Our next coach watch

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ducky23
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In reply to HoopDreams • 3:13p, 1/22/22
HoopDreams said:


When you look at his face, it is quite different than those around him, including the head coach who tried to help him up which is what anyone should do in that situation






When Sean f'ing miller displays more class than the coach some here seem so desperate to hire, I think there might be a problem

Most of my hate for Pasternak is fabricated as I just think that whole situation was funny and absurd. With that said, sometimes a persons true character comes out when you have no time to think and you react instinctually to something.

Watch the clip again. Why does Pasternak have such a look of disgust on his face? Jorge is going for a ball. Happens all the time. Wth does Pasternak want Jorge to do? Not go for the ball? Try to land somewhere else?
Why does he instinctually try to kick him off? Would that be your instinct to do in that situation? Why does Pasternak still look disgusted even after the incident?

This is a norma basketball play. When a player crashes into the opposing bench, 99% of the time the opposing bench doesn't get upset because they know it's part of the game. What makes Pasternak so special? And even after the fact, after being clearly in the wrong, to my knowledge, he never apologized to Jorge.

It's just a very very bad look. He looks like a small petulant spoiled child. But if he can win, whatever I guess.
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UrsineMaximus
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In reply to Big C • 3:50p, 1/22/22
He then maneuvered himself to take Jorge down to apply a rear naked choke and tap out, you could see it in the kickboxer turned MMA phenom's facial expression and hand movements.

"I must say, Joe Rogan, I have never seen anyone go from assistant BB coach to MMA star, in a matter of seconds, right before our eyes" said Dana White.
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SFCityBear
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In reply to calumnus • 4:08p, 1/22/22
calumnus said:
82gradDLSdad said:
GMP said:
Golden One said:
bearup said:
socaltownie said:
Just for fun

The Kicker seems to be struggling right now at UCSB. 7-7
Travis is doing "OK" - 4-2 in the big sky, 11.-6 overall

Who else should we put on the list?
How certain are we that JK will again use a "search firm"......or not?
You can bet the farm that he will again use a search firm.

And he should. He doesn't know what the heck he's doing.



I think you're right and why I think he should not only be using a search firm but also a choosing and hiring one. Sort of like using an architect and engineering firm but then deciding to build your own house when you don't even know how to work a hammer.


He needs a consultant to hire and manage the consultants.
The definition of a consultant used to be someone carrying an attache case with a sandwich inside.
SFCityBear
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calumnus
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In reply to GMP • 6:29p, 1/22/22
GMP said:
philbert said:
GMP said:
Wilner's analysis has a flawed assumption: that no efforts were made to vet candidates before that first announcement Jones would return.

Quote:
It's not like Knowlton had the framework for a change in place … like he had been thoroughly scouting options for the final month of the season … because until late last week, he planned to bring Jones back.


Wilner doesn't know that, nor does he claim to.
Well, if you recall, there was a bit of a roller coaster where Wyking was said to be coming back and then suddenly got fired. From this calgoldenblogs story, the timeline is as follows:

March 22nd: (False?) News leaks that Cal is retaining Wyking Jones
March 24th: Cal announces firing of Wyking Jones
March 27th: News breaks that Cal has hired a search firm
March 29th: Cal announces hiring of Mark Fox

I understand that the 3/22 date was from a Jeff Goodman tweet (who had talked to an assistant coach that said Knowlton told Wyking he was coming back). At some point between 3/22 and 3/24, Knowlton changed his mind. So at best, Knowlton had two additional days to do the search.

That still doesn't seem to be very much extra time to do a thorough search.

https://www.californiagoldenblogs.com/2019/4/1/18287048/california-golden-bears-men-basketball-wyking-jones-mark-fox-march-madness-georgia-nevada


I disagree. Why couldn't Knowlton have engaged the search firm to vet candidates for any length of time before 3/22? I have no inside info. I am suggesting it's a possibility - Knowlton engages a search firm a month before the season ends, to steal Wilner's example. He gets the candidates they recommend. Maybe he even does some interviews. He doesn't love the options enough to fire and pay Jones. So he decides Jones will stay. Then he changes his mind, fires him and a week later hires Fox.


Sure he could have and should have.

However, Knowlton said he would not do an evaluation of Jones until the season was over. After the season was over he initially indicated Jones would be back.

Why make a hire a week into the NCAA Tournament in the midst of a dead period? There was no need to rush. Why not interview more up and coming candidates? Fox wasn't going anywhere.
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calumnus
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In reply to ducky23 • 6:46p, 1/22/22
ducky23 said:
HoopDreams said:


When you look at his face, it is quite different than those around him, including the head coach who tried to help him up which is what anyone should do in that situation






When Sean f'ing miller displays more class than the coach some here seem so desperate to hire, I think there might be a problem

Most of my hate for Pasternak is fabricated as I just think that whole situation was funny and absurd. With that said, sometimes a persons true character comes out when you have no time to think and you react instinctually to something.

Watch the clip again. Why does Pasternak have such a look of disgust on his face? Jorge is going for a ball. Happens all the time. Wth does Pasternak want Jorge to do? Not go for the ball? Try to land somewhere else?
Why does he instinctually try to kick him off? Would that be your instinct to do in that situation? Why does Pasternak still look disgusted even after the incident?

This is a norma basketball play. When a player crashes into the opposing bench, 99% of the time the opposing bench doesn't get upset because they know it's part of the game. What makes Pasternak so special? And even after the fact, after being clearly in the wrong, to my knowledge, he never apologized to Jorge.

It's just a very very bad look. He looks like a small petulant spoiled child. But if he can win, whatever I guess.


I would have disliked hiring Pasternak less than I disliked hiring Fox, but why do Cal fans act like there are so few basketball coaches in this country?
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BEAR2dBONE
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7:52p, 1/25/22
Think, out of the box : ANDRE IGUODALA
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KoreAmBear
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In reply to BEAR2dBONE • 6:08p, 1/27/22
Chris Mack is available. But he went through an extortion scandal not that we would even be in the running.

https://247sports.com/LongFormArticle/Louisville-basketball-coaching-search-Potential-candidates-to-replace-Chris-Mack-from-CBS-Sports-181584634/
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BearoutEast67
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8:31p, 1/27/22
Jerod Haase has a 93-80 record at Stanford. I suppose you think he's better than Fox.
Donate to Cal's NIL at https://calegends.com/donation/
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BC Calfan
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9:04a, 1/28/22
I'm not into "What-Ifs" but hey this is a message board.

Looking at the rest of the schedule, only Utah at home is a likely win. UW is better now. Stanford just beat USC for the second time. OSU & ASU aren't good but we're terrible on the road.

WHAT IF Fox wins just one game the rest of the way? 1 win in the last 18 games. (including a first round Pac-12 tourney exit)

Unfortunately, i still think he gets another year. Knowlton sticks with his man.
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BeastBear69
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In reply to BEAR2dBONE • 10:31a, 1/28/22
BEAR2dBONE said:
Think, out of the box : ANDRE IGUODALA


I WANT IGUODALA

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Gkhoury2325
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In reply to BeastBear69 • 10:36a, 1/28/22
Iggy would be a dream for Cal and I would love it. Not sure if he wants to coach college basketball, but he would be an amazing hire.

Knowlton get it done. Lol! We can all only dream.
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KoreAmBear
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In reply to BearoutEast67 • 12:22p, 1/28/22
BearoutEast67 said:
Jerod Haase has a 93-80 record at Stanford. I suppose you think he's better than Fox.
He is certainly a good recruiter. He does waste more talent per capita however.
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GMP
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In reply to KoreAmBear • 12:22p, 1/28/22
KoreAmBear said:
BearoutEast67 said:
Jerod Haase has a 93-80 record at Stanford. I suppose you think he's better than Fox.
He is certainly a good recruiter. He does waste more talent per capita however.


Is it better to have talent and waste it, or never to have talent at all?
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KoreAmBear
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In reply to GMP • 12:24p, 1/28/22
GMP said:
KoreAmBear said:
BearoutEast67 said:
Jerod Haase has a 93-80 record at Stanford. I suppose you think he's better than Fox.
He is certainly a good recruiter. He does waste more talent per capita however.


Is it better to have talent and waste it, or never to have talent at all?
The former. At least you have some hope they just do it despite the coach. That's what happened at UCLA under Lavin. They went to some Sweet 16s and I believe one Elite 8 under him.
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Dduster
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12:38p, 1/28/22
Why isn't that cracker jack 'search firm' involved getting improved players? The Bear's position in the Pac 12 Standings is the true indication of the problem. It's not the coach. You guys spend too much time spinning in circles. Focus on the real problem.
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Big C
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In reply to KoreAmBear • 1:06p, 1/28/22
KoreAmBear said:
GMP said:
KoreAmBear said:
BearoutEast67 said:
Jerod Haase has a 93-80 record at Stanford. I suppose you think he's better than Fox.
He is certainly a good recruiter. He does waste more talent per capita however.


Is it better to have talent and waste it, or never to have talent at all?
The former. At least you have some hope they just do it despite the coach. That's what happened at UCLA under Lavin. They went to some Sweet 16s and I believe one Elite 8 under him.

I think that question reminds me of the Cal Football question of recent years: Easier to live with offense and no defense (Dykes), or defense and no offense (Wilcox)?

To me, whichever one I have to endure that particular season seems like the worst. The grass is always greener...
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socaltownie
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In reply to Dduster • 2:43p, 1/28/22
Dduster said:
Why isn't that cracker jack 'search firm' involved getting improved players? The Bear's position in the Pac 12 Standings is the true indication of the problem. It's not the coach. You guys spend too much time spinning in circles. Focus on the real problem.
The coach recruits. Alpha and Omega. And it has been show that Cal CAN attract upper 1/3 talent.
Take care of your Chicken
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bluesaxe
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In reply to HoopDreams • 4:02p, 1/28/22
HoopDreams said:
I think the AD had several criteria of different weights:

A. had to fit the budget
B. had to be from a P6 conference (or high mid-major)
C. had to have HC experience
D. had to have a good academic record and clean background
E. had to have shown success
F. had to be someone he could work with


A. He probably was given a budget and went with it thinking it was out of his control (maybe it was, maybe it wasn't if he found a great candidate)

C. Was a major criticism of the WK hire, so this was an essential criteria

D. Cal was not going to hire Pearl

E. Most experienced coaches have shown some success to point to, otherwise they would not be a P6 coach in the first place, and given A we were not going to hire, or even be considered by a top coach

F. most people factor this into their hires

The problem with the above, is it was missing several key criteria including:

1. Track record of recruiting
2. Basketball strategy that would be successful for Cal
3. A coach for this generation of players for the new world college basketball





B should not be among the criteria. Not saying it wasn't, but given where the program was/is we'd have a better shot at success finding an up and coming mid-major HC. And I completely agree on your 1-3.
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bluesaxe
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In reply to Dduster • 4:04p, 1/28/22
Dduster said:
Why isn't that cracker jack 'search firm' involved getting improved players? The Bear's position in the Pac 12 Standings is the true indication of the problem. It's not the coach. You guys spend too much time spinning in circles. Focus on the real problem.
Who is responsible for getting those players if not the coach?
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bluesaxe
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In reply to BEAR2dBONE • 4:05p, 1/28/22
BEAR2dBONE said:
Think, out of the box : ANDRE IGUODALA
He's not interested in coaching in the NBA, much less college. He's said that he has plans in the financial world and if he ever gets involved in basketball after he's done playing it would likely be in a front office job.
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stu
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In reply to bluesaxe • 5:17p, 1/28/22
Like Athletic Director?
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Golden One
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In reply to stu • 8:13p, 1/28/22
stu said:
Like Athletic Director?
More like a General Manager for an NBA team.
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calumnus
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In reply to bluesaxe • 11:33p, 1/30/22
bluesaxe said:
HoopDreams said:
I think the AD had several criteria of different weights:

A. had to fit the budget
B. had to be from a P6 conference (or high mid-major)
C. had to have HC experience
D. had to have a good academic record and clean background
E. had to have shown success
F. had to be someone he could work with


A. He probably was given a budget and went with it thinking it was out of his control (maybe it was, maybe it wasn't if he found a great candidate)

C. Was a major criticism of the WK hire, so this was an essential criteria

D. Cal was not going to hire Pearl

E. Most experienced coaches have shown some success to point to, otherwise they would not be a P6 coach in the first place, and given A we were not going to hire, or even be considered by a top coach

F. most people factor this into their hires

The problem with the above, is it was missing several key criteria including:

1. Track record of recruiting
2. Basketball strategy that would be successful for Cal
3. A coach for this generation of players for the new world college basketball





B should not be among the criteria. Not saying it wasn't, but given where the program was/is we'd have a better shot at success finding an up and coming mid-major HC. And I completely agree on your 1-3.


I think he was saying that is part of the input Knowlton gave the search firm: "Must have P5 HC experience" which is basically asking for a proven mediocre or worse retread fired from his last job. It was an extreme overreaction to the failure of Wyking Jones, a coach with no previous HC experience at all. Between the two, I'd prefer swinging for the fences again with an unknown, rather than a proven mediocrity, but I agree, far and away the best bet is an up and coming HC who has West Coast recruiting ties.

USF right across the Bay is playing good basketball, the #36 team in Ken Pom. Golden and his wife met at St. Mary's where he was #2 in the nation in assist/turnover ratio as a PG. After college he played professionally in Israel then he went into advertising sales. He was an assistant to Kyle Smith at Columbia and Bruce Pearl at Auburn, before returning to work for Smith again at USF and getting the HC job when Smith moved on to WSU. Super smart, a really good guy, good salesman (recruiter), only 33.
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socaltownie
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In reply to calumnus • 7:56a, 1/31/22
calumnus said:
bluesaxe said:
HoopDreams said:
I think the AD had several criteria of different weights:

A. had to fit the budget
B. had to be from a P6 conference (or high mid-major)
C. had to have HC experience
D. had to have a good academic record and clean background
E. had to have shown success
F. had to be someone he could work with


A. He probably was given a budget and went with it thinking it was out of his control (maybe it was, maybe it wasn't if he found a great candidate)

C. Was a major criticism of the WK hire, so this was an essential criteria

D. Cal was not going to hire Pearl

E. Most experienced coaches have shown some success to point to, otherwise they would not be a P6 coach in the first place, and given A we were not going to hire, or even be considered by a top coach

F. most people factor this into their hires

The problem with the above, is it was missing several key criteria including:

1. Track record of recruiting
2. Basketball strategy that would be successful for Cal
3. A coach for this generation of players for the new world college basketball





B should not be among the criteria. Not saying it wasn't, but given where the program was/is we'd have a better shot at success finding an up and coming mid-major HC. And I completely agree on your 1-3.


I think he was saying that is part of the input Knowlton gave the search firm: "Must have P5 HC experience" which is basically asking for a proven mediocre or worse retread fired from his last job. It was an extreme overreaction to the failure of Wyking Jones, a coach with no previous HC experience at all. Between the two, I'd prefer swinging for the fences again with an unknown, rather than a proven mediocrity, but I agree, far and away the best bet is an up and coming HC who has West Coast recruiting ties.

USF right across the Bay is playing good basketball, the #36 team in Ken Pom. Golden and his wife met at St. Mary's where he was #2 in the nation in assist/turnover ratio as a PG. After college he played professionally in Israel then he went into advertising sales. He was an assistant to Kyle Smith at Columbia and Bruce Pearl at Auburn, before returning to work for Smith again at USF and getting the HC job when Smith moved on to WSU. Super smart, a really good guy, good salesman (recruiter), only 33.
This! Cal is _NOT_ a school which has the history or budget to make a lateral p5 hire. Instead, you get a guy like Fox who has shown that he is one of those guys that can inherit a roster (nevada) and get them to overachieve and then no implode a program (Georgia) but who is ill suited to the game of modern recruiting.

But I have to say so is the fear of someone like Golden. The core question has to be "can they recruit in the Pac 12".

Take care of your Chicken
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stu
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In reply to socaltownie • 8:52a, 1/31/22
What's worse: fear of can't recruit in the Pac-12 or fact of can't recruit in the Pac-12?
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KoreAmBear
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In reply to stu • 9:29a, 1/31/22
I have always thought recruiting was like rebounding or defense in basketball. Lots of hard work, but those that desire it the most (and often illegally), are good at it. Guys like Hufnagel and Grace were able to make some progress, and never using facilities as an excuse. Guys like Monty and Fox, don't play that. At least Monty could overcome with enough recruits and then get over with Xs and Os. You need a salesman on your staff that can move the needle. It doesn't seem like we have a guy like that.
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BeachedBear
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In reply to socaltownie • 10:14a, 1/31/22
socaltownie said:
calumnus said:
bluesaxe said:
HoopDreams said:
I think the AD had several criteria of different weights:

A. had to fit the budget
B. had to be from a P6 conference (or high mid-major)
C. had to have HC experience
D. had to have a good academic record and clean background
E. had to have shown success
F. had to be someone he could work with


A. He probably was given a budget and went with it thinking it was out of his control (maybe it was, maybe it wasn't if he found a great candidate)

C. Was a major criticism of the WK hire, so this was an essential criteria

D. Cal was not going to hire Pearl

E. Most experienced coaches have shown some success to point to, otherwise they would not be a P6 coach in the first place, and given A we were not going to hire, or even be considered by a top coach

F. most people factor this into their hires

The problem with the above, is it was missing several key criteria including:

1. Track record of recruiting
2. Basketball strategy that would be successful for Cal
3. A coach for this generation of players for the new world college basketball





B should not be among the criteria. Not saying it wasn't, but given where the program was/is we'd have a better shot at success finding an up and coming mid-major HC. And I completely agree on your 1-3.


I think he was saying that is part of the input Knowlton gave the search firm: "Must have P5 HC experience" which is basically asking for a proven mediocre or worse retread fired from his last job. It was an extreme overreaction to the failure of Wyking Jones, a coach with no previous HC experience at all. Between the two, I'd prefer swinging for the fences again with an unknown, rather than a proven mediocrity, but I agree, far and away the best bet is an up and coming HC who has West Coast recruiting ties.

USF right across the Bay is playing good basketball, the #36 team in Ken Pom. Golden and his wife met at St. Mary's where he was #2 in the nation in assist/turnover ratio as a PG. After college he played professionally in Israel then he went into advertising sales. He was an assistant to Kyle Smith at Columbia and Bruce Pearl at Auburn, before returning to work for Smith again at USF and getting the HC job when Smith moved on to WSU. Super smart, a really good guy, good salesman (recruiter), only 33.
This! Cal is _NOT_ a school which has the history or budget to make a lateral p5 hire. Instead, you get a guy like Fox who has shown that he is one of those guys that can inherit a roster (nevada) and get them to overachieve and then no implode a program (Georgia) but who is ill suited to the game of modern recruiting.

But I have to say so is the fear of someone like Golden. The core question has to be "can they recruit in the Pac 12".

Agree - but at least with someone like Golden - there is still the 'potential' - AND the possibility that Cal make that hire.

The only lateral hire Cal has made in my memory is Cuonzo - and there were a number of asterisks in that opportunity that made it unique. Monty - local legend who wanted to come out of retirement. Braun & Campanelli were mid major "up and comers". Kuchen and Bozeman were assistants.
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calumnus
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In reply to KoreAmBear • 1:32p, 1/31/22
KoreAmBear said:
I have always thought recruiting was like rebounding or defense in basketball. Lots of hard work, but those that desire it the most (and often illegally), are good at it. Guys like Hufnagel and Grace were able to make some progress, and never using facilities as an excuse. Guys like Monty and Fox, don't play that. At least Monty could overcome with enough recruits and then get over with Xs and Os. You need a salesman on your staff that can move the needle. It doesn't seem like we have a guy like that.


Hustle and hard work are part of the equation, as is personal charm, but having a good product, knowing your product and identifying those likely to find that product attractive is key.

Back in the 90s my dad wrote the NCAA's guide to recruiting for athletes. He also wrote a handbook for coaches, explaining the rules and applying sales principles to recruiting (many coaches know Xs and Os, they know the sport, but sales/recruiting is left for them to just wing it). He gave over 100 seminars on recruiting to athletic departments all over the country.

When he presented to Stanford the big coaches were Bill Walsh, Tara Vanderveer and Monty. Bill Walsh had won multiple Super Bowls, but filled a notebook with notes, excitedly grabbed my dad after the talk spoke with him for an hour after and arranged for further trainings for all of his staff. Tara, who my dad knew from her previous stint and who my dad had helped bring to Stanford had already won National Championships and had trainings for her staff. Monty had sat in the audience, arms crossed, saying nothing, falling asleep and left early.
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Big C
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In reply to calumnus • 5:03p, 1/31/22
calumnus said:
KoreAmBear said:
I have always thought recruiting was like rebounding or defense in basketball. Lots of hard work, but those that desire it the most (and often illegally), are good at it. Guys like Hufnagel and Grace were able to make some progress, and never using facilities as an excuse. Guys like Monty and Fox, don't play that. At least Monty could overcome with enough recruits and then get over with Xs and Os. You need a salesman on your staff that can move the needle. It doesn't seem like we have a guy like that.


Hustle and hard work are part of the equation, as is personal charm, but having a good product, knowing your product and identifying those likely to find that product attractive is key.

Back in the 90s my dad wrote the NCAA's guide to recruiting for athletes. He also wrote a handbook for coaches, explaining the rules and applying sales principles to recruiting (many coaches know Xs and Os, they know the sport, but sales/recruiting is left for them to just wing it). He gave over 100 seminars on recruiting to athletic departments all over the country.

When he presented to Stanford the big coaches were Bill Walsh, Tara Vanderveer and Monty. Bill Walsh had won multiple Super Bowls, but filled a notebook with notes, excitedly grabbed my dad after the talk spoke with him for an hour after and arranged for further trainings for all of his staff. Tara, who my dad knew from her previous stint and who my dad had helped bring to Stanford had already won National Championships and had trainings for her staff. Monty had sat in the audience, arms crossed, saying nothing, falling asleep and left early.

Good ol' Monty. Always true to himself, no matter what. I was thinking wouldn't it be great to have a coach who was half Mike Montgomery and half Todd Bozeman. Then I realized that Cal would probably get the hybrid that was Monty-the-recruiter and Bozeman the ethicist-and-X's-and-O's-guy.
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HoopDreams
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In reply to calumnus • 5:05p, 1/31/22
calumnus said:
KoreAmBear said:
I have always thought recruiting was like rebounding or defense in basketball. Lots of hard work, but those that desire it the most (and often illegally), are good at it. Guys like Hufnagel and Grace were able to make some progress, and never using facilities as an excuse. Guys like Monty and Fox, don't play that. At least Monty could overcome with enough recruits and then get over with Xs and Os. You need a salesman on your staff that can move the needle. It doesn't seem like we have a guy like that.


Hustle and hard work are part of the equation, as is personal charm, but having a good product, knowing your product and identifying those likely to find that product attractive is key.

Back in the 90s my dad wrote the NCAA's guide to recruiting for athletes. He also wrote a handbook for coaches, explaining the rules and applying sales principles to recruiting (many coaches know Xs and Os, they know the sport, but sales/recruiting is left for them to just wing it). He gave over 100 seminars on recruiting to athletic departments all over the country.

When he presented to Stanford the big coaches were Bill Walsh, Tara Vanderveer and Monty. Bill Walsh had won multiple Super Bowls, but filled a notebook with notes, excitedly grabbed my dad after the talk spoke with him for an hour after and arranged for further trainings for all of his staff. Tara, who my dad knew from her previous stint and who my dad had helped bring to Stanford had already won National Championships and had trainings for her staff. Monty had sat in the audience, arms crossed, saying nothing, falling asleep and left early.
great story, especially the punch line in the last sentence!
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In reply to Big C • 5:56p, 1/31/22
Big C said:
calumnus said:
KoreAmBear said:
I have always thought recruiting was like rebounding or defense in basketball. Lots of hard work, but those that desire it the most (and often illegally), are good at it. Guys like Hufnagel and Grace were able to make some progress, and never using facilities as an excuse. Guys like Monty and Fox, don't play that. At least Monty could overcome with enough recruits and then get over with Xs and Os. You need a salesman on your staff that can move the needle. It doesn't seem like we have a guy like that.


Hustle and hard work are part of the equation, as is personal charm, but having a good product, knowing your product and identifying those likely to find that product attractive is key.

Back in the 90s my dad wrote the NCAA's guide to recruiting for athletes. He also wrote a handbook for coaches, explaining the rules and applying sales principles to recruiting (many coaches know Xs and Os, they know the sport, but sales/recruiting is left for them to just wing it). He gave over 100 seminars on recruiting to athletic departments all over the country.

When he presented to Stanford the big coaches were Bill Walsh, Tara Vanderveer and Monty. Bill Walsh had won multiple Super Bowls, but filled a notebook with notes, excitedly grabbed my dad after the talk spoke with him for an hour after and arranged for further trainings for all of his staff. Tara, who my dad knew from her previous stint and who my dad had helped bring to Stanford had already won National Championships and had trainings for her staff. Monty had sat in the audience, arms crossed, saying nothing, falling asleep and left early.

Good ol' Monty. Always true to himself, no matter what. I was thinking wouldn't it be great to have a coach who was half Mike Montgomery and half Todd Bozeman. Then I realized that Cal would probably get the hybrid that was Monty-the-recruiter and Bozeman the ethicist-and-X's-and-O's-guy.
Yes we would always wind up holding the bag.
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82gradDLSdad
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In reply to Big C • 7:22a, 2/1/22
Big C said:
calumnus said:
KoreAmBear said:
I have always thought recruiting was like rebounding or defense in basketball. Lots of hard work, but those that desire it the most (and often illegally), are good at it. Guys like Hufnagel and Grace were able to make some progress, and never using facilities as an excuse. Guys like Monty and Fox, don't play that. At least Monty could overcome with enough recruits and then get over with Xs and Os. You need a salesman on your staff that can move the needle. It doesn't seem like we have a guy like that.


Hustle and hard work are part of the equation, as is personal charm, but having a good product, knowing your product and identifying those likely to find that product attractive is key.

Back in the 90s my dad wrote the NCAA's guide to recruiting for athletes. He also wrote a handbook for coaches, explaining the rules and applying sales principles to recruiting (many coaches know Xs and Os, they know the sport, but sales/recruiting is left for them to just wing it). He gave over 100 seminars on recruiting to athletic departments all over the country.

When he presented to Stanford the big coaches were Bill Walsh, Tara Vanderveer and Monty. Bill Walsh had won multiple Super Bowls, but filled a notebook with notes, excitedly grabbed my dad after the talk spoke with him for an hour after and arranged for further trainings for all of his staff. Tara, who my dad knew from her previous stint and who my dad had helped bring to Stanford had already won National Championships and had trainings for her staff. Monty had sat in the audience, arms crossed, saying nothing, falling asleep and left early.

Good ol' Monty. Always true to himself, no matter what. I was thinking wouldn't it be great to have a coach who was half Mike Montgomery and half Todd Bozeman. Then I realized that Cal would probably get the hybrid that was Monty-the-recruiter and Bozeman the ethicist-and-X's-and-O's-guy.


Yah, good old Monty. Goes to show you why he got just so far and no farther and why Walsh got to the top. You can always learn something even after you think you know it all. Sounds like Monty had a fair amount of dick in him.
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stu
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In reply to 82gradDLSdad • 11:27a, 2/1/22
Maybe Montgomery just hated sales. I can understand that.
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bipolarbear
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In reply to CalLifer • 12:24p, 2/1/22
CalLifer said:
Dennis Gates, 11-4 this year at Cleveland State.

Shantay Legans, 10-8 this year in his first year at Portland.
These guys should definitely be on the list legacies or not.
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calumnus
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In reply to stu • 1:38p, 2/1/22
stu said:
Maybe Montgomery just hated sales. I can understand that.


He's all about basketball. He showed up to coach the Warriors in grey cotton sweats and a whistle.: He is a teacher, albeit a tough and often cranky teacher. Look at all the good coaches that played for him or were on his staff. It is what makes him so good in the broadcast booth. He didn't just tell his players what to do, he explained why. Critical when you are coaching smart kids at Stanford or Cal.

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