said:

BearForce2 said:


Congratulations to Jason Kidd for taking the Mavericks to the 2022 Western Conference Finals by beating the number one seed Phoenix Suns in seven games.


And to think, in 2019 when we fired Wyking Jones, Jason Kidd expressed interest in coaching at Cal ("the only college job I am interested in") and Knowlton hired Mark Fox.


It could have been beautiful.
He didn't hire Fox over Kidd. There wasn't that option. Happy for Jason, seeing he has had ups and downs in the NBA...
I'm pretty sure he didn't even try. We wrapped up this coaching search in like a couple of weeks. Who knew how lucky we were to have such a high caliber coach who took a year off? Actually with Monty we really were lucky. With our currently guy, not so much.
I'm pretty sure he did.
Dgoldnbaer
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Idea ... As far fetched as it seems ... How 'bout Knowlton pursue Kidd now, at end of Jason's season? I'm not saying Kidd will say "Yes" to coaching the Bears but there's ALWAYS the 'what if' - that being the case, he should definitely pursue him. Worst he'll get is a "No." And IF he got " Yes"???? !!!!!! Haas would be packed regularly!
BC Calfan
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I believe Kidd is getting paid $8.5 million a year from the Mavs. I don't think he's going anywhere for a while.

The only possible scenario I see: He gets that salary for the next 5 years or so, builds a nice nest egg, then wins a championship. With his personal NBA coaching goals accomplished, maybe he'd be willing to take a drastic pay cut to run our program.
Civil Bear
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BC Calfan said:

I believe Kidd is getting paid $8.5 million a year from the Mavs. I don't think he's going anywhere for a while.

The only possible scenario I see: He gets that salary for the next 5 years or so, builds a nice nest egg, then wins a championship. With his personal NBA coaching goals accomplished, maybe he'd be willing to take a drastic pay cut to run our program.
...or Cal could just win the National Championship with Fox.
ducky23
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Dgoldnbaer said:

Idea ... As far fetched as it seems ... How 'bout Knowlton pursue Kidd now, at end of Jason's season? I'm not saying Kidd will say "Yes" to coaching the Bears but there's ALWAYS the 'what if' - that being the case, he should definitely pursue him. Worst he'll get is a "No." And IF he got " Yes"???? !!!!!! Haas would be packed regularly!


Right now Kidd is the darling of the nba. Every talking head is gushing about him

He's also making a ton of money

Coaching in a city that he's beloved since he helped bring them a title

With the best young player in the entire league

No. The time to get him was when he was without a job and thought of to be a terrible head coach. I doubt knowlton even knew who Kidd was since he's not a famous hockey player.

But you're not going to get him now that he's on top of the nba mountain

MSaviolives
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concordtom said:

Jason Kidd vs Chris Paul…. Who would YOU take?

Answer before looking up the stats:
https://www.landofbasketball.com/player_comparison/jason_kidd_vs_chris_paul.htm

And you might like this article about shade between the two:

https://www.yardbarker.com/nba/articles/amp/jason_kidd_mocked_chris_paul_after_game_7_for_the_10_oclock_curfew_he_gave_his_suns_teammates_curfew_10_oclock/s1_16751_37504460


I'm definitely biased biased, both as a Cal basketball fan and because my wife was one of Jason's elementary school teachers, but I would take Kidd over Paul. The difference is that Kidd always made his team better apart from his individual stats, including assists. Jason took a mediocre Nets team to the finals two consecutive years. Most of the teams he joined, from Cal, to Dallas (the first time), the Suns, the Nets got better when he joined.

And it isn't all about assists in terms of making team mates better. Westbrook would be a good example of that. To be fair, Paul is a great player, and a sure HOFer. But I'm not so sure he is the team enhancer that Kidd was. Paul played on very good Clippers and Rockets teams, but couldn't even get them to the finals, and then lost in the finals with the good Suns team and just contributed to an all time crash and burn in this year's playoffs with the team with the best record. So I'll go with Kidd. Reasonable people can disagree for sure.
calumnus
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ducky23 said:

Dgoldnbaer said:

Idea ... As far fetched as it seems ... How 'bout Knowlton pursue Kidd now, at end of Jason's season? I'm not saying Kidd will say "Yes" to coaching the Bears but there's ALWAYS the 'what if' - that being the case, he should definitely pursue him. Worst he'll get is a "No." And IF he got " Yes"???? !!!!!! Haas would be packed regularly!


Right now Kidd is the darling of the nba. Every talking head is gushing about him

He's also making a ton of money

Coaching in a city that he's beloved since he helped bring them a title

With the best young player in the entire league

No. The time to get him was when he was without a job and thought of to be a terrible head coach. I doubt knowlton even knew who Kidd was since he's not a famous hockey player.

But you're not going to get him now that he's on top of the nba mountain




Sadly, yes.

A bit like Ron Rivera, both before he became an NFL head coach and after he was fired by Carolina. Maybe still have a chance with Ron before his career is over.
concordtom
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MSaviolives said:

concordtom said:

Jason Kidd vs Chris Paul…. Who would YOU take?

Answer before looking up the stats:
https://www.landofbasketball.com/player_comparison/jason_kidd_vs_chris_paul.htm

And you might like this article about shade between the two:

https://www.yardbarker.com/nba/articles/amp/jason_kidd_mocked_chris_paul_after_game_7_for_the_10_oclock_curfew_he_gave_his_suns_teammates_curfew_10_oclock/s1_16751_37504460


I'm definitely biased biased, both as a Cal basketball fan and because my wife was one of Jason's elementary school teachers, but I would take Kidd over Paul. The difference is that Kidd always made his team better apart from his individual stats, including assists. Jason took a mediocre Nets team to the finals two consecutive years. Most of the teams he joined, from Cal, to Dallas (the first time), the Suns, the Nets got better when he joined.

And it isn't all about assists in terms of making team mates better. Westbrook would be a good example of that. To be fair, Paul is a great player, and a sure HOFer. But I'm not so sure he is the team enhancer that Kidd was. Paul played on very good Clippers and Rockets teams, but couldn't even get them to the finals, and then lost in the finals with the good Suns team and just contributed to an all time crash and burn in this year's playoffs with the team with the best record. So I'll go with Kidd. Reasonable people can disagree for sure.
I like your rationale.
And, did Kidd ever give thanks with tickets or swag?
Does that ever happen to Elementary teachers?
BearSD
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ducky23 said:

Dgoldnbaer said:




I doubt knowlton even knew who Kidd was



The sad thing is, this might be true.
calumnus
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BearSD said:

ducky23 said:

Dgoldnbaer said:




I doubt knowlton even knew who Kidd was



The sad thing is, this might be true.



More likely true than not.
mbBear
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calumnus said:

BearSD said:

ducky23 said:



I doubt knowlton even knew who Kidd was



The sad thing is, this might be true.



More likely true than not.
Except that Cal has the Jason Kidd Scholarship, endowed in 2016...before Knowlton was AD, but still on the books as something on-going.

calumnus
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mbBear said:

calumnus said:

BearSD said:

ducky23 said:



I doubt knowlton even knew who Kidd was



The sad thing is, this might be true.



More likely true than not.
Except that Cal has the Jason Kidd Scholarship, endowed in 2016...before Knowlton was AD, but still on the books as something on-going.





Sure, but Cal also has a Robert Albo Scholarship for basketball among others. I'm sure he does not know who all the original donors were and might just assume Jason Kidd is any other wealthy alum.
concordtom
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Great quote by Kidd!

The NBA announced on Wednesday that it has fined the Dallas Mavericks $50,000 for "violating league rules regarding team bench decorum."

The league cited Mavericks players and coaching staff for violations during Sunday's 123-90 Game 7 victory over the Phoenix Suns that clinched a spot in the Western Conference finals. The fine is the second such for the Mavericks this postseason after the NBA issued a $25,000 fine following Game 2 against the Suns. The fine is doubled this time because of the previous infraction.

"On multiple occasions, several players and member of the coaching staff stood for an extended period in the Mavericks' team bench area, stood away from the team bench, and were on or encroaching upon the playing court during game action," the NBA's statement reads.

The statement did not name names.

Head coach Jason Kidd criticized the the NBA after the first fine, telling reporters that "the league is worried about the wrong thing."
Quote:


"I didn't know we got fined, but that's cool," Kidd told reporters on May 6. "You know, the league is worried about the wrong thing. You have millionaires cheering on other millionaires. Doesn't happen in this society. And the enthusiasm of the game, for a teammate to cheer on another teammate, is special."


Kidd also noted that the fine is "going to a good cause, charity."



"Hey! DOWN in front!!!!"
mbBear
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calumnus said:

mbBear said:

calumnus said:

BearSD said:

ducky23 said:



I doubt knowlton even knew who Kidd was



The sad thing is, this might be true.



More likely true than not.
Except that Cal has the Jason Kidd Scholarship, endowed in 2016...before Knowlton was AD, but still on the books as something on-going.





Sure, but Cal also has a Robert Albo Scholarship for basketball among others. I'm sure he does not know who all the original donors were and might just assume Jason Kidd is any other wealthy alum.

Because Jason doesn't have a sports reputation beyond Cal?
You hate Knowlton...no reason to try a theory beyond what you actually know.
calumnus
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mbBear said:

calumnus said:

mbBear said:

calumnus said:

BearSD said:

ducky23 said:



I doubt knowlton even knew who Kidd was



The sad thing is, this might be true.



More likely true than not.
Except that Cal has the Jason Kidd Scholarship, endowed in 2016...before Knowlton was AD, but still on the books as something on-going.





Sure, but Cal also has a Robert Albo Scholarship for basketball among others. I'm sure he does not know who all the original donors were and might just assume Jason Kidd is any other wealthy alum.

Because Jason doesn't have a sports reputation beyond Cal?
You hate Knowlton...no reason to try a theory beyond what you actually know.



I don't hate him. I just think he was a really bad fit for Cal at this time in our history. Who turns down nearly $1 million a year for 10 years? That is generational wealth for a career Army officer. I don't blame him for accepting it.

I made it clear I was speculating, but based on what I know.

I have a close family member who sat next to him in a dinner and tried to engage him in a conversation about basketball, it was clear he doesn't follow the sport. His passion is hockey.

If he was passionate about basketball, looking to hire a coach he would have consulted more than the search firm, hung out at the NCAA Tournament like other ADs looking for coaches, and taken more than theee days to make a hire:
https://www.mercurynews.com/2019/04/01/cal-ad-jim-knowlton-explains-the-search-process-that-ended-with-mark-fox/amp/

If he knew who Kidd was, why wouldn't he have followed up on Jason's publicly stated interest in the job? The hypothesis that he didn't know who Kidd was seems as good as any and is actually more charitable than alternatives. I mean, if I was hiring a hockey coach for Army I am sure I would seem clueless about hockey and Army's sport's history because I would be.
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