interrupting the Fox lovefest to give you Wilner's take on Furd.

The Haase situation is interesting. How many HCs miss the NCAAs for 6 straight years and are given a 7th? But the AD who hired him (Bernard Muir) is still in charge and the U admin doesn't know if the ball is inflated or stuffed - and doesn't care https://t.co/0knqTppFBw

— Jon Wilner (@wilnerhotline) February 18, 2022

MoragaBear said:

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Golden One said:

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MoragaBear said:

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Golden One said:

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stu said:

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Also why did we play the last 4 or 5 minutes with Hyder and Roberson at guard?

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Exactly what I was thinking. Neither Hyder nor Roberson has seen much playing time this season, and they haven't shown much when they have played. Beats the heck of me why Brown, Foreman, and Shepherd were on the bench the last 5 minutes.

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Shepherd was 0-4 in the 2nd half, Brown had no points, rebounds or assists in the 2nd half and didn't play his usual strong defense and Foreman was 1-5 with no rebounds or assists in the 2nd half.

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Yes, but Shepherd had 7 points in the game, Foreman had 5, and Brown had 4. Roberson had 0, and is very raw.

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The team was going nowhere at that point and Roberson only played 5 minutes and Hyder 4. Just trying to shake things up, I'm sure.

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Not sure Fox is ever very 'happy' when coaching, but he lit into the team in one of the timeouts

That usually happens because of defense, and we fouled colorado a lot

I figured Battey would get his, and besides his threes, Lars did a pretty good job on him

Jabari was the other big gun and I said before the game we needed to limit his rebounds ... he got 15 rebounds, and the strangest rebound I've ever seen. 2K blocks his shot and it bounces straight up way above the basket, and then straight down right back in the hands of Jabari who dunked it

how unlucky was that?

but back to defense... we scored 1 more basket and 5 more three pointers ... but they scored 21 FTs to our 6

In the first half, Cal outrebounded Colorado by 3. In the second half, Colorado outrebounded Cal by 18.

It seemed like Cal played like they were out of gas right from the beginning of the second half. It was weird. I don't understand how that happens, but there was no rebounding, defense fell off, and shots stopped falling (especially GA) including many good shots from right around the basket.

It's too bad. The first half was very pretty to watch. The second half was maddening to watch.

I didn't like going with Hyder and Roberson at the end. Even if you're frustrated with how the main guys are playing, they're still your main guys, and the guys who give you any shot at winning the game at that point (still four or five minutes left). That is not the time to be sending a message.

Alajiki's 3-point shooting percentage continues to amaze.

Kuany played well. The progress has been painfully slow, but tonight seemed like a nice step forward. Would be nice if he could back that up with another good game or two.

MoragaBear said:

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They cut the lead from 14 to 8 in the last 5 minutes and Hyder scored their last 5 points so kind of hard to focus on playing him and also Roberson for 4 minutes. They did so many other things poorly in the 2nd half that were the key to the loss.

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I'm certainly not blaming the loss on those guys. But once they were in, it was impossible for us to make the comeback (though it was already a long shot).

The first thing Hyder did when he entered the game was turn the ball over (dropped an easy pass and kicked the ball into the back court). The second thing Hyder did was turn the ball over again (wild pass ricocheting off someone's head). I don't understand how the box score shows him with zero TO.

I'm happy for Hyder that he got a couple buckets at the very end.

Golden One said:

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MoragaBear said:

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Golden One said:

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stu said:

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Also why did we play the last 4 or 5 minutes with Hyder and Roberson at guard?

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Exactly what I was thinking. Neither Hyder nor Roberson has seen much playing time this season, and they haven't shown much when they have played. Beats the heck of me why Brown, Foreman, and Shepherd were on the bench the last 5 minutes.

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Shepherd was 0-4 in the 2nd half, Brown had no points, rebounds or assists in the 2nd half and didn't play his usual strong defense and Foreman was 1-5 with no rebounds or assists in the 2nd half.

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Yes, but Shepherd had 7 points in the game, Foreman had 5, and Brown had 4. Roberson had 0, and is very raw.

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Versus UW he pulled the starters with like 10 minutes left only down like 10. Said they were tired. Now he does this. He also doesn't foul late trying to extend the game. Done that all season. I'm tired of Fox ball. Not a bad guy, and decent teacher but Cal has a rich basketball history that deserves better.

When the defender overplays Lars T. to the right, he lowers his shoulder and keeps going right. Maddening.

My guess is we have a game in a day and a half, and coach felt the starters weren't giving the needed defensive efforts, and at that point the game was basically over anyway

Two players already were at 33 minutes, so why have them go to 38 minutes and exhaust them or risk injury, when he can get some play time to freshman and Hyder who have probably been working hard in practice

Coach probably thinks he is playing a couple players too many minutes, and he knows the injuries/issues each one has

Basically take your ball home and focus on Utah, and give some experience to young players (which many on this board complain we don't do enough)

Tad is a solid coach. It's interesting he stayed with the Buffs when he was a a hotter commodity, and has become the veteran Pac 12 coach.

I recently saw a quote from Bobby Knight that the best teaching tool for players is the bench. Sit them down and they will learn and do what it takes to get back on the court.

Seems to be Fox's belief too, but the problem is Knight was a Championship Coach with tons of talent on his roster and capable replacements. Sometimes I feel like Fox coaches/behaves like he's some top tier coach, which could further alienates him from the team, media and fans.

After every loss, he either blames or makes excuses. Again, Coach K can get away with that but not him.

I digress.

Interesting that Jeff Van Gundy and Chris Mullin were at the game sitting together. JVG is from Martinez and Monty said his dad has 3 (!) degrees from Cal. Can you be our next coach please?? Shoot, I'd take Mullin at this point even though his run at St. John's didn't work out. At least it would be exciting.

BC Calfan said:

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I recently saw a quote from Bobby Knight that the best teaching tool for players is the bench. Sit them down and they will learn and do what it takes to get back on the court.

Seems to be Fox's belief too, but the problem is Knight was a Championship Coach with tons of talent on his roster and capable replacements. Sometimes I feel like Fox coaches/behaves like he's some top tier coach, which could further alienates him from the team, media and fans.

After every loss, he either blames or makes excuses. Again, Coach K can get away with that but not him.

I digress.

Interesting that Jeff Van Gundy and Chris Mullin were at the game sitting together. JVG is from Martinez and Monty said his dad has 3 (!) degrees from Cal. Can you be our next coach please?? Shoot, I'd take Mullin at this point even though his run at St. John's didn't work out. At least it would be exciting.

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That was cool. I'm a big fan of JVG. IIRC, he has a relationship with Fox (they were on staff together for some all-star team right before Cal hired Fox?) and he attended or ran some Cal practices when Fox first started with Cal. I seem to recall Mike Montgomery did as well. Am I remembering that correctly?

drizzlybear said:

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BC Calfan said:

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I recently saw a quote from Bobby Knight that the best teaching tool for players is the bench. Sit them down and they will learn and do what it takes to get back on the court.

Seems to be Fox's belief too, but the problem is Knight was a Championship Coach with tons of talent on his roster and capable replacements. Sometimes I feel like Fox coaches/behaves like he's some top tier coach, which could further alienates him from the team, media and fans.

After every loss, he either blames or makes excuses. Again, Coach K can get away with that but not him.

I digress.

Interesting that Jeff Van Gundy and Chris Mullin were at the game sitting together. JVG is from Martinez and Monty said his dad has 3 (!) degrees from Cal. Can you be our next coach please?? Shoot, I'd take Mullin at this point even though his run at St. John's didn't work out. At least it would be exciting.

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That was cool. I'm a big fan of JVG. IIRC, he has a relationship with Fox (they were on staff together for some all-star team right before Cal hired Fox?) and he attended or ran some Cal practices when Fox first started with Cal. I seem to recall Mike Montgomery did as well. Am I remembering that correctly?

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I think Fox worked for USA basketball during his year of exile, and I believe Van Gundy has as well, so that might be a connection.

I didn't see the game. In fact, I didn't even know we were playing. But, can someone please report on the outcome of the Bear Growls competition? It's my favorite part of the game day experience. On the delightful scale of 1 = "just OK" and 10 = "super delightful, like snuggling with a Golden Retriever puppy," just how delighted were you by the experience?

TIA!
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BC Calfan said:

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I recently saw a quote from Bobby Knight that the best teaching tool for players is the bench. Sit them down and they will learn and do what it takes to get back on the court.

Seems to be Fox's belief too, but the problem is Knight was a Championship Coach with tons of talent on his roster and capable replacements. Sometimes I feel like Fox coaches/behaves like he's some top tier coach, which could further alienates him from the team, media and fans.

After every loss, he either blames or makes excuses. Again, Coach K can get away with that but not him.

I digress.

Interesting that Jeff Van Gundy and Chris Mullin were at the game sitting together. JVG is from Martinez and Monty said his dad has 3 (!) degrees from Cal. Can you be our next coach please?? Shoot, I'd take Mullin at this point even though his run at St. John's didn't work out. At least it would be exciting.

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What evidence do you have that Fox has been alienated from the team? This team plays damn hard. There is no quit in them. They would not have played this hard in games if he had alienated them.

SFCityBear said:

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What evidence do you have that Fox has been alienated from the team? This team plays damn hard. There is no quit in them. They would not have played this hard in games if he had alienated them.

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I have no inside info but from looking at the team I'd guess all of the players Fox had alienated are gone.

I forget what player I heard say that several guys went to Fox's home for Thanksgiving and the have meals there all the time. Say what you will about his coaching and recruiting, but the player clearly appreciated that personal touch.

drizzlybear said:

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In the first half, Cal outrebounded Colorado by 3. In the second half, Colorado outrebounded Cal by 18.

It seemed like Cal played like they were out of gas right from the beginning of the second half. It was weird. I don't understand how that happens, but there was no rebounding, defense fell off, and shots stopped falling (especially GA) including many good shots from right around the basket.

It's too bad. The first half was very pretty to watch. The second half was maddening to watch.

I didn't like going with Hyder and Roberson at the end. Even if you're frustrated with how the main guys are playing, they're still your main guys, and the guys who give you any shot at winning the game at that point (still four or five minutes left). That is not the time to be sending a message.

Alajiki's 3-point shooting percentage continues to amaze.

Kuany played well. The progress has been painfully slow, but tonight seemed like a nice step forward. Would be nice if he could back that up with another good game or two.

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"Kuany played well" is an understatement. He blocked 6 shots! When was the last time a Cal player blocked 6 shots in a single game? We might have to go back 50 years to Bob Presley for that one.

I don't think his progress has been painfully slow. I think it has been right on schedule. He is fast, he is quick, he can handle the ball, he can shoot threes, he makes his free throws, he rebounds well for someone playing most of the time on the perimeter, and he can see the floor and pass a bit. He is learning how to take the ball to the basket. I think his progress has been fine. I think what has been painfully slow for me is that Fox has been slow to get confidence in him. He needs to play more minutes.

stu said:

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SFCityBear said:

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What evidence do you have that Fox has been alienated from the team? This team plays damn hard. There is no quit in them. They would not have played this hard in games if he had alienated them.

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I have no inside info but from looking at the team I'd guess all of the players Fox had alienated are gone.

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I think you are right, and I think that is not unusual, when a new coach comes in, and brings a new system and attitude with him, for some players to have strong feelings, either loyalty to the guy who recruited them, or little faith in his replacement. Unfortunately for Cal, we couldn't afford to lose players from our rotation, even if it was a group that was not performing as well as we'd hoped.

stu said:

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SFCityBear said:

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What evidence do you have that Fox has been alienated from the team? This team plays damn hard. There is no quit in them. They would not have played this hard in games if he had alienated them.

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I have no inside info but from looking at the team I'd guess all of the players Fox had alienated are gone.

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Or at this point, do not come. With the internet and social media the players who sign up now pretty much know what they are signing up for. Knowlton has successfully transformed our basketball program into a bizarro world Air Force. Limiting our recruiting to kids who are willing to put up with the discipline and authoritarian coaching style while working hard on their academics to achieve non-basketball goals. Best fit is hard working foreign students, immigrants or sons of immigrants who are relatively new to the game but see it as a vehicle for a world class education. Kids who grew up playing basketball, who know and love basketball well, who have a mind of their own and are not afraid to speak it, who love the NCAA Tournament and want to play in it, especially win a game or more in it, and maybe have a shot at the NBA, will just look elsewhere.

SFCityBear said:

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"Kuany played well" is an understatement. He blocked 6 shots! When was the last time a Cal player blocked 6 shots in a single game? We might have to go back 50 years to Bob Presley for that one.

I don't think his progress has been painfully slow. I think it has been right on schedule. He is fast, he is quick, he can handle the ball, he can shoot threes, he makes his free throws, he rebounds well for someone playing most of the time on the perimeter, and he can see the floor and pass a bit. He is learning how to take the ball to the basket. I think his progress has been fine. I think what has been painfully slow for me is that Fox has been slow to get confidence in him. He needs to play more minutes.

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I'm pleased with Kuany's development. I think he's more of a PF than a SF but Anticevich has the PF spot.

stu said:

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SFCityBear said:

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"Kuany played well" is an understatement. He blocked 6 shots! When was the last time a Cal player blocked 6 shots in a single game? We might have to go back 50 years to Bob Presley for that one.

I don't think his progress has been painfully slow. I think it has been right on schedule. He is fast, he is quick, he can handle the ball, he can shoot threes, he makes his free throws, he rebounds well for someone playing most of the time on the perimeter, and he can see the floor and pass a bit. He is learning how to take the ball to the basket. I think his progress has been fine. I think what has been painfully slow for me is that Fox has been slow to get confidence in him. He needs to play more minutes.

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I'm pleased with Kuany's development. I think he's more of a PF than a SF but Anticevich has the PF spot.

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I agree. I'd like to see him inside more, on both ends of the floor, moving to the corner for an occasional 3 on offense. He'd need to bulk up some, though. He's slight of build and a stronger PF can probably move him around.

SFCityBear said:

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drizzlybear said:

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In the first half, Cal outrebounded Colorado by 3. In the second half, Colorado outrebounded Cal by 18.

It seemed like Cal played like they were out of gas right from the beginning of the second half. It was weird. I don't understand how that happens, but there was no rebounding, defense fell off, and shots stopped falling (especially GA) including many good shots from right around the basket.

It's too bad. The first half was very pretty to watch. The second half was maddening to watch.

I didn't like going with Hyder and Roberson at the end. Even if you're frustrated with how the main guys are playing, they're still your main guys, and the guys who give you any shot at winning the game at that point (still four or five minutes left). That is not the time to be sending a message.

Alajiki's 3-point shooting percentage continues to amaze.

Kuany played well. The progress has been painfully slow, but tonight seemed like a nice step forward. Would be nice if he could back that up with another good game or two.

---

"Kuany played well" is an understatement. He blocked 6 shots! When was the last time a Cal player blocked 6 shots in a single game? We might have to go back 50 years to Bob Presley for that one.

I don't think his progress has been painfully slow. I think it has been right on schedule. He is fast, he is quick, he can handle the ball, he can shoot threes, he makes his free throws, he rebounds well for someone playing most of the time on the perimeter, and he can see the floor and pass a bit. He is learning how to take the ball to the basket. I think his progress has been fine. I think what has been painfully slow for me is that Fox has been slow to get confidence in him. He needs to play more minutes.

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I don't see all that in Kuany, especially not handling the ball. He's a good defender, but he's basically another 3-and-D guy, except that his 3-point percentage (.317) is low for that role. I had hoped his offensive game would be farther along by this point.

SFCityBear said:

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stu said:

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SFCityBear said:

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"Kuany played well" is an understatement. He blocked 6 shots! When was the last time a Cal player blocked 6 shots in a single game? We might have to go back 50 years to Bob Presley for that one.

I don't think his progress has been painfully slow. I think it has been right on schedule. He is fast, he is quick, he can handle the ball, he can shoot threes, he makes his free throws, he rebounds well for someone playing most of the time on the perimeter, and he can see the floor and pass a bit. He is learning how to take the ball to the basket. I think his progress has been fine. I think what has been painfully slow for me is that Fox has been slow to get confidence in him. He needs to play more minutes.

---

I'm pleased with Kuany's development. I think he's more of a PF than a SF but Anticevich has the PF spot.

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I agree. I'd like to see him inside more, on both ends of the floor, moving to the corner for an occasional 3 on offense. He'd need to bulk up some, though. He's slight of build and a stronger PF can probably move him around.

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A true PF needs a lower/stronger center of gravity.

Agree right now he is a 3 and D player, but he's shown flashes of driving and finishing

As a freshman it looked like all arms and legs but the ball somehow went in the hoop

As a junior it looks more in control but he dribbles too high and gets stripped too often

Still he's more under control and I think he will improve more with playing time and working on a number of dribbling and finishes

drizzlybear said:

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SFCityBear said:

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drizzlybear said:

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In the first half, Cal outrebounded Colorado by 3. In the second half, Colorado outrebounded Cal by 18.

It seemed like Cal played like they were out of gas right from the beginning of the second half. It was weird. I don't understand how that happens, but there was no rebounding, defense fell off, and shots stopped falling (especially GA) including many good shots from right around the basket.

It's too bad. The first half was very pretty to watch. The second half was maddening to watch.

I didn't like going with Hyder and Roberson at the end. Even if you're frustrated with how the main guys are playing, they're still your main guys, and the guys who give you any shot at winning the game at that point (still four or five minutes left). That is not the time to be sending a message.

Alajiki's 3-point shooting percentage continues to amaze.

Kuany played well. The progress has been painfully slow, but tonight seemed like a nice step forward. Would be nice if he could back that up with another good game or two.

---

"Kuany played well" is an understatement. He blocked 6 shots! When was the last time a Cal player blocked 6 shots in a single game? We might have to go back 50 years to Bob Presley for that one.

I don't think his progress has been painfully slow. I think it has been right on schedule. He is fast, he is quick, he can handle the ball, he can shoot threes, he makes his free throws, he rebounds well for someone playing most of the time on the perimeter, and he can see the floor and pass a bit. He is learning how to take the ball to the basket. I think his progress has been fine. I think what has been painfully slow for me is that Fox has been slow to get confidence in him. He needs to play more minutes.

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I don't see all that in Kuany, especially not handling the ball. He's a good defender, but he's basically another 3-and-D guy, except that his 3-point percentage (.317) is low for that role. I had hoped his offensive game would be farther along by this point.

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HoopDreams said:

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Agree right now he is a 3 and D player, but he's shown flashes of driving and finishing

As a freshman it looked like all arms and legs but the ball somehow went in the hoop

As a junior it looks more in control but he dribbles too high and gets stripped too often

Still he's more under control and I think he will improve more with playing time and working on a number of dribbling and finishes

drizzlybear said:

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SFCityBear said:

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drizzlybear said:

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In the first half, Cal outrebounded Colorado by 3. In the second half, Colorado outrebounded Cal by 18.

It seemed like Cal played like they were out of gas right from the beginning of the second half. It was weird. I don't understand how that happens, but there was no rebounding, defense fell off, and shots stopped falling (especially GA) including many good shots from right around the basket.

It's too bad. The first half was very pretty to watch. The second half was maddening to watch.

I didn't like going with Hyder and Roberson at the end. Even if you're frustrated with how the main guys are playing, they're still your main guys, and the guys who give you any shot at winning the game at that point (still four or five minutes left). That is not the time to be sending a message.

Alajiki's 3-point shooting percentage continues to amaze.

Kuany played well. The progress has been painfully slow, but tonight seemed like a nice step forward. Would be nice if he could back that up with another good game or two.

---

"Kuany played well" is an understatement. He blocked 6 shots! When was the last time a Cal player blocked 6 shots in a single game? We might have to go back 50 years to Bob Presley for that one.

I don't think his progress has been painfully slow. I think it has been right on schedule. He is fast, he is quick, he can handle the ball, he can shoot threes, he makes his free throws, he rebounds well for someone playing most of the time on the perimeter, and he can see the floor and pass a bit. He is learning how to take the ball to the basket. I think his progress has been fine. I think what has been painfully slow for me is that Fox has been slow to get confidence in him. He needs to play more minutes.

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I don't see all that in Kuany, especially not handling the ball. He's a good defender, but he's basically another 3-and-D guy, except that his 3-point percentage (.317) is low for that role. I had hoped his offensive game would be farther along by this point.

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Yeah, I'm not saying he hasn't improved; just saying he hasn't improved as much as I'd hoped he would by now. I see him still as a somewhat limited offensive player.

Here's a quote from Kuany's HS alma mater, Prolific Prep's website:
"Prolific Prep provides a unique opportunity for serious student-athletes to be immersed in an environment of unmatched basketball training (game-style practice, basketball development, and athletic training)"

I like Kuany's enthusiasm and he has improved over the years, but does anybody see evidence of any immersive basketball training? Whoever paid for his tuition, I guess it was worth it given he's getting up to a five-year ride at Cal, but I'm not impressed by the Prolific Prep brand.

HearstMining said:

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Here's a quote from Kuany's HS alma mater, Prolific Prep's website:
"Prolific Prep provides a unique opportunity for serious student-athletes to be immersed in an environment of unmatched basketball training (game-style practice, basketball development, and athletic training)"

I like Kuany's enthusiasm and he has improved over the years, but does anybody see evidence of any immersive basketball training? Whoever paid for his tuition, I guess it was worth it given he's getting up to a five-year ride at Cal, but I'm not impressed by the Prolific Prep brand.

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I'm always a little skeptical of places like Prolific Prep, so yeah, but how many years was he there for and what was his background before that? Rome wasn't built in a day.

Anyway, nice to see Kuany, Lars and Joel Brown all making some noticeable strides this season! I was hoping for more from each, and earlier, but I acknowledge the moderate upward trajectory nonetheless.