OT: The Most Amazing Statistical Achievement in U.S. Sports History

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bearister
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The Most Amazing Statistical Achievement in Sports - The Atlantic


https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/01/most-amazing-statistical-achievement-in-us-sports-history/621329/
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SFCityBear
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bearister said:

The Most Amazing Statistical Achievement in Sports - The Atlantic


https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/01/most-amazing-statistical-achievement-in-us-sports-history/621329/
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ncbears
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Russell Westbrook (love him or hate him) has four seasons in which he averaged a triple double. Oscar Robertson has one. No other player has averaged a triple double for a season.
82gradDLSdad
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Amazing statistics. Say what you will about Bonds and his substance use. I remember telling my son, who was in the midst of a normal high school baseball career, that I'd never seen anyone hit like Bonds. Of course I didn't see Ruth or DiMaggio, etc. but still. Bonds was hitting like a kid dominating a little league. I swear it seemed like he either hit a home run or was walked during a couple of years.
calbearinamaze
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ncbears said:

Russell Westbrook (love him or hate him) has four seasons in which he averaged a triple double. Oscar Robertson has one. No other player has averaged a triple double for a season.
+1000

Russ plays his heart out.

DOUBLE-DOUBLES

Wilt 16
Stockton 10
Magic 9
Robertson 7*
Bird 6
Russ 5*
Lebron 1
Jordan 0

*Includes triples

Many others with multiple doubles in points and rebounds. Must be a complete list out there.

I've seen enough: 4 years of triple-doubles is amazing


****COP-OUT there may be errors

bearister
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ncbears said:

Russell Westbrook (love him or hate him) has four seasons in which he averaged a triple double. Oscar Robertson has one. No other player has averaged a triple double for a season.


I can't guaranty the accuracy of this:

"If his (Oscar Robinson) first five NBA seasons are strung together, Robertson averaged a triple-double over those, averaging 30.3 points, 10.4 rebounds and 10.6 assists.[37] For his career, Robertson had 181 triple-doubles, a record that had never been approached for decades until by Westbrook in the 2020-21 season.[38] These numbers are even more astonishing if it is taken into account that the three-point shot, which benefits sharpshooting backcourt players, did not exist when he played."

Oscar Robertson - Wikipedia


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oscar_Robertson
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SFCityBear
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bearister said:

ncbears said:

Russell Westbrook (love him or hate him) has four seasons in which he averaged a triple double. Oscar Robertson has one. No other player has averaged a triple double for a season.


I can't guaranty the accuracy of this:

"If his (Oscar Robinson) first five NBA seasons are strung together, Robertson averaged a triple-double over those, averaging 30.3 points, 10.4 rebounds and 10.6 assists.[37] For his career, Robertson had 181 triple-doubles, a record that had never been approached for decades until by Westbrook in the 2020-21 season.[38] These numbers are even more astonishing if it is taken into account that the three-point shot, which benefits sharpshooting backcourt players, did not exist when he played."

Oscar Robertson - Wikipedia


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oscar_Robertson

Then there are the few quadruple doubles, and one quintuple double (by guess who?), which may be unofficial, as they rely on newspaper accounts, because the games were held during time where blocks and steals stats were not kept by the NBA:

https://nbahoopsonline.com/History/Records/quaddouble.html

or here: https://ballislife.com/history-of-the-quadruple-double/



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BearSD
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bearister said:

ncbears said:

Russell Westbrook (love him or hate him) has four seasons in which he averaged a triple double. Oscar Robertson has one. No other player has averaged a triple double for a season.

I can't guaranty the accuracy of this:

"If his (Oscar Robinson) first five NBA seasons are strung together, Robertson averaged a triple-double over those, averaging 30.3 points, 10.4 rebounds and 10.6 assists.[37] For his career, Robertson had 181 triple-doubles, a record that had never been approached for decades until by Westbrook in the 2020-21 season.[38] These numbers are even more astonishing if it is taken into account that the three-point shot, which benefits sharpshooting backcourt players, did not exist when he played."

Oscar Robertson - Wikipedia


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oscar_Robertson

Sure, the 3-point shot benefits "sharpshooting backcourt players", but Westbrook isn't in that category. Made 3-pointers are not significant to his stats.

In his best season, Westbrook averaged 31.6/10.4/10.7 and averaged only 2.5 made threes per game. In his three other triple-double seasons, he averaged 1.2, 1.6, and 1.3 made threes per game.
calbearinamaze
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BearSD said:



Sure, the 3-point shot benefits "sharpshooting backcourt players", but Westbrook isn't in that category. Made 3-pointers are not significant to his stats.

In his best season, Westbrook averaged 31.6/10.4/10.7 and averaged only 2.5 made threes per game. In his three other triple-double seasons, he averaged 1.2, 1.6, and 1.3 made threes per game.
+1000

For his career, Russ has shot a rather woeful 30.5% from three. I'm certainly no expert, but his mechanics
need help. But, as you point out, he is in no way a heartless gunner from outside.
calbearinamaze
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bearister said:

ncbears said:

Russell Westbrook (love him or hate him) has four seasons in which he averaged a triple double. Oscar Robertson has one. No other player has averaged a triple double for a season.


I can't guaranty the accuracy of this:

"If his (Oscar Robinson) first five NBA seasons are strung together, Robertson averaged a triple-double over those, averaging 30.3 points, 10.4 rebounds and 10.6 assists.[37] For his career, Robertson had 181 triple-doubles, a record that had never been approached for decades until by Westbrook in the 2020-21 season.[38] These numbers are even more astonishing if it is taken into account that the three-point shot, which benefits sharpshooting backcourt players, did not exist when he played."

Oscar Robertson - Wikipedia


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oscar_Robertson


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wifeisafurd
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bearister said:

The Most Amazing Statistical Achievement in Sports - The Atlantic


https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/01/most-amazing-statistical-achievement-in-us-sports-history/621329/
Interesting article.

I walked away confused as do I want to look at one play or action, one game, a season, a group of years or entire body of work?

I would say that if you look at one play, it has to be Beamon's jump. It would be like the 500 yard drive or the pass the traveled 80 yards in the air for a touchdown. It was just so different from the norm that anything else in my life time. The other time periods I could debate for years.
Big C
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wifeisafurd said:

bearister said:

The Most Amazing Statistical Achievement in Sports - The Atlantic


https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/01/most-amazing-statistical-achievement-in-us-sports-history/621329/
Interesting article.

I walked away confused as do I want to look at one play or action, one game, a season, a group of years or entire body of work?

I would say that if you look at one play, it has to be Beamon's jump. It would be like the 500 yard drive or the pass the traveled 80 yards in the air for a touchdown. It was just so different from the norm that anything else in my life time. The other time periods I could debate for years.

The 21st century equivalent of Bob Beamon's jump would have to be Joe Ayoob's paper airplane flight.
PtownBear1
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82gradDLSdad said:

Amazing statistics. Say what you will about Bonds and his substance use. I remember telling my son, who was in the midst of a normal high school baseball career, that I'd never seen anyone hit like Bonds. Of course I didn't see Ruth or DiMaggio, etc. but still. Bonds was hitting like a kid dominating a little league. I swear it seemed like he either hit a home run or was walked during a couple of years.
Yeah I haven't given a **** about baseball since the Bonds/Mcguire/Sosa era. They actually made baseball somewhat exciting.
bearister
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LeBron James, 37, already has 22 30-point games this season, the second-most ever in a season for a player age 36 or older.

Question: Who's first on that list? Axios
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Cal8285
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wifeisafurd said:

bearister said:

The Most Amazing Statistical Achievement in Sports - The Atlantic


https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/01/most-amazing-statistical-achievement-in-us-sports-history/621329/
Interesting article.

I walked away confused as do I want to look at one play or action, one game, a season, a group of years or entire body of work?

I would say that if you look at one play, it has to be Beamon's jump. It would be like the 500 yard drive or the pass the traveled 80 yards in the air for a touchdown. It was just so different from the norm that anything else in my life time. The other time periods I could debate for years.
Well, if we can go as small as one play or action, or one game, how about two games?

Johnny Vander Meer's two consecutive no-hitters in 1938 is a record that is very unlikely to be tied, and will certainly never be broken. Heck, in today's game, good luck in having a pitcher throw two consecutive complete games. And Vander Meer meets the 50% criterion from The Atlantic article.

Beamon's jump was a crazy feat at the time, even if altitude was a factor. But it has been surpassed.

Unlike Beamon, Vander Meer hasn't been matched, much less surpassed. Vander Meer was the first to throw two no-hitters in one season, a feat that wasn't matched until 1951 and has been matched 4 times (5 if you include Halladay in 2010 that included a post-season no-hitter).

If you want amazing statistical feats, however, there is also Johnnie LeMaster, who has a MLB record that will likely never be matched, and certainly never broken. In 1985, LeMaster played for 3 different teams in the same season that all lost 100 games that year. No one else has played for more than 2. Of course, there haven't been that many. That is truly amazing. There have only been 15 seasons in which at least 3 teams lost 100 games, so that makes it hard to begin with (although it has happened in each of the last 2 full seasons played, 2019 and 2021), and only in 2002 and 2019 did four teams lose 100 games. Not very many players play for 3 different MLB teams in a single season. For all three of them to lose 100 games? Considering how rarely it happens, and that when it does, it is almost always only three teams? A truly amazing statistical feat.
bearister
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This was a BFD:

On May 6, 1954, Roger Bannister broke the 4-minute barrier, running the distance in 3:59.4.

There are seven billion people, but only a thousand and change have ever run a sub four-minute milethat's astonishing. And only three, after 40, have ever gone under four," Famiglietti says. The three runners who belong in that exclusive latter group are Bernard Lagat, Eamonn Coghlan, and Anthony Whiteman.May 24, 2018



Eamonn Coghlan at 69:
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ncbears
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Cal8285 said:




If you want amazing statistical feats, however, there is also Johnnie LeMaster, who has a MLB record that will likely never be matched, and certainly never broken. In 1985, LeMaster played for 3 different teams in the same season that all lost 100 games that year. No one else has played for more than 2. Of course, there haven't been that many. That is truly amazing. There have only been 15 seasons in which at least 3 teams lost 100 games, so that makes it hard to begin with (although it has happened in each of the last 2 full seasons played, 2019 and 2021), and only in 2002 and 2019 did four teams lose 100 games. Not very many players play for 3 different MLB teams in a single season. For all three of them to lose 100 games? Considering how rarely it happens, and that when it does, it is almost always only three teams? A truly amazing statistical feat.
Hey, you are talking about the SF Giant's 25th Anniversary Dream Team shortstop!
Big C
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Here's one I always have to look up, because I always think no way it really happened:

Against the Giants in 1966, the Braves' Tony Cloninger hit two grand slams in a single game. And Cloninger was their pitcher.

It is not uncommon for other pitchers to get 50% of that (the author's guideline), but that's as far as they will ever get.
Cal8285
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Big C said:


Here's one I always have to look up, because I always think no way it really happened:

Against the Giants in 1966, the Braves' Tony Cloninger hit two grand slams in a single game. And Cloninger was their pitcher.

It is not uncommon for other pitchers to get 50% of that (the author's guideline), but that's as far as they will ever get.
I'm tempted to say this is a record that will never be broken, because the universal DH is coming.

However, you never know. Othani, or far off in the future, someone like Ohtani, might pitch in a game where his manager decides not to use the DH. So even though the universal DH is almost certainly coming this year, it is still POSSIBLE for Cloninger to be matched, but astoundingly unlikely.

Cloninger was not only the first (and only) pitcher to hit 2 slams in a game, he was the first NL player to hit two slams in a game. No NL player did it again until Tatis hit his 2 in one inning. The NL is now at 3, to 10 for the AL.

If you want to look up something else related to 2 slams in a game that there's no way happened, Nomar was the 11th of the 13 MLB players to hit 2 slams in an inning, a couple of weeks after the Tatis 2 in one inning, and the first (and still only) player to do it at home. When Tatis hit his two, all 10 had been done on the road? Really? There is some advantage to hitting at home, so it should be a little more likely to happen at home. How do we have 12 out of 13 players who have done this on the road, and the first 10? Candlestick was a pitcher friendly park, but who knew that meant friendly to a pitcher hitting two grand slams?

4 years after Nomar as a Red Sox player became the only one to hit 2 slams at home, Bill Mueller as a Red Sox player became the only one to hit a slam from each side of the plate in the same game.

The 1998 2 slam day by Chris Hoiles is the only time a catcher did it.

So at least five guys who hit 2 slams in a game also have a feat nobody else accomplished - Cloninger the only pitcher, Hoiles the only catcher, Tatis the only two in one inning, Mueller the only from two sides of the plate, and Nomar the only one at home. You'd think Nomar would most likely be the first among that group to have someone else join him, but who knows.
HearstMining
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ncbears said:

Cal8285 said:




If you want amazing statistical feats, however, there is also Johnnie LeMaster, who has a MLB record that will likely never be matched, and certainly never broken. In 1985, LeMaster played for 3 different teams in the same season that all lost 100 games that year. No one else has played for more than 2. Of course, there haven't been that many. That is truly amazing. There have only been 15 seasons in which at least 3 teams lost 100 games, so that makes it hard to begin with (although it has happened in each of the last 2 full seasons played, 2019 and 2021), and only in 2002 and 2019 did four teams lose 100 games. Not very many players play for 3 different MLB teams in a single season. For all three of them to lose 100 games? Considering how rarely it happens, and that when it does, it is almost always only three teams? A truly amazing statistical feat.
Hey, you are talking about the SF Giant's 25th Anniversary Dream Team shortstop!
Really? Oh man . . . Johnnie Disaster! I wasn't paying much attention to the Giants in 1982 (for good reason, they were bad), but LeMaster really sucked and the SF fans who voted him onto this dream team weren't any better. The Giants never should have traded away Chris Speier. Just one in a long series of dumb-ass moves they made throughout the 1970s and well into the 1980s.
HearstMining
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wifeisafurd said:

bearister said:

The Most Amazing Statistical Achievement in Sports - The Atlantic


https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/01/most-amazing-statistical-achievement-in-us-sports-history/621329/
Interesting article.

I walked away confused as do I want to look at one play or action, one game, a season, a group of years or entire body of work?

I would say that if you look at one play, it has to be Beamon's jump. It would be like the 500 yard drive or the pass the traveled 80 yards in the air for a touchdown. It was just so different from the norm that anything else in my life time. The other time periods I could debate for years.
What's surprising is that Beamon's record stood for 23 years until Mike Powell barely broke it (2 inches) in 1991 but nobody has broken Powell's mark since. Usually when one person breaks one of those thresholds like the 4-minute mile or the 10.0 100meters, a whole bunch follow but not the case here.
Big C
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To really impress somebody how amazing it is to long jump 29 feet, measure out that distance inside a house!
ncbears
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HearstMining said:

wifeisafurd said:

bearister said:

The Most Amazing Statistical Achievement in Sports - The Atlantic


https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/01/most-amazing-statistical-achievement-in-us-sports-history/621329/
Interesting article.

I walked away confused as do I want to look at one play or action, one game, a season, a group of years or entire body of work?

I would say that if you look at one play, it has to be Beamon's jump. It would be like the 500 yard drive or the pass the traveled 80 yards in the air for a touchdown. It was just so different from the norm that anything else in my life time. The other time periods I could debate for years.
What's surprising is that Beamon's record stood for 23 years until Mike Powell barely broke it (2 inches) in 1991 but nobody has broken Powell's mark since. Usually when one person breaks one of those thresholds like the 4-minute mile or the 10.0 100meters, a whole bunch follow but not the case here.


Powell's record has stood for 30 years!
bearister
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